Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[OblivionWolf]

I really want people to look at these 3 pictures at the same time. (Sorry idk how to post pics :/)

Picture of shadow Ridley and shadow Pika.

http://i.imgur.com/XpKGpy5.jpg

Picture of Samus and Pika.

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130616051350/ssbb/es/images/f/f7/Pikachu_y_Samus_SSB4_(3DS).jpg

Picture of Other M Ridley and Samus.

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb...arge_Geothermal_Power_Plant_Pyrosphere_HD.jpg

If you really look at these sizes shadow Ridley size is literally half the size of Other M Ridleys fist.....Heck Other M Ridley finger would be longer then Pika but the the shadow show Pika being half shadow Ridley size. C'mon dont tell me you guys can't see that?

 

[Xhampi]

It's still nice to see that Sakurai have made some progress in Metroid Prime, going from Frigate Orpheon to Phendrana Drifts

Good luck Sakurai we believe in you, we know that you will succesfully complete this game some day.

 

[Oasis_S]

Maybe Ismar won't notice.

 

[majora_787]

And here lies the problem with your argument. You're attacking the design choices of the game that you don't even know yet, that you are extrapolating from 5 seconds of the bosses shadow. This is simply ridiculous. If it is a boss fight, you know next to nothing about it, how the hell can you attack the design? For all you know, this was a scripted 5 seconds purely for this direct, and the actual boss fight is much different.

The crazy claims you make just make you sound like someone who can't accept that Ridley might be a boss, so you're lashing out at shadows. I still have hope that Ridley might be playable, but when these are half the arguments I hear in his favor, it physically hurts.

I am attacking design choices I can see. That is not ridiculous. And if you don't see the problem with the whole "they could have reprogrammed him to do whatever and he literally acts 100% different" excuse, then you're not really in any position to tell other people to stop using bad logic.

And how many times have I said he could be a boss? SEVERAL. I am not discounting the possibility of him being a boss, I am pointing out what is THERE. If you are going to sit there and tell me moving at a half-walk speed is not slow, and grabbing and not doing damage is NOT weird boss behavior, and it doesn't matter because that was obviously not how the boss even behaves, we're done having this conversation because you're obviously at no point going to be even half reasonable about this whatsoever and refuse to acknowledge any of the obvious outstanding problems that are sitting out for us to see, boss or not.

EDIT: @ OblivionWolf , you know, the scale is different between Smash Bros. and the games themselves. But yes, however big Ridley is, he's not THAT big. I wouldn't call Pikachu "half" his size, but yeah.

 

[Zage]

I don't know if it was already stated but :

Ayup.

Those are two different characters.

 

[Sinn]

I think one of the reasons I never came to this thread much before is it just moves too fast. I miss a day and five new pages appear, gah.

Also, I'm officially going to call this Ridley/Nintendo Direct incident "Shadowgate." Yes I know it's a game.

(Also, before Ridley grabs Pikachu, you have that clunky animation. Maybe it's caused by a cut in the footage, that Pikachu needed to high enough to be grabbed).

I had thought about this briefly before you mentioned and and wrote it off, thinking, "Well, why would they bother to do that?" However, it just struck me (and I don't think I've seen anyone else mention this): They've already done it before. When Little Mac was revealed, the last section where they showed off his KO Punch meter, they zoomed into that small section of the stage and drastically sped up the footage. If they were willing to do that, I don't see why they might not tweak the Ridley footage for hype.

From what I saw, more people cared about the fact Samus is wearing heels now then Ridley being deconfirmed.

I've seen a lot of people gripe about that, and frankly, I don't understand why they all think it's such a huge deal. I actually thought it was awesome since I remember Monty Oum's old Haolid video showed her with some and she was freaking BADASS.

Watch they reveal Gangplank Galleon as a stage ... with K. Rool making a special boss appearance!

*shivers*

Shiver your...timbers?

The whole trilogy was apparently made non-canon with Other M, though.

Where was that? I played through Other M (unfortunately), and I don't recall any particular part contradicting the Prime trilogy...

A bit offtopic but I think Greninja got in because it was essentially a 12 year old's wet dream.

The water type is a...wet dream?

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I really want people to look at these 3 pictures at the same time. (Sorry idk how to post pics :/)

Picture of shadow Ridley and shadow Pika.



Picture of Samus and Pika.

Picture of Other M Ridley and Samus.



If you really look at these sizes shadow Ridley size is literally half the size of Other M Ridleys fist.....Heck Other M Ridley finger would be longer then Pika but the the shadow show Pika being half shadow Ridley size. C'mon dont tell me you guys can't see that?

Picture forms of them and yes I could see it before you showed this i exclused the wings

 

[Phaazoid]

If you are going to sit there and tell me moving at a half-walk speed is not slow, and grabbing and not doing damage is NOT weird boss behavior, and it doesn't matter because that was obviously not how the boss even behaves, we're done having this conversation because you're obviously at no point going to be even half reasonable about this whatsoever and refuse to acknowledge any of the obvious outstanding problems that are sitting out for us to see, boss or not.

This is exactly the problem, you're taking a four second clip of a shadow from not even a trailer from an un finished game and trying to establish "outstanding problems that are sitting out for us to see"

To me, that sounds crazy, so I guess this is where we just live and let live.

 

[Zage]

I am attacking design choices I can see. That is not ridiculous. And if you don't see the problem with the whole "they could have reprogrammed him to do whatever and he literally acts 100% different" excuse, then you're not really in any position to tell other people to stop using bad logic.

And how many times have I said he could be a boss? SEVERAL. I am not discounting the possibility of him being a boss, I am pointing out what is THERE. If you are going to sit there and tell me moving at a half-walk speed is not slow, and grabbing and not doing damage is NOT weird boss behavior, and it doesn't matter because that was obviously not how the boss even behaves, we're done having this conversation because you're obviously at no point going to be even half reasonable about this whatsoever and refuse to acknowledge any of the obvious outstanding problems that are sitting out for us to see, boss or not.

EDIT: @ OblivionWolf , you know, the scale is different between Smash Bros. and the games themselves. But yes, however big Ridley is, he's not THAT big. I wouldn't call Pikachu "half" his size, but yeah.

The game isn't even done yet, what are you on about? Several characters were using their Brawl artwork for Christ's sake.

 

[majora_787]

The game isn't even done yet, what are you on about? Several characters were using their Brawl artwork for Christ's sake.

So we're going to go back to the "Ridley isn't done" argument and say that even though Pyrosphere has been finished as a stage for at LEAST six months, probably longer, for some reason after six months they still haven't finished its hazard? If you want to believe that, you go right ahead. I don't have to explain what the problem is with that.

 

[Radical Larry]

Ahem, if you look at a specific frame in the videos, you will see Ridley's wing just above the middle of the stage. Also, do you wonder why Ridley actually STOPS after moving and then moves again? As if a controller was used on Ridley? In fact, I find it wholly odd that Ridley doesn't even attack Pikachu as a stage hazard.

I just find it completely odd that Ridley moves like that; in fact, he moves just like he was "walking". I find it odd.

 

[majora_787]

Ahem, if you look at a specific frame in the videos, you will see Ridley's wing just above the middle of the stage. Also, do you wonder why Ridley actually STOPS after moving and then moves again? As if a controller was used on Ridley? In fact, I find it wholly odd that Ridley doesn't even attack Pikachu as a stage hazard.

I just find it completely odd that Ridley moves like that; in fact, he moves just like he was "walking". I find it odd.

It really is. And if he's a boss, it's a really odd decision. I don't really know why a boss would move so slowly than anyone can avoid them, and then grab and not attack. Even if it is only a small part of his move pool, for a boss to have a completely useless action is kind of questionable. Like I said earlier, he's really doing his best Scyphozoa impression and it's definitely strange.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Yea I feel sakurai will rip the bandaid off for saying he could not make ridley playable

Just showing his shadow and plus we all thought toon link was dead near the very begining because of him as a conductor on the stage but then we all got suprised that we were wrong this could be one of those

But I woulden't get are hopes up too much

Something i have been thinking about if Ridley is playable how would he reveal him now?

We all know Sakurai likes to explain things but hes alreafy imposed the thought to everyone that Ridley is a boss so i dont really think a out the blue Newcomer traoler will do it....surely he would wanna break down and explain his troll...sdo you guys think they will be another developer direct............think about it.

There seem to be more evidence supporting Ridley's inclusion then going against it. If not playable, I rather Ridley be an Assist Trophy then a Boss/Stage Hazard.

I will never play on Pyrospheree....serious...

 

[aldelaro5]

Sakurai said "Other boss characters make appearance in other stages; not just this one (yellow devil)." So, this COULD mean that he's talking about a stage that is not pyroshpere and the boss character would be of another franchise. (yeah, I'm delusional THAT much).

 

[Dark Phazon]

Did anybody get that tingle in the back of their throat when Ridley's shadow graced the Pyrosphere floor? The kind of feeling you get when horrible news hits you? :o

You should have seen my face man....my jaw hit the ground and i couldnt lift with that shadoww cane massive sorrow .it alost spoiled the whole direct...i couldnt stop thinking about it......was truly ...truly.......horrible...horrible...feeling i wouldnt wish upon even my enemy

"Other boss appearance"

Try thinking about that a little more.

I think what stood out the most was
Other Boss ''Character'' Appearences.

He could have easily said
''Other Boss's Appear''
would have strong implied he is a boss while giving the same impression.

 

[Zage]

So we're going to go back to the "Ridley isn't done" argument and say that even though Pyrosphere has been finished as a stage for at LEAST six months, probably longer, for some reason after six months they still haven't finished its hazard? If you want to believe that, you go right ahead. I don't have to explain what the problem is with that.

Oops, didn't know we had a game developer on our hands here. For a moment there I thought you were just being delusional.

 

[majora_787]

Sakurai said "Other boss characters make appearance in other stages; not just this one (yellow devil)." So, this COULD mean that he's talking about a stage that is not pyroshpere and the boss character would be of another franchise. (yeah, I'm delusional THAT much).

I would go as far as to say he was only acknowledging the fact that Ridley is a boss 99% of the time and literally is a 'boss character', but didn't say he was actually a boss just like Yellow Devil is intentionally.

But who knows.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Even though Yellow Devil works the same as other bosses do? And really, moving slowly and unaggressively isn't "bad boss behavior for the Smash series because other smash bosses didn't do it". It's objectively bad boss design. Take literally any boss you have ever fought. Now imagine instead of the actual fight, they walk slowly over to you, dry hump against you lazily / pick you up and hold you in a warm embrace and do nothing else.

Is that boss battle better or worse than it was before? And that's not even accounting for the weird treatment and the fact that Ridley is really small for a boss appearance. That's just looking at behavior that was definitely taking place.

In literally no setting is slow, languid, docile behavior from a strangely small boss ever a good idea. This isn't a "smash thing". And no, this doesn't prove the Ridley in the footage is not a boss; It proves that he is either playable or an awful boss.

To be fair ofc ypu know im on your side but i can bring up 2 counter points.

1. its very Ridley like behaviour to grab people in his talons and all chars in this smash are more canon like then before. (DK got a roll etc)

2. The reason wy Ridley is slower less aggresive maybe because it is expected he will be among 4 other players at the time and being crazy active or atleast as active as his brswl boss would be too much to handle...he would destroy all 4 playable humans easily and would heavily obstruct the fight constantly.

This fusion of stage hazards and bosses maybe more of a ''Hey remember im here too you know''
and attack you every know and then and not completely destroy the flow of the match to the point where everyon litreally stops fighting each other gangs up on Ridley when he appears because hes so OP and makes it almost impossible to fight the other humans when hes present.

Thats not fun.....

Eh just a thought hope you get my drift.

 

[aldelaro5]

I would go as far as to say he was only acknowledging the fact that Ridley is a boss 99% of the time and literally is a 'boss character', but didn't say he was actually a boss just like Yellow Devil is intentionally.

But who knows.

if he's hinting as ridley only being a boss in his but not an actual hazard well it would confirm 2 things:

1 he's the best troll ever
2 the best plot twist ever (seriously paper mario being playable is more likely than this).

 

[Dark Phazon]

The popular theory is Metroid Prime 4 needs to hurry the **** up.

 

[majora_787]

I dunno. Sakurai has literally no reason to be "sneaky" or indirect in the slightest about deconfirming a popularly requested character. Hell, I don't think he has ever been sneaky about deconfirming a character ever. They either were confirmed, maybe hinted at being playable or making an appearance, or they were outright shown to not be playable.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I dunno. Sakurai has literally no reason to be "sneaky" or indirect in the slightest about deconfirming a popularly requested character. Hell, I don't think he has ever been sneaky about deconfirming a character ever. They either were confirmed, maybe hinted at being playable or making an appearance, or they were outright shown to not be playable.

I'm still skeptical about the shadow deconfirming him

And it sounds like you changed sides on the shadow situation

Again there's no way to proove or disprove that ridley is playable or not

 

[majora_787]

I'm still skeptical about the shadow deconfirming him

And it sounds like you changed sides on the shadow situation

Again there's no way to proove or disprove that ridley is playable or not

I'm not changing sides on the shadow situation. And I am not saying the small shadow, un-bosslike behavior, OR the lava hazard confirm Ridley to be anything other than small, slow, and on a stage that probably has a lava hazard. I have said that's all it really confirms a number of times.

The main thing that makes it iffy as to whether he is playable or not is how Sakurai handled the situation. And in my opinion it makes it far more likely that it IS a buildup to playable Ridley, mostly because I have faith in Sakurai to not make poor decisions like hyping up a dull boss and deconfirmation of a popular character. But obviously it can go either way, and I'm prepared for that.

EDIT: I guess a good explanation would be, it's the same as my kickstarting and participating in the Medusa thread. I am acknowledging that anything is possible, but I'm supporting the "less likely" possibility that is definitely possible, even though many dismiss it as "being struck by lightning fifteen times while in a building" level of probability. I could go on about reasons Ridley ISN'T playable, but a lot of people are acknowledging that he probably is a boss. So I am supporting the possibility of the opposite. And that's it.

 

[Keeshu]

To be fair ofc ypu know im on your side but i can bring up 2 counter points.

1. its very Ridley like behaviour to grab people in his talons and all chars in this smash are more canon like then before. (DK got a roll etc)

2. The reason wy Ridley is slower less aggresive maybe because it is expected he will be among 4 other players at the time and being crazy active or atleast as active as his brswl boss would be too much to handle...he would destroy all 4 playable humans easily and would heavily obstruct the fight constantly.

This fusion of stage hazards and bosses maybe more of a ''Hey remember im here too you know''
and attack you every know and then and not completely destroy the flow of the match to the point where everyon litreally stops fighting each other gangs up on Ridley when he appears because hes so OP and makes it almost impossible to fight the other humans when hes present.

Thats not fun.....

Eh just a thought hope you get my drift.

As for #2..... *looks at Yellow Devil's attacks*....... I don't think that's an excuse to make Ridley slow with Yellow Devil attacking the entire stage.

 

[Jigglypuff & Luma]

I'm still skeptical about the shadow deconfirming him

And it sounds like you changed sides on the shadow situation

Again there's no way to proove or disprove that ridley is playable or not

Well the only way to prove Ridley is playable now is if Sakurai confirms him (or deconfirms him) by actually stating so

 

[majora_787]

Well the only way to prove Ridley is playable now is if Sakurai confirms him (or deconfirms him) by actually stating so

And that's what everyone is hoping to get out of E3. Because honestly, the ambiguity, teasing, and Sakurai mysteriously leaving possibilities open is way worse than outright saying "Ridley's a boss again guys".

 

[Dark Phazon]

Maybe in that case in that clip he was either preforming a recovery or a hover ability like Peach's

Something tells me the audio was cut for a extremely good reason in that clip.

 

[AndreaAC]

I did this out of boredom since i have no idea what to draw...i remember someone saying that Roidley was the same as the Original one...but obviously not

 

[majora_787]

... I'm surprised. It looks like they may have made Other M look distinctly different while keeping all others have distinct similarities on purpose.

I mean even if Other M Ridley is a clone, it would be much younger and have grown up in a significantly different environment. It would definitely be "similar" but still different from that crazy half-machine dragon we all know.

 

[KMAL]

I still think Ridley still has a chance of getting in. Im sure many people have probaly said this but im think that in the direct that the boss character they mentioned may have been Meta Ridley, but then again, I could have been ridley with his Other-M design. Fingers crossed.

 

[SchAlternate]

Those are two different characters.

So are Classic Ridley and Other M Roidley, but they're referred to by the same name. Just like Arcade DK ans Modern DK. And ST Toon Link and WW Toon Link, etc.

Oops, didn't know we had a game developer on our hands here. For a moment there I thought you were just being delusional.

It doesn't take a professional game developer to know what is wrong with that. It's basic logic.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Well the only way to prove Ridley is playable now is if Sakurai confirms him (or deconfirms him) by actually stating so

That will probably happen at E3

That's the next supspicous thing by the way

World directs have always ben 2 months away so from April it goes May then June and guess whats in June and that's E3 even bigger thing than the smash direct a couple of days ago

 

[KMAL]

if he's hinting as ridley only being a boss in his but not an actual hazard well it would confirm 2 things:

1 he's the best troll ever
2 the best plot twist ever (seriously paper mario being playable is more likely than this).

I agree that Sakurai is the best troll ever. When he said Zero Suit Samus wasn't participating, and then said he was joking.... man.....

 

[Dark Phazon]

... I'm surprised. It looks like they may have made Other M look distinctly different while keeping all others have distinct similarities on purpose.

I mean even if Other M Ridley is a clone, it would be much younger and have grown up in a significantly different environment. It would definitely be "similar" but still different from that crazy half-machine dragon we all know.

 

[Zage]

So are Classic Ridley and Other M Roidley, but they're referred to by the same name. Just like Arcade DK ans Modern DK. And ST Toon Link and WW Toon Link, etc.


It doesn't take a professional game developer to know what is wrong with that. It's basic logic.

Cranky Kong and Donkey Kong are not the same character. That's basic logic.

And I'm more tempted to believe Sakurai over a user on Smash Boards.

Right before the direct he said everything we see is still in development and subject to change. Which is why we saw a debug menu and some characters using their Brawl artwork. Not everything is done yet.

Again, basic logic.

 

[BoxedCookies]

After finally catching up on the thread, I still do believe that Ridley is a playable character until Sakurai states that he is or not. It doesn't look good considering the direct however after the analyses that people are making, I do think that he's still possible. Although, on the other hand, I wouldn't be devastated if he isn't however considering the teasing and build up as well as the amount of support, it's about time he's apart of the smash roster.

 

[Deleted member]

So are Classic Ridley and Other M Roidley, but they're referred to by the same name. Just like Arcade DK ans Modern DK. And ST Toon Link and WW Toon Link, etc.

I'm not really liking this logic.

In the case of the DKs, they really are two different characters. They're grandfather and grandson, with the grandfather going by a different moniker after the grandson comes into existence.
All Links are the same being; they are merely reincarnations whenever the world needs the Spirit of the Hero. That being said, ST Link and WW are different incarnations, but they are the same being.

Other M Ridley is a clone of the late, original Ridley. Not only that, but he's treated as a direct rebirth of the original, especially with the fact he retains his memories of Samus.

 

[Dark Phazon]

This guys last point is a pretty good one imo everything is based of Other M so if Ridley is a boss on Pyrosphere why have him have a Hybrid design like all playable chars do?

And before you bring up Brawl Ridley is based of SM Ridley right? SM Ridley never had a 3D Design before and Other M came out after Brawl.

Plus there has ben People saying it looks like Meta Ridley which i disagree but it could be a re design but why just for a boss.....has classic two toes not 3 like Roidley.

 

[Keeshu]

I still think Ridley still has a chance of getting in. Im sure many people have probaly said this but im think that in the direct that the boss character they mentioned may have been Meta Ridley, but then again, I could have been ridley with his Other-M design. Fingers crossed.

Other M Ridley's Swordlike tail
Also if you look closely during some parts you can clearly see spikes on his arms and stuff. If you go into over analyzation mode and look at his head for a while, you'll see he also has the head of Other M Ridley, including the rediculously skinny tip. Just be careful when you look at his head if you're looking at it when he holds Pikachu, cause it will look more like the classic Head, when it's just the arm giving that illusion.
It's not Meta Ridley.

Edit: Dark Phazon basicly answered it already it seems.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Well other m ridley is a lock but not if he's deconfirmed or playable

If playable I am 90% sure super metroid ridley will be a alternate costume for the fans