Time Travelers - Town wins! Time travel mechanics rarely used!

[#HBC | Laundry]

I can't delay this **** any longer.

**** you Ran.
**** you Reyth.

Once I'm done catching up in games that are not this significantly long, it's *****ing time.

 

[Nicholas1024]

Scatter brained and impulsive. Tbh, I could probably easily sway him if I needed the vote bad enough. I think Swiss could as well. I dunno if PLSD could anymore after ruining their credibility with inactivity.

I think he's looking for where to be and I haven't felt that any of his flips were unnatural.

As for Nich in particular, he's been so balls ******** about a lot of things I don't care about the switching. This is exactly what I was talking about when I said he was an easy mislynch.

You do realize that you're a more likely lynch than I am at this point?

What can I say? I didn't have the strongest reads at the time. The read on you, KK, was the only read that was based only on whether you agreed with me. At that point, the July read was influenced by my strong scum Nich read, as she had been acknowledging the points in the case against Nich, but dismissing them with no more reasoning than "i don't see scummy motivation behind it". I'm always wary of that type of defense, especially when someone uses it to defend my top scumpick. Maybe I didn't state it as explicitly in my post, but you can see it's there. For the reads on Nabe and Reyth, note that the fact that their thoughts lined up with mine was brought up as a secondary point. The main reasoning was that they were being active about generating content.

Reyth I agree with being active and generating content, however Nabe I have to strongly disagree with. The content he generates does not tell us anything about his reads, his reasoning, or his alignment. (And of course, the only way to prove this would be to do an ISO on Nabe. I've done it, so I'm sure of this, but I can't exactly force everyone else to do it.)

I did have a different reason, which I showed in 1149. It juist took me forever to post it because that's how long it took to reach that point in my catch up. What is there to show that it's scum leaving an out rather than town actually with a different reason?

This is more or less the central problem with motivations, although you can point at the scum motivation for stuff, unless there isn't any town motivation at all, you can't PROVE that was the motivation for doing it.

No, that's not what I said at all. How does that post in any way imply that I didn't think Ran was scum for what he had done? I was just looking to find more about Reyth's switch to Ran (which came pretty suddenly) -_-

You didn't say it, but if someone said "Yes, this is typical Ran", it would have made a good backdoor to get off the case quickly.

Okay, you're either misrepresenting my posts, or just not reading them clearly enough. Please fix that.

The REASONING for his original read was bad. Here's the reason for his town Nabe read, based on posts 1-176:

"I already explained the SK one, but regarding nabe, he seems to be a rather solid contributor, without being in the forefront."

KK, explain to me how this is good reasoning for a town read? In any case, I was attacking the apparent CONTRADICTION between his case and his original town read. His case took into account plenty of Nabe's 1-176 posts and tries to show scumminess in them, which contradicts his town read based on those posts given earlier. Nich states later when confronted about this that he was wrong about his first town read, which I accepted.

First off, the not being in the forefront was a meta bit, Nabe is never a town leader from what I remember. The main reasoning behind the town read was Nabe being a solid contributor (which I was indeed mistaken on.) However, what's the point in asking the question to begin with? As was proven, it's quite easily dismissed with the three words "I was wrong", and the fact that the past and present reads conflict implies that fact anyway!

You completely misread my posts.

July went out of her way to quote posts ABOUT DG. Pretty much any time anyone made a post along the lines of "i don't understand the motivation behind dg's play and i don't like it" (which was said a lot), July would be there saying "yeah i agree", without adding anything new.

You seemed to do the same thing whenever someone said Nich was town, although not to as great an extent.

July has more or less explained that by DG being her number 1 scum read. If you want a parallel, any time someone mentions Nabe's alignment, I'm usually there to comment on it. (Of course, my comments then go ignored. I've forgotten how many times I've asked people to comment on the Nabe case in detail, and IIRC only Reyth and July have done it. )

I re-read the case and noticed that he had a point about Nabe's lack of stances, so I clarified. What's scummy about this?

I believe Kawaii answered this bit.

I am certainly not alluding that I know DG is not scum, and I don't see how the bolded suggests that at all.

I think what the line is conveying is more or less "That's all there is to say on this issue, Grey is town, end of story." I'm not going to push this as INSTA FLAWLESS SCUM TELL (like Nabe would), as I've made similar mistakes myself, but Kawaii does have a point.

DG was being anti-town, but that doesn't make him scum. That's the best way I can put my stance on DG, and I've been consistent with that.

Ah. You probably shouldn't use the phrase scummy behavior to describe anti-town play, as most people won't understand you correctly.

For the record, I agree with Degray that anti-town and scummy behavior are two separate things. To use a classic example, Frozenflame (an old vet) is almost always inactive, which is obviously anti-town, however through lots (and lots) of experience, I've found his inactivity has no bearing on his alignment, it's just him noticing that I'm in the game. (Inside joke, every game I've been in with him he's lurked through.)

Don't exaggerate... I do nothing of the sort. I was asked for my opinion of DG's claim, and I gave it. I said I could understand the timing of the claim because of his role.

I disagree, you come off as very supportive of Degrey with "There's no reason to disbelieve his claim."

You left out where I said "defend with meta", which doesn't really hurt my argument.

I can't agree with your Ran case simply because Nabe has been doing fake contributing via questions for the entire blasted game, not just 3 posts. The meta defense mention comes off as you not feeling sure regarding how valid your case is.

Why is it null? Why is asking pointless questions that don't help town in an effort to appear town null? I call him scum for my own reasons - I don't give a **** about being original.

I agree that this is scummy, and that's why I'm on Nabe so hard.

Why is it off-colour?

Moreover, why do so many of your points against me say "this is off-colour" or "this is odd" without much of an explanation at all?

Kawaii gives an explanation most of the time, and in the couple instances where he doesn't, I think it's fairly obvious.

I said "Would Ryker unknowingly be this scummy as scum?" Could townRyker ever have a reason to act scummy? Sure. Could scumRyker ever have a reason to act scummy? Sure. Is there anything to suggest that it is one scenario over the other? I don't see anything.

Um... neither alignment has motivation for acting scummy. Admittedly, Ryker's claim does explain some of his play.

Interesting, because I happen to think a lot of your reasonings here weak as hell and not substantial. Look at how many times you say "this is off-colour" or "this is odd" or "i dislike this" without showing why it's an actual scum tell. I have been scumhunting, but you've either been conveniently ignoring it or it's been lost in the sea of crap that is this thread. My reads will get stronger as time goes on - keep in mind we're still in D1. I'm already starting to solidify some of them.

It might be D1, but we've got about as much content as your average full game by this point. And you're scumhunting hasn't exactly been stellar, let's leave it at that.

Regarding Nabe in general, I'm going to have to go back through his posts and dig up the questions that I feel don't serve much of a purpose except fake contributing.

@Zen
I didn't mean I'd dig up Ran's FE play and compare it to this one, just that I needed to reread him in this game and that there's a precedent for him being idiot town.

 

[Reyth]

For the record I se Nabe's questions throughout the game as genuine scum hunting. For quite awhile I thought Ran looked town too.

 

[T-block]

Thanks Ryker - I'm good with that response.

@t-block: have you noticed the way Ran has been tunneling me to the exclusion of all else? His read on me is wrong, and his smug confidence in my alignment disgusts me. I don't trust him with that role AT ALL.
And I believe him because from the sounds of it, that is a role that will be verified by the mod upon the start of a new Day, so I don't see why he would fakeclaim it.

Yes, I've noted the way he is constantly on you. You state here that you BELIEVE HE IS TOWN, yet you still want to lynch him. This isn't an inactive "i don't know if he's scum, but if he's town he's useless so it's okay". This is "you're probably town, but i want you lynched". This also reeks of self-preservation.

Do you honestly believe that if all of town were to tell Ran to follow their direction, he would disobey?

 

[Nicholas1024]

I've been thinking, and a couple points about Degrey's play still strike me as odd, despite his claim.

1): Why not claim right away? Since he claimed D1 under little pressure, why not just tell everyone right away what your role restriction is and get right into scumhunting?

2): Given Ryker's comically over-inflated ego, why not just play normally and push lynches through himself? After all, I'm sure Ryker is confident that he can find scum and get them lynched with his 1337 skillz, so why not simply act on that, and claim only if you fail in that regard?

Also, on further reflection, I dislike the claimed role, as that basically gives him a guilt-free reason to be on any lynch regardless of what happens.

 

[T-block]

It is way too much tinfoil hat.

VG.jpg, would you mind if I turn the question back on you? Who would you use Ran's ability on and why?

^TB, I want you to answer this as well.

At this moment, I would take the two scumpicks approach, and limit it to July and Ran. They are my two strongest scumpicks at the moment, and what's more, I can see them as scum together.

 

[videogames.jpg]

Anyway, I'm sure Ran is going to go straight to Scum for X1 whenever he reads this.

Compare this guilty claim and series of posts: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=13081049#post13081049

To this (fake daycop) guilty claim and series of posts: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=12390671#post12390671

 

[T-block]

^I was actually looking at that too Asdioh. Keep in mind that Ranmaru read the whole game of DKR.

 

[videogames.jpg]

Yes, I've noted the way he is constantly on you. You state here that you BELIEVE HE IS TOWN, yet you still want to lynch him. This isn't an inactive "i don't know if he's scum, but if he's town he's useless so it's okay". This is "you're probably town, but i want you lynched". This also reeks of self-preservation.

Ah well. I can't GUARANTEE he's town, but even if he did it would be a sigh of relief for me. Honestly, even if we directed his role, it would still be anti-town.

Do you honestly believe that if all of town were to tell Ran to follow their direction, he would disobey?

I haven't seen anyone try to dissuade him from picking me/Nabe :/

^I was actually looking at that too Asdioh. Keep in mind that Ranmaru read the whole game of DKR.

Good stuff.

 

[Reyth]

Ya I mean gosh dang all of us would react the same way as town as Asidoh did and NOT as Ran did. Ran acted as if he knew the guilty were true and was only trying to get the town to lynch Zen first as his last act of desperation.

I totally agree that even if the town were to attempt to direct Ran's role it would be anti-town; I mean we have to make a choice a full day ahead AND use a lynch to do it.

 

[T-block]

TB, who IS the focus of your posts? Who are you pursuing cuz I honestly don't know if it's not Nichy-boy. I'd take a stab at saying July possibly...?

I mean your vote is even on Nichy still too.

It's been Ran and July.

You're absolutely right that my vote is not where it should be.

unvote
vote: Ranmaru

Questions asked that do not seem genuine, over the top reaction to the gambit, a premature claim and an unjustified call for a claim from Zen.

Yes, his role is provable, but I don't see why it can't be a scum role.

 

[Reyth]

Btw T-Block I see KK's case against you as reaching on alot of points.

 

[T-block]

Ah well. I can't GUARANTEE he's town, but even if he did it would be a sigh of relief for me. Honestly, even if we directed his role, it would still be anti-town.

I haven't seen anyone try to dissuade him from picking me/Nabe :/

Good stuff.

Why would him flipping town be a sigh of relief for you? Is that even what you said? I don't really understand the first paragraph.

Ya I mean gosh dang all of us would react the same way as town as Asidoh did and NOT as Ran did. Ran acted as if he knew the guilty were true and was only trying to get the town to lynch Zen first as his last act of desperation.

I totally agree that even if the town were to attempt to direct Ran's role it would be anti-town; I mean we have to make a choice a full day ahead AND use a lynch to do it.

So Reyth, based on everything that's happened so far, is Ran town or scum? Do you want to see him lynched?

Those are two separate questions.

Guys, we can direct him not to use it, right? Or am I missing something.

Btw T-Block I see KK's case against you as reaching on alot of points.

As do I.

 

[Reyth]

I am holding Ran as scum here -- the ONLY thing that dissuades me from wanting him lynched (consider at as a last minute doubt) is his claim of a secondary role power. I mean none of his behavior convinces me at all that he's town; in fact, positively the opposite.

 

[videogames.jpg]

Why would him flipping town be a sigh of relief for you? Is that even what you said? I don't really understand the first paragraph.

As I've said, even if he is town I don't trust him. If he were lynched and flipped what he claimed, that would be fine for me because it guarantees we aren't forced into a crappy position some Day when we have to choose between two specific lynches.
Is it self-preservation? Not so much that, it's more that I don't want something incredibly stupid to happen as the result of one person's utterly wrong reads.

 

[videogames.jpg]

Because think about it. If he uses his power Night 1 on two certain people, and then we have new information on Day 2 with the help of informative roles such as a cop, doesn't that screw us over?




Also, T-Bleck. lolol jk

/content

 

[July]

is july ur scumbud? she was viewing before u came on

I did see your claim before I left, but there was nothing I wanted to say until I saw a reaction from Ran. Speaking of Ran's reaction:

Yes. YOU WILL DIE YOU **** SUCKER.

I AM CAPTAIN KIRK. DESTROY THIS SCUMBAG.

I know this has been a toss-up for some people but I could literally see the wheels turning in his head as he read Zen's posts because he thought he caught scum. I saw this first hand as a hydra with him on mafiascum where he was "day-vigged" and idk even know how to describe it...he just like word vomited our role and the other player's scumminess...I literally facepalmed but it was just like instinctual for him. I see the exact same thing here.

Absolutely confident in TownRan.

Ranmaru your reaction is horrendously ugly. Based solely to how you acted to Zen's claim or whether it be a gambit, it's bad.

ZenTown btw. I'll die for this read alone. Throw in July too, I'll defend her too.

Unvote
Vote: Ranmaru

Pile dem votes on boys!

J, I see what you did here <3 Very good job at helping Zen with his gambit, and I can fully agree to ZenTown.

Anyways, i'm going to sleep.

Here are my FINAL scum reads if I am lynched:

Zen
Jpg
Nabe
SK

Those four.

Reyth is Null. He isn't scum for what he has said, he exagerates regardless of alignment. I still don't like him not going on Jpg. ;-;

KK is painfully null.

Nich is town.

Gray? I don't even know.

PL? I don't know. Obv keep an eye on him.

July town.

Tblock null scum.

For the Reyth thing, him not going onto jpg is actually a good thing imo because he's hung unto that as a town read ever since I remember him catching up, so I'm actually glad to see he wasn't easily swayed away from that read.

Also has the "actual scumslip" statement the videogames brought up factored into your read on Nich at all?

July dear/SK fellow, I want to know what you gained from this little back and forth from me and Zen. Then tell me what you think of DeGrey's hop along vote when it seemed Zen was committed.

Everyone, I would like one name as to whom you want to lynch after this rapid fire of Zen vs. Ran/KK. It doesn't have to be out of those three but I want to know who you have in mind and why (key factor).

I'll go first.

At the current time I am more inclined to vote for DeGrey simply because sans claim he has absolutely no redeeming factors. He claimed just to CYA (cover his ***) and sheeps it behind hydra johns. Then there is a big thing here where he comes in to yell at Ran and call him dumb or scum, but votes KK because that's what Zenny boy said to do. DeGrey is the single most scummiest player IMO and I've yet to see anyone even have scummier behaviour. (He even admits that he has scummy behaviour )

Vote: DeGrey

KK/Zen/Ran/July/Reyth/Nichy = Town
Swiss = lol Swiss
Null = Nabe/SK/TB
Scummy = VG.jpg/PLSD/DeGrey

I really enjoyed the back and forth between you and Zen, I've heard you say before you can read Zen pretty well and throughout the conversation I felt like you already had an gut feeling that he was town and from his interactions with Ran and yourself that became more solidified. As for Zen I could very easily see him trying to get a read on you and trying to size you up, he was very clearly scumhunting and getting a read on you and I took away a solid town read on Zen as well as yourself from the whole interaction.

DeGrey's hop along vote on you seemed very random, because he has pushed you as a possibility for quite some time and he's been stingy with his vote, but he then showed no hesitation to vote you almost immediately after Zen brought up the possibility that you were scum. Very convenient timing. I also think that his interactions with Ran throughout that episode was disingenuous and it detracted from Zen's gambit because DeGrey made a point to yell at Ran but insinuate he was town in his #1321. For those reasons the person I still want to lynch after the Ran/Zen thing is DeGrey.

vote: Ranmaru


he's a detriment

afk work

This sounds a lot like DeGrey's "liability" thing with Nich, except more straight forward with the vote. I think you explain this later though so I'll hold onto my thoughts for now.

Option A: Zen could be pulling this gambit as scum
Option B: Zen could be pulling this gambit as town

If Zen is scum Ran is conf-not scum (assuming only one scum team). So a really important question is "Is Zen scum here?". KK seems to be pretty sure not. I think not as well.

Ok so we assume Zen has pulled this gambit as town.

My gut on Ran's response was it was at first scummy and then slowly morphed into acceptable... I need to re-read this whole exchange.

KK, about your one person and all that, if I unltimately determine that Ran is town from all of this, I really het your scum list. You might very well be that vote.

I think I HET .jpg's Ran vote here; mainly because it reads as "Ran is town and he sucks so bad as a power role that we need to lynch him anyway". This sounds so much like a scum overreaction. .jpg how am I misreading you here?

Back after I re-read.

Mod: Votecount Please

Mod: Votecount Please

Mod: Votecount Please

This is saying that KK might be your vote for toDay, correct? Can you give me reasons why KK would be your vote other than that you really hate his scum picks?

I do like that you called .jpg out on that Ran vote though because I was thinking the same thing.

Right here. This is VERY bad play. I don't like this at all. I also don't like his subsequent explanation of this bad play as "I was just playing in the moment". If Ran is scum here this would be indicative of a fakeclaim and guilty overreaction which is how I am inclined to see this atm.

I mean everybody knows that when you are cop and scum claim cop its to out you right? Then WAT THE HECK was Ran thinking here by claiming? I think it is more likely his brain cells got overloaded because he is actually scum. Just my theory.

Back to re-reading.

I would be worried if Ran handled this calmly actually. His reactions were quick and pretty much instinctual, if he were scum I see him thinking about it a lot harder and at least taking on Zen a lot slower, if not calmer.

Time to explain my vote. It's simple, really. Imagine someone you think seems overall townie has been tunneling you all game. Suddenly he reacts extremely poorly to an obvious gambit, and then claims a role that can guarantee a lynch will be between two specific players the next day.
THE TWO PLAYERS ARE YOU, AND ONE OF YOUR STRONGEST TOWN READS. He has been making connection cases with the false assumption that I am scum. He is wrong, and if he continues charging forward blindly with this very powerful role, HE WILL (I'm assuming Nabe is town here) *GUARANTEE* A MISLYNCH ON ONE DAY. THIS IS THE MOST ANTI-TOWN THING POSSIBLE. A vig shot can be bad if it kills a townie, but all it did was waste a vig shot, not a huge deal. However, Ran's claimed role WASTES AN ENTIRE DAY. It guarantees scum a mislynch that they can't look bad for, because there are no other lynch options. It will stagnate discussion. It's kind of like the princess role.

Now, this might be a different story if Ran would listen to the input of others for who to use his ability on, but he's demonstrated nothing but thickheadedness this game, and I don't trust him with his role. I have NO problem lynching him toDay.

I...actually understood this better and liked your reasoning better than I expected to because I would be frustrated if my top two town reads were the only ones on the chopping block for an entire Day. However I am also not comfortable with a lynch on my town read toDay and I am confident in my town read on Ran. I also think that there are ways to avoid his ability being used in an anti-town way, so unless Ran is a solid scum read for you outside of his role and his claim it's not a good idea to push his lynch toDay.

Nobody else seems to want to vote for Ran, huh? At least agree with me that the path he's on is anti-town...
Just saying, if we find ourselves being forced to lynch between vg.jpg and Nabe tomorrow, I'm gonna be pretty pissed.
Also, I just thought of the fact that what if one of Ran's targets gets NKed?

I can agree that using his role the way he has proposed is not what I would prefer...my read on you is pretty weak but I don't want to have to choose between you and Nabe as a lynch either, but he doesn't think it's anti-town because he's trying to get rid of 2 of his scum picks.

That would be a nightmare. Hey any chance Ran's ability was made up on the spot in the scum QT? I mean your question about the traget getting NK'ed and my question about how the power would be revealed to the town do throw some monkey wrenches into it.

I also remember thinking that it was thrown in as an afterthought to make his claim sound more believable; e.g. his buddies in the QT were like "oh better throw an extra ability in there that sounds too strong to be scum held".

I hope all that isn't too much tinfoil hat. I think it needs to be discussed anyway.

The conversation was too rapid-fire between Zen and Ran for me to believe that it was made up on the spot. You said that you believe DeGrey's claim, yes? Well Captain Kirk as a time traveler definitely makes sense, the "bold leadership" role would be something very stupid to make up on the spot because it's provable but once again fits with the role, and double voter was provable. So what makes DeGrey's claim more believable or more pro-town than Ran's in your opinion?

 

[T-block]

@Reyth: His ability to limit the lynch pool makes you give pause to wanting to lynch him? I think you've already said why, but do you mind repeating it?

@vg.jpg: So just to confirm, you think Ran is town, but you're okay with lynching him because you think leaving him alive is more anti-town than lynching him.

 

[Nicholas1024]

Hey July, any chance you could link that game on mafiascum so we can take a look at Ran's reaction firsthand?

 

[videogames.jpg]

@vg.jpg: So just to confirm, you think Ran is town, but you're okay with lynching him because you think leaving him alive is more anti-town than lynching him.

I think he's anti-town. As for his alignment, it keeps flipping in my head. I'll have to discuss it with X1 when he gets here, but he'll probably say scum, and that's fine by me.

And yeah, I think leaving him alive could very well potentially be more anti-town that lynching him even if he is town. If we can find someone we think is more likely to flip scum, that's fine with me as well.

 

[Dramatic Flair]

Ran is town.

DeGrey is scum because he thinks Ran is town.

Hurp durp.

 

[Dramatic Flair]

Also, I'm almost certain Ran is town because it makes too much sense. Some people actually might want to lynch him BECAUSE he is town. I don't. I'm annoyed, but I don't.

 

[Reyth]

1) July does give me pause with her read on Ran; can you link to that game in MS July?

2) Well I noticed that the secondary role claim came later and on second thought it couldn't be made up but would be slightly re-named to sound like a town-aligned power

3) Alot of things line up for me with Grey's claim like his lack of voting and the timing of the claim and such

4) Well the questions are really: "Can Ran's declared power actually be a scum power? Is it too powerful to be scum held?" Beacuse that is the only thing about it that makes me think he could even be town here (besides July's read here now)

 

[Reyth]

@Grey: Ran hasn't answered your questions yet has he??

 

[July]

Ya I mean gosh dang all of us would react the same way as town as Asidoh did and NOT as Ran did. Ran acted as if he knew the guilty were true and was only trying to get the town to lynch Zen first as his last act of desperation.

I totally agree that even if the town were to attempt to direct Ran's role it would be anti-town; I mean we have to make a choice a full day ahead AND use a lynch to do it.

*facepalm*

Has any one considered that in a game with time travel, his role could be directed via time travel? It seems like everyone is jumping the gun by saying there is nothing we can do and his role will definitely be used in an anti-town manner.

Hey July, any chance you could link that game on mafiascum so we can take a look at Ran's reaction firsthand?

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=17759&start=75

That should link to the page where the dayvig claim is and Ran's subsequent reaction.

 

[T-block]

@Nich: Thanks for your 1482. If there's anything in particular you want addressed, let me know - otherwise I'm going to leave it. What's your stance on Ran right now, and why?

@July: I know you're quite convinced that Ranmaru is town, but IF he were to flip scum, would that affect your reads on anyone? Also, has your read on Reyth changed any? Where is it at now, and why?

 

[Reyth]

Time travel with Ran's role?? That seems even less useful to me...

 

[July]

Hurp durp.

I see you are not ignoring me anymore, eh?

I never said you were wrong about seeing Ran as town, but I don't think you are genuine at all.

 

[Nicholas1024]

Hm. After seeing Ran respond in basically the same way to something similar as town, I feel a lot better about him. So I'd put him back at leaning town for the moment.

Thanks for the link July.

 

[Reyth]

@July: Ran is TOTALLY calm in your link??

 

[Reyth]

I would be worried if Ran handled this calmly actually. His reactions were quick and pretty much instinctual, if he were scum I see him thinking about it a lot harder and at least taking on Zen a lot slower, if not calmer.

So your link and his behavior here don't line up??

 

[July]

@Nich: Thanks for your 1482. If there's anything in particular you want addressed, let me know - otherwise I'm going to leave it. What's your stance on Ran right now, and why?

@July: I know you're quite convinced that Ranmaru is town, but IF he were to flip scum, would that affect your reads on anyone? Also, has your read on Reyth changed any? Where is it at now, and why?

If Ran were to flip scum, I would then feel much, much better about Videogames, it would also reaffirm my town reads in Zen and Nabe (since Nabe was the second in his hypothetical limitation of the lynch pool). I might look into SK more, since Ran has poked at him a bit but they really haven't interacted much, and SK and PLSD are the only two people on the player list I think that is true about.

No, my read has not changed on Reyth, he's a town read, not a strong read like KK or Ran but he's shown me he is scumhunting and trying...I just disagree with most of his reads.

Time travel with Ran's role?? That seems even less useful to me...

No, I guess I didn't word that correctly. I'm thinking that there is some way to send him back to N0 to use his ability where it can't do any harm...

Hm. After seeing Ran respond in basically the same way to something similar as town, I feel a lot better about him. So I'd put him back at leaning town for the moment.

Thanks for the link July.

No problem.

 

[Reyth]

I'm just going to note here that so far July's defense of Ran is reaching on two points:

1) Use of his power in time travel being somehow a superior option
2) That calmness with Ran somehow suggests that he is scum

PEDIT: So you are saying you meant BACK in time?? Where does OS' illustration ever say we can travel BACK in time?? (rechecking his illustration...)

 

[Dramatic Flair]

Role speculation with no goal is not what we need.

 

[Reyth]

The why does she use it as a defense??

 

[Reyth]

Plus I'm having a hard time digging up that illustration but according to my memory of it ALL time travel was FORWARD in time. Still checking...

 

[July]

@July: Ran is TOTALLY calm in your link??

So your link and his behavior here don't line up??

I disagree, mafiascum, at least what in my experience, is a lot more laid back in general, and considering we were only 4 or 5 pages the reaction was proportional. And remember Flavour Analysis was our HYDRA, so I got his immediate reactions and he deff was not calm nor collected hen it happened.

I'm just going to note here that so far July's defense of Ran is reaching on two points:

1) Use of his power in time travel being somehow a superior option
2) That calmness with Ran somehow suggests that he is scum

PEDIT: So you are saying you meant BACK in time?? Where does OS' illustration ever say we can travel BACK in time?? (rechecking his illustration...)

4. Knowledge of Tim Travel isn't necessary to play, but it might be useful. Try reading up on wormhole theory and Stephen Hawkings recent papers.

Stephen Hawkings happens to be my hero ;P and wormhole theory states that you can traverse a wormhole back in time to the point where the wormhole was created, but no further. With a N0 in this game its easy to infer that N0 is the origin of said wormhole and thus I would fully anticipate there are roles where time travel back in time is prohibited.

Also, its kind of common sense. Time travel can work both ways and is often depicted in popular culture as occurring in the past as well as the future.

 

[Nicholas1024]

Ack, I looked back over Nabe's early posts, and I have to confess that pointless questioning isn't something I can fault him for, the questions aren't scummy (and in fact seem townie) on their own. Rather, the problem in his play is that he doesn't actually do anything with the answers to said questions. (He'll claim they help his reads, of course, but due to his lack of stances with reasoning, it's unprovable.) For example, he did a good bit of questioning on SK regarding his suspicion of T-block's mechanics post, but despite going back and forth for a bit, it never actually led to anything more than a mild "Don't like that you're still voting him, hope to see more from your slot tomorrow." And that's a series of questions he actually followed up on somewhat! Usually he doesn't even mention the answers to the questions he asks. For example,

This is a fair assessment, T-block seems very much into his vote on you.

What do you think of my discussion with SK about T-block? And of SK in general?

I respond with

Hm. SK would be a gut read for me, but I'm feeling townie on him. His rapid-fire posting seems legit to me, and I like how he identified T-block's second point in 151 as Wifom. Regarding the discussion, I've been focused elsewhere, but it feels profitable enough to me.

Anyway, thanks for the comment on town T-block's meta. I think that'll come in handy in the future.

And he never mentions it again.

 

[July]

Role speculation with no goal is not what we need.

There is a goal, NOT to lynch Ranmaru just because of his role because there may be a way to direct it.

 

[Reyth]

Can you explain how he could even be sent back in time and help town? I see it even less than sending him into the future...