Official Toon Link Match-Up Discussion Thread (Informative Posts/Guides in the OP)

[Dre89]

Lol if Cloud runs away, that does our zoning for us. He cant approach to use hit limit breaks, and neutral B is nowhere near useful for Cloud, even with limit break. Where on the stage would he be able to charge limit break freely? If he does this, throw a boomerang at him or something. We don't need to approach except when killing, which doesn't matter because we get guaranteed kills off of bomb.

If you're running away camping, he can just run away and charge. He doesn't have to get it all in one go, and throwing a boomerang won't do much because he can do any action of out of charging immediately. The reward he gets for charging is much higher than what Tink gets for setting up his zoning.

If you're not approaching except for to kill, then he can easily stand on the other side of the stage charging and just powershield projectiles, or continue to run away and charge. Throwing projectiles might delay his charge but he'll eventually get it if you're not approaching. Even if you do some chip damage he doesn't care about taking 10% when you kill him at 120 and he kills you at 60.

It'll now be even easier for him to approach and kill you at 60 because he has the stat boosts and downb confirms out of nair and is generally landable when Tink is in disadvantage.

 

[Halfy]

If you're running away camping, he can just run away and charge. He doesn't have to get it all in one go, and throwing a boomerang won't do much because he can do any action of out of charging immediately. The reward he gets for charging is much higher than what Tink gets for setting up his zoning.

If you're not approaching except for to kill, then he can easily stand on the other side of the stage charging and just powershield projectiles, or continue to run away and charge. Throwing projectiles might delay his charge but he'll eventually get it if you're not approaching. Even if you do some chip damage he doesn't care about taking 10% when you kill him at 120 and he kills you at 60.

It'll now be even easier for him to approach and kill you at 60 because he has the stat boosts and downb confirms out of nair and is generally landable when Tink is in disadvantage.

I'm not sure this is how it works...
Do you have a video of the matchup so I can visualize it?

 

[Dre89]

I'm not sure this is how it works...
Do you have a video of the matchup so I can visualize it?

I don't, but when I versed a Cloud, if I ever was on one side of the stage trying to wall him out, he'd just run to the other side of the stage and charge. You basically have to run at him with a bomb otherwise he'll just shield your stuff or dodge it and keep charging. Even if you interrupt him if he does this twice he'll probably be fully charged.

 

[mdoepker]

If Toon Link is camping a Cloud, they'll just run away and charge limit, then downb kill you at 60% when you're in the air or something because Toon Link has heavyweight frame data with no range.

The burden is on Toon Link to be aggressive in this MU because Cloud gets much more reward from running away than Toon does.

What I've been doing depending on how "defensive" the Cloud is playing is that when then continue to use their neutral B to "out-camp" me, I pull a bomb and just let it hit my shield without having to do anything. Usually after they do that 2-3 times they'll either approach or start to charge limit in which case I go in or have forced them to approach me.

I don't know if that's a good way to handle the situation as I'm still really new, so I'd totally be interested in hearing some thoughts on that.

 

[Dre89]

What I've been doing depending on how "defensive" the Cloud is playing is that when then continue to use their neutral B to "out-camp" me, I pull a bomb and just let it hit my shield without having to do anything. Usually after they do that 2-3 times they'll either approach or start to charge limit in which case I go in or have forced them to approach me.

I don't know if that's a good way to handle the situation as I'm still really new, so I'd totally be interested in hearing some thoughts on that.

That's a fine way to handle that particular situation, but the issue is that the Cloud is being sub optimal. He can't really outcamp you projectile-wise. But if you try camp him he can just run away and charge to then use the stat boosts to get in on you and kill you at 60 with downb. That's what Clouds should be doing against you.

 

[Halfy]

That's a fine way to handle that particular situation, but the issue is that the Cloud is being sub optimal. He can't really outcamp you projectile-wise. But if you try camp him he can just run away and charge to then use the stat boosts to get in on you and kill you at 60 with downb. That's what Clouds should be doing against you.

It shouldn't be that hard to read the down b. And why would the stat boosts make it so much easier for him to approach? We can still wall out Cloud if you make good use of all of your projectiles and zair. Toon Link excels at forcing opponents into certain options, just bait things and punish. Cloud is a lot easier to deal with than plenty of other characters such as link, sheik, mario, and ZSS due to his lack of a reliable way to deal with our zoning, yet we don't seem to have issues with those characters as much because we have had more time to learn the MU. Cloud will be the same way, in a month or two he will be cake to fight against.

 

[Dre89]

It shouldn't be that hard to read the down b. And why would the stat boosts make it so much easier for him to approach? We can still wall out Cloud if you make good use of all of your projectiles and zair. Toon Link excels at forcing opponents into certain options, just bait things and punish. Cloud is a lot easier to deal with than plenty of other characters such as link, sheik, mario, and ZSS due to his lack of a reliable way to deal with our zoning, yet we don't seem to have issues with those characters as much because we have had more time to learn the MU. Cloud will be the same way, in a month or two he will be cake to fight against.

Well it makes it easier because I'm pretty sure he gets faster.

Tink can keep people out but people are going to get in on him eventually. If he could keep characters out without taking any damage he'd be top tier. Cloud isn't Sheik but he can definitely get in on Tink is he's patient and uses his massive arcing hitboxes that can cover several options at once. He only needs to do it 3 or 4 times too. And it's not about reading the downb because he can just confirm it out of nair.

 

[Moobussir]

Well it makes it easier because I'm pretty sure he gets faster.

Tink can keep people out but people are going to get in on him eventually. If he could keep characters out without taking any damage he'd be top tier. Cloud isn't Sheik but he can definitely get in on Tink is he's patient and uses his massive arcing hitboxes that can cover several options at once. He only needs to do it 3 or 4 times too. And it's not about reading the downb because he can just confirm it out of nair.

What I think is interesting is yes, I agree that Cloud technically outcamps us. To counter this, we just have to use projectiles in an offensive way in a decent range against him. Close enough so he's uncomfortable, but far enough so the Buster Sword can't reach us. Otherwise, he can keep distance with Blade Beam and Limit Charge. But what's really interesting is that once he's charged, he gains advantages but also gains disadvantages. He can't space with Blade Beam when Limit Break is charged since he wants to use his charge on something more rewarding. And he can't threaten us with Limit Charge because obviously he's charged. His only option at that point is to approach us, where we can wall him out. We just have to be careful in how close he can get to us, since he has that major speed boost, the attack boost, and Finishing Touch.

 

[Dre89]

What I think is interesting is yes, I agree that Cloud technically outcamps us. To counter this, we just have to use projectiles in an offensive way in a decent range against him. Close enough so he's uncomfortable, but far enough so the Buster Sword can't reach us. Otherwise, he can keep distance with Blade Beam and Limit Charge. But what's really interesting is that once he's charged, he gains advantages but also gains disadvantages. He can't space with Blade Beam when Limit Break is charged since he wants to use his charge on something more rewarding. And he can't threaten us with Limit Charge because obviously he's charged. His only option at that point is to approach us, where we can wall him out. We just have to be careful in how close he can get to us, since he has that major speed boost, the attack boost, and Finishing Touch.

Yeah you have to pressure him, but at the same time you're effectively giving him less work to approach you because you're closer. He doesn't always have to run away and charge. If you're pressuring him he's fine to just fight back. But if you decide to try camp him he can just charge limit because he gets much higher reward out of that situation than you do.

Once he's fully charged he does have to approach, and yes you can keep him out but it's not like you'll never let him through. Toon Link would be top tier if people never broke his zone. Cloud's reward is just too high. He has a much larger margin for error than Toon Link does, especially if the Cloud knows to just patiently poweshield and be reactive.

 

[Moobussir]

Yeah you have to pressure him, but at the same time you're effectively giving him less work to approach you because you're closer. He doesn't always have to run away and charge. If you're pressuring him he's fine to just fight back. But if you decide to try camp him he can just charge limit because he gets much higher reward out of that situation than you do.

Once he's fully charged he does have to approach, and yes you can keep him out but it's not like you'll never let him through. Toon Link would be top tier if people never broke his zone. Cloud's reward is just too high. He has a much larger margin for error than Toon Link does, especially if the Cloud knows to just patiently poweshield and be reactive.

I guess that's the matchup then honestly. For rushdown Cloud's, zone their approach, and for campy Cloud's, pressure his position. And when he charges, be cautious. You can honestly shield anything he throws, so as long as you stay dilligent you're alright.

 

[Watermarlon]

Hey guys, I've decided to make my old main, Toon Link, my secondary character now(Fox is primary). I just wanted to know how the Toon vs Lucas matchup is because Lucas is a character I seem to struggle with as Fox. Thanks!

 

[Wintermelon43]

Hi. Could anyone tell me what Toon Link's worst matchups are? (Apart from Sheik or SSS if they're bad)? Thanks

 

[Dre89]

Hi. Could anyone tell me what Toon Link's worst matchups are? (Apart from Sheik or SSS if they're bad)? Thanks

I'm pretty sure Rosalina is the worst. She forces you to approach by just powershielding and GPing everything and shooting Luma out to hit you. It's easy for her to punish your movements with stuff like dash attack and tons of other moves that vastly outrange Toon's.

She honestly doesn't care that much if you kill Luma because she can just still stall for Luma and take advantage of the fact that Toon doesn't have good rush down.

Her advantaged state is extremely strong against Toon. Toon's normal defence against juggles is plucking a bomb but the range on Rosa's uair makes that extremely unsafe until very high percents. She also gimps him very easily because of his predictable recovery.

The match up only seems ok if you verse impatient Rosas who approach you with stuff like dashes. A patient Rosa who just walks blocking/GPing stuff then dash attacking or baiting on reaction to your movements is a nightmare to deal with.

 

[Moobussir]

Hey guys, I've decided to make my old main, Toon Link, my secondary character now(Fox is primary). I just wanted to know how the Toon vs Lucas matchup is because Lucas is a character I seem to struggle with as Fox. Thanks!

I haven't fought a tourney-hardened Lucas before, but since no one has replied I want to at least describe what I can for you.

Both of these characters are good at their neutral game for different reasons. Lucas has a long ranged and quick projectile that moves him back, along with great aerials for offensive approach, a Down-B to mindgame and a Zair for poking, zoning and approaching. Toon Link has his projectiles mostly for stage control, so controlling where his opponent is going to be, limiting options and creating pressure for them. However, since Toon Link's projectiles have more coverage then Lucas's, he wins the spacing game. But Lucas definitely wins the close-quarters combat, with his grab game and combo's, along with his better frame data making him a better offensive fighter.Though Toon Link is on the lighter side, so his combo's will work for only so long.

Toon Link's finishers are tricky to land since the safest ones rely on projectiles like bomb and boomerang to connect for a F-air, Up-air, sometimes Up-Smash to kill at higher percents. But since landing projectiles isn't hard, especially with great projectile awareness, killing isn't a chore here. Along with his B-throw, the 3rd strongest in the game if I'm not mistaken, he has options. Lucas also has excellent throws, with his Up-throw killing even sooner then Toon Link's on platforms, and the rest having great scaling. Up-air is also a good finisher for Lucas if I'm not mistaken, but attacking Toon Link from below when he has a bomb in hand is difficult to say the least.

Gimping Toon Link is often called an easy task, but I personally almost never get edge-guarded (Except by Shiek, thanks needles!). Hookshot is an extremely important tool to use when recovering. You can go from 3 body-lengths away from the ledge to above your opponent in an instant if you grapple and jump right away, or mix-up and roll, attack at ledge, etc. Lucas has some good ledge-guarding thanks to the large coverage F-air and D-air provide, but if Toon Link is patient and aware, he can maximize the length of his hookshot to avoid any and all options. Lucas, on the other hand, might be fairly easy to bother, since his optimal angle to recover at is where our bombs and boomerang can travel. Unlike Ness, however, Lucas's projectile can travel undisturbed, even if a projectile connects, due to its multi-hitting nature. And if Lucas is well-aware of his own Z-air, he can also stall similar to Toon Link, though his Z-air tether is shorter, and Toon Link can throw bombs down to intercept. With enough mix-up and speed, he can try to be safe, but it's easier for Toon Link to edgeguard Lucas then vice-versa basically.

Overall, from an analysis-only standpoint, it seems very even. Both characters each have their own good tools and strengths to use to win the match. I can imagine Lucas can take out Fox pretty well because of his fast-falling nature and ease to gimp, so I hope Toon Link can serve you better. I can see it being positive for Toon Link, but again I'm not a Toon Link vs Lucas master, so take everything I've said with a grain of salt. I just didn't want to leave you hanging either. Let me know what you think. Apologies for the essay though!

 

[Dɛαd]

Does anyway have tips to fight Mewtwo? I don't know how to play vs him... I can't camp and I can't fight too close. His Side-B f me up..

 

[GreenT]

What are some opinions on the Mario match up

Does anyway have tips to fight Mewtwo? I don't know how to play vs him... I can't camp and I can't fight too close. His Side-B f me up..

Try using zair a lot. I find zair helpful against Mewtwo. Also try and bait the side B out with projectiles and punish. Some Mewtwo players will use side B a lot, because they are predicting you to use a projectile. I don't know if I helped but I hope I did a little.

 

[Grandma Wilkins]

What are some opinions on the Mario match up

The mario matchup is very hard. I think that along with RosaLuma it may be one of our hardest matchups. Just try to bait the cape as much as possible, and use zair to space out his aerials. But personally, I switch to a secondary for this matchup, typically Marth.

 

[GreenT]

The mario matchup is very hard. I think that along with RosaLuma it may be one of our hardest matchups. Just try to bait the cape as much as possible, and use zair to space out his aerials. But personally, I switch to a secondary for this matchup, typically Marth.

I have a strong Ike secondary. I find that matchup easier. I also use Palutena, but I don't like that matchup.

 

[Dɛαd]

I have a strong Ike secondary. I find that matchup easier. I also use Palutena, but I don't like that matchup.

I think Mario MU is even, as far as I know. I'll try to find my set vs Ally where I did not bad (still lost the set btw)

 

[GreenT]

I think Mario MU is even, as far as I know. I'll try to find my set vs Ally where I did not bad (still lost the set btw)

Alright that would be great. Where did you verse Ally?

 

[Dɛαd]

Alright that would be great. Where did you verse Ally?

Smash Intensifies 2, a regional at Montreal

There you go

 

[ILJ]

Smash Intensifies 2, a regional at Montreal

There you go

That was a good display. Thanks.
You had the match man but you missed the two fairs :'(.

 

[Dɛαd]

That was a good display. Thanks.
You had the match man but you missed the two fairs :'(.

I Knnooowww... I'm still doing nightmare about this LMAO

 

[Halfy]

The mario matchup is very hard. I think that along with RosaLuma it may be one of our hardest matchups. Just try to bait the cape as much as possible, and use zair to space out his aerials. But personally, I switch to a secondary for this matchup, typically Marth.

Mario honestly isn't that big of a deal. zair of course is good if you read a cape, but most Marios won't use the cape too often due to its lag. Mario has one of the most predictable recoveries in the game, so we can edgeguard him pretty easily if you are careful to not get hit by his frame 2 recovery.

Mario is a combo character with an amazing down throw, so avoid his grabs as much as possible. Use zair and projectiles along with nair and bair to zone him out, then we can finish him off at a decent percent with fair, back throw, up air, up smash, or an edgeguard will even work pretty early if you can read him offstage.

When edgeguarding Mario, use arrows to rob him of his jump, then bait airdodges by coming close to him but jumping back towards the stage. Even at ridiculously low percents, Mario can be gimped with weak aerials if you rob him of his jump.

Basically, just take stage control at the start of the match and try to get Mario offstage and not let him back on.

 

[JimmyTheCaterpillar]

Hey, Toon Links! The Dadeldingos are now officially Tinking (I'm so sorry) with the D3xTL matchup!

Your input would be greatly appreciated! You can find our MU thread in the link below! Hope to see you guys there!

http://smashboards.com/threads/read...currently-discussing-toon-link.395045/page-14

​

 

[Halfy]

Hey, Toon Links! The Dadeldingos are now officially Tinking (I'm so sorry) with the D3xTL matchup!

Your input would be greatly appreciated! You can find our MU thread in the link below! Hope to see you guys there!

http://smashboards.com/threads/read...currently-discussing-toon-link.395045/page-14

​

This matchup in a nutshell

I'm so sorry.

 

[JimmyTheCaterpillar]

This matchup in a nutshell

I'm so sorry.

lol I love how this doesn't even show why Dedede has the disadvantage in this MU. It's ok, though. I deserve it for the tink pun .

 

[Halfy]

lol I love how this doesn't even show why Dedede has the disadvantage in this MU. It's ok, though. I deserve it for the tink pun .

The joke is that it's heavily in tink's favor

Yeah, I could see how that was confusing lol

I'll type up the matchup in the morning, I'm too tired right now

 

[Blue Banana]

Hi, the Olimar board is now discussing the Toon Link matchup. Any input is appreciated.

 

[Abbey Street]

Greetings, young heroes.

In this age of ninjas, bounty hunters, space princesses, pyromancing plumbers and the Satsui no Hado, it is easy to lose track of or interest in lesser threats. Such a blind eye can be one's undoing, especially given what lurks in the shadows.
A great evil, ready to rise again, to hold the world in giant fists.

However, young heroes, know that evil has a familar face. Ganondorf, the King of Evil, risen once more, seeks to twist the world into a realm of darkness, where no light can exist. Young heroes, will you be prepared for your inevitable struggle against Ganondorf himself?

You owe it not only to yourself, but to the whole of Hyrule, to be ready to face the King when the time comes. If you feel you are not ready for the epic confrontation, then click on the image below to head to the Ganondorf Matchup thread, where you can read, discuss, and devise a battle plan amongst the rabble of his evil legion.

​

 

[Moobussir]

Greetings, young heroes.

In this age of ninjas, bounty hunters, space princesses, pyromancing plumbers and the Satsui no Hado, it is easy to lose track of or interest in lesser threats. Such a blind eye can be one's undoing, especially given what lurks in the shadows.
A great evil, ready to rise again, to hold the world in giant fists.

However, young heroes, know that evil has a familar face. Ganondorf, the King of Evil, risen once more, seeks to twist the world into a realm of darkness, where no light can exist. Young heroes, will you be prepared for your inevitable struggle against Ganondorf himself?

You owe it not only to yourself, but to the whole of Hyrule, to be ready to face the King when the time comes. If you feel you are not ready for the epic confrontation, then click on the image below to head to the Ganondorf Matchup thread, where you can read, discuss, and devise a battle plan amongst the rabble of his evil legion.

​

lol spam projectiles u gud son

Okay seriously I'm coming to discuss now

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

I have an announcement regarding this thread and the future of the Toon boards.

The observant among you will notice that the thread name has been changed, and this reflects the new direction that is being taken. We can no longer rely on MU guides being put together by the TLBR. History has shown that any TLBR will be doomed to inevitable failure, but it served its purpose while still active. This post has been a long time coming, but I'm now opening up this thread more to the general public, specifically, any posts you make that are considered informative, correct, and useful will be quoted and edited into the OP alongside any guides left behind by the TLBR. My hope is that this will further inspire you to make valuable contributions in this thread to push Toon's metagame forward and give him the fighting chance he deserves.

For now, we will continue discussing any MU you want to talk about. If you know a particular MU inside out because you play it all the time, then by all means, tell us what you know; you don't need to wait till someone asks about that MU. If later on it becomes apparent that certain MU's are not being talked about, I may make a post directing everyone's minds toward those MU's momentarily. If at any point you feel you want the opinions of the opposing character, which you should, it's a simple matter of going to their board, finding the appropriate thread, and making a post informing them that we are discussing their character here, at which point you leave a link. I'm sure you guys can handle that part. Later on if I'm convinced that there is enough activity, I will try to impose more structure on the discussion.

It would be nice if we could complete the MU chart in the OP, and certain MU's already present will need to be revised for sure due to patches and developments, so feel free to check out what we have currently to see if you agree or not. I will be editing in your quotes to the OP, but to ensure quality I will be helped in deciding what posts get chosen by other members of the TLBR who have agreed to help out. They will be indicating their opinions by 'liking' posts.

If you have any questions or suggestions, please PM me.

 

[ILJ]

Toon link VS. Robin
MU ratio: 50-50

At my locals I play Dath, arguably the best robin alive. He beat nairo's in dittos (doesn't mean much but worth mentioning). Me and him go back and forth because unfortunately this match up requires alot of patience and focus and on any given day one of us can be the winner.

In this match up toon link has to do, well, what he always does, namely, camp. But the camping will have to be based on a mid-range, in and out game - that is, semi aggressive while still creating space to ensure your camping.

Robin's special is a long beam that can reach across platforms and thus trying to spam from long range will not be beneficial because for one he will just shield, and two, his beam beats all projectiles. Also he has the book and sword which become available to him after using the specials. These items have significant knockback, do solid damage, and can be thrown across the screen as well. So if you want to lose fairly quick play from long range. The best range is mid range because of Robins great aerials (fair and bair), being close will cost you. I assure you that Robins fair and bair can destroy tink quickly, don't get anywhere near them. Keep distance using bombs, zair, rang and arrows to your discretion.

Robin is a zoning character. He/she uses side special, "ark fire", to assist in zoning. Constantly beware of this move because similar to toon links bomb combos, robin gets combos off of this move. They can forward air, grab, up smash, etc. The best way to avoid this move is to honestly anticipate it when robin is trying to create space for zoning reasons. They will also use it for edge guarding. When they do this you will get hit every time unless you beat them to the stage or avoid it by other means like recovering onto the stage directly. This will be Robins main edge guarding tactic though, rest assured.

Aside from the following, once your above 100%, robin 9/10 times will look for their kill throw confirm - down throw into up air.

The MU requires you to camp very patiently and always looking for Robins strong points to be shut down. If you heed these instructions you'll be a step ahead. Goodluck.

 

[HyLeN]

Not sure how i feel about robin being 5-5. It's definitely a close mu and robins zoning is on par with ours, but the over all mobility toonlink has overwhelms robin. Toonlink can avoid robins projectiles much easier because of that mobility. Robin, a lot of times, is forced to shield since he's too slow to run away or jump to avoid our projectiles so we get free grabs any time we force him into his shield. In my experience on the mu, it isn't drastically in anyones favor but i feel it's slight toonlinks advantage. Maybe 5.5-4.5. Toonlink overall avoids getting hit and gets much more mileage from his projectile confirms and he arguably also wins the off stage game. Forcing robin offstage means he is going to eat some damage, you can make quick damage by doing bomb->footstool and if he's low enough it can potentially gimp as well, if he's high enough to make it back you're already on the stage ready to edgeguard. Robin can kill very early with his dthrow->uair or other levin sword setups but his grab range hurts him a lot making it fairly difficult for him to grab a moving target. The best way to play this mu IMO is to jump around his projectiles playing very bomb/zair heavy and put pressure on him off stage with falling projectiles.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

The Rosalina sub-forum is analyzing Toon Link again this week. Here's the link to the page if you have anything to contribute.

http://smashboards.com/threads/409125/

 

[Moobussir]

I've only ever fought one Robin (twice), so my experience is limited, but from that experience, I found that Toon Link can afford to be in Robin's space with sword attacks. Their attacks have a long range, but notable startup, with his fastest being N-air and B-air at Frame 9, whereas our N-air and B-air beat that at 6 and 7 respectively. That's a little too technical for even my taste, but basically, because Robin's slow in the air, and we thrive well in the air, we win while challenging an aerial Robin. But you still MUST respect the Levin aerials, because the hitboxes are huge, and they can all kill REALLY early and well.

I found that Arrow's are actually really useful in this matchup, and I found myself using a LOT of arrow's towards the end of my match, since they outrange uncharged Thunder and fly under Thunder and ArcFire, and they'd tie with Elthunder and Arcthunder. Another potentially underlooked tidbit is that Hookshot can tie with any of their projectiles, making Thunder and Elthunder disappear, and making Arcthunder/Arcfire explode on the spot. Arcthunder is risky to tie with since it can suck you in, but now you know.

Be careful when returning to the ledge, because it's easy to be hit with Elwind. Maybe not spiked, but whether you Up-B or Hookshot, you are very likely to collide with the wind. On the other hand, enough strategic projectile usage will be able to gimp Robin, because their recovery is so linear.

Robin is tall enough to be hit by the bomb explosion when it hits the lower BF or DL platform and they're under it, so use that to create more pressure. Remember they're slow so chasing you is a chore for them, but don't get too far or they'll be ready with a ranged spell or even an item to throw.

That's all I have to contribute for now. I'll talk about Greninja once Robin's discussion passes.

 

[WatchfulComa24]

I'm struggling against Rosalina so what can I do to make the situation better for me?

 

[KirbyFan20]

Anyone have advice against Corrin? This MU always seems to give me trouble every time. Any advice?

 

[Grandma Wilkins]

I'm struggling against Rosalina so what can I do to make the situation better for me?

For Rosalina, camping works quite well when Luma is in play. Once your projectiles take out Luma, that is when you have to go in while you can. For approaching at this time, sh bomb throws and aerials work very well due to Rosalina's hitboxes having a type of blind spot when around 30 degrees (Not temperature, geometry) away from you, making approaches with bombs and zairs quite safe. Zair also does wonders, as none of Rosalina's aerials can rival it when spaced well.

Full hops around her are the last things you want to do, as that will put her in range of her uair, which is possibly her best move.

But Grandma, doesn't her down b destroy your projectiles? Not when you bait it out. Sometimes baits can be as simple as angling a boomerang away from her and then going in, or just bomb shenanigans. Personally, I like to do a JCBT up throw when Rosalina is at usmash kill percent to bait out the down b, and then I just up smash her to her death. That works well against all characters with a reflector.

For edgeguarding, try your best to space yourself around that uair, and her up b can be hit easily by a bomb, setting up a lot of follow-ups.

For recovery, always hookshot when possible to avoid dair and Luma crap.

I really don't know what to say for stage choices, so help would be appreciated here. Although I would recommend wide stages to give you space to move.

Even though I made this matchup seem reasonable, this is a very hard matchup. A Rosalina with good Luma spacing has the ability to completely trap Toon Link, punishing you for doing something as simple as pulling out a bomb. To give yourself a chance in this matchup, do your best to stay away from Luma while in play, and take the chance to attack when it is gone.

I rate this matchup 40:60

 

[RonNewcomb]

Anyone have advice against Corrin? This MU always seems to give me trouble every time. Any advice?

I second this. A bad Corrin will use dair, which should be shielded then punished with Spin for damage or a smash for KOing.

A good Corrin is like Cloud but without the drawbacks.

Anyone have thoughts?