Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[Cutie Gwen]

So, I haven't actually watched this yet myself, but well, I participated in the discussion so I don't really need to watch it to know what's being said. Here's Wiidude's chat about Ridley featuring both me and his friend R.O.B. and beyond. Its also linking back to this thread, too.

LOOK AT THOSE COMMENTS! Tons of people are stating that their look on Ridley changed! YOU DECREASED THE AMOUNT OF TOOBIGOTS!! THANK YOU

 

[Reila]

You know what would be a nice surprise in the Comic Con thingy? The 3DS Metroid stage revealed. Without Hazardley in sight, of course.

 

[Gene]

I do fear that Sakurai might end stage week with Hazardley...

Hopefully he shows Rideconfirmedley on that potential Falco Friday.

 

[Deleted member]

Was there another Picture PR or something?

Where are all of these pictures coming from?

 

[SmilingMad]

@TitanTeaTime I know. That's why I said kind enough. because no hazardly.



also, new pyrosphere pics

Spoiler

And still, not a sight of Ridley.

 

[Gene]

The Tomodachi Life argument is so stupid. Ridley detractors never cease to amaze me.

State your case. I'd like to know why you think so.

 

[NintenRob]

Something I see tossed around a lot here is that people say Metroid hasn't been represented well in past Smash Bros. and honestly, thats plain and simply not true.

In 64, we got Samus and Zebes, this was the first Smash game with only 12 characters so having Samus is already good and while Zebes wasn't anything special, neither were some other stages.

Melee, Samus remains alone again. But so do Kirby and DK, in fact, the only reason any franchises not named Mario, Zelda and Pokemon had more then 1 character, is because we got last minute clones. As for other content, Brinstar is pretty much a Zebes rehash but looks much better and more organic. Then we have Brinstar Depths, which is absolutely excellent. It captures that same lonely feel that Metroid games gives, and Kraid in the background was great. Kraids fight might not have any lava in his fight but honestly it works better giving of this dark lighting. We also have that Metroid section in Adventure which is very reminiscent of trying to escape Zebes from the actual games, it even had a metroid styled door at the beginning. Add the screw attack item and Metroid is pretty well represented for that game.

Now Brawl.

We got
a Newcomer in the form of Zero Suit Samus, its not the one people wanted but she does bring in something new with her unique paralyzer and Final Smash transformations.
Two new stages, the only other franchise to get more then one stage who isn't the big 3 is DK, and one of them is just a retro stage.
Norfair is the place you fight Ridley making it an iconic location, although it doesn't really look like Norfair and its filled with Hazards. We also have Frigate Orpheon, this is actually a really good pick, Watch this video for why

It also got two bosses, and no other franchise got two bosses. And while Ridleys moves might not represent him well, his character definitely does, even in Smash he is trying to mess with Samus and even tries again as Meta Ridley where he does get firebals and it is probably the most fun of all the bosses, Smash even introduced Ridleys iconic wall scrape.
You also get a Metroid assist trophy and a revamped item. How isn't this good representation?

 

[Phaazoid]

State your case. I'd like to know why you think so.

Because Giga-Bowser will be on that stage. Will they just say Bowser can't use his final smash on that stage? Or will they have some sort of gameplay built in to allow characters that are a little bigger to work there instead. Plus, Ridley wouldn't even be bigger than bowser, let alone giga bowser.

is the size argument still really a thing? really?

 

[Reila]

Lol @ people that actually thinks Metroid isn't under-represented. The series has ONE playable character (Samus and Zamus have different movesets, but they still are the same person). Even freaking Star Fox has three. Having a few stages in the series and a boss character (who no one wants to see as a boss, but as a playable character) doesn't make Metroid "well represented".

 

[Gene]

Because Giga-Bowser will be on that stage. Will they just say Bowser can't use his final smash on that stage? Or will they have some sort of gameplay built in to allow characters that are a little bigger to work there instead. Plus, Ridley wouldn't even be bigger than bowser, let alone giga bowser.

is the size argument still really a thing? really?

The size arguement will be a thing until he's confirmed playable. I'm not arguing against him since I want him playable, but I still think he's a stage hazard because of the Smash direct. I hope I get btfo though because he's pretty fun to play in Smash Crusade.

 

[Phaazoid]

The size arguement will be a thing until he's confirmed playable. I'm not arguing against him since I want him playable, but I still think he's a stage hazard because of the Smash direct. I hope I get btfo though because he's pretty fun to play in Smash Crusade.

I can respect your position except the part where you play crusade

I'm not sold on his inclusion either. I just tire of bad arguments, like the size one. I've been seeing them for 8 years. It wears on you.

 

[NintenRob]

Lol @ people that actually thinks Metroid isn't under-represented. The series has ONE playable character (Samus and Zamus have different movesets, but they still are the same person). Even freaking Star Fox has three. Having a few stages in the series and a boss character (who no one wants to see as a boss, but as a playable character) doesn't make Metroid "well represented".

There's more to Smash then characters, and Zero Suit Samus is still another character. Especially now they are separated.

 

[Phaazoid]

There's more to Smash then characters, and Zero Suit Samus is still another character. Especially now they are separated.

There's a difference between # of slots on a roster and number of represented characters.

The argument isn't that ZSS counts as a roster spot or not. The argument is that ZSS is still Samus.

 

[Waluigi is too big]

If Ridley is a boss, getting all those pictures of the pyrosphere must be a real pain. If the yellow devil is any indication then boss ridley would appear quite frequently and the smash direct shows that he moves around a lot. Think about all the pictures and gameplay clips that have been taken on the pyrosphere. Try to avoid a possible boss Ridley in those must be a pain.

 

[JaidynReiman]

LOOK AT THOSE COMMENTS! Tons of people are stating that their look on Ridley changed! YOU DECREASED THE AMOUNT OF TOOBIGOTS!! THANK YOU

Keep in mind that Wiidude was the one who started the discussion and invited me! Thank Wiidude, I just helped a bit. :D

@TitanTeaTime I know. That's why I said kind enough. because no hazardly.



also, new pyrosphere pics

Spoiler

Lol even more Pyrosphere pics. Keep it coming, Sakurai. Honestly, I keep looking at those holes in the background, and I swear, they are nothing but decorations.

 

[NatP]

If Ridley is a boss, getting all those pictures of the pyrosphere must be a real pain. If the yellow devil is any indication then boss ridley would appear quite frequently and the smash direct shows that he moves around a lot. Think about all the pictures and gameplay clips that have been taken on the pyrosphere. Try to avoid a possible boss Ridley in those must be a pain.

Maybe most of these pictures are on the FD version?

 

[CrypticSpark]

The point about pyrosphere pics is interesting, all these pics of a apparently unfinished stage (at least according to people who say Hazardly isn't finish), yet we still have no idea how the stage works, if it even does have any special mechanics . Keep hoping we get info sooner to catch people off guard but looks like we may get the big reveal in August. I know people say that Sakuari has caught us off guard with the Little Mac reveal when people were expecting a DK rep, but the Pyrosphere PoTD being in August, the same month as the original Metroid release in Japan and North America feels like it makes too much sense.

 

[Phaazoid]

Lol even more Pyrosphere pics. Keep it coming, Sakurai. Honestly, I keep looking at those holes in the background, and I swear, they are nothing but decorations.

Decorations and misdirection

 

[SmilingMad]

EVO is apparently on the anniversary of Earthbound/Mother according to someone. I do wonder what kind of special secret thingy could be revealed at EVO, huh?
August here we come hell yeah.

 

[Exate]

I can't recall a time on any forum where I've had so much trouble keeping up with a thread. I've been lurking here for quite a few weeks, and while I've managed to read a good few hundred or so pages along the way, this thread moves so fast that it's easy to miss posts along the way.

Anyway, hello! I know this introduction isn't that formal, but introductory threads aren't really my cup of tea. I'm not somebody who gets too involved with communities these days, so I prefer to hang around in the background. I've been playing SSB since its first installment, and I've kept up with the series since. My free time usually ends up pouring into reading message boards revolving around the franchise when a new game is up-and-coming. I'd also like to state that I, too, am a supporter of Ridley's inclusion as a playable character.

This thread's been full of a bunch of wonderful fan art, speculation, and general all-out silly posts — quite a testament to this character, but... as aforementioned by somebody else, also just as much a testament to how unsure we are of Ridley's status in the game. As indicated by the second post in the thread, we have a lot of conclusions to come to that he's likely a playable character, but things are still up in the air.
Granted, everything is still up in the air until Sakurai makes it 100% clear.

I can see a detractor's point of view in the conclusion that Ridley is a boss hazard: Sakurai brought up the Yellow Devil durign the direct to explain the mechanics of boss hazards (who was a perfect choice, considering he's familiar enough to the audience in the respect that he's been shown before), and due to constraints in time, teased Ridley's shadow, with the remark that there'd be other boss characters that'd appear in the game — Ridley's appearance was like the period to the sentence that was the Yellow Devil, so to speak. But, as supporters have noticed, there are a lot of fishy things about it; shadow analyses indicates he's not very large, he has choppy movement, and he's... slow. Very slow. Unfinished boss at the time? Maybe. Playable? Perhaps. We can try to draw conclusions, but nobody really knows for sure.

Personally? I find the shadow tease in the direct a form of damage control. It's implied he's a stage hazard, yet leaves enough room for uncertainty based on Sakurai's wording, and his history of being vague about various details in the game (Toon Link, for example).

At this point in time, if Ridley is strictly a boss, there's no real good reason for Sakurai to continuing beating around the bush — he could show him off already and get it over with. If Ridley isn't the stage hazard? Showing what is the real stage hazard (presumably Rhedogian or Goyagma as possible alternatives), would directly — albeit informally — confirm Ridley right off the bat, considering we already saw what was obviously his shadow in the direct. Sakurai has indicated that wow-ing the player with character reveals is something he likes to do, what with the whole interview regarding using trailers over a subspace in this installment of the game. It makes sense to me that he'd drag on a character like Ridley for so long, for one big reveal at the end before release.

If we so much as get a Zelda newcomer reveal soon, it'd be safe to say the trophy quiz is indeed an instance of foreshadowing, and we can probably expect a Metroid newcomer sometime soon after (or the other way around; we could get a Zelda newcomer last!).
And I say "Metrouid newcomer" because I know it's a possiblity that we could get something that isn't Ridley, although we'd hope for that to not be the case.

While many of you probably take it into account, I'd still like to remind everybody that while Sakurai may have certain patterns in how he has done things up to this point, he is still human; he's not a machine restricted to doing things a certain way, and could have unintentionally misled us fans with the shadow in the direct. While you might be convinced Ridley is playable at this point (and I absolutely understand as to why), it could still very well be the opposite, unfortunately. Prepare for disappointment, just in case.

-----

Concerning the stage reveals this week; Sakurai's probably just briefly elaborating on these stages in advance of the tournament this weekend, as these stages will likely be playable during it. While I'd love for him to show Pyrosphere tomorrow with the full reveal of its stage hazard, and a follow-up post later about a new character trailer this coming Monday, I'm not countin' on it.

 

[Phaazoid]

Concerning the stage reveals this week; Sakurai's probably just briefly elaborating on these stages in advance of the tournament this weekend, as these stages will likely be playable during it. While I'd love for him to show Pyrosphere tomorrow with the full reveal of its stage hazard, and a follow-up post later about a new character trailer this coming Monday, I'm not countin' on it.

Welcome, very thoughtful first post, glad to have you.

Just wanted to give you some info you've missed about this last part, it's been confirmed that the comicon tournament will use the same build as the best buy demo, so no new stages there. Makes you think.

Also if he did a stage hazard post of Pyrosphere on a friday that wasn't Ridley, and that was all... It'd be troll as hell xD, but it'd still be as close to confirming Ridley as possible, at least indirectly, so I'd still be happy.

 

[majora_787]

I'm not going to sit and read everything I've missed in this infinite skeleton hell death train of hype, I thought I'd put this out there. I posted it to Gamefaqs, though I may as well throw it here so it doesn't go to waste.

Spoiler

Characters get deconfirmed explicitly. It is said they are not playable, or they are shown explicitly in nonplayable roles. Yellow Devil was no exception. While we didn't know his exact role at the time, it was visibly apparent he was not a boss.

Ridley was supposedly EXPLICITLY DECONFIRMED beyond a shadow of a doubt (pun) without being mentioned, without being SHOWN, and without having a role defined? That is the definition of a vague or ambiguous portrayal when EVERYONE ELSE was handled up front and explicitly. And it isn't some thing where "Oh if I handle everyone BUT Ridley explicitly and just show a shadow without saying anything they'll GUESS the right answer probably" is a legitimate thing here. Sakurai went out of his way to clarify that CHROM wasn't playable after he DELIBERATELY SHOWED CHROM in Robin's final smash.

Then we get to BOSS handling. Dark Emperor and Yellow Devil were both shown in their stages' first appearances. Pyrosphere's first appearance? A hint at Ridley being able to appear on the stage in NO specified context whatsoever (a lot of things can appear on stages, after all), and no visual indication that Ridley is in the game at *ALL* until EIGHT MONTHS later.

Then we get to the footage. We have 11 seconds of Ridley with about 6-7 seconds of flight. Ridley is shown flying slowly to the left, stopping, and continuing left without changing altitude which is fully able to be a hover. We then see Ridley abruptly hop right. Ridley doesn't seem to attack in 11 seconds. In 11 seconds, Yellow Devil attacks about ten times and *dies* in some observed footage. So Ridley is a PRETTY docile boss it seems.

His shadow is approximately Bowser-sized given that shadows are about 1:1 and all follow the same physics on Pyrosphere, allowing us to compare the two. Which means we have a slow Ridley that moves slightly faster than Pikachu's half-walk that is very docile only attacking after entire ten-second windows who needs to jump for small boosts in altitude and make abrupt turns unlike normal bosses and is conveniently the size of a large playable character.

On the layout of the Pyrosphere, this means we have a small, docile, slow boss on a very large stage about ten times his size. Other bosses shown generally occupy 1/3 to 1/4 of the space of the stage so you are forced to contend with them. Here? If Ridley were a boss, you have 90% of the stage free AND platforms to help characters with bad jumping avoid him with ease. This is poor boss design.

So let's talk about Sakurai. Let's suppose he is teasing Ridley as a boss. He is taking a popularly requested character and teasing them more than any other character in order to reveal him in a downgrade of the role he ALWAYS OCCUPIES, even in just the last Smash Bros. game... in a fashion that rips off another game he did not make? That is an absolutely ridiculous notion that is not going to excite anyone.

"Hey! I hope you find this exciting! We took a character people want to play as and gave them the SAME ROLE THEY ARE ALWAYS IN! Except now they're not a boss, they're just a GLORIFIED STAGE HAZARD PUNCHING BAG! And best of all this exact same situation is replicated much better in DEAD OR ALIVE! So nothing changed except for a downgrade, and I got lazy! EXCITING, HUH? Worth a year of teasing and ambiguity which has not been dealt to any other characters except for Palutena on any level!"

You can call it "grasping at straws", but the problems are extremely apparent. With the entire situation. All of it. Ridley's playable because this is probably the poorest way of building excitement ever conceived if he isn't.

And yes, you can say "BUT THAT'S JUST SPECULATION!"

Well of course it is. It's speculation off what we were given. Everything we know about Ridley being in the game. A portrayal accurate to what we've seen.

While I can respect that people would think so, I don't believe Sakurai is "unintentionally" doing anything with Ridley. He has been at least semi-explicit in deconfirming every single character and even made clear that Chrom is not playable after showing him as part of a final smash.

If Ridley is literally the only character in the entire game he forgets to clarify or be explicit with for an entire year while only showing his shadow and being no more forward than that, that's a little bit worse than an "oops" I think.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Welcome, very thoughtful first post, glad to have you.

Just wanted to give you some info you've missed about this last part, it's been confirmed that the comicon tournament will use the same build as the best buy demo, so no new stages there. Makes you think.

Like it matter the pyrosphere is wii u exclusive.

 

[Phaazoid]

Like it matter the pyrosphere is wii u exclusive.

It may not relate as much to Ridley, but his PotD patterns are always interesting to me. We'll never be able to accurately predict his reveals, but who knows, he might let something slip .

 

[Deleted member]

Just watched Wiidude's Ridley video, I then scroll down in the comments expecting war, but what I see is peace, there were even people who changed their minds, is this really happening?

 

[majora_787]

Just watched Wiidude's Ridley video, I then scroll down in the comments expecting war, but what I see is peace, there were even people who changed their minds, is this really happening?

Not on Gamefaqs.

 

[Maxilian]

I had a vision of the future (a dream) where Ridley was confirmed, so fear not my brother and sisters!, Ridley is comming and noone will stop him/her!

 

[AustarusIV]

@TitanTeaTime I know. That's why I said kind enough. because no hazardly.



also, new pyrosphere pics

Spoiler

Holy crap, am I the only person who's noticed that new hole at the top of the first pic? It's there, right next to Diddy Kong's face.

Now before you start panicking, that definitely does not look like it could have been created by Hazardly. It seems to be just another hole in the background, but with a red hue.

 

[Exate]

Just wanted to give you some info you've missed about this last part, it's been confirmed that the comicon tournament will use the same build as the best buy demo, so no new stages there. Makes you think.

Huh. Suddenly, these PotD reveals are much more peculiar. He could certainly be building up to something, but it's also likely that he feels he's running out of time. I'm not sure what he plans to do with PotD post-release of the 3DS version in Japan, but he's really pumping out quite the variety of content this week.

And thanks for the welcome!

While I can respect that people would think so, I don't believe Sakurai is "unintentionally" doing anything with Ridley. He has been at least semi-explicit in deconfirming every single character and even made clear that Chrom is not playable after showing him as part of a final smash.

If Ridley is literally the only character in the entire game he forgets to clarify or be explicit with for an entire year while only showing his shadow and being no more forward than that, that's a little bit worse than an "oops" I think.

It would be one heck of a shock if he made such a mistake, but anything's possible. Admittedly, I'm a fairly pessimistic person by nature, hence why I'm not getting my hopes up too much.

 

[NatP]

If you ask me, I think Ridley is WAAAAAAAAAAY too popular and well-known of a character for Sakurai to make the mistake of unintentionally hyping him. If it was any other character I could believe it, but considering it's freaking Ridley? Seems extremely unlikely.

 

[Riskman]

[/spoiler]

Holy crap, am I the only person who's noticed that new hole at the top of the first pic? It's there, right next to Diddy Kong's face.

Now before you start panicking, that definitely does not look like it could have been created by Hazardly. It seems to be just another hole in the background, but with a red hue.

That isn't a new hole. If you look closely at other pictures of Pyrosphere (looking at the detail I can tell that it is the regular version of it) you'll notice that the 'new' hole is actually just the one above the door that has always been there.

 

[Reality_Ciak]

[/spoiler]

Holy crap, am I the only person who's noticed that new hole at the top of the first pic? It's there, right next to Diddy Kong's face.

Now before you start panicking, that definitely does not look like it could have been created by Hazardly. It seems to be just another hole in the background, but with a red hue.

There is one jagged edge that vaguely looks like Ridley's tail. I hope I'm just seeing thing. Playable or bust. And if he's a boss, he damn well better be a boss on the 3DS as well. But I'm still convinced on playable.

 

[JaidynReiman]

There is one jagged edge that vaguely looks like Ridley's tail. I hope I'm just seeing thing. Playable or bust. And if he's a boss, he damn well better be a boss on the 3DS as well. But I'm still convinced on playable.

Jagged edge? In the second pic? That is just a part of a cracked wall or pillar. Its definitely not Ridley's tail.

 

[Phaazoid]

Huh. Suddenly, these PotD reveals are much more peculiar. He could certainly be building up to something, but it's also likely that he feels he's running out of time. I'm not sure what he plans to do with PotD post-release of the 3DS version in Japan, but he's really pumping out quite the variety of content this week.

And thanks for the welcome!

Sure!

The last time we had a 'stage reveal week' was right before E3 this year, and we got 2 Wii U stages. Both of which were playable in the demo, both previously unknown (Colosseum, Mario U). This time around he's gone and given us a Wii U stage(starfox), a previously unknown 3DS port(megaman), a full reveal of a previously teased 3DS stage(tomadachi life), and in the picture gallery we got a tease of yet a 4'th stage, Green Hill Zone for 3DS.

It's been a good week. And who knows, we could have something bigger Friday.



Also, for y'all worrying that the holes in pyrosphere look like they were made by Ridley - it wouldn't even matter if we had a distinctly Ridley -shaped hole. This is his stage, it would make sense for him to have marked it. Playable or boss, him making those holes fits.

 

[DustyPumpkin]

A really long but good post

Kinda wanna Copy-Paste this onto my Tumblr..

 

[Kenith]

As I thought, none of these screenshots confirm anything.

However, I did not realize lava actually pours through the holes in the wall.
Further emphasizing a connection to lava on this stage.

I'm guessing that either

A) The stage boss isn't Ridley, but instead a Metroid boss associated with lava, like, say, Kraid, or Vorash.
B) There is no stage boss because there's already a lot of lava hazards and it would be too hectic to have a boss

 

[RidleyKraid187]

As I thought, none of these screenshots confirm anything.

However, I did not realize lava actually pours through the holes in the wall.
Further emphasizing a connection to lava on this stage.

I'm guessing that either

A) The stage boss isn't Ridley, but instead a Metroid boss associated with lava, like, say, Kraid, or Vorash.
B) There is no stage boss because there's already a lot of lava hazards and it would be too hectic to have a boss

Kraid isn't associated with Lava........His association is Jungles, caves, areas like Brinstar or Biosphere or Phazon Mines.

 

[majora_787]

Kinda wanna Copy-Paste this onto my Tumblr..

Go nuts.

I don't go on about Ridley on my own, so if you want to I don't mind.

 

[Kenith]

Kraid isn't associated with Lava........His association is Jungles, caves, areas like Brinstar or Biosphere or Phazon Mines.

He is in Melee, with Brinstar Depths.

 

[SmilingMad]

So my friend brought up a rather interesting theory regarding Ridley's inclusion and ZSS's upgrades.

Spoiler

Remember how in Other M, Samus's Sissy Syndrome nearly killed her in the Ridley cutscenes by making her armour phase out? Apparently, she wouldn't have stood a chance in her Zero Suit.
So, let's say that Ridley is in the game. The Brawl ZZS fighting with Ridley would then be rather...odd, considering in Other M this would've been her death-sentence. So they gave her rocket heels to give her more combat potential and make it easier to imagine her fighting Ridley without the Varia Suit.

What do you guys think?