The Winning Steak Cinemas: Video Archive & Criticism Thread Updated

[TwinkleToes]

Lmfao.

I love this.

Am I the only one that's surprised to hear such a ghetto accent on KASR's voice?

Other than that he talks exactly like he types. Lol.

Uh, so, anyways, KASR shield grab more. Don't spam fair and ha quite as much. Work on your technical ability so you don't screw up and do things you don't mean to...

Et ceteraaaaaaa~

 

[infomon]

ahahahahaha

wowwww

kasr 2 good

and yea I thot he'd have a high-pitched 12yo voice

but the "owwwww"s and "wheeee"s are so pro

Edit: ^^^ I'm gonna practice commentating my own matches like that so I can do it in tourney
wheeeeeeeeeeeee

 

[Espy Rose]

I was suppose to update this on Friday, but ran into complications.

Either way, the archives are now fully updated. Added videos from:

Shado
Trent
Omega75
Sonikupo
Suna
Ed
Ryuken
Sonic Orochi
Kinzer
Tails
5P1FFY
KASR
Kai
Espy

My videos with mikehaze have already been seen, so there's no need for me to relink them. Besides, they're already in the archive.

It's been awhile, and even though they're friendlies, I would appreciate someone just watching over them and catching the bad habits I pick up during the matches.

 

[Kinzer]

Kinzer (Sonic) Vs. FrozenFlare (Donkey Bong).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5blSWzkVQqM

Fresh from the oven. Recorded today and played today as well, thanks Tails for uploading this!

Unfortunately no HQ version is available (yet?)

 

[KirbyandSonicrock14]

Am I the only one that's surprised to hear such a ghetto accent on KASR's voice?

Other than that he talks exactly like he types. Lol.

Uh, so, anyways, KASR shield grab more. Don't spam fair and ha quite as much. Work on your technical ability so you don't screw up and do things you don't mean to...

Et ceteraaaaaaa~

I should try that. I just can't keep the adv. on Marth, so I shoudl try to shield grab more. And need to work on my recovery gimmicks with Sonic, so I'll nail them everytime.

P.S

Is N air and b air better to start an offense.

 

[TwinkleToes]

Don't use nair. Ever.

Personally, I wouldn't suggest using bair as an approach (particularly against Marth) but maybe someone else here has a good mix-up option for it. I just find it comes out a bit too slowly.

 

[da K.I.D.]

Kinzer (Sonic) Vs. FrozenFlare (Donkey Bong).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5blSWzkVQqM

Fresh from the oven. Recorded today and played today as well, thanks Tails for uploading this!

Unfortunately no HQ version is available (yet?)

Im legitamately upset that you won that. That was the most upsetting match ive seen in a while. some of the stuff you did was cute, and you had a few nice strings, but you had to get the dude to 240% plus, everystock, and the one time you didnt, he killed himself to kill you, and he should have won for that move. LOL at that second stock, you are at 50% and you take him from 20% to like 160% without getting hit and than you get baired off stage, and reverse fair spiked for a kill at 80. I wanted to cream and cut myself at the same time

Don't use nair. Ever.

Personally, I wouldn't suggest using bair as an approach (particularly against Marth) but maybe someone else here has a good mix-up option for it. I just find it comes out a bit too slowly.

nair is quite good in situations where any aerial would connect (follow up after a side b hop hit) and it helps because it does good damage and refreshes all your other moves

 

[Camalange]

I' m a fan of Nair.


Bair, Uair, and Fair are just so much more practical/spammable though, so most people like to shun Nair :/

 

[infomon]

nair is quite good in situations where any aerial would connect

This x1000
it sounds silly but it's right

If you're in the air and they airdodge near you, bust out a Nair so when their invincy frames are done they get hit. Either time it so the first hit gets them (it's sometimes a kill move! that comes out faster than Bair and they can't escape like Fair), or time the last hit so you might be able to actually follow-up in the air (lolwut aerial comboz).

I love Nair when you're on top of each other on the ground, and you know they're going to spotdodge (or they already have). Like in those times when you're both shielding near each other, and/or they think you're gonna try and grab. You shorthop OoS so you don't have the 7 frames of shield-drop lag and start a Nair which hits on frame 5. It actually costs you 7 frames best-case to get the Nair out (1 frame to jump, 1 frame where all inputs are ignored (which is why aerials OoS can be annoying sometimes), 5 frames for Nair to start)...... but w/e. The point is the Nair smacks 'em good, and if it doesn't hit then it doesn't leave you in much lag after either (unlike Fair, your other frame-5 aerial). If they're at low %, you can often follow-up after the Nair, too.

Third reason I love Nair: killmove!! When you land an Fsmash or Bair (that of course doesn't kill them cuz you're Sonic), and you're chasing them off the stage, and you've got a million tools at your disposal (cuz you're Sonic, lol), but then you just stop following them forward and put up a Nair wall which they can't get past as they try to find a way back to the stage. Fastfall Nair is great for this, like out of the peak of an SDJ. Alternatively, simply SDJ > Nair oft hits them when their options are limited and they're trying to return..... and they expect you to do something like go for a Dair semi-spike or attempted spring-gimp.

sorry for WoT

 

[Kinzer]

Personally, I wouldn't suggest using bair as an approach (particularly against Marth) but maybe someone else here has a good mix-up option for it. I just find it comes out a bit too slowly.

Spinshot over Marth and try Bair.

Im legitamately upset that you won that. That was the most upsetting match ive seen in a while. some of the stuff you did was cute, and you had a few nice strings, but you had to get the dude to 240% plus, everystock, and the one time you didnt, he killed himself to kill you, and he should have won for that move. LOL at that second stock, you are at 50% and you take him from 20% to like 160% without getting hit and than you get baired off stage, and reverse fair spiked for a kill at 80. I wanted to cream and cut myself at the same time.

It's not my fault the guy is playing DK, has great DI, and Sonic's lack of kill moves! >

I also call adapting johns, that was the third match or so of our friendlies and I was still trying to pick up on his habits, I think I did rather well when I said to him "alright, do you mind if we play one more game?" I had enough of being 2-stocked when I know I could beat him, and when this match is playing, I put it into overdrive.

P.S. two more vids, one's another Sonic ditto, and another is my Ike... on Japes... I get *****... by the stage...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5blSWzkVQqM&fmt=18

Actually, that's the same match of me against FrozenFlare... it's just when I saw it before I went to sleep, a HQ version wasn't available... might be good to watch it now that's easier on your eyes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VUG7EAb-NQ&fmt=18

Kinzer (Sonic) Vs. Tails (Sonic) - Rainbow Cruise

I jab-locked him for a while... but since it was friendlies I only did it to him for a while to show him that it can be done and to try to not fall for it... I also love the last kill, but he could've done the same so it isn't too special... fun match if you ask me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKYolbld5uo&fmt=18

Kinzer (Ike) Vs. Tails (Sonic) - Jungle Japes

The first time I (had to) play Ike in forever (just so I can help Tails with that MU too) and the random stage selection just had to pick Japes... out of all stages I swear... And I know it could've been avoided if we only had neutrals on, but I wanted to practice on all the stages Vegas has legal in the selection... and Tails would get the same practice too... *sigh*

 

[ShadoFiend]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBkzX5N11WY&feature=channel_page

I got a new vid. This is wifi though and i just got DDP down on it. Im working on the Oli match up. I know this match was kinda a decimation but he went icees after it so i couldnt get more. But any advice on this match up more than I already know? I dont have a huge problem with it. But I still don't feel comfortable while playing it.

Also Nair is a completely situational move. It can be used as a nice run off stage edge guard. But i personally use it after shooting down from a spring dair. Just to catch someone off guard. Like with my match vs Omni's meta knight. It sweet-spotted and killed him. Complete luck on my part.

 

[chaoechidna]

Nice match dude, you made pretty quick work outta that oli. Your Spin jump-> bair seemed to be amazing. I also like the Scourge texture you have going on there. Only one thing that I recommend is the instant ledgegrab (edgeguard), which works wonders against most tether grabbers (ivysaur, samus and zamus, links, sheik). But it was wifi, and maybe it's hard to get it to work on wifi. Also, I noticed you use Uair as a momentum cancel. I do that too, but everyone says fair is the best, especially fair-> downB. It's a bad habit of mine. Awesome match though, great sonic skills dude. I really liked how you figured out how to get around spin dashing into Oli's grab and then just owned the guy. Quick thinking man, good match.

 

[ShadoFiend]

Thanks and yea. Wifi = me not being able to grab the ledge at all. I'm still learning the match up to this day lol.

 

[chaoechidna]

Yea, my wifi blows so i never use it at all. When i did use it I got owned all the time. Oli MU sucks hard man but from what I saw, you have it down pretty solid.

 

[~TBS~]

nair is used as a gtfo move, or the previous situations mentioned.

Shado, i saw no ddp, but usage of dash dance to run in opposite directions. but thats not important, what important is how you handled this match. nice moves there, nothing went wrong. (the usmashes are spammed until they hit you. the only thing you can do is block or try to run)

i liked the way you fought around Olimar's strong points, but i want to see you vs P~S. he'll test out your understanding of olimar.

 

[KirbyandSonicrock14]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXC8AwdQKQo&feature=PlayList&p=B125BE8B07244741&index=15

A guy name Kuraudo from Hawaai played Sonic. What do you guys think about his Sonic?

edit: vs.Falco(Convael) and vs. Lurcario(Kasai)

 

[ShadoFiend]

Kuraudo is from Canada and he went to hawaii. I played his Sonic at Genesis. It was pretty good. Kinda did some moves that were easily punished but he isnt a bad player at all. I like the dude and his Sonic has a future.

His DI needs ALOT of work

 

[KirbyandSonicrock14]

Kuraudo is from Canada and he went to hawaii. I played his Sonic at Genesis. It was pretty good. Kinda did some moves that were easily punished but he isnt a bad player at all. I like the dude and his Sonic has a future.

His DI needs ALOT of work

I knew a SF player who was good with DDD from Canada. I didn't know that man was from Canada though? Must have cost him a lot of money to go down to Hawaii.

 

[Arikie]

I'm asking for tips/pointers/advice/critiquing on my sonic, particularly I'm looking for advice in the match up against Falco.

If you don't like the sound/music/backround noise/talking/whatever just MUTE IT please, and listen to something else while you watch. Also I'm using music and texture hacks on my wii, but not gameplay hacks.

Also I'm really sorry about the crappy video quality, I'll use something better next time.

These are friendlies, so there are a few mistakes in game play that wouldn't have been made in more serious play. I'm sorry I don't have any videos of me at tournaments, yet. I am going to a tournament this weekend hopefully i can get some quality video there.

Thank you for the critique from last time.

BTW if anyone wants to, you can do annotations.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2OK8VonvHc
siege(gaw) 2:55

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phXmfzR_TrI
siege(gaw)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0De51Qq8FuY
ignis(falco)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUFN3YyTd9g
ignis(falco) 0:50 - 1:17

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaG8Pz4Mn2Q
ignis(snake) 4:07

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20wum-cjKtA
siege(gaw)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruCjCUoWnOc
d12(lucario)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvcRlEPFLlk
siege(gaw)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsNm4UD2arA
ignis(falco)

...50th post since May 2008

 

[Exceladon City]

I only looked at the first video in that group.

0:11-I love doing those. It throws people for a loop...sometimes.

0:25-Never go for HA when they are above you. Unless you're too low to spring to the ledge and your opponent is chasing you off stage. Being above GW is a bad place for you to be unless your name is Meta Knight.

0:43-Ugh turtle is a pain. But good spinshot attempt.

0:49-Good spotdodge punish.

0:52-Don't bother chasing GW offstage. His UpB makes it **** near impossible to do anything to him.

0:57-That was pretty weird. You weren't quite high enough for it to autocancel but it did anyway. Pretty cool though.

1:12-1:29-Good stuff with the spinshots and punishing. You're pretty good at shutting down Nair with hyphen smash.

1:35-Momentum cancel with Fair and spin charge to cancel the rest of the momentum. It works like GW's bucket brake.

1:40-Some would get on you about the use of Fsmash when your opponent isn't at kill percents, but it's GW and IMO you can spare one or 2 a stock against him. Hypnosmashing is a good way to bait an airdodge as well.

1:45-I approve.

1:54-Quick charge HAs are too good.

2:13-I like that. Nair comes in handy alot more than you'd think.

2:58-Doesn't it feel awesome to get a kill like that?

3:17-Nice mix-up.

3:55-You're really good with Usmash.

4:37-GW Uair can be an annoyance, especially when it can refresh his moveset.

4:52-Killer Bair. lol puns

So yeah you've gotten alot better. That GW wasn't very good but you played it well. You knew when to GTFO and when to run in and punish which is basically how that match-up should work. You did good with the HA but everyone on here will tell you to lay off of it. To each their own. If you know how to mix it up HA can be pretty useful.

 

[KirbyandSonicrock14]

I got a question about d smash. Every time I tr to kill with it has somewhat of a slow start up time. So is true that dsmash has bad ending lag?

 

[Kupo Rose]

So is true that dsmash has bad ending lag?

Yup .

 

[Chis]

Fsmash: Frame 18
Lasts: 44 frames
hitbox duration: Frame 18-22

Dsmash: Frame 17
Lasts: 57 frames
durationof hitbox: frame 17-37 (not 100% sure)

From SL's frame data thread.

 

[Kinzer]

DSmash does not have bad ending lag, the problem with it is that it loses a lot of power as the attack draws to its end, and if an enemy shields it Sonic is open to counterattack... however it does have some counter-mechanism for preventing said punishment... For one, the attack has a lot of shield pushback, even moreso if you charge it... and it's release from a charge is very fast, so even if they spotdodge it they are guaranteed to at least take the weak hit from the attack best case scenario. While it won't kill, it will send like 2-3 Bowsers away from you, which is enough to give you breathing room. If the attack is shielded they're going to need a quick and long ranged attack before you kick in the IASA frames/are able to safely punished.

Allow me to elaborate, assuming you hit the opponent with the weaker parts of the hitbox, you are nearing the end of the duration of the move, and shield pushback does have some lag before an opponent , so considering all the time it takes them just to act and react... you (might) be safe. Now if you hit with the earlier parts of the hitbox, while I think it poses much more risk, it still has some defensive rewards, as I said, it has a lot of shield pushback... and uhm... err... how do I put it...? I guess you could say thatwith the pushback and shieldstun considered, it leaves you somewhat safe, but still leaves you open enough for something like Ike's DA to punish you... well, I did say how the ladder hitbox is safer than the former/earlier parts of it, but it's still better than say Bowser's DSmash, eh?

Have you tried using it against airborne opponents? It's the same thing as trying to spotdodge the attack, which is why I love it for that situations.

With all that said, it is still to be used sparingly, much like any other of Sonic's kill moves. I don't think even good MK's spam their DSmash, and the reason DSmash only works is because people can't punish it correctly, but when you play/main Sonic you tend to learn some core game mechanics...

 

[Arikie]

I only looked at the first video in that group.



So yeah you've gotten alot better. That GW wasn't very good but you played it well. You knew when to GTFO and when to run in and punish which is basically how that match-up should work. You did good with the HA but everyone on here will tell you to lay off of it. To each their own. If you know how to mix it up HA can be pretty useful.

Thanks alot, I'm still working on some habits like HA and using fsmash, I play against my friend's gaw alot so I guess I know the matchup pretty well. Any chance I could get any help with one of my matches against Falco? I've been playing against Falco a while now but I still struggle to pull a win.

Edit: That one KO at 2:55 was the best kill Ive ever had in a while.

 

[ShadoFiend]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efNFOnDxmz8

Enjoy lol. IT has a pretty long intro but. Yea. I use my Custom Sonic texture. The ShadoScourge. Its hella legit

 

[Sagen du Smash]

Here is my first upload for critique. I know my Sonic has room for improvement! This is using the Brawl+ 5.0 nightly build btw.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lueTnAvnMMQ

 

[Chis]

Critique a Brawl + video?

 

[Sagen du Smash]

please?...

 

[da K.I.D.]

some one get ispin in here

 

[Kinzer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylWOSm_gcx0

Kinzer (Sonic) Vs. Drex (Lucario) - Final Destination

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQfyNNlAYTU&feature=channel

Kinzer (Sonic) Vs. Drex (Lucario) - Lylat Cruise

Feel free to add the HD code onto both videos when they're both HD available (they will be if they don't appear to be) (&fmt=18), I promise you won't regret watching these matches. One of the best Sonic's, and finally a Lucario who plays the MU right. I don't think it's completely right since he shouldn't have lost (maybe), but what will you do?

This was a tourney set, Drex won the 2nd match we played on Frigate, but neither of us remembered to record it. :/ I'll need to make a habit out of that now that I have an SD card waiting to be loaded with replays and infinite replay and more.

Be on the lookout, I still have three more matches to be uploaded within the week.

I'll never give up even if the MU is proven to be unwinnable by any means, this one's for all the Sonic's fanboys like me who still try.

 

[Camalange]

One of the best Sonic's, and finally a Lucario who plays the MU right. I don't think it's completely right since he shouldn't have lost (maybe), but what will you do?

I honestly thought he played the MU poorly, lol...but I guess that's what you meant since he ended up losing xD

no offense to you though, gg on the victory. how'd you place overall in the tourney?

 

[Kinzer]

Oh right, I should go report that shouldn't I?

out of 11 entrants, I got 5th.

Not the usual turn-out, but we all know the culprit is school.

 

[Browny]

sorry kinzer, but that Lucario played the MU horribly.

soooo many times all he had to do was put out a hitbox and it would have beaten your attacks but he just roll dodges all over the place with no intent.

GGs for winning though, landing of the grabs so often is hard as hell I know, and given the roll dodge spam its even harder lol. Would have liked to see a little less spindash to approach though, when aura sphere/ftilt/fair can stop it so easily

 

[Kinzer]

:<

Meh, oh well. I thought it was pretty good, considering that Luc's roll is too @#$% good, meaning I have to put out a hitbox and hope it hits.

 

[Boxob.]

93'd page.

o:

 

[da K.I.D.]

ninety FOURTH page

get blapped

 

[Boxob.]

Awwww fuuuuuuuuuuuck.

 

[Camalange]

ROFL

blapped

 

[infomon]

frist psot?