Tier List Speculation

[standardtoaster]

Except for the fact that ZSS upsmash hitboxes are still out when the whip is BACK IN HER POCKET.

ZSS whip hitboxes do not clear properly in debug mode. Them staying out forever is not accurate at all.

 

[Deleted member]

ZSS whip hitboxes do not clear properly in debug mode. Them staying out forever is not accurate at all.

Can confirm by using PSA to look at zero suits hitboxes

please use PSA people its jesus christ reborn

 

[Frost | Odds]

Jesus Christ wasn't nearly as useful

 

[TheGravyTrain]

Is PSA more useful/better then brawlbox? What's the differences?

 

[Deleted member]

Brawlbox is a tool that lets you edit basically everything except for movesets

PSA lets you edit movesets.

 

[Frost | Odds]

Friendly reminder to everyone that stretching is top tier.

Someone was complaining of hand pain in the Bowser Skype, and had never seen that video or this post.

You can't advance the meta if your hands are cramping!

EDIT: Ganon still underrated, yo

 

[CORY]

@Lunchables @ Strong Badam
i just realized that i can't search individual threads. do you guys happen to have your tier lists saved anywhere?

 

[Deleted member]

@Lunchables @ Strong Badam
i just realized that i can't search individual threads. do you guys happen to have your tier lists saved anywhere?

http://smashboards.com/threads/tier-list-speculation.331666/page-677#post-18726713 Strong Bads is basically mine but formatted better, so here.

 

[Strong Badam]

@Lunchables @ Strong Badam
i just realized that i can't search individual threads. do you guys happen to have your tier lists saved anywhere?

You can also search within a thread by going to a thread, scrolling up to the Search function, and then checking "Search this thread only"

Also lol @ everyone callin me out on my Lucario placing and then Aftershock happened. A couple things on my list I'd probably revise, but nothing major enough to warrant a full revision of the list.

 

[Deleted member]

Lucarios really ****ing good

Its kind of weird how everyone says he has an awful neutral and sucks vs CC'ing when he actually has a great neutral and some of the best anti-cc options in the game. Lucario players are trying to trick us.

 

[CORY]

You can also search within a thread by going to a thread, scrolling up to the Search function, and then checking "Search this thread only"

holy ****, mind blown : o

i'm such a forum scrub...

 

[DrugsM2]

Friendly reminder to everyone that stretching is top tier.

Someone was complaining of hand pain in the Bowser Skype, and had never seen that video or this post.

You can't advance the meta if your hands are cramping!

EDIT: Ganon still underrated, yo

can confirm stretching is insanely important, i showed my sister how far my thumb bends backwards after 7 months of doing it and she was in shock lol

 

[Helsong]

I feel like Ganon should be doing more. He's got great followups from flame choke, down throw is amazing, rar-uair can basically give you a free tipman. Also, rar tipman into ledgegrab is pretty good and should be used more. I see a lot of people trying him out and playing him, but it's either using a lot of Flame Choke or they're still doing the Melee thing. Combining both would be great. And that's not even getting into the float. Watching the Ganon RR at Afershock opened my eyes a bit.

I don't know if I would place him much higher than I've seen him, but I don't think players are doing as much as they could be? That's my scrub opinion, anyway. If Ike wasn't my bae and I wasn't flirting with Roy and GnW on the side I'd totally grab Ganon as another character.

 

[The Baron]

I feel like Ganon should be doing more. He's got great followups from flame choke, down throw is amazing, rar-uair can basically give you a free tipman. Also, rar tipman into ledgegrab is pretty good and should be used more. I see a lot of people trying him out and playing him, but it's either using a lot of Flame Choke or they're still doing the Melee thing. Combining both would be great. And that's not even getting into the float. Watching the Ganon RR at Afershock opened my eyes a bit.

I don't know if I would place him much higher than I've seen him, but I don't think players are doing as much as they could be? That's my scrub opinion, anyway. If Ike wasn't my bae and I wasn't flirting with Roy and GnW on the side I'd totally grab Ganon as another character.

Anyone else find ganon hard to combo as well. I know he's heavy and meaty as **** but comboing him seems like a honest to god chore most times

 

[Player -0]

Not really. Only with Ness sometimes because I haven't practiced DJ shenanigans nearly enough.

 

[CORY]

like... you're the one doing the comboing to ganon?

he's a pretty good combo weight/fall speed for a lot of the cast, afaik. doesn't mario out of throws and doesn't luigi out of aerial strings.

 

[Zoa]

Well...we have an underdeveloped player base, and we're still learning a mechanic that's pretty alien for Smash, so...we just need to go even further beyond.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKjKrjTWDBg

 

[Venom_909]

Please fix Lucario that is all. <3

 

[The Baron]

like... you're the one doing the comboing to ganon?

he's a pretty good combo weight/fall speed for a lot of the cast, afaik. doesn't mario out of throws and doesn't luigi out of aerial strings.

I probably should have reworded it to say following up on throws but essentially yes. It isn't too big a deal as I just go for more tech chases on him now but it just feels like I'm doing something wrong when I try to follow up on throws at low percentages. I know that weight is a factor on throw speed and follow ups but things that work on characters with similar weights, I just can't pull off against him.

 

[Jacob29]

Im really tired right now but ill comment my thoughts on this later.

so like whatever happened to this lmao

 

[ChiePet]

Welp, time to throw it ALL out the window now, guys.

even something as minor (and all minor changes we dont know of yet) as Olimar getting a new Up B changes things a bit.



#NOCONTEST

 

[steelguttey]

oh no oli is getting so much more changes

 

[Ripple]

Wait till you see new DDD. We'll have literally tens of players!

 

[ChiePet]

oh no oli is getting so much more changes

-slow clap-

blahblahbl- More importantly though, according to StrongBad on the Top Player/Character Vid 3.5 thread that there shouldn't be enough significant changes to the roster's balance to warrant making a new thread for 3.6, so there's that, but also understandable for only a handful of tweaks to change the top 10 by a fair margine.
WE MIGHT EVEN SEE FOX IN 1ST

Wait till you see new DDD. We'll have literally tens of players!

Why, did he finally get the option to throw Items like Peach back?
Or stop Gordos from appearing in the wrong spot/time to screw up Waddle-Dashes?

#MakeMeBelieve !!

 

[Phan7om]

Hopefully, eventually, they make every character fun to play as and to watch. Also how are some people getting told about the changes? Sign me the **** up on that (Kappa). But no reallly, i want to see 3.6 make character design just as much better as it did from 3.02.

 

[ChiePet]

Hopefully, eventually, they make every character fun to play as and to watch. Also how are some people getting told about the changes? Sign me the **** up on that (Kappa). But no reallly, i want to see 3.6 make character design just as much better as it did from 3.02.

afaik from just analyzing things from the 3.6 trailer. nothing besides what it grazes upon has been discussed or revealed yet, though.

 

[Narpas_sword]

Why, did he finally get the option to throw Items like Peach back?

He never lost it, turn items on.

That's why rules are 'items off and set to none'. If 'on' and none ddd throws items.

Tbh, Peach's Saturn, bobomb and beam sword should be governed by the same rules.

 

[ChiePet]

He never lost it, turn items on.

That's why rules are 'items off and set to none'. If 'on' and none ddd throws items.

Tbh, Peach's Saturn, bobomb and beam sword should be governed by the same rules.

This info is too good to be true; Never again do I want to hear complaints about Peach's pulls, lol. THANK YOU

 

[Narpas_sword]

er, should be, but they arent.

Peach still pulls those things despite items being off.

 

[ChiePet]

Had my first legit Peach mirror yesterday and he pulled a Beam Sword; I understand completely now. I will never, ever, dis-value the beamsword or question why it's the hardest thing to pull of her items.

Seriously, FTilt/FSmash covers half of dreamland.

 

[Player -0]

Toad?

10Toads

 

[howbadisbad]

this is ridiculous lol

the point of an animation is to indicate where hitboxes and hurtboxes are in relation to the environment, are they not? i don't have an issue with hitbox size, nor do i think characters are "op" or w/e because of the size of their hitboxes. is it too much to ask that an animation serve its purpose, though? come on.

Definitely, we should double the time gdubbs dtilt hitbox is out so it matches the animation.

 

[jtm94]

Or we could change the animation to match the hitbox by making the animation start later, end sooner, and be shorter overall.

My only gripes with GnW both playing and playing against him are his dtilt being so strong/good on shield and his dash attack 1. having so much stun and 2. sending behind him so you instinctively DI away and as a result go nowhere so he can land actually anything.

His recovery doesn't bother me, most bairs, nairs, or whatever beat it out.

I've been surprised at the lack of activity, especially after Aftershock. I guess there's not as much to speculate after seeing a tournament have almost all unique characters with little overlap in top 16.

 

[The Baron]

I've been surprised at the lack of activity, especially after Aftershock. I guess there's not as much to speculate after seeing a tournament have almost all unique characters with little overlap in top 16.

We've basically said all that needs to be said. Roy's d-tilt is good, lucario has got combos, diddy does, uhhhh, stuff, and a dedede(ripple) beat a fox(westballz) meaning ripple was right and he will never let the thread live it down. ever. hopefully. It'd be the right thing to do. Oh, and we even talked about rng again so we pretty much hit everything. We could talk about a link making a top 8 in a national. That was pretty cool.

 

[.alizarin]

Definitely, we should double the time gdubbs dtilt hitbox is out so it matches the animation.

or you could be less overtly absurd lol

 

[941]

We could talk about a link making a top 8 in a national. That was pretty cool.

For a character considered to be low-ish tier, Link seems to get surprisingly good tournament results.

 

[The Baron]

For a character considered to be low-ish tier, Link seems to get surprisingly good tournament results.

The more links I see, and the more wacky **** I see done with bombs, the more I'm convinced that he isn't as bad as everyone is saying. Not s-tier or anything, but with the conversions and pressure hero of time was pulling off, I would definitely say we might be sleeping on him just a little if only because his field of projectiles and diversity of playstyles he can have means that he can be pretty adaptable to many situations though it is far from perfect.

 

[941]

I'm guessing that Link is a bit underrated because he looks really bad when not played optimally. Good Link players are usually able to use his versatility with projectiles to pressure opponents and play around their weaknesses. Link also has some really good options for edgeguarding and closing out stocks. When not played optimally, Link looks bad because he has a really good weight and fallspeed for most of the cast to combo, and his recovery isn't that great.

 

[Bazkip]

While we're still on the topic of hitboxes, I kinda have to question the upper ones on these two

Yeah Eruption has a big visual effect, but that top one still seems a bit excessive.

I don't even know what that one on Aether is about. It's just...out there.

 

[The Baron]

I'm guessing that Link is a bit underrated because he looks really bad when not played optimally. Good Link players are usually able to use his versatility with projectiles to pressure opponents and play around their weaknesses. Link also has some really good options for edgeguarding and closing out stocks. When not played optimally, Link looks bad because he has a really good weight and fallspeed for most of the cast to combo, and his recovery isn't that great.

Sounds like ness syndrome. A whole lot of people pick him up because he seems easy, spams one move, gets rekt utterly and then the conception is that the character sucks when in reality, they really don't. Or at least not as much as people would like to say they are.