Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[MasterOfKnees]

This is the biggest misconcept ever. Melee Ridley, is actually big. The camera is just playing tricks on ya.

No it's not. Ridley is farther back than Samus, but not by too much, it's quite clear that he isn't that far behind. It's still his smallest depiction to date except for the retconned original Metroid.

 

[Aurane]

This is the biggest misconcept ever. Melee Ridley, is actually big. The camera is just playing tricks on ya.

If you slow the part in the cutscene when Samus jumps over Ridley, you can see that's actually not the case.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I don't think how it can be judged from a 3~4 second clip though... Speaking of, those 3~4 seconds are the cause of massive Ridley support on the internet in the first place. I really can't FATHOM how people where really, honestly, genuinly expecting Ridley from that clip anyway... I mean, it showed lots of Pokémon to, other F-Zero racers... Wolf (who did became playable in Brawl at least). Yet people decided to massively focus on Ridley.

Also, this comment:

Time to visit the church of Ridley again.

Made me wanna make a pic of Ridley coming out of a hole saying: 'EXCUSE ME, DO YOU HAVE TIME TO TALK ABOUT RIDLEY CHRIST?' - But family is watching so I couldn't...

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I don't think how it can be judged from a 3~4 second clip though... Speaking of, those 3~4 seconds are the cause of massive Ridley support on the internet in the first place. I really can't phantom how people where really, honestly, genuinly expecting Ridley from that clip anyway... I mean, it showed lots of Pokémon to, other F-Zero racers... Wolf (who did became playable in Brawl at least). Yet people decided to massively focus on Ridley.

Maybe because he was given genuine screen time. Ice Climbers, Peach, Fox, Kirby and Sheik didn't have much more screen time either. It wasn't very good trailer material, it's good for an opening cinematic, but for showing off the game and its features it's very misleading. The tons of Pokémons it showed was rather obvious that none of those were gonna end up as playable since they were all put together, with only Pikachu and Jigglypuff being in focus. It was Ridley, Goroh and Wolf that were the tricky ones that didn't get in. And I'm sure Ridley support would have begun even without him being in the Melee trailer, since he's a major Nintendo character in general.

 

[Diddy Kong]

But the screen was focussed on Samus all the time. It even zoomed in into her...

 

[Anomilus]

This is the biggest misconcept ever. Melee Ridley, is actually big. The camera is just playing tricks on ya.

The misconception exists on both sides of the debate.

The detractors want the supporters to believe that Ridley is actually HUGE in the Melee video. The detractors either fail to understand or intentionally ignore that, regardless of Ridley's actual size in that video, what happened is that people found an acceptable range of scale for playable Ridley in that video. People want to say "He'll look weird shrunken down" and crap like that, but it's clear those words are merely personal sentiment, and they're not shared across the board.

...But that's not all. Detractors have failed to notice the Metroid capsule Ridley is holding. Even if the capsule is at exact scale as it was in the game, it would only mean that Ridley is slightly larger than he looks in the video. NOT "huge".

It's actually interesting... Let's consider not just the capsule itself, but the size of the metroid larva within.

As you can see: Capsule, Larva, Samus, Ridley.

Now here's a scene from Super Metroid prior to the encounter with Ridley: Larva, Samus, Scientist.

Larva, Capsule, Scientists.

And.... the Melee opening: Samus, Ridley, Capsule, Larva (barely...)



Perspective can be a really funny thing, ya know...

 

[Diddy Kong]

Diddy, you want to illustrate how big Ridley is compared to Samus?

Prima facie right there!

Notice that the Nintendo bosses in the Adventure Mode are all characters who are really large in their original games.

To be honest, that clip in general was very respectful towards Ridley as a character. I can't believe there was so much hate about his Boss apperance in Brawl.

 

[FalKoopa]

I really can't phantom how people where really, honestly, genuinly expecting Ridley from that clip anyway...

Lolwut?

*fathom

We saw 3 NPCs in the Melee trailer - Ridley, Samurai Goroh, and Wolf.

Wolf became playable (although he was low-priority), Ridley became a boss, and Samurai Goroh became an assist trophy.

Regardless, the trailer is not the reason Ridley is popular. Instead, Ridley was in the trailer BECAUSE he is popular.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

To be honest, that clip in general was very respectful towards Ridley as a character. I can't believe there was so much hate about his Boss apperance in Brawl.

It's only missing like his most important means of attack, you know, his fireballs and fire breath.

While that got into his Meta Ridley fight, as Meta Ridley he has another main means of attack, and that's his new gained arsenal as a cyborg, which means missiles and stuff like that.

The tail scrapper is cool, I'm not totally sure where the wind blowing comes from but it's okay since Smash is allowed to make new stuff, but the rest is very "meh." It's not a terrible boss battle, but it could have been more faithful towards Ridley. I still appreciate his double boss role though, since Ridley obviously didn't make it as a character it's at least nice to get the acknowledgement that he's a super important figure.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I really can't phantom how people where really, honestly, genuinly expecting Ridley from that clip anyway...

What does my kind have to do with this?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Still think a disadvantage Ridley has is the lack of actual 'character' in the Metroid games. Sure, he has manga backstory, but Metroid failed to really go deep into that in the Metroid games. Think his chances would grow considerably if there was a Metroid focussing far more on Ridley's role, and not just 'have him be there and wreck **** up'.

Editted my last posts you ********.

 

[ChronoBound]

Still think a disadvantage Ridley has is the lack of actual 'character' in the Metroid games. Sure, he has manga backstory, but Metroid failed to really go deep into that in the Metroid games.

Zero Mission implied he had character. But yeah, I think more should be done to show Ridley as an actual character as opposed to just a beast. However, I don't think the portrayal he currently has in Metroid hurts his chances.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Still think a disadvantage Ridley has is the lack of actual 'character' in the Metroid games. Sure, he has manga backstory, but Metroid failed to really go deep into that in the Metroid games. Think his chances would grow considerably if there was a Metroid focussing far more on Ridley's role, and not just 'have him be there and wreck **** up'.

Other M seemingly tried to do that, but failed since Ridley's actual appearance happened so late, and his lack of pupils and such makes it impossible to give him an actual character while keeping him mute. I agree that if he showed more character, then he'd probably already be in, but showing characteristic traits are merely bonuses for characters that do so and not minuses for characters that don't, since we have plenty of characters in Smash Bros that don't have an actual personality per say. However, ones that have, like Wolf, Dedede, Meta Knight, Wario, Ike, Diddy Kong etc. obviously get in rather early since they have so much appeal because of that. So yeah, I do agree to a certain extent, I don't think it hurts his chances directly but instead might put him in lower priority because other character have more appeal that way. If Sakurai wants him to have more of a personality, then he will just give him more personality too, as we've seen him do with the retro characters. I do wish the games did give Ridley more of a personality than making him give a somewhat displeased glare in Zero Mission. Just don't give him a voice actor, his personality works great on paper, but I can't imagine a suitable voice actor (inb4 someone links me that video Golden made.)

 

[ChronoBound]

Ridley also built that Ridley robot you fight at the end of Zero Mission, so he is actually incredibly intelligent.

I think Sakamoto not just took Samus back with Other M, but also Ridley and the Pirates back by showing them to be more animals than cognitive beings.

 

[FalKoopa]

Does personality even matter?

I don't remember how much "personality" Bowser had when he was included in Melee.

We haven't gotten Ridley yet only because Metroid isn't as big a series as Mario or Zelda, and it's comparatively lesser popularity in Japan.

And going by the belief that Sakurai wrote the Melee trophy descriptions himself, he has commented that despite his savage looks, he is actually quite intelligent.

 

[Arteen]

In the Super Metroid screenshot, Samus isn't much taller than the capsule itself. If we assume Melee uses those same proportions, then Samus should be roughly half as tall as the perspective makes her appear.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Bowser arguebly had personality in Mario 64, and if nothing else, Mario RPG. Mind that being obstinate enough to kidnap a princess every time despite a plumber throwing all your plans into ruins everytime already is more personality than Ridley has shown in the games.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I don't think personality really matters that much.

There have been several characters that got in and hardly showed any of their personality. And personality isn't really a major factor when it comes to adding characters, it's mostly popularity, potential, and relevance. Characters like Bowser and King Dedede are good examples of this, having showed little of their personality, and retro reps come into mind as well. Though, I guess personality can come with potential at times, Wario being one who loves gross humor having gotten him his fart attack, and Luigi shows a lot of his personality, (particularly in the screenshots for the upcoming game) but for a character like Ridley, it really doesn't matter if not much detail into his life or personality is given in games, I don't think it has much of an affect on his chances.

 

[ChronoBound]

Metroid has never been known for story anyway, and for the one Metroid game that actually tried to make its story a big deal (Other M) is in the running for the worst game in its series.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I kinda liked the story in Other M though. It was really cinematic, like a movie. It suits the series well. Wish they would do it again in such a way. I really wouldn't mind Another M.

Also, if all else fails to resize Ridley, there's always this:

 

[ChronoBound]

I kinda liked the story in Other M though. It was really cinematic, like a movie. It suits the series well. Wish they would do it again in such a way. I really wouldn't mind Another M.

I'm not sure what is worse. This opinion or that Impa should replace Sheik.

 

[FalKoopa]

I'm not sure what is worse. This opinion or that Impa should replace Sheik.

Most of Other M's criticism was directed toward Samus' character, and the controls right? (and Ridley's design, but that's beside the point.)

 

[Ridley22]

On a completely unrelated note, I finally got this in the mail.

Special thanks to whoever made the design in the character icon thread.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I'm not sure what is worse. This opinion or that Impa should replace Sheik.

Both are completely fiiiiiiiiiiineeeeeeeeeee!

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Most of Other M's criticism was directed toward Samus' character, and the controls right? (and Ridley's design, but that's beside the point.)

My main problem with it is neither of those things, it's just that it's a poorly stitched together story that wants to tell too much and ends up not telling enough about what matters. It's the best example why you need to show and not tell things in a story. That, and I think the Galactic Federation part of Samus' story is extremely bland and unimportant in comparison to her life with the Chozo and why she became who she is. They should have started from the beginning if they wanted to tell a story, not just dump some random Federation story unto us.

On a completely unrelated note, I finally got this in the mail.

Special thanks to whoever made the design in the character icon thread.

Holy ****! I want one! How did you get this?

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

If you think that Ridley is too big, you'd be dead wrong after this...

Spoiler

 

[Diddy Kong]

Let's talk more about Ridley's hole.

Spoiler

 

[Kamiko]

I've been thinking his tail could just not cause flinching, maybe even take reduced damage. It would be like getting hit with Fox's blaster; It's annoying, but it's not stopping you.

 

[Arcanir]

Ridley also built that Ridley robot you fight at the end of Zero Mission, so he is actually incredibly intelligent.

I think Sakamoto not just took Samus back with Other M, but also Ridley and the Pirates back by showing them to be more animals than cognitive beings.

Agreed, though at least Ridley shown some sort of self-identity by acting on his own, the rest of the Space Pirates being degraded to just "drones without a queen" was such a kick in the teeth.

 

[?????????????]

Agreed, though at least Ridley shown some sort of self-identity by acting on his own, the rest of the Space Pirates being degraded to just "drones without a queen" was such a kick in the teeth.

Heh. More than a couple of people have told me that "Space Pirate" would be a better character for SSB than Ridley.

 

[Xhampi]

Let's talk more about Ridley's hole.


I like the size comparaison at the bottom right corner of the pic =]

 

[AnOkayDM]

Jeeeeeeeez, now personality is a reason to keep Ridley out of Smash? And I thought we'd heard it all.

 

[Arcanir]

Heh. More than a couple of people have told me that "Space Pirate" would be a better character for SSB than Ridley.

I always have to scratch my head at that, while they're a cool enemy, they're not like Yoshi or Toad and they don't have any strong or defining traits that truly make them stand out. It's literally like suggesting a Goomba over Bowser, except now it's even worse since Other M turned them into cannon fodder with no mind of their own.

 

[Deleted member]

Hmm, that makes me wonder if Sakurai would take more from the concept design than the final one....

 

[Diddy Kong]

And everybody was there just bashing Other M Ridley cause it looks ugly in-game.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Hmm, that makes me wonder if Sakurai would take more from the concept design than the final one....

Yeah, the head looks much better in concept art, his skin looks much more sleek, his arms aren't fat as hell, his wings look much better instead of those weird wings that actually made it into the game, and heck there's even concept design of his old trademark neck (not that I missed that too much.) Something went incredibly wrong during the modelling process. I'd very much like this Ridley in Smash Bros, because this isn't the same design that actually made it into the game.

 

[LiteTheIronMan]

On a completely unrelated note, I finally got this in the mail.

Special thanks to whoever made the design in the character icon thread.

****ing need

anyways, I don't think Sakurai will be unwilling to take creative liberties in order to fit Ridley in. despite what anyone says I'm confident that Ridley can be put in the game properly

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah, the head looks much better in concept art, his skin looks much more sleek, his arms aren't fat as hell, his wings look much better instead of those weird wings that actually made it into the game, and heck there's even concept design of his old trademark neck (not that I missed that too much.) Something went incredibly wrong during the modelling process. I'd very much like this Ridley in Smash Bros, because this isn't the same design that actually made it into the game.

Since Samus isn't a direct rip from Other M and has visual upgrades, it wouldn't be surprising if concept Ridley was the source of Ridley's inspiration. It would still be the Other M Ridley, but given more appealing updates to make it more "bearable" if you will.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

I think Sakamoto not just took Samus back with Other M, but also Ridley and the Pirates back by showing them to be more animals than cognitive beings.

Eh... I would have to say both yes and no to that. Yes, towards the Pirates, as their execution in Other M made them seem more primitive compared to what we came to know them as (kind of a punch in the face to the Pirates' intelligence in the Prime series, that was often displayed in their logs). But no, towards Ridley. Quite arguably, he showed more intelligence in Other M than in any previous game, whether it was outsmarting others while in his earlier lifecycles, i.e., using his shrieks to make the other creatures of the Bottle Ship run amok and keep others busy while he focused on Samus (adolescent stage), and other things.

Even with the Pirates in Other M though, I kinda let that pass since they were just clones from the Federation that may have lacked a lot of basic knowledge of their original counterparts. If the same holds true with Other M Ridley, then well he still came off as a pretty damn intelligent beast regardless.

/another random reply to Chrono's rage boner for Sakamoto

Most of Other M's criticism was directed toward Samus' character, and the controls right? (and Ridley's design, but that's beside the point.)

Not so much the controls, although I guess that could be used as an excuse for others to further hate the game. I liked the whole having to use the d-pad for movement though, as it felt like I was being brought back to the Metroid sidescrollers.

Heh. More than a couple of people have told me that "Space Pirate" would be a better character for SSB than Ridley.

A random Pirate grunt over the leader? I guess like a random Klump or Krusha would be a better character for SSB than K. Rool then.

I always have to scratch my head at that, while they're a cool enemy, they're not like Yoshi or Toad and they don't have any strong or defining traits that truly make them stand out. It's literally like suggesting a Goomba over Bowser, except now it's even worse since Other M turned them into cannon fodder with no mind of their own.

Yeah... At least in the Prime series the Pirates had those cool energy scythes. The pincer-arm Zebesian Pirates kinda lost their appeal to me in Other M for the reasons you mentioned.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Since Samus isn't a direct rip from Other M and has visual upgrades, it wouldn't be surprising if concept Ridley was the source of Ridley's inspiration. It would still be the Other M Ridley, but given more appealing updates to make it more "bearable" if you will.

But Link is 1000% a direct rip from Twilight Princess right?