Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[?????????????]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2H4SkPxfyN8

This guy pretty much sums up my thoughts on the "ridley is too big" argument

Hey, that's me.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

I want to say we'll see a character reveal at PAX for sure because of Nintendo's big presence and all, it would be good for publicity if they had some devs show off a newcomer in a presentation, just like the Wii Fit Trainer.

But.

The fact that I doubt Sakurai or other devs working on the game will be there is what makes me think we shouldn't fully expect a character reveal at the event.

PAX is more possible than people think considering crazy bull**** always happens at PAX.

...granted less than Gamescom but pfft nothing is happening at Gamescom.

Next month is soon, guys.

 

[Deleted member]

Hey, that's me.

HORY SHET, HE FINALLY JOINS THE BOARDS.

 

[Lasifer]

Hey, that's me.

Lol I just got done watching your Smash videos, subscribed! You still doing roster critiques?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Hey, that's me.

The way you talk and look... INSTANTLY reminded me of this dude.

Knocked Up was an awesome movie btw.

 

[SmasherP82]

I didn;t feel like Subscribing to lazy :/ plus I didn't even like the video.

 

[?????????????]

Lol I just got done watching your Smash videos, subscribed! You still doing roster critiques?

Nah, I stopped doing roster critiques after the first Nintendo Direct on SSB4. My videos pretty much show my thoughts on (most) potential characters, I had more requests than I could keep up, and the official roster was starting to come into play (for instance, I got sent tons of rosters to critique after the Direct, only to have them edited hours later when the Wii Fit Trainer was introduced).

I still do roster critiques in PMs, or I see there's a thread on here for it. Might do videos on specific characters I haven't really talked about. Subs have been asking me about thoughts on Wonder Red and Rayman.

 

[SmasherP82]

Nah, I stopped doing roster critiques after the first Nintendo Direct on SSB4. My videos pretty much show my thoughts on (most) potential characters, I had more requests than I could keep up, and the official roster was starting to come into play (for instance, I got sent tons of rosters to critique after the Direct, only to have them edited hours later when the Wii Fit Trainer was introduced).

I still do roster critiques in PMs, or I see there's a thread on here for it. Might do videos on specific characters I haven't really talked about. Subs have been asking me about thoughts on Wonder Red and Rayman.

I kind of get a feeling that Wonder Red might be in O:

 

[Lasifer]

Nah, I stopped doing roster critiques after the first Nintendo Direct on SSB4. My videos pretty much show my thoughts on (most) potential characters, I had more requests than I could keep up, and the official roster was starting to come into play (for instance, I got sent tons of rosters to critique after the Direct, only to have them edited hours later when the Wii Fit Trainer was introduced).

I still do roster critiques in PMs, or I see there's a thread on here for it. Might do videos on specific characters I haven't really talked about. Subs have been asking me about thoughts on Wonder Red and Rayman.

I'm going to be finishing up my final roster soon, could you critique it pls? (This is irrelevant to the Ridley discussion lol)

 

[?????????????]

I kind of get a feeling that Wonder Red might be in O:

Well, I don't want to discuss it at length in a Ridley thread, but I'm not sure atm. W101 hasn't even been released yet.

 

[Deleted member]

And then, this thread is changed from a "Ridley Thread" to a "pizzadudemanguy's FAQ".

 

[?????????????]

And then, this thread is changed from a "Ridley Thread" to a "pizzadudemanguy's FAQ".

Trying to avoid that, but it's been happening wherever I post

 

[Diddy Kong]

And then, this thread is changed from a "Ridley Thread" to a "pizzadudemanguy's FAQ".

Ben is awesome, let him!

 

[Dark Phazon]

All good things are worth the wait.

If Sakurai thought Ridley wasn't worth the wait, he wouldn't be playable, and Sakurai would flat out mention him in an almost disregarding manner like Virdii, instead of making Ridley the focus on the Miiverse update.

Hmmmmm i hear that.....hmmmm.....

 

[Lasifer]

If Ridley isn't confirmed in September, I think we'll have to wait until next year until we get news on him, hell, we might have to wait until the game releases or the roster leaks until we find out if he's playable!

I think it would totally be awesome if Sakurai held on Ridley, and then while we're playing, we fight Ridley and unlock him! I'd still equally be excited if he was confirmed before release.

As for him being deconfirmed, we should be real here, it can happen at ANY time really.

 

[?????????????]

If Ridley was confirmed to be a stage hazard, then honestly, I would not expect him to also be playable. It's not like it would be 100% impossible, but it would be odd.

On the flipside, if we never get a confirmation that Ridley IS a stage hazard, then I think it's entirely likely that he is playable.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

If Ridley isn't confirmed in September, I think we'll have to wait until next year until we get news on him, hell, we might have to wait until the game releases or the roster leaks until we find out if he's playable!

I think it would totally be awesome if Sakurai held on Ridley, and then while we're playing, we fight Ridley and unlock him! I'd still equally be excited if he was confirmed before release.

As for him being deconfirmed, we should be real here, it can happen at ANY time really.

be reasonable

we're going to find the roster before the game comes out, leaks will go everywhere

 

[Lasifer]

be reasonable

we're going to find the roster before the game comes out, leaks will go everywhere

Well how was the roster leaked last time?

 

[Mypantisgone]

be reasonable


we're going to find the roster before the game comes out, leaks will go everywhere

Now the problem will be→Wich roster ?
Everybody wants their minutes of fame,last time the real roster was thought to be fake.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

last time the real roster was thought to be fake.

True. Everyone thought ROB was the one from Star Fox because of where he was postioned and thus thought it was FAKE.

 

[Lasifer]

It's fairly easy to determine whether if a roster is fake, most of them reuse art from other games.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

It's fairly easy to determine whether if a roster is fake, most of them reuse art from other games.

It wasn't a picture posted, just the list.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Sorry to break the subject guys, but I thought I wanted to share something I made. Basically it's gonna be a long weekend, so I thought I might get started making stuff that could replicate what it'd look like if Ridley is confirmed as a playable character, since that's what I've been thinking about these last couple of days.

To save someone from a heart attack, I just want to note this is something I made, it's in no way real, which can also be seen specific places.

Might make the character page later, of course without in-game screenshots. Credit to Ceroja on Deviantart for making the picture on the right side.

Edit: Made some fixes. Original can be seen in the quote under this post to compare.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Sorry to break the subject guys, but I thought I wanted to share something I made. Basically it's gonna be a long weekend, so I thought I might get started making stuff that could replicate what it'd look like if Ridley is confirmed as a playable character, since that's what I've been thinking about these last couple of days.

To save someone from a heart attack, I just want to note this is something I made, it's in no way real, which can also be seen specific places.

Might make the character page later, of course without in-game screenshots. Thanks to Ceroja on Deviantart for making the picture on the right side.

i wish ;-;

 

[Dark Phazon]

Sorry to break the subject guys, but I thought I wanted to share something I made. Basically it's gonna be a long weekend, so I thought I might get started making stuff that could replicate what it'd look like if Ridley is confirmed as a playable character, since that's what I've been thinking about these last couple of days.

To save someone from a heart attack, I just want to note this is something I made, it's in no way real, which can also be seen specific places.

Might make the character page later, of course without in-game screenshots. Thanks to Ceroja on Deviantart for making the picture on the right side.

Oww....man....you PeePz are killing it....RealTalk...

 

[Arteen]

No, I didn't bother making a big long post when he said that he didn't plan to have a discussion made out of it, he just wanted to express his opinion, so there was no reason to make a long post discussing it. Previously people have brought up that they think Ridley fits better as a boss though, and people have even gone ahead and labeled us as "people that don't understand Ridley" which definitely isn't true. We have dealed with such arguments before, which is what I was referring to. Ridley isn't as one-sided as every other boss, and certainly not as one-sided as any bosses from the Metroid series either, sure he's not a complex character in any way, but he does have a character, he's more than just a big scawy dragon that looks cool, which is why it's important that gets represented properly, and it can't get represented properly if he's just in the background ocassionally shooting a fireball or two off. That's not Ridley's appeal, and it'd be much wasted potential.

And yes, Ridley is a boss in the Metroid games. Bowser, Dedede, Meta Knight, Ganondorf, Wolf and even Wario are in their games of origin too. Does that mean that their potential should get wasted too?

Boss attacks are made very differently, there are many more restrictions because you have to take the location and players into consideration much more. With Ridley as a character Sakurai would of course research much more about him, he wouldn't be as limited moveset wise, and he'd have many more moves to represent Ridley's actual fighting style. Therefore I believe that Sakurai would do much better when making Ridley as a character, and would do him much more justice that way.

And Kraid is a much more minor boss than Ridley, it would be sad to see the second most iconic character of Metroid get degraded to the same role as a boss who hasn't appeared in 10 years soon, his last appearance being in a remake, if we go further back than that Kraid hasn't officially appeared in the storyline since 1994.

I liked the boss fights, but I can see what you mean about Sakurai not implementing them in a faithful way. And there will need to be compromises to his fighting style anyway, since Smash obviously plays differently than Super Metroid.

Honestly there's no way to get a playable Ridley in a completely faithful way. There's more to Ridley than size, but being a big, imposing, flying dragon is a major part of his character that would need to be compromised. Sure he was small in the NES game, but that was the only time. He looked hugely different in that game anyway, and spent the whole match hopping in place. I don't think NES-style Ridley is really what anyone wants.

He's also lanky and awkward. Ridley also spends most of his fights hunched up and flying. I can see that being a nightmare for Sakurai to animate. Ridley would need to be incredibly tiny to not be too big when stretched out. Or he'd need to be hunched all of the time, which would look weird when punched in the face, knocked on the ground, or sent flying. Charizard is much more compact, by comparison. Ridley's much easier to animate as a boss.

He can certainly work as a fighter, but it'd be pretty impossible and a huge amount of effort just to make him look half decent.

 

[Dark Phazon]

I dunno if Sakurai WILL do it...but i know he CAN....thats all im saying....
Its not impossible...like he said but it dont think it would be as easy as other chars.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I liked the boss fights, but I can see what you mean about Sakurai not implementing them in a faithful way. And there will need to be compromises to his fighting style anyway, since Smash obviously plays differently than Super Metroid.

Honestly there's no way to get a playable Ridley in a completely faithful way. There's more to Ridley than size, but being a big, imposing, flying dragon is a major part of his character that would need to be compromised. Sure he was small in the NES game, but that was the only time. He looked hugely different in that game anyway, and spent the whole match hopping in place. I don't think NES-style Ridley is really what anyone wants.

He's also lanky and awkward. Ridley also spends most of his fights hunched up and flying. I can see that being a nightmare for Sakurai to animate. Ridley would need to be incredibly tiny to not be too big when stretched out. Or he'd need to be hunched all of the time, which would look weird when punched in the face, knocked on the ground, or sent flying. Charizard is much more compact, by comparison. Ridley's much easier to animate as a boss.

He can certainly work as a fighter, but it'd be pretty impossible and a huge amount of effort just to make him look half decent.

As Sakurai said himself, he and his team could do it if they really put a big effort into it. There's no denying Ridley is one of the harder characters to pull off, his structure is really what could make it hard, and it's really the one and only reason he wouldn't be included since he has everything else going for him. However, we're talking about the man who made Pokémon Trainer happen, and this time with a bigger and incredibly experienced team.

And I'm well aware that Ridley's size is part of his character, but he doesn't need to be several feet bigger than his opponents. To seem imposing he simply needs to be a margain bigger than his opponents, sure he'd not seem huge in comparison to Bowser, but that's because Bowser himself already pulls this off in Smash Bros. Bowser is made huge in the 3D Mario games to show his might, status and make him incredibly threatening to face. Ridley does the same in his source games. However, it still works for Bowser in Smash Bros, especially with his new pose, because he's still the biggest and acts the baddest out of all characters. Ridley can pull the same trick off, he just needs to be about the same height as Bowser while hunched over. And yes, it'd be hard to make it feel natural when Ridley is getting smacked about if his pose is constantly hunched over, but they did it with Bowser in Brawl and Melee, and unlike Bowser Ridley can also run on all fours, so he should actually have an easier time being hunced over than Bowser had.

As for Ridley in the air, it's a matter of scaling the proportions right. What you see most hacks fail at, and why he seems so small, is because they don't scale proportions. If Ridley has to have a smaller wingspan you don't just scale the whole model down, you just scale the wings down, and then maybe scale other body parts down a bit too to not make it look too unnatural. It's just about fine tuning and hitting the right spot in regards to proportions, which is another thing that's hard about implementing Ridley. It's a general rule in 3D to do so, and it happens regularly to Ridley in the Metroid games too in-between games and appearances.

No, there's no way to make him 100% faithful as a playable character, but it's easier to do that with him as a character than as a boss since Smash Bros bosses remain too stationary. Even then not all characters are faithful to their original counterparts, look at Ganondorf, Lucas, R.O.B, Captain Falcon and Ness, they all do different things that they can't do originally to compensate for different reasons (though Ganon is admittedly just hurt from the Melee days.)

 

[Steelia]

If Ridley was confirmed to be a stage hazard, then honestly, I would not expect him to also be playable. It's not like it would be 100% impossible, but it would be odd.

On the flipside, if we never get a confirmation that Ridley IS a stage hazard, then I think it's entirely likely that he is playable.

My thoughts as well. As the saying goes, "No news is good news."

Sakurai is obviously well aware of Ridley's support in the West. I don't think he'd leave us hanging so long and get us hyped up for a stage hazard, unless he was going to reveal that's what Ridley was within the next few weeks/month, or not say anything and leave it to the secret char reveals

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Hmph...no Ridley confirmation today.

Seriously people, lets get real. It's highly unlikely that Ridley will be a stage hazard AND a character. The reason there were two Donkey Kong's is because that was a retro stage, and we all know it wouldn't have been complete if old DK wasn't present at the very top. Not to mention they're different characters.

Sure, one could be the real one, and the other would be a clone, but that probably won't happen anyway. If Samus is the Other M version, logic dictates that Ridley, in whatever appearance he makes, would be the Other M version as well. Not to mention, with Prime and Super Metroid being completely ignored thus far, it should be safe to say it's Other M Ridley or bust.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Prime and Super Metroid may be ignored but jesus christ we know next to nothing about the game

I think they'll pick Other M or the Smash Bros design and expand on that whether he's playable or not but still

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Prime and Super Metroid may be ignored but jesus christ we know next to nothing about the game

I think they'll pick Other M or the Smash Bros design and expand on that whether he's playable or not but still

This is true. However, I can't understand why some people think that Ridley being both playable AND a hazard is likely to happen. There's a difference between being hopeful and being stupid about it, and hoping that he is both is just plain stupid.

It's just like how people thought he would be a boss and a character. It just wouldn't happen.

However, as others have said, there has been nothing said to disconfirm Ridley, and instead, I think we'll see him revealed soon.

 

[Tetra's Tracker]

I've never seen an argument that murders the 'Ridley is too big' crap as brutally as this one, not that particular piece of crap hasn't been brutally murdered time and time again already:

 

[FlareHabanero]

Hmph...no Ridley confirmation today.

Ridley won't be revealed for a while (if he gets revealed).

 

[Angelglory]

Just imagine Miss Fit in the Smash cafeteria, making sure everyone is eating healthy.

She takes away a big plate from Bowser, since he's so fat.

Notices Ridley's anorexic body and slides it over to him instead.

I'm just gonna throw this out there...

...This may or may not be turning into a picture right now.

 

[Starcutter]

I drew Ridley today.

u like?

 

[CardiganBoy]

I think if Ridley will be revealed, we have to wait a little, im sure sakurai will show us another 2 or 3 screenshots of the Metroid stage, maybe with more hints, and then he will throw the bomb, something like the Pilotwings stage.

 

[RODO]

Hey, that's me.

Holy ****, how about that haha

 

[Z1GMA]

I drew Ridley today.

u like?

He seem like he wants a cracker.

 

[Tepig2000]

I've never seen an argument that murders the 'Ridley is too big' crap as brutally as this one, not that particular piece of crap hasn't been brutally murdered time and time again already:

I think you're the third one to post this video already.