Toon Link Moveset Discussions! Finished, add your thoughts if necessary.

[Barge]

Toon Link Move set Discussions​

Hello I've acquired this idea from a various amount of character boards, as far as I can tell, Toon Link doesn't have one. So please, fill in all of your observations and facts on each Move that we are currently discussing. I'll change the move when I feel we are done discussing it. I may paraphrase your posts as to put them in the "About this move" section.​

Forward Smash: Pages 1-2
Spin Attack: Pages 2-3
lolDown Tilt: Pages 3-4
Down Air: Pages 4-5
Bomb: Pages 5-6
Upwards Smash: Pages 6-7
Back Air: Pages 7-8
Jab Attack: Page 9
Z-air: Pages 9-10
Boomerang: Pages 10-11
Downward Smash: Page 11
Forward Air: Pages 11-12
Forward Tilt: Page 12
Neutral Air: Pages 12-13
Up Tilt: Page 13
Upwards Air: Pages 13-15
Dash Attack: Page 15

Move #1 Forward Smash!

Thank you sasukebowser!​

About Forward Smash:
Has 2 strikes, first one doing around 10-12% (c-sticked) and little knock back, while the second one doing 12-14% (c-sticked) and very large knock back.
Semi-Situational, though it can kill fairly early, it's quite hard to get a good hit with Forward smash, let alone hit with both strikes. Its extremely punishable and difficult to set-up properly, though a boomerang hitting your opponent into your forward smash seems to be effective. It can hit behind you slightly, and is a good punishing move. Floaty characters can get out of the first hit at low percentages, spacing is essential if you wish to land one of these. Faking the second strike could improve your chances of landing another hit.

Move #2 Spin Attack!

​

About Spin Attack:
Toon Links main recovery move, and exceptionally better than Links Spin attack (in terms of recovery). It does around 12% if all hits land uncharged, and 20% damage fully charged. Exceptional at punishing spot dodgers. You can charge it up on the floor for extra damage (Mind games?). When used on land, if your opponents come in contact with it, they get pulled into the middle of the attack, landing a lot of hits. Punishable if you use it in the air, minor punishment levels on ground, Opponents can DI out of the last few hits.

Move #3 lolDown Tilt!

Thank you sasukebowser!​

About Down Tilt:
This move is a poke move, with IASA frames and decent knock back, not very useful in the heat of battle, but is good as a ledge guard because it swoops them low. It has a hitbox in the back and fair damage. It can hit beneath shields and have a good trip rate, very situational.

Move #4 Down Air!

​

About Down Air:
This is my personal favorite move that Toon Link has.
Comes down fast, real fast, so fast you can't control it or stop it unless there's something to block him. If the first strike hits, you'll bounce and have a chance at a second hit, its Toon Links greatest spike, if it lands, you can almost guarantee a free KO unless they're at 0-10%. It has a shock wave effect which pushes opponents away when the sword hits the ground. This is useful if you miss and are in-range of punishment. Only use this move off stage if your 100% that it'll hit, otherwise...you die. Over-use this move and you're going to become fairly obvious. If you use Dair when you get sent up into the sky, and jump right before you preform it, you'll float for about a second, its really neat and good for faking out your opponent.

Move #5 Bomb!

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About Bomb:
These are "Toon Links Bread and Butter" as it was said. The Bombs make the Link, they're useful in almost every battle against everyone in every situation, recovering, damage dealing, combo set-ups, distractions, aerial attacks, ground attacks, everything! Useful if combined with D-air, as it provides a short stun which provides an opening to get 2 hits with dair. Easily spammable, and can set-up into some good combos. You can lay them on the ground (perhaps comparable to snakes down smash?) And SH - > Bomb = Quickdraw. If you pull out a bomb when you're far from the stage, and not sure if you're going to be ledge hogged/fail at making it back up, you have a chance to get back up by using Up- B twice. (Bomb explodes after you do the first one, allowing you to preform another one). Overall this is a high priority projectile.

If you want more Information about bomb/Bomb techs, refer to this thread
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=172216

Move #6 Upwards Smash!

​

About Up Smash:
This is a great move, can KO at 90~120%, comes out fast, is only punishable in a small amount, and is a great punisher. Hyphen smash is incredibly useful as well (Dash and while dashing preform an up smash) And Hyphen > DACUS In Toon Links case. It can cancel into out of shield for defensive uses, and has great priority. Hyphen smash is often combined with Bomb/Boomerang/Arrows/Zair as to distract them. Its easily one of Toon Links best moves.

Move #7 Back Air!

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About Back Air:
Toon Links "Best' move as said by many Toon Link Mainers, and I think so as well. Actually its probably the greatest move in this game, why you ask? It can combo/string well, VERY well. Has great priority, good damage, its fast, short hop -> Bair = 1337, its flashy (xP) and its a killing move (relatively high percents, 100-140%) If you fight backwards most of the match, you have an automatic lead. Bair has a hitbox thats pretty insane, covers almost 180 degrees of his back (maybe a little in front as it tends to hit a little in front of you) and can be used almost 6 times in 2 full jumps.

Move #8 Jab Attack!

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About Jab Attack:
Does good damage, hits 3 times (2% 3% 5%). His fastest move, best grounded move to use defensively. Jab cancel can work, but is avoidable if you decide to set-up for anything other than the last hit. This however, sets up for "mindgames". It can be used to get yourself some distance to start projectile spam, and is great for close ranged shield pressure.

Move #9 Z-Air!

Thank you sasukebowser!!!!
​

About Z-air:
Easily one of Toon Links best moves, its lagless when you land (though little air lag) it has great range, decent damage, can lead into MANY other moves, is a great approach, and has great priority. Has good stun, it's good for keeping distance, can be used to attack out of an airdodge, and leads into many other attacks, Nair, Upsmash/Hyphen Smash, bomb, grabs, best used when Short hopping, and best used right before you hit the ground, otherwise you'll miss. Overall a great move

Move #10 Boomerang!

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About Boomerang:
Very good projectile, it comes out quite slow, but has many chances to hit and you can control in which direction it goes out and comes back. It can go through ledges, and deals roughly 9-12% on the first hit forwards, and about 3% on the way back. Boomerang catch lag (stopping to catch it) can be quite annoying, though. It can bounce off the ground, it can open a lot of opportunities to hit (rang -> Fsmash) and theres no catch lag if you have the right timing to dodge or attack for it.

Move #11 Downward Smash!

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About Downward Smash:
Not one of Toon Links best moves, but really useful. It hits twice (once in front, then takes them to the back of you and lands another strike). It can kill at higher percentages (150+), and if your opponent is under 30% when you use it, it can send them horizontally back far. (Good for setting up for spikes/gimps). Punishable if missed, and situational at best.

Move #12 Forward Air!

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About Forward Air:
Another one of Toon Links kill moves, does very good knockback and damage, but has some starting lag, and a little punishable if missed. Fair to Arrow cancle is extremely useful and a lot of TL's do this. This move is great for offstage game, and usually isnt expected. N-air is better for forward air game when at lower percentages.

Move #13 Forward Tilt!

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About Forward Tilt:
Not much to this move, but definitely has its uses and advantages.
This move hits behind you, has good horizontal knock back. It's good for ledge guarding and for setting up projectile spam. As sasuke said "Its Nair on the ground".
It has decent damage, and can kill at higher percentages.

Move #14 Neutral Air!

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About Neutral Air:
This is a great move, and highly prioritized.
"Fast, great damage, can be a decent kill move. Hits behind you." It can hit twice, and Zair -> Nair is one of the most common follow ups after zair, it can be canceled into Arrow cancle, and has a small-ish hit box.

Move #15 Up Tilt!

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About Up Tilt:
A pretty simple move, can be used for juggling at low percentages, a fast good kill move, comes out fast, little lag and has a big hitbox. Probably best to be used after a jab cancle, and it can lead into a variety of combos. 'Nuff Said.

Move #16 Upwards Air!

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About Upwards Air:
One of Toon Links best killing moves, kills at low percentages, sweetspots at tip of sword, stays up for a long time so you can get air dodgers, it counters a lot of characters down airs/king dededes up b. Has little landing lag, but shouldn't really be used near the ground. Use it high for best results.

Move #17 Dash Attack!

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About Dash Attack:
Comes out pretty fast, can trip at a high rate, shouldn't be used excessively, nice for edge guarding and getting a bit of damage. Dash Attack - > Hyphen smash = too good. Can be canceled into a DACUS, though his hyphen smash is better.

Discuss :D​

 

[urdailywater]

Useful on large targets being hit by boomerang on its way back.

I don't use it a lot, It's good in combos though.

 

[Barge]

I think its (One) of Toon Links best kill moves, it can kill beneath 100% fully charged, and a bit over 100% when you just c-stick it, you have two chances to hit, the second strike being the strongest. Slightly punishable though.

 

[urdailywater]

I think its (One) of Toon Links best kill moves, it can kill beneath 100% fully charged, and a bit over 100% when you just c-stick it, you have two chances to hit, the second strike being the strongest. Slightly punishable though.

I can agree with you on that.
But emphasis on punishable. Usually enemies can just jump right over the second one, that's why I don't use it as often as I'd use f-air or whatever.

 

[Barge]

I can agree with you on that.
But emphasis on punishable. Usually enemies can just jump right over the second one, that's why I don't use it as often as I'd use f-air or whatever.

If you hit with the first strike, you can almost guarantee you'll hit with the second one if they're at relatively low percentages.

 

[Asdioh]

I rarely use it. I can go for games without using it.

I suppose it could be good after they're hit by a returning boomerang, or a falling bomb.

But it's just sooo easy to punish, I use upsmash and downsmash 10x more.

 

[Barge]

I need some more input here.

 

[Sosuke]

The hit box of the second swing hit behind him. Too good.
I sometimes use this move just to rank up damage, and save all the other kill moves.
It has great knock back and the fact that you can choose when to swing the second time makes it much better for us.

That only thing that sucks is that some characters can sometimes float over the second hit.

 

[zaf]

A lot of chars can jump out after the first hit, try not to let it linger so you can get the second hit in asap.

Also, at low %'s after a bair or two instead of doing more bairs, you can do a fsmash. Works fine and is guaranteed .

 

[Ginger_Warrior]

A good move to damage opponents, plus the knockback gives time for TL to get in a shield or something before he can be punished.

Only if he hits though. Range is still relatively short, and the second hit barely hits most times. It's predictable (may as well be telegraphed) and easily punished.

Not a move that should be depended on. I imagine you can tell when someone's new to TL by the amount of times they'll try killing with Fsmash.

 

[Barge]

A good move to damage opponents, plus the knockback gives time for TL to get in a shield or something before he can be punished.

Only if he hits though. Range is still relatively short, and the second hit barely hits most times. It's predictable (may as well be telegraphed) and easily punished.

Not a move that should be depended on. I imagine you can tell when someone's new to TL by the amount of times they'll try killing with Fsmash.

But if it Does hit, it Kos earlier then most moves

 

[Ginger_Warrior]

"If" being the operative word there. Let's do a poll and ask whether people would rather lose USmash or Fsmash as a killing move.

 

[Barge]

I still think we're missing something about it, I know theres more to it then that!

 

[vanderzant]

Uh... I often use the first swing as a 'mindgame' or fakeout of sorts. It can be delayed a LONG time if your opponent is silly enough to spot dodge or drop their shield (instead of running, jumping or rolling away).

A situational use of Fsmash that I try and use alot is when my opponent is trying to land on the ground (after using their second/third jump) as an alternative to the oh so obvious Hyphen Smash. It's not too hard to space and time so that the second hit connects as they land. I reccomend only doing this at low percents or if Usmash won't kill instead. While the running Usmash is probably easier to connect with, it is really important to try and save Usmash for kills.

 

[iRjOn]

I barely use fsmash unless I want to punish them or they get hit with a bomb or my rang or something.
I use dsmash and usmash more.

 

[QUIVO]

Fsmash is an awesome kill move, but in the heat of battle it's hard to pull off at high percentages. Not to mention that this attack is quite laggy and easily punished.

Most players will play smarter once they're at killing percent, so they'll be watching out for this attack.

Using the first part of the fsmash is pretty good, usually they'll just shield it, letting you run away and projectiles spam. I don't use this tactic enough though. Another thing I like to do is fsmash them when they're next to the edge. If they shield it, you can use both parts to push them onto the ledge making it impossible to punish.

Also, this is incredibly situational and I'm yet to do it. But I think a good idea is to just shield pressure until it's weak and then try to get an fsmash drawn out so you can break a shield. Of course it'd need to be spaced properly otherwise you can get shield grabbed (which is what usually happens if I try it).

Can you do cancel the fsmash and jab or something? I haven't really tested it out, and only a few times have I tried mid-battle. Most of the time I accidentally fsmash again.

 

[Rawrness]

You can fsmash mindgames like faking a second fsmash hit or something.

 

[Ørion]

Kinda hard to set up, obviously spacing it so they will be hit after being knocked back by a boomerang is optimal. Personally, I kill with Usmash, and maybe even uair more, but I don't completely ignore this move. It does kill at fairly low percentages, and is a solid kill move if you set up right. I have a question, and I've never heard a completely positive answer, so I'll ask again: does using the first swing alone affect the decay of the second swing?

 

[Barge]

Kinda hard to set up, obviously spacing it so they will be hit after being knocked back by a boomerang is optimal. Personally, I kill with Usmash, and maybe even uair more, but I don't completely ignore this move. It does kill at fairly low percentages, and is a solid kill move if you set up right. I have a question, and I've never heard a completely positive answer, so I'll ask again: does using the first swing alone affect the decay of the second swing?

I don't see how you would tell..

 

[iRjOn]

@ Ørion

Yes I believe so because (correct me if I'm wrong) it is still registered as the same move.
Like Snakes ftilt.

 

[Barge]

Thank you all for your input, I put a summary on the OP. If you feel something should be changed or added, please let me know. I'll change the move discussion tomorrow, as I think we've covered the basics of Fsmash.

 

[popsofctown]

A good move to damage opponents, plus the knockback gives time for TL to get in a shield or something before he can be punished.

Only if he hits though. Range is still relatively short, and the second hit barely hits most times. It's predictable (may as well be telegraphed) and easily punished.

Not a move that should be depended on. I imagine you can tell when someone's new to TL by the amount of times they'll try killing with Fsmash.

And you can measure how accustomed the opponent is to Toon Link by how many times it works.... It's an important dynamic. I think if both the Toon Link and the opponent are good, well educated people, Tlink's Fsmash shouldn't come up that much.

 

[Barge]

I decided to change the skill early, I think we covered all of Forward smash.

Move #2: Spin attack!

Discuss!

 

[vanderzant]

In the air
- Toon's third jump. Not especially safe though (it's predictable) and since there is no hitbox (or at least a large one) near the end of the animation it can often be ledgeguarded by smart opponents.
- I try to use it as a last resort recovery, and prefer using the hookshot
- I've seen people use this to get star KO's as a finisher because of it's decent range

On the ground
- Most Toon Links don't use this move enough (myself included)
- It can be used to punish spotdodges
- Don't spam it, it is VERY punishable
- I'm pretty sure it can be Smash DI'd out of (the last few hits)

 

[Barge]

In the air
- Toon's third jump. Not especially safe though (it's predictable) and since there is no hitbox (or at least a large one) near the end of the animation it can often be ledgeguarded by smart opponents.
- I try to use it as a last resort recovery, and prefer using the hookshot
- I've seen people use this to get star KO's as a finisher because of it's decent range

On the ground
- Most Toon Links don't use this move enough (myself included)
- It can be used to punish spotdodges
- Don't spam it, it is VERY punishable
- I'm pretty sure it can be Smash DI'd out of (the last few hits)

I NEVER use it on the ground, if I do, its usually in friendlys, I noticed it does get good damage, and it "sucks" them into the middle. Better word to replace sucks please?

 

[Sosuke]

How much damage does it do? like 13-ish?

 

[Barge]

How much damage does it do? like 13-ish?

Depends on how much you charge it up

 

[Sosuke]

Depends on how much you charge it up

...>_> Who charges it?



lol i guess i could see when you would as mindgames.

 

[Barge]

...>_> Who charges it?



lol i guess i could see when you would as mindgames.

...>_> Who uses it on the floor?

I don't know, I'll do some testing in training mode tonight.

 

[IDK]

well as for the spin attack just a simple note... it is one of (two?) upb's that can be charged (on the ground) and used as an attack on stage without having to freefall. was pretty broken for link in melee but still has some use in brawl. however i hardly ever see it used...

 

[VietGeek]

...>_> Who uses it on the floor?

I don't know, I'll do some testing in training mode tonight.

Who uses it in the air as an attack? It has no hitbox behind you, can be DI'd out of, and if you whiff, you're probably going to die. Too risky.

Also, your post count in correlation to your join date is absurd.

 

[Barge]

Who uses it in the air as an attack? It has no hitbox behind you, can be DI'd out of, and if you whiff, you're probably going to die. Too risky.

Also, your post count in correlation to your join date is absurd.

I guess im an active member, but look at chaco.
2.4k posts and only joined 4 months ago.

 

[F3ma Ch33f]

TL's spin attack on the ground is a somewhat useful move, it's best used after a spot dodge or after perfect shielding. I usually catch my oppenents of guard with it, and it does 8-10% uncharged.

In the air not so much, as Viet said it's too risky.

 

[Asdioh]

ugh, I've told the TL boards this before, but I love spin attack. I ... use this move too much >_>

Punish approaches with it, use it to approach, punish spotdodges, punish rolldodges...it's just fun. Of course, it's extremely punishable, but I don't worry about it too much. Don't use it if you're at a high percent, that's all.

Spin attacking in the air to finish a combo, to star ko, or to ko near the edge, should not be counted out. Use it sparingly, but never forget you have it. If you miss a potential ko just because it's "risky", then that's a waste of a move in your arsenal.

it's gud. Seriously, who expects you to run up to them and...spin attack?

 

[iRjOn]

dtilt is a waste...
But I dont use spin attack unless Im recovering sometimes.
IDK I'd rather use something less punishable to punish someone or something with more knockback.

 

[Asdioh]

dtilt is a waste...

tewshay! !

dtilt should be the next move discussion, maybe we can find a way to make it not suck.

 

[Sosuke]

Toon Links Dtilt is the best move in Brawl.

 

[Barge]

I suppose i'll add that tommorow
but is there anything else really about Spin Attack that we should know?

 

[Ørion]

Toon Links Dtilt is the best move in Brawl.

I think its all mindgames!


Anyway, personally I only use Up-B for a recovery, unless I accidentally press it LOL (yes, this still happens occasionally ). Maybe every five games or so I'll use it in the air because they don't expect it.

 

[l SOUP l]

I strongly believe in using every move atleast once in a game. Toon Link has such a great mix-up game.