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The Winning Steak Cinemas: Video Archive & Criticism Thread Updated

Kinzer

Mammy
Joined
Jun 2, 2008
Messages
10,397
Location
Las Vegas, NV
NNID
Kinzer
3DS FC
2251-6533-0581
Err, I had to edit it, Syon just told me the ICs was a different player, so no I don't think it's the same person. :p

Sorry about all that, but everything's up to par now, now I just have to edit the tags with the peoples' names and junk, but I'm going to go eat so maybe another time later.
 

MaverickZ

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 20, 2009
Messages
68
Location
Portugal
hey there I have some vids I would like that you guys commented. These are my first offline videos (yeah:(). I finally met in person some of the players of the portuguese smash community, I had only played with them on wi-fi before this monday. We did a smashfest and we recorded some friendlies, there are probably more replays saved but these are the ones uploaded.

Flayl's channel usually has our smash vids, from tourney's, bi-weeklies, etc.
http://www.youtube.com/user/Flayl#p/u/4/JLS9xcu1RTo

Matchs:
NatP (G&W) VS MaverickZ (Sonic) 1
NatP (G&W) VS MaverickZ (Sonic) 2
NGFC (Yoshi) VS MaverickZ (Sonic)
NGFC (Jigglypuff) VS MaverickZ (Sonic)


Remember that these are some of my first offline matchs :p. We were only 3 on that smashfest (there aren't many smash players in the north of Portugal). We are still developing as a community, there were 3 tourney's already and the next one is coming (I haven't gone to any tourney btw -.-, and I probably won't go to the 4th one too).
I guess you can learn more about the players from our power rankings: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=264151
(notice my special spot on that one)
The last match with jiggs was kinda of random, I was messing around with homing attack and weakened bair in the end almost on purpose :chuckle:.
If I get more videos from that smashfest I might post them here.
 

Kinzer

Mammy
Joined
Jun 2, 2008
Messages
10,397
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Las Vegas, NV
NNID
Kinzer
3DS FC
2251-6533-0581
You need to play people who will force you to think about playing better.

Most of those matches were made up of going from one side of the stage and using a Spin Attack, and unpunished Spring -> Dairs.
 

BSP

Smash Legend
Joined
May 23, 2009
Messages
10,246
Location
Louisiana
Two quotes from people I fought on AiB:

"worst sonic i have ever playd, he seriously was running the time out on me, well a good purple upsmash desynch is what he deserved, serious i recommend NOT playing this guy, seriously DO NOT waste ur time, because you will be aggrivated at the end of these matches. Worst sonic award"

"He'll time you out if it's a 99 min match if you don't approach. All sonic mains do this, on wifi. Abusing wifi is not fun kids. And I recommend not playing him because of it. I'm not playing anymore because he's really annoying. And yes, I know you're going to copy and paste this somewhere. I want this to be a very long feedback lol. tl;dr He's annoying and will time you out. Not ggs I'm sorry. :l LONGER@ I want you to SCROLL@"

From an olimar and kirby user respectively...I'm gonna get the matches up eventually. Or I could just Wiimail them to someone who wants to see. I want some advice.
 

JayBee

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 13, 2002
Messages
2,173
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Green Hill Zone, MD/VA
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jamesbrownjrva
I'd post it up on youtube. An Olimar that can't hit a sonic with an upsmash on wifi should either get better or stop playing wifi. I wish i was good on wifi, but whatever. its like a "WHOLE NEW GAAAAAAAAAME!!!!"

"Ah, no its not..."
 

B.A.M.

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
1,538
Location
Fullerton, CA
NNID
Bambatta
I watched more and more vids. You seem to have habits. Like you go into auto-pilot mode.
yeah very true shado. After playing with that guy so much, i feel that has a tendancy to happen. What would u suggest to get me out of this? Thats why i feel i do better against ppl i dont play with ( well tons) like when we go to play with Tyrant or im chillin at our usual spot playing with Dao.
 

Kupo Rose

It's what my cutie mark is telling me ♫
Joined
May 19, 2009
Messages
2,980
Location
Scotland, UK
SoniKupo (Sonic) + marthshadow (Falco) vs NightSky (Fox) + zeldspazz (Kirby)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H60YY6-hTVU

Just purely for entertainment.

==========

@Trent: Not much of a critique but there were a couple of things I see you do and not get punished for it. At all.

From what I saw...

1. You roll way too much. Mostly retreating rolls after nearly everything you did
2. You mostly just spammed iSDR.
3. Predictable pattern :/ --> iSDR>Bair/Uair
4. You never did much running. It was always spindashes.
5. You kinda played like it was wifi. :dizzy:
6. The MK was hella bad...

I liked the first kill though, lol.
 

sonictailslink

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 21, 2009
Messages
497
Location
Henderson & Downtown Express, Las Vegas, NV
Here are some friendlies I had back on Sunday at Gameworld and on Monday at UNLV. Feel free to criticize them.

Tails (Sonic) vs. FOW (Captain Falcon) I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUUIXeET7yI

Tails (Sonic) vs. FOW (Captain Falcon) II
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29zuQ2RU_pc

Tails (Sonic) vs. FOW (Mario)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VS1Pn9X7XWw

Tails (Sonic) & FOW (Mario) vs. FireBullet (Mario) & ??? (Mr. Game & Watch)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYR6zaY0gBg

Please note on the video above, that is not Hino playing Mr. Game & Watch. I don't know the person's name, but he was using Hino's gametag

Tails (Sonic) vs. Badface (Marth)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmmLP1yUtok

Tails (Sonic) vs. metalfalcon (Sonic)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpxQASLFscI

Tails (Sonic) vs. Andre (Zero Suit Samus)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnINnOeGn8g
 

-Axis-

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Messages
273
Location
Peoria, AZ
Tails, there are primarily two problems with your playstyle that seem to be holding you back.
1. You commit to much to your attacks. This is something I do a lot too, so I've learned to spot it and have begun to make a point to fix it. When you have in your mind a set course of action on how to attack your opponent, you try to go through with it despite their reaction.
2. You have very predictable approaches. You were mostly just running up and shielding, and then you'd get hit when you tried to do something OOS (or grabbed for that matter). Watch some of the better Sonics and study their methods of approach. They all vary of course, but it's still a good thing to do. Part of fighting a Sonic is finding a way to beat his approaches, because if you don't you're going to take a lot of damage. Make this as difficult for them impossible. Make them tear out their hair in frustration as you run at them only to jump away with an empty shorthop or spring away to safety. Make them become more reckless when throwing out their brick-wall of attacks, because that's your chance to get inside.

Also, camping = good. :p You probably hear this all the time, but you really don't need to approach when you get a hefty lead. If you're a stock up, just play as safe and annoying as possible so you can rack up the optimal amount of damage before you die.
 

JayBee

Smash Champion
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Aug 13, 2002
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Green Hill Zone, MD/VA
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jamesbrownjrva
vs Razor: DDD's tend to wait for sonic to move at them all day. you have to provoke him better. you are gonna need to cancel spin dashes more as to make it as hard as possible to read you. that one HA kill was nice, but there was no reason to use it again at the end when you are at 100% or more. also, your patterns when you ASC were easier to read not only because oyu did it at a distance where he had more time to react, but then when you released it you got grabbed because you didn't mix it up with a jump cancel, spring jump special or anything. simply put, you didn't take advantage of sonic's mixups fully and got read for it. work on mixups. that's the key if you're gonna rely on spin dashes.

vs Joker: i liked your aggressiveness in this one, but you should bait that spot dodge from falco more. they like to do that early then grab right after for the chaingarb so bait that and punish instead. there were a few instances where you had him but you messed up so work on those patterns of attack so that its second nature. second, your attempts to spring against his phantasm will work better if you buffer the turnaround before hand, so that you can quickly lagless dair on the stage and get a possible followup. but i loved how you were able to give yourself multiple opportunites to gimp him offstage,hence 3:23. steak. you used more fakes and seemed more aggressive against this one, but different against DDD, which is odd, i guess you were more focused on the chaingrab of DDD then falco?

ill talk about the others later...
 

sonictailslink

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 21, 2009
Messages
497
Location
Henderson & Downtown Express, Las Vegas, NV
Tails, there are primarily two problems with your playstyle that seem to be holding you back.
1. You commit to much to your attacks. This is something I do a lot too, so I've learned to spot it and have begun to make a point to fix it. When you have in your mind a set course of action on how to attack your opponent, you try to go through with it despite their reaction.
2. You have very predictable approaches. You were mostly just running up and shielding, and then you'd get hit when you tried to do something OOS (or grabbed for that matter). Watch some of the better Sonics and study their methods of approach. They all vary of course, but it's still a good thing to do. Part of fighting a Sonic is finding a way to beat his approaches, because if you don't you're going to take a lot of damage. Make this as difficult for them impossible. Make them tear out their hair in frustration as you run at them only to jump away with an empty shorthop or spring away to safety. Make them become more reckless when throwing out their brick-wall of attacks, because that's your chance to get inside.

Also, camping = good. :p You probably hear this all the time, but you really don't need to approach when you get a hefty lead. If you're a stock up, just play as safe and annoying as possible so you can rack up the optimal amount of damage before you die.
Thanks Axis. I really wish I read this before I left to Gameworld today, but it was too late. I'll try to keep all this in mind. I may have to completely change up my gameplay since my current style isn't working at all. With camping, I've been told so many times that I still haven't gotten though my head at all. Now, I'm going to try to get it in my head. I'm just an impatience player. I just want to get the match over with and that's it. Hopefully I'll improve my gamestyle since I am in a bit of a depressed at the moment with life in general. Thanks again Axis
 

-Axis-

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Messages
273
Location
Peoria, AZ
Thanks Axis. I really wish I read this before I left to Gameworld today, but it was too late. I'll try to keep all this in mind. I may have to completely change up my gameplay since my current style isn't working at all. With camping, I've been told so many times that I still haven't gotten though my head at all. Now, I'm going to try to get it in my head. I'm just an impatience player. I just want to get the match over with and that's it. Hopefully I'll improve my gamestyle since I am in a bit of a depressed at the moment with life in general. Thanks again Axis
You're completely welcome. Just try to be more analytical when you play. Trying to balance playing the game and strategizing requires a whole lot of work and can really take a toll on your head, but i'm sure you'll become better at it with experience.
 

sonictailslink

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 21, 2009
Messages
497
Location
Henderson & Downtown Express, Las Vegas, NV
You're completely welcome. Just try to be more analytical when you play. Trying to balance playing the game and strategizing requires a whole lot of work and can really take a toll on your head, but i'm sure you'll become better at it with experience.
Okay, I will. Being a Computer Science student, I'm required to do a lot of analytical thinking so I'll try to do it with Brawl as well. I got to turn off the auto pilot and think though it more. I know for a Fredericks' Fact that I will hurt my head and probably slow my gameplay down a bit to think more through, but it will be worth it in the long run I hope.
 

Dark 3nergy

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 15, 2008
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6,389
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Baltimore, MD
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Gambit.7
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SW-5498-4166-5599
well with sonic hes got alot of different ways to approach the opponent through spin dash stuff. I agree with your thinking about slowing down and taking more time to think about whats going on in the match.

I believe one of the hardest aspects to learn about a fast character is how to control them in every conceivable situation. Your not alone in this struggle.
 

Trent

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 26, 2007
Messages
2,305
Location
New York, NY
Thanks for the advise Kojin. Those friendlies were played on two different days so my momentum might have been different.
 

Exceladon City

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 2, 2008
Messages
6,037
Location
The Lonesome Crowded Midwest
Here's a little mantra that should work for Sonic players. "Keep your mind moving as fast as Sonic's feet." Well, it's not really a mantra, but you get where I'm coming from. Even if you aren't doing alot of attacking make sure you can get the mindset of being able to mentally outrun your opponents. It's been helping me alot in some match-ups that I have trouble in.
 

Espy Rose

Dumb horse.
Joined
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Texas
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EspyRose
Jamz seems to have a pretty solid Sonic.

Sonic's main focus is to punish any and all lag on any moves you see that have said lag. Sonic's ground speed allows him to punish anything of this sort with terrifying efficiency.

Having said that, Jamz needs to work on his ability to read and punish. A lot. There were quite a hefty number of opportunities during that set where Sonic had a guaranteed grab (one of Sonic's best damage builders in that it puts most opponents in bad aerial positions) or smash. There were also scenarios were he should've applied more pressure to the Dedede, but failed to do so, and gave the Dedede room to breathe.

That, and he shouldn't be getting hit by Dedede's dash attack or sideB more than once.

He also, based off of the first match, tried way too hard to land smash attacks at near 0%. While this is all fine and good when they land, it's not something that a Sonic player should rely on for early damage. Sonic's smashes take forever to come out, and forever to end after the hitbox is released, and when it comes to vs. Dedede, that leads into a chaingrab off of the stage which builds up percentage, and puts you in a bad spot vs. Dedede.

Anyways, those were just my thoughts based on watching the first game.

=====

Second match reflections were worse. He played better in that he didn't start out trying to add up % with smash attacks, but that didn't really help him when he started trying for smash attacks around 90%.

He ran into Dedede's dash attack again as well, and although D3 didn't really slip up in terms of lag as much this time around, there were, again, several missed opportunities in the set.

Overall, his performance was worse not because of this, but because he played the Dedede match up completely wrong on this level. Sonic is suppose to abuse the sideB invincibility on this level. Dedede can't do a **** thing about it. Instead, he uses it once here, once there, but opts to approach.

Had he stayed behind and forced Dedede to approach by abusing the invincibility, he just might have won that match.

=====

Overall, it's bluntly obvious that he was being completely outplayed. He's good, but he still needs a bit of work.
 

Kinzer

Mammy
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Jun 2, 2008
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Kinzer
3DS FC
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From a critic's perspective, that kid needs a lot of work. If that's the best U.K. has to offer, I'll be very sadface :( knowing that he ought to do better to take less damage from recovery; not to mention cut down on the running around his opponent and no nothing while they toss out attacks.

That's what Sonic ought to do, work the mindgames so it's like they throw out attacks when in reality he will perform a feint and punish the attack after~. >_<
 

Ciro67

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 26, 2010
Messages
40
ahh ok. thanks for the quick responses.

i'm just wondering. you say abuse the invincibility against D3? i've got two questions; a) what other matchups/situations is this useful for, b) if i recall correctly, it's where you charge side b then release b and you'll do a hop - you're invincible for like 10 frames in this hop?

i'll keep other questions for the q&a thread, i promise! ^^
i might consider secondarying Sonic, just for friendlies first. he's actually pretty fun and the community here seems friendly :D
 

da K.I.D.

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
19,658
Location
Rochester, NY
new wes vids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmHp9HR9HVw&feature=channel unfinished vid vs mah boi san.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Zluo3tperc&feature=channel good example of what happens when you have a guy that plays the matchup vs sonic for 2 years and knows all that the character is capable of.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=551fYtiO2xQ&feature=channel atomsk stays creating new dance crazes.
EDIT
the last vid just got fixed. but viewers with sensative stomachs may want to steer clear of this one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sl_p6th2w1Y&feature=channel
 

Browny

Smash Hater
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
10,416
Location
Video Games
Well that wasnt exactly some top play right there :/

Roll dodge behind oos was really bad lol and he never camped outside ikes range, always running in and rarely mixing it up with a walk or feinting any approach.
 

Joemama8

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 23, 2009
Messages
270
Location
Muncie, IN

Kupo Rose

It's what my cutie mark is telling me ♫
Joined
May 19, 2009
Messages
2,980
Location
Scotland, UK
Dunno, I think Muhsoce was just using Snake for lulz anyway.

He posted an awesome Sonic combo video a while back.
 

Kinzer

Mammy
Joined
Jun 2, 2008
Messages
10,397
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Las Vegas, NV
NNID
Kinzer
3DS FC
2251-6533-0581
Hai guyz... I have more vids for you guys to take a peek at. I feel like im getting better everytime I put up more vids. Hopefully the tourney this weekend can give me a better indication. Just need to stop SDing and getting ahead of myself and I think I will be in good shape.

Tear these apart and tell me what I doing wrong!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqqeqdWsfJE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWtBo3W88Ck&feature=channel

I gotz that need for speed now!
...The videos got removed...
 

B.A.M.

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
1,538
Location
Fullerton, CA
NNID
Bambatta

Ciro67

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 26, 2010
Messages
40
I've watched X play three matches against Fluxus, two against Nismo, two against Z, two against Zex, and two against a Falco I can't remembeer the name of. Any other videos of him? i can't find any.

Were vids recorded of the recent St Phillips tourny that espy won?

are there any vids of speed/sonicmaster5? i saw some against atomsk and chu, but the quality was bad and laggy.

thaanks in advance! :D
 
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