The Ultimate Life Form ~ Shadow the Hedgehog for Smash Ultimate! (Maria...)

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Look, Im a huge Shadow fan, and my first post was going to be mostly be centered around how Shadow like all of you have said, deserves a fighter slot. But maybe, Shadow wasn't meant to be in smash peroid, and theres just many reasons why this is the case. I keep hearing Shadow's the most requested echo and one of the most popular sonic characters ever, so what? Shadow is a still cult status, he's not still not as iconic as Tails, Knuckles and Eggman, more or less he's a second banaana in relevance in all sonic fan demand (in all classic Sonic fundamentals) considering he gets rarer face time in covers and main advertisement as Sonic and the classic characters. He gets more extra content compared to the other newbies but he never gets mainstream exposure that allows characters like amy and knuckles to show up every game, cartoon and comic. It's like he's struggling to make a iconic impact when he's a lesser main character than even Amy is.

Also look at his fanbase, it's full of fujoshi, edgy kids and memetic posting. No one probably takes Shadow seriously anymore as a marketable or favorable asset to nostalgia fan pandering. since he's always been kept back from achieving a position that makes him a house hold name like Ken, Zelda, Tails and Mewtwo. The former has something Shadow doesn't, the ability to have quality success in their gaming legacy thus generating better fan reception to now adult seasoned hobbyists preserving their novelty in fan media and fanservice activities. Shadow.......failed to grow momentum properly after his game and didn't get a much acclaim as Knuckles and Tails once did because those two had more set the bar for quality in their gameplay, he started getting divisive when he came back to life, and theres the demographic of fans he over all caters to.....Mostly kids who grow out of him and girls who ship him as this edge marionette of self serving pleasure pairing him with all the guys more than the girls. Sega probably looks at Shadow as the most inconsistent fan favorite to appeal to after Sonic because he keeps getting less relevant as a character and more a fan magnet that can't decide which type of fans he has to satisfy. The fujos? The SA2 fans? The Archie Fans? The Mariadow fans? Sega keeps Shadow on a stricter lease than the the classic 4 because they don't want to risk another bad game experience after shth bombed, and his personality caters to a specific standard in a theme only a modern platform game can handle, Shadow just is too insufferable to push to a commercial way like say Eggman or Tails. Even on pixiv, he's mostly a teenage girl fantasy and no one older or is actually a dude, would draw Shadow constantly to represent a majority of novelty that allows him to be reguarded as a Smash newcomer, on twitter I've seen amy and tails get heavier push from actual sonic purists that came off as visionaries in taking the characters they grew up with and pushing them with all their hearts to be in smash.

Finally Shadow gets divisive backlash and is still in a bad light with people since his game or even his debut. It's almost like Shadow has to start over and reinvient his impact to video gamers by not being a mix of all sorts of wrong angles to explore in a sonic concept. Shadow needs to be worthy of a iconic playable slot. His games are not critical acclaimed, he himself caters to a census of young try hards and fangirls, he has no real serious fan recognigition outside of modern fans that use his character to prove himself amongst imaginative legends like DK or Bayonetta, and He's stuck in hiatus with all the other characters thanks to sonic teams current mostly reaching attempts to appeal to the fans with only the main character and the main villain.
Because of this, I'm siding with you!

Shadow was only an icon for for the first two games that he appeared in and since that one game that he starred in he's fallen off and he will continue to fall off until Sega forgets him altogether and that's exactly what they want!

It's time that we give up for good, we've lost, Shadow's never happening as a playable fighter period and Sega knew this (which is why we got Joker, he's the edgy rep the entire time and fits it far better than Shadow ever will!)

Because of this, I hate Shadow the Hedgehog and no longer a fan of him and never will be again, I never want him in Smash (playable or assist) again or want to be a part of the Shadow fanbase again, I'm sticking with Tails, Knuckles or Eggman as the 2nd Sonic rep.

Shadow fanbase, just close this thread now, he's never getting in and no matter how many times you support him, it's not happening, it is final!
 
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TerminatorLOL

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Because of this, I'm siding with you!

Shadow was only an icon for for the first two games that he appeared in and since that one game that he starred in he's fallen off and he will continue to fall off until Sega forgets him altogether and that's exactly what they want!

It's time that we give up for good, we've lost, Shadow's never happening as a playable fighter period and Sega knew this (which is why we got Joker, he's the edgy rep the entire time and fits it far better than Shadow ever will!)

Because of this, I hate Shadow the Hedgehog and never want him in Smash again, I'm sticking with Tails, Knuckles or Eggman as the 2nd Sonic rep.
Sega is not trying to phase Shadow out. They brought him back in Forces, shown him off as a main rival in Team Racing, and made his third appearance in Smash. It may not be in the form you want but being a AT is not a sign of disrespect for any character that gets that spot.

I also never considered Joker a "edgy" character.

Honestly if this is all it takes to make you hate a character then I don't think you where that big a fan of him in the first place.
 
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Sega is not trying to phase Shadow out. They brought him back in Forces, shown him off as a main rival in Team Racing, and made his third appearance in Smash. It may not be in the form you want but being a AT is not a sign of disrespect for any character that gets that spot.

I also never considered Joker a "edgy" character.

Honestly if this is all it takes to make you hate a character then I don't think you where that big a fan of him in the first place.
Never will be a fan of him again! Been a fan since his first game appearance until today, but no more!

Take me off your support list, you filthy Shadow supporter! I want nothing to do with Shadow or his fans in general ANYMORE, you are all scum, just like the rest of the Sonic fandom!

2pgztr.jpg
 
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TerminatorLOL

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VioletSmashfan VioletSmashfan As you wish.
Shadow Supporters: 142
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OnePerson

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Hiii! I've just registered because I want to be in the supporters' list. I really want Shadow for Smash and I'm trying to show my support when I can (don't know what else I could do honestly)
Real talk, I know the fanbase is crowded with weirdos like... oh, mostly any fanbase... huh, who would have said it. Also, I know Sonic Team has done very weird **** with Shadow and that is awful, but he will still be my boi. However, I don't blame the fans but Lizuka... he is like... a fanboy of Shadow who has a very edgy perception of him, like, he was in charge of Shadow the Hedgehog (the videogame) and then in an interview about the current Team Sonic Racing he said that his favourite character was Shadow and that "they" made Shadow's personality accurate in the game... then you just ****ing see a clip where he says "DEAL WITH IT, SONIC!!" ... so... haha... yeah... we've got a problem there...
Anyways... I always laugh with the memes, I know Sonic games are not perfect, I know Shadow has a reputation of edgelord and I laugh with the jokes about it, my friends always share with me those kind of things. However, I like the Sonic games (not all of them, but most of them, I even enjoyed STH) and I like many of its characters, and my favourite is Shadow, I can take things with humor but that doesn't mean I don't like the character, because I do.
Aaahhmm.. what else... I have almost 23 years, just finished my college, very normal life, I don't like things because of nostalgia factor since I was poor during my childhood and also, I'm Chilean, so, I mean, I wasn't close to videogames as Americans or Japanese were, I played Sonic Adventure 2 Battle in 2008 and Zelda Ocarina of Time in 2014, when I say I liked something I really mean it.
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Honestly... I was thinking in giving up on the franchise because of Lost World and Colors (I prefer an over the top edgy franchise than a Mario rip-off with a flat comedian as a main character) but, I honestly want this franchise to rise. Sonic Forces was average and a step back from Unleashed, but, it helped me to overcome the stress of the university and also, its announcement demonstrated me that I will always be excited for a new title, not just because I want to play it but because maybe, and just maybe, that would be the title that a lot of people will buy and enjoy.
And well, about Smash I was never too keen on expecting characters since Sonic was a guest, but come on! two Belmonts and Ken? I need my edgy Shadow! Sonic and him have been an staple since Brawl.
 

TerminatorLOL

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Violet's outburst was disappointing, though I admit I was finding their constant over dramatic flip-flopping between supporting Shadow and wanting this thread shut down pretty tiring.

I didn't think I'd be updating this list again, But seeing some new supporters pop up after removing one motivated me to go back some pages and add the names of people I missed.

Shadow Supporters: 158
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Keep fighting like you always have, my friends
shadow_fight.gif
 
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OnePerson

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It's so nice to meet you! I really wanted and expected Shadow in this installment, honestly, I didn't "care" about him before because Sonic was just a guest in this franchise.
However, Sonic and Shadow have been a staple in this series, this is the third time in a row that they are present in Super Smash Bros., and we've got Ken and two Belmonts, I really think that by now he deserves to join the fight and accompany Sonic!
I was thinking about sending a letter to Lizuka, Sega and/or Nintendo, but I don't know :c (didn't find anything that could help me with that) so, for now I'm just going to show my support out loud.
Also, I did this drawing also, I'd like to share it (?)
https://www.instagram.com/p/BqxuMlXgN_4/
 

Arcadenik

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Where do I find Shadow the Hedgehog spirit?

Edit: Never mind. Just got him from the Vault Shop.
 
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RandomAce

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And it's already begun....

And Bam! That’s how you make the Base Model for Sonic and it’s only a few steps away from looking exactly like Shadow.
—————————————————————
I honestly feel like it was a missed opportunity to add Shadow. He would be one of the easier characters to create and differentiate from Sonic, and Shadow is very popular as well.

I disagree with the post about Sega not caring about Shadow, because they clearly do. Shadow constantly appears in many games after his appearance and even got his own DLC in Forces where you play as him. Not only that, but Shadow isn’t really that divisive of a character, he’s still a well respected character for a lot of people that played the games he’s from. The only downside was his own game “Shadow the Hedgehog” but it was more of a meme against Sega than Shadow more than anything (though I do admit the memes with Shadow using a gun and swearing are still funny as hell).

I do think Shadow has an edge over other characters for an AT promotion because he would be more easy to create than let’s say Isaac or Spring Man.

I support Shadow.
 
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T-Donor66

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Because of this, I'm siding with you!

Shadow was only an icon for for the first two games that he appeared in and since that one game that he starred in he's fallen off and he will continue to fall off until Sega forgets him altogether and that's exactly what they want!

It's time that we give up for good, we've lost, Shadow's never happening as a playable fighter period and Sega knew this (which is why we got Joker, he's the edgy rep the entire time and fits it far better than Shadow ever will!)

Because of this, I hate Shadow the Hedgehog and no longer a fan of him and never will be again, I never want him in Smash (playable or assist) again or want to be a part of the Shadow fanbase again, I'm sticking with Tails, Knuckles or Eggman as the 2nd Sonic rep.

Shadow fanbase, just close this thread now, he's never getting in and no matter how many times you support him, it's not happening, it is final!
This is ironic and a joke, right? New to this thread and find it hard to believe this is real despite what everyone else is saying.
 
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Chinderblock

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Shadow's in an odd spot indeed. Sega blatantly cares about him. We just don't know why he's not playable. Sakurai may have never considered him for the spot. Sega may have said no. With Sonic being more Classic-based, maybe Shadow didn't fit well enough to them. Maybe Sakurai wanted him more unique and Sega said no. There's just no way to know at this point. My guess is that if overall he wasn't considered or plans fell through, he eventually got the same role back. Now, note that Sakurai never took off or added a character to the project plan itself. This means, if Sega said, it had to have happened before the final character list was made. Otherwise, he was never considered to begin with and was revealed late for an unknown reason.
 

TerminatorLOL

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This is ironic and a joke, right? New to this thread and find it hard to believe this is real despite what everyone else is saying.
I don't really know. As cartoonish and random as those last few posts were, Violet acted like a normal Shadow fan until that final direct.

Shadow's in an odd spot indeed. Sega blatantly cares about him. We just don't know why he's not playable. Sakurai may have never considered him for the spot. Sega may have said no. With Sonic being more Classic-based, maybe Shadow didn't fit well enough to them. Maybe Sakurai wanted him more unique and Sega said no. There's just no way to know at this point. My guess is that if overall he wasn't considered or plans fell through, he eventually got the same role back. Now, note that Sakurai never took off or added a character to the project plan itself. This means, if Sega said, it had to have happened before the final character list was made. Otherwise, he was never considered to begin with and was revealed late for an unknown reason.
"Shadow's is in a odd spot", you can say that again. Even if there is a second wave of DLC it's hard to say where Shadow would stand.

I don't stress much over way he didn't make the roster, we don't know how they pick characters. But the late reveal is the part I don't really get. I mean Issac got a real upgrade, doing more then he did in Brawl, so I can understand why they would think thats a reveal worth saving.

But Shadow only got a animation update. They couldn't have thought that seeing them add an emerald would be that exciting of a reveal. I actually think it would have made more sense if Knuckles was the late reveal and they showed the updated Shadow first.
 
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T-Donor66

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I don't really know. As cartoonish and random as those last few posts were, Violet acted like a normal Shadow fan until that final direct.



"Shadow's is in a odd spot", you can say that again. Even if there is a second wave of DLC it's hard to say where Shadow would stand.

I don't stress much over way he didn't make the roster, we don't know how they pick characters. But the late reveal is the part I don't really get. I mean Issac got a real upgrade, doing more then he did in Brawl, so I can understand why they would think thats a reveal worth saving.

But Shadow only got a animation update. They couldn't have thought that seeing them add an emerald would be that exciting of a reveal. I actually think it would have made more sense if Knuckles was the late reveal and they showed the updated Shadow first.
I think she was serious. Yesterday I was reminiscing on an old ballot speculation thread from 2015 and I found a post from her where genuinely asked if she could request a character from Incredibles because they had been in a video game before. With that in mind I could see her making this post genuinely.
 

Chinderblock

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I think she was serious. Yesterday I was reminiscing on an old ballot speculation thread from 2015 and I found a post from her where genuinely asked if she could request a character from Incredibles because they had been in a video game before. With that in mind I could see her making this post genuinely.
And if the user does request that, we'll deal with it when it comes up. Till then, it doesn't really matter. The user left the thread at this point. If they don't want to contribute any more, it's best to not drag them back in. They have a right to not enjoy a character due to circumstances. Best to leave it be.

"Shadow's is in a odd spot", you can say that again. Even if there is a second wave of DLC it's hard to say where Shadow would stand.

I don't stress much over way he didn't make the roster, we don't know how they pick characters. But the late reveal is the part I don't really get. I mean Issac got a real upgrade, doing more then he did in Brawl, so I can understand why they would think thats a reveal worth saving.

But Shadow only got a animation update. They couldn't have thought that seeing them add an emerald would be that exciting of a reveal. I actually think it would have made more sense if Knuckles was the late reveal and they showed the updated Shadow first.
Maybe Shadow and Isaac got their AT's finished up last minute. Isaac got upgrades. Sega could've been heard to deal with in Shadow's case for all we know. Being a 3rd party character, it means things get complicated. My best thought is that he was being negotiated for DLC around that time, but it fell through, and Sakurai quickly re-rigged his AT back up with a few updates. There's no telling how many negotiations happened and also fell through. We don't know when they got started either. We do know they got finalized before the game itself released fully. Some time after it went gold.
 
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I think she was serious. Yesterday I was reminiscing on an old ballot speculation thread from 2015 and I found a post from her where genuinely asked if she could request a character from Incredibles because they had been in a video game before. With that in mind I could see her making this post genuinely.
And I was actually being serious, I'm actually at peace with myself on that decision, I could have left the thread on better terms, but whatever!

Also the Incredibles one was more or less just me goofing around at the time, seeing as I'm well aware that Violet debuted in the film first before getting into the video games (same with Goku debuting in the manga and anime before becoming a popular video game character himself), she has 0% to get in (hence why we have the Mii Fighter system in place to make those dream characters of ours into a reality.)
 

T-Donor66

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And I was actually being serious, I'm actually at peace with myself on that decision, I could have left the thread on better terms, but whatever!

Also the Incredibles one was more or less just me goofing around at the time, seeing as I'm well aware that Violet debuted in the film first before getting into the video games (same with Goku debuting in the manga and anime before becoming a popular video game character himself), she has 0% to get in (hence why we have the Mii Fighter system in place to make those dream characters of ours into a reality.)
I just find it odd that you would stop supporting a character because of a paragraph someone else wrote, that quite frankly, didn’t make any sense and was just a bunch of generalizations. If your opinion of a character was that easily swayed then I don’t see why you supported them in the first place. And on top of that your called everyone here toxic for no reason, while being toxic.
 
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Chinderblock

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What was said in the past is done. Stop dredging up past stuff and let it go. There is no reason to continue this on, as it's causing more issues, when one can just ignore a bad thing in the past.

Now it's time to move on. Take it to PM's or drop it. Continuation on here will be treated as spam. It clearly no longer has to do with the thread.
 
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I just find it odd that you would stop supporting a character because of a paragraph someone else wrote, that quite frankly, didn’t make any sense and was just a bunch of generalizations. If your opinion of a character was that easily swayed then I don’t see why you supported them in the first place. And on top of that your called everyone here toxic for no reason, while being toxic.
Sadly a good portion of the Sonic fans are toxic as a whole, even the ones who supported Shadow can be quite toxic at times!

Because I used to love Shadow and he was my favorite Sonic character, but after that direct not anymore (because the ones who hated Shadow were 100% right, he's a joke of a character), and I had a right to be toxic here because these fans are nothing more but dreamers and they should learn to face the damn facts and face reality, I'm pretty much a realist, if a character that has been an AT for well over 3 games now, they'll never be playable!

If Shadow makes it in a future Smash Bros game as a fighter (if there is one), I'll be happy for those who supported him, I just won't play as him ever.
 

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User was warned for this post; off-topic spam
Sadly a good portion of the Sonic fans are toxic as a whole, even the ones who supported Shadow can be quite toxic at times!

Because I used to love Shadow and he was my favorite Sonic character, but after that direct not anymore (because the ones who hated Shadow were 100% right, he's a joke of a character), and I had a right to be toxic here because these fans are nothing more but dreamers and they should learn to face the damn facts and face reality, I'm pretty much a realist, if a character that has been an AT for well over 3 games now, they'll never be playable!

If Shadow makes it in a future Smash Bros game as a fighter (if there is one), I'll be happy for those who supported him, I just won't play as him ever.
All that tells me is that you have incredibly weak convinction and that you are not someone to take seriously quite honestly. If your appreciation of a character is dependent on whether or not they get into Smash Bros, a third prty fighting game unrelated to the character, then you simply never liked the character.

What the hell do you mean you have a right to be toxic because we want a character YOU WANTED TOO at one point? Talking down to us for being “dreamers” is one of the most petty things you can do. You sound EXACTLY like the Ridley detractors. “He will NEVER get in. Sakurai doesn’t like him, hes not even a good villan”. And here we are now. Fools like you who think they can predict Sakurai and think they know his rules have to eat crow, as always.

Is Isaac a joke of a character for being an assist since Brawl? What is Sakurais next move? You know who will and will not get in, right? Maybe stop talking about things you know little about, it doesn’t look too good my friend.
 
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Chinderblock

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Would it have REALLY been that hard for Nintendo to do this, polish it a bit and give him different effects, taunts, and a voice?
Depends; was Sakurai interested in making him playable? Was Nintendo suggesting him? Did he have a ton of ballot presence compared to some others? Did Sega say no?

It's not that simple. It's not a first party character. There's way too many reasons why it might not have happened. It sucks he didn't get in, but we have no information on why.
 

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Depends; was Sakurai interested in making him playable? Was Nintendo suggesting him? Did he have a ton of ballot presence compared to some others? Did Sega say no?

It's not that simple. It's not a first party character. There's way too many reasons why it might not have happened. It sucks he didn't get in, but we have no information on why.
The third party bit didn’t cross my mind honestly. That is a fair point. I really don’t see them saying no, and you gotta admit, it would be relatively low work to please a LOT of people. But, its Sakurais call in the end.
 

Chinderblock

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The third party bit didn’t cross my mind honestly. That is a fair point. I really don’t see them saying no, and you gotta admit, it would be relatively low work to please a LOT of people. But, its Sakurais call in the end.
Well, it can be also Nintendo or Sega's call in the end too. Negotiations fell through.

I'm sure we'll find out later on what happened. It's quite possible he never got considered. All of Sega's playable characters are different ones. Maybe that's how they prefer it in Smash. There's too many variables with no explanations.
 
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What if Nintendo limited the third party companies to three in the game? With that, it would've been between Joker and Shadow for the spot. At that, I could at least understand SEGA passed on Shadow, they wanted to represent another series in the game. Which I would've preferred though... I can't say. I can't fairly judge Persona, I've never played it.
 

Luigifan18

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What if Nintendo limited the third party companies to three in the game? With that, it would've been between Joker and Shadow for the spot. At that, I could at least understand SEGA passed on Shadow, they wanted to represent another series in the game. Which I would've preferred though... I can't say. I can't fairly judge Persona, I've never played it.
Pour one out for Ridrool64 Ridrool64 's dreams.
 

Chinderblock

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What if Nintendo limited the third party companies to three in the game? With that, it would've been between Joker and Shadow for the spot. At that, I could at least understand SEGA passed on Shadow, they wanted to represent another series in the game. Which I would've preferred though... I can't say. I can't fairly judge Persona, I've never played it.
I will note that Sega heavily pushes Sonic characters in their own crossovers. It's not actually farfetched that they want to show off series that isn't Sonic. This is logical too. They want people to know their franchises. If all they put in is Sonic, nobody will care about their other IP's.
 

TerminatorLOL

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I don't really think third party companys get to pick who gets in the game. They obvisoley have to approve of their characters appearance, but I doubt they can push Sakurai and Nintendo to pick someone.

Sakurai said Nintendo picked who would be added as DLC. It just makes sense from a business perspective that Nintendo would want to pick a character from a relatively recent hit game from a popular series, because that means people will want to buy him.

Shadow, while still pretty popular, is a side character for a series that's already in the game. "Smash Bros X Persona 5" just builds up more hype in comparison, which means more DLC sales.

Edit: Also we already knew Shadow was unlikely for this DLC pack, since Sakurai said none of them are echos, so it's not like him and Joker were competing for the spot.
 
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