Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[OblivionWolf]

Seriously, I bet Sakurai could make a moveset for just about anyone.

Can't wait for the shocker reveal!!!

 

[Snagrio]

He let us think Zamus was disconfirmed for literally one second. Ridley has been going on for two months, longer if you count the first daily pic where he hinted Ridley. Two months is unprofessional, one second is just a joke. Besides, for that one second he let us believe that Zamus had NO purpose in the game, which is not teasing, while for this two months he is having us believe that Ridley is a stage hazard, which IS a purpose, so that is why it isn't unprofessional to troll Zamus. And you can't speak for everyone and say no one wants Ridley as a stage boss.

The one second joke was for a returning veteran. The ongoing teasing is for a newcomer that otherwise wouldn't be surprising, so making the illusion that he isn't playable in order to maintain the surprise factor makes perfect sense.

Think of it this way. Is it more exciting to see a character that you were kinda expecting anyway, or one that you were sure was down for the count (and really wanted playable) and suddenly comes out of nowhere with florish?

Sakurai has shown he wants to surprise us, like with characters that most didn't think would make it in (or in WFT's case, anybody). But of course more popular choices are in order, but how to go about in a way that the surprise is still there when those that many want/expect appear? Well, what better way then to fool the masses into thinking that x character has no chance to be playable.

 

[samsparta21]

The one second joke was for a returning veteran. The ongoing teasing is for a newcomer that otherwise wouldn't be surprising, so making the illusion that he isn't playable in order to maintain the surprise factor makes perfect sense.

Think of it this way. Is it more exciting to see a character that you were kinda expecting anyway, or one that you were sure was down for the count (and really wanted playable) and suddenly comes out of nowhere with florish?

Sakurai has shown he wants to surprise us, like with characters that most didn't think would make it in (or in WFT's case, anybody). But of course more popular choices are in order, but how to go about in a way that the surprise is still there when those that many want/expect appear? Well, what better way then to fool the masses into thinking that x character has no chance to be playable.

Yes, but he's already presented a different possibility that some people like. If he suddenly changes it, the people who liked the stage hazard idea will be disappointed. It's unprofessional.

 

[OblivionWolf]

Yes, but he's already presented a different possibility that some people like. If he suddenly changes it, the people who liked the stage hazard idea will be disappointed. It's unprofessional.

Thats such a terrible argument lol. It sounds so desperate.

 

[Deleted member]

I would agree with you, but the inner 12 year old obsessed with dragons will not let me. Even if he is hinted, there's an iota of hope that a hint does not transition into fact.

On the other hand, canonically, Ridley can appear in two places at once, so there's that hope.

The point isn't that Ridley has no chance, but that Ridley's chances of appearing as a playable character is slim. Whenever we like or not, RIdley is going to appear as a boss; being playable as well isn't exactly likely.

They completely ignored you. lmao

Next time people forget this, just bring up the quote again:

I hate to be that person, but people are looking way too much into the shadows argument.

No matter what people want to say, the fact is that he's been explicitly hinted as a boss (well, Other M). There is no denying it, Other M Ridley is a boss and we do have to accept that. The ONLY way he is EVER going to be playable is if Ridley receives a twin-scenario role; which could happen, but probably won't.

That isn't objectively true; in order for that scenario to become fact beyond a reasonable doubt, we would need more than an ambiguous allusion. You can accept whatever you find to be the case, but "we" are not obligated to accept anything definitively until we have more than a hint.

The fact is that Ridley was shown off when Sakurai was talking about bosses. It should be obvious that Ridley is, indeed, a boss. Why would you shown Ridley off in the boss section and say he isn't a boss?

That would beg the question as to why Sakurai would keep Ridley, one of the top 5 requested characters, as an unlockable, instead of revealing him outright so people got more hyped and bought the game.

That wouldn't make sense to me.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mewtwo and King K. Rool were unlockables and as such, were held off until release. However, I do agree that it's show up as playable or die for Ridley at E3 2014. I'm confident that we will see Ridley there; probably not playable though.

Relating to that, I have a sneaking suspicion that we're not going to get a lot of fan favorites beyond Mega Man and Little Mac. Call it paranoia, but that's what my gut is telling me.

At the very least, I would expect to see Mewtwo get in. No way are they going to skip out on the most wanted character.

 

[The King of Skulls]

Don't count your chickens before they hatch.

Don't count their gravestones either.

Ridley, however bleak it may seem, has a chance. Not nearly as high as 95%, but maybe 20% at minimum.

 

[Snagrio]

Yes, but he's already presented a different possibility that some people like. If he suddenly changes it, the people who liked the stage hazard idea will be disappointed. It's unprofessional.

Really? You can't please everyone, and I'm pretty dang sure there will be far more people happy to see him playable then upset that he isn't a stage hazard.

 

[SvartWolf]

Yay for Ridley!
although i'm quite sure than the information we got from the direct doesn't 100% deconfirm it as a playable, it doesn't either confirms it 100%. there is still lots of potential situations that could explain this situation and yet end with ridley not playable.

First is priority, maybe Ridley was included on the list of newcomers when the developers started the game, and he is being worked on, but until its revelead as a playable, that either doesn't confirm it 100% either. (i'm a mewtwo fan, so i could say that i know this can happen) it can have low priority, so the team would give more priority to finish higher priority characters and could end with not enough time to finish ridley. or they could have found a technical problem and again it wasnt priority to finish it. in that case, Sakurai's ambiguity would mean that he is playing safe. and im pretty sure that converting a advanced character into a stage hazard would cost very little time, since it havent had to be balanced and stuff.

Another point that although i don't share it too much it is still a somewhat valid point is that Sakurai wants the boss to be an important part of gameplay, much like the smash balls were on brawl. so he feels that bosses can be teasing material. but this view have been discussed before.

At the time of the direct i though that he didn't showed Ridleys because he wasnt ready as a boss (I personally found the animation was very choppy) but this theory have somehow lose validity, after 2 months he wasnt shown on the PotD. one thing is a video of the hazard working, at which it have to be nearly complete, other is a screen that only need to have the model and least some basic animation complete. and I doubt that up to 2 months they dont have that.

So who knows... maybe he hasn't said anything because even Sakurai isn't 100% sure if Ridley will be completed as a playable character, or scrapped. unlikely possibility? yes. but not impossible. I just hope if it that happens to any character they could made them dlc afterward .

 

[samsparta21]

Thats such a terrible argument lol. It sounds so desperate.

"Desperate"
Implying I don't want Ridley playable. I just go with the most logical conclusion at this point. Teasing him as a stage hazard and revealing him as a character is like telling someone they can have a hamster for Christmas and giving them a cat. Even if they really wanted a cat, they would be disappointed that they didn't get a hamster because they were building it up in their head.

 

[majora_787]

This is bringing me back to when Ness was deconfirmed in the Brawl days.

EDIT: Are you really trying to say that teasing a heavily requested character as unplayable (which is a bad idea really) and revealing them as playable just like everyone wants is somehow just as bad as teasing a heavily requested character as possibly playable and then ONCE AGAIN not making them playable and ignoring their requests?

 

[samsparta21]

This is bringing me back to when Ness was deconfirmed in the Brawl days.

Noo, it's almost the complete opposite. Ness was "disconfirmed" on insubstantial evidence (Lucas being revealed, having similar moves to Ness) and everyone immediately jumped ship on him. Ridley is being "confirmed" on insubstantial evidence (Sakurai being vague, shadow being smaller) and everyone is immediately believing he will be 100% playable.

Are you really trying to say that teasing a heavily requested character as unplayable (which is a bad idea really) and revealing them as playable just like everyone wants is somehow just as bad as teasing a heavily requested character as possibly playable and then ONCE AGAIN not making them playable and ignoring their requests?

That is not what I am trying to say. If Ridley is playable and not a stage hazard, then Ridley will not be on Pyrosphere, and there are people who liked that idea. Also technically Sakurai would have been "lying" about an aspect of the game that would have an effect on people playing on Pyrosphere, and that is unprofessional.

 

[Snagrio]

"Desperate"
Implying I don't want Ridley playable. I just go with the most logical conclusion at this point. Teasing him as a stage hazard and revealing him as a character is like telling someone they can have a hamster for Christmas and giving them a cat. Even if they really wanted a cat, they would be disappointed that they didn't get a hamster because they were building it up in their head.

You got the analogy completely wrong. Instead think of a little kid who wants a big chocolate sundae. His dad tells he'll only get a small vanilla cone. The kid is disappointed, but gets over it. Suddenly his dad has a change of heart and gets him the sundae he wanted and he is even more happy then before.

 

[Deleted member]

Don't count your chickens before they hatch.

Don't count their gravestones either.

Ridley, however bleak it may seem, has a chance. Not nearly as high as 95%, but maybe 20% at minimum.

Honestly, Ridley's chances of being playable are below single digits at this point. At this point, it's going to take a mini-miracle for the playable scenario to happen.

Also, Ridley is not going to be DLC. He's either playable in the initial game or not at all.

 

[egaddmario]

My whole problem is Sakurai knows how much people want Ridley. He. Knows. How? Well gosh, even before Miiverse, that Nintendo Power interview we all keep going back to could have put the bug in his ear that people like the character. Sakurai obviously sees things differently than Brawl- we got Villager and Little Mac, who was only an assist trophy. Sakurai decided Little Mac had more going for him than originally thought and as such, poof, character. And Little Mac is MUCH more popular out West than in Japan. Why give the West one of their most wanted without giving us THE most wanted? Plus, the only character he's teasing as much as Ridley is Palutena, and we all know how much love he's showing Kid Icarus and how likely she is to join. The jerky movements of the shadow should raise a red flag and the whole "boss thing" could be clever word-play: for example- he could have shown Bowser in a Mario stage and said the same thing. Bowser is a boss character in Mario games, so having Boss characters appear on other stages would technically be true, even if it's a blatant troll. Dangling Ridley in front of our faces without a payoff doesn't make sense- the original Pyrosphere comment, the shadow, the trophy in the direct having his theme, it's too much of a coincidence. And if you think he's not dangling, you're as delusional as you say us Ridley fans are...

EDIT- Ridley's shadow is the "up until now" of this game.

 

[majora_787]

This ISN'T completely different. People assumed Ness was deconfirmed based off the explicit "Up until now" statement by Sakurai. That's MORE evidence than what is going against Ridley right now. And look how that turned out.

 

[Mypantisgone]

"Desperate"
Implying I don't want Ridley playable. I just go with the most logical conclusion at this point. Teasing him as a stage hazard and revealing him as a character is like telling someone they can have a hamster for Christmas and giving them a cat. Even if they really wanted a cat, they would be disappointed that they didn't get a hamster because they were building it up in their head.

That's a wrong way of interpreting it.
It would actually be like telling someone he's getting a hamster plush because he likes hamster, but then give him an actual hamster.

 

[Deleted member]

"Desperate"
Implying I don't want Ridley playable. I just go with the most logical conclusion at this point. Teasing him as a stage hazard and revealing him as a character is like telling someone they can have a hamster for Christmas and giving them a cat. Even if they really wanted a cat, they would be disappointed that they didn't get a hamster because they were building it up in their head.

Not exactly a good comparison. Teasing Ridley as a stage hazard and revealing him as a playable character would pleasantly surprise most people at this rate. People didn't want a stage hazard, hence why people are trying to deny that he is.

I guarantee you that almost no one would be disappointed if Ridley was playable. However, reality dictates that he is a stage hazard and that alone.

 

[samsparta21]

This ISN'T completely different. People assumed Ness was deconfirmed based off the explicit "Up until now" statement by Sakurai. That's MORE evidence than what is going against Ridley right now. And look how that turned out.

Wasn't Ness actually planned to be cut? I read that somewhere.

 

[majora_787]

Wasn't Ness actually planned to be cut? I read that somewhere.

In Melee. Not Brawl, as far as anyone knows.

The fact of the matter is we have two scenarios going on here.

1) We have a character pretty similar to Ness from the newest game! Sakurai's "up until now" statement indicates Ness is probably gone. The fact that we never saw any sign of Ness for the ENTIRE pre-release period until the game came out and leaks happened didn't do any favors. But look how it turned out? Ness was in the game.

2) Sakurai acted in a deliberately shifty manner to hide the nature of Ridley's appearance in literally every way he could while still showing that Ridley is somewhere in the game. The only even remotely concrete evidence AGAINST Ridley is the mention of "other boss characters" at the time Ridley's shadow was shown. Despite the evidence collected from people using their eye holes, Ridley is obviously just deconfirmed. Facts and observations don't matter, because Sakurai! What is going to happen this time though, I wonder.

 

[SmashBro99]

Villager is alot easier to make playable than Ridley.

Sakurai stated his reasons for not including Ridley as playable in Melee and Brawl...he's not the type of person to just cave for the fans, he will not include him if he thinks he's better off as a stage hazard/boss or would rather pick other characters (Wii Fit Trainer!)

 

[majora_787]

The issue is, Sakurai's biggest concern that he ever expressed was Ridley being slow. That's really not a major concern, and it says good things when off the top of his head, Sakurai's first issue is "Well if we made him playable he'd probably be slow."

 

[Deleted member]

This ISN'T completely different. People assumed Ness was deconfirmed based off the explicit "Up until now" statement by Sakurai. That's MORE evidence than what is going against Ridley right now. And look how that turned out.

"Up until now" only referred to the fact that Ness was playable in all previous Smash games, not that Ness was going to be replaced by Lucas. Ridley, on the other hand, has been explicitly hinted as a boss role; shown as part of the boss section in the Smash Direct. You can't flat-out say he's a boss anymore than that.

 

[MagnesD3]

e3 is taking so long to get here

 

[OblivionWolf]

The issue is, Sakurai's biggest concern that he ever expressed was Ridley being slow. That's really not a major concern, and it says good things when off the top of his head, Sakurai's first issue is "Well if we made him playable he'd probably be slow."

And he didn't look like Speedy Gonzales in that direct either. He looked pretty slow to me.

 

[majora_787]

"Up until now" only referred to the fact that Ness was playable in all previous Smash games, not that Ness was going to be replaced by Lucas. Ridley, on the other hand, has been explicitly hinted as a boss role; shown as part of the boss section in the Smash Direct. You can't flat-out say he's a boss anymore than that.

Hindsight is 20/20. And that wasn't what people assumed at the time. Now, we assume that "other boss characters appear on other stages" means Ridley is a boss DESPITE the laundry list of evidence making that unlikely. And were he to become playable? Five years later, people would be saying "Oh of course! Ridley is a boss character just like Bowser and Ganondorf and Dedede are boss characters! And they all appear on different stages! It makes sense."

And if you honestly somehow have convinced yourself that that vague shenanigan-fest was "as flat-out as possible", you really should learn the English language and how to say things with it. Because in no way was that direct.

 

[Luigi#1]

"Up until now" only referred to the fact that Ness was playable in all previous Smash games, not that Ness was going to be replaced by Lucas. Ridley, on the other hand, has been explicitly hinted as a boss role; shown as part of the boss section in the Smash Direct. You can't flat-out say he's a boss anymore than that.

You actually can flat out say he's a boss more. By saying flat out he's a boss:
"He's a boss."

 

[majora_787]

You actually can flat out say he's a boss more. By saying flat out he's a boss:
"He's a boss."

I dunno. Show Ridley coming in from the background in an actual boss size, and refer to Ridley as a boss.

Don't show a Bowser-sized shadow flying lazily across the stage and acting unlike an AI, and don't not acknowledge it past putting it in a section called "Yellow Devil" (not bosses) and say "Other boss characters can appear on other stages" (vague sentence). That'd all be a pretty good start for actually deconfirming a character as a boss.

 

[DMTN]

The FD-version of Pyrosphere seems to avoid lava or heat altogether. Whenever the standard Pyrosphere is shown, there’s always a big amount of steam, probably caused by the lava pit. However, there are no signs of steam or smoke in the FD-Pyrosphere, which leads me to believe that there’s absolutely no lava in that version of the stage, not even in the depths of the stage. So I think there’s a good chance the stage hazard will be lava related. Who knows?

Oh yeah, I’m new here. Hi everybody.

 

[Deleted member]

Hindsight is 20/20. And that wasn't what people assumed at the time. Now, we assume that "other boss characters appear on other stages" means Ridley is a boss DESPITE the laundry list of evidence making that unlikely. And were he to become playable? Five years later, people would be saying "Oh of course! Ridley is a boss character just like Bowser and Ganondorf and Dedede are boss characters! And they all appear on different stages! It makes sense."

And if you honestly somehow have convinced yourself that that vague shenanigan-fest was "as flat-out as possible", you really should learn the English language and how to say things with it. Because in no way was that direct.

That's because like you said, people misinterpreted what Sakurai said with "up until now".

The case with Ridley, on the other hand, does hint towards being a boss. Look at the fact that the Yellow Devil was revealed in the boss section and notice that Ridley is also under the boss section in the Smash Direct. Putting Ridley and Yellow Devil in the same section doesn't implicate in any way that Sakurai means that Ridley is a boss character like Bowser, Ganondorf, and King Dedede, it means in the same context as Yellow Devil; a boss in Smash.

Honestly, that hint was not vague by any means. It was, in fact, pretty obvious to most people that Ridley is a boss in this game in some form.

 

[Luigi#1]

The FD-version of Pyrosphere seems to avoid lava or heat altogether. Whenever the standard Pyrosphere is shown, there’s always a big amount of steam, probably caused by the lava pit. However, there are no signs of steam or smoke in the FD-Pyrosphere, which leads me to believe that there’s absolutely no lava in that version of the stage, not even in the depths of the stage. So I think there’s a good chance the stage hazard will be lava related. Who knows?

Oh yeah, I’m new here. Hi everybody.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

I keep thinking Sakurai showed us the shadow in the boss section to confirm Ridley as a boss.
But why couldn't he simply say "Ridley is a boss on pyrosphere !" ? What is his objective ?

 

[Xhampi]

e3 is taking so long to get here

I know right ?
The only thing keeping me on this forum is the fact that Ridley's fate is only hinted, if Ridley is really a boss, I would like it to be confirmed as soon as possible so I can finnally forget about this game =/

 

[majora_787]

That's because like you said, people misinterpreted what Sakurai said with "up until now".

The case with Ridley, on the other hand, does hint towards being a boss. Look at the fact that the Yellow Devil was revealed in the boss section and notice that Ridley is also under the boss section in the Smash Direct. Putting Ridley and Yellow Devil in the same section doesn't implicate in any way that Sakurai means that Ridley is a boss character like Bowser, Ganondorf, and King Dedede, it means in the same context as Yellow Devil; a boss in Smash.

Honestly, that hint was not vague by any means. It was, in fact, pretty obvious to most people that Ridley is a boss in this game in some form.

There was no boss section of the direct. There was only a "Yellow Devil" section. And you seem to either be completely ignoring how hindsight works, or you are entirely oblivious to the concept. Which would be ironic, but the way you've been rattling bull off it's not particularly surprising.

EDIT: Wait no, I get it now! Since Ridley was in the YELLOW DEVIL section of the direct, Ridley is the Yellow Devil! Everything you said suddenly makes sense.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

There was no boss section of the direct. There was only a "Yellow Devil" section. And you seem to either be completely ignoring how hindsight works, or you are entirely oblivious to the concept. Which would be ironic, but the way you've been rattling bull off it's not particularly surprising.

EDIT: Wait no, I get it now! Since Ridley was in the YELLOW DEVIL section of the direct, Ridley is the Yellow Devil! Everything you said suddenly makes sense.

Dude, hindsight is good, but you don't need to make fun of what he is saying because he is thinking differently.

I mean, come on, we are speculating on Ridley's side with a f***ing shadow. If the anti Ridley thoughts seem oblivious, damn, the for Ridley thoughts are relying on really unsure information.

Don't kill me.

 

[OblivionWolf]

There was no boss section of the direct. There was only a "Yellow Devil" section. And you seem to either be completely ignoring how hindsight works, or you are entirely oblivious to the concept. Which would be ironic, but the way you've been rattling bull off it's not particularly surprising.

EDIT: Wait no, I get it now! Since Ridley was in the YELLOW DEVIL section of the direct, Ridley is the Yellow Devil! Everything you said suddenly makes sense.

It all makes sense!!! Yellow Devil is known for his shapeshifter abilities!!! That means Yellow Devil just made a Ridley like shape and confused everyone. Yellow Devil is pure evil.

 

[AndreaAC]

A Random interaction between Ridley and Roidley...I was going to do the fusion dance but I had a little bit of problems when I tried to draw it

Quick sketch...

 

[aldelaro5]

That's because like you said, people misinterpreted what Sakurai said with "up until now".

The case with Ridley, on the other hand, does hint towards being a boss. Look at the fact that the Yellow Devil was revealed in the boss section and notice that Ridley is also under the boss section in the Smash Direct. Putting Ridley and Yellow Devil in the same section doesn't implicate in any way that Sakurai means that Ridley is a boss character like Bowser, Ganondorf, and King Dedede, it means in the same context as Yellow Devil; a boss in Smash.

Honestly, that hint was not vague by any means. It was, in fact, pretty obvious to most people that Ridley is a boss in this game in some form.

I'm really considering to stop talking about this because no one was able to prove me wrong while I still see some people believing that I'm wrong. If you take the pots quote and the direct, there's no way to even tell his fate and if Sakurai wanted to clear, he just wouldn't do any of this ambiguity.

By saying that this situation isn't vague, doubtful, ambiguous and suspicious, this means that the following question would have an 100% undeniable answer (copy paste from a previous post)

So, tell me,

Why his shadow LOOKS so big?
Why we cannot hear audio in the clip?
Why the ambiguity at all?
Why not just mentioning his name?
Why not even tell how he's boss/playable?

And most importantly: Why not even showing him at all?

If you have answer to these questions that hints to a 100% hazard, then, try prove that this is the only answer possible. There was so much double meaning evidences that you can't tell if he's playable or hazard. To this point, I saw no undeniable interpretation of those questions because the opposite is realistically possible. Every facts bring us again the same outcomes which is playable or hazard and the purpose of the ambiguity is because he's playable or hazard. There's one thing that no one denied: he did this for a purpose but the question is what is this purpose?

If you really think that he's an hazard WHITOUT ANY FORM OF DOUBT, then quote this. You can also do this for his playability this one is also impossible to prove.

my two cent (and maybe my last because I'm so tired to repeat this).

 

[majora_787]

Dude, hindsight is good, but you don't need to make fun of what he is saying because he is thinking differently.

I mean, come on, we are speculating on Ridley's side with a f***ing shadow. If the anti Ridley thoughts seem oblivious, damn, the for Ridley thoughts are relying on really unsure information.

Don't kill me.

There is a difference between thinking differently and not thinking. If you're going to outright deny how hindsight works and deny any similarities between this and the Ness situation, you're not thinking differently, you're just not thinking.

And really? Measuring the shadow is more reliable than one vague sentence, which is all that is "solid" about the anti-Ridley argument at this point. Unless, of course, we have some evidence that the Pyrosphere completely changes size and floor layout throughout a match. It may be "vague", but it has any legitimate basis at all.

And really, the fact that this is what we even have to GO off of in general to analyze Ridley, his shadow and the context of the situation, that vagueness and obfuscation is pretty incriminating of wanting to hide something. What? Who knows. But something.

 

[shrooby]

It all makes sense!!! Yellow Devil is known for his shapeshifter abilities!!! That means Yellow Devil just made a Ridley like shape and confused everyone. Yellow Devil is pure evil.

Yellow Devil is actually everything in the game. He's learned to change his pigment and texture as well.

 

[Deleted member]

My internet is s***, so it has been a long time since I wanted to post this:
First, something odd I noticed, Roidley's tail is very detailed, I mean, why would you put so much effort on something that appears in only ONE stage? Look at YD, he's plain and simple, one tone of yellow and his eye with a basic animation, it's just waste of resorts to put such details on a stage boss
Now, no one, literally no one mentioned this here(or I at least didn't read it): the fact that Pikachu doesn't have a shadow in that clip, think about it, if Pikachu had a shadow, we could easily know Ridley's size this way(easier than have been done), besides, there is a reason why Pikachu was chosen, and the reason is this:

And this:

Mac was promoted from AT to Playable, and Sakurai reused Samus mocking his size in the reveal trailer, now, who thunderbolts Ridley in the SSE that make he loses his chance of killing Samus?
Yup, that's right, it's Pikachu!

It would make sense for Sakurai to do this with Ridley in the same way he did with Mac(guess Ridley wants revenge from Pikachu)