Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[Jerry Applesauce]

That actually brings up something else I've been thinking about lately. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that, typically, bosses in Smash follow a similar pattern of standing in one place (usually the left or right of the stage they're fought on), attacking from that location, and moving to another location while attacking. That's how the majority of bosses in Brawl functioned, and the Yellow Devil also follows this pattern. The Ridley we saw in the Direct slowly flew in to the center of the stage, stopped, seemingly did nothing, and then slowly flew to the left end of the Pyrosphere, and then immediately turned back. What's strange is that Ridley didn't seem to really do anything in that time he was shown, and considering how slowly he was moving, I find it unlikely that his movement across the stage would actually cause damage to players who touched him. It doesn't seem to match up with what bosses in Smash have usually, and seem to still, act.

Yeah, true. But keep in mind the "bosses" you are talking about were not "stage bosses." We've had boss fights, but have never really had stages with bosses in them. Yellow Devil is the first revealed "stage boss" in the series. So how can we conclude that Ridley's going to be this poorly-designed, sluggish stage boss when we've only viewed a few seconds of footage of him flying, grabbing Pikachu, and then continue flying in the initial direction he was going? In the Metroid series here are times in Ridley fights where he's slow, some times where he picks you up, some times when he's fast.

 

[Deleted member]

In reading through the last few pages, I get the feeling I'm kind of lucky that I missed what went down here in the last hour and a half.

Cyclical arguments about the bigotry of Ridley Supporters and Detractors and the evidence each base supports, that must've been a fun time.

 

[Kamiko]

Yeah, true. But keep in mind the "bosses" you are talking about were not "stage bosses." We've had boss fights, but have never really had stages with bosses in them. Yellow Devil is the first revealed "stage boss" in the series. So how can we conclude that Ridley's going to be this poorly-designed, sluggish stage boss when we've only viewed a few seconds of footage of him flying, grabbing Pikachu, and then continue flying in the initial direction he was going? In the Metroid series here are times in Ridley fights where he's slow, some times where he picks you up, some times when he's fast.

Because Ridley has no reason to move to a character at that speed. When he moves that slowly in a Metroid game, he's already close to the player, or is attacking with ranged attacks. If Ridley was spewing fire at Pikachu in the direct, the slowness would've been fine. But he does nothing, and that speed would never let him catch up to a player. Might as well give him the Quad Laser while we're at it.

 

[IsmaR]

They're hardly going to translate exact gameplay for a mechanic/reason like this. If they made the boss hazards such a omni-present factor in a match (which is hard enough to imagine considering how obtrusive the Yellow Devil is now), then people wouldn't pick the stage to play so much as to play a Bowser-Party-esque minigame of 'avoid the hazard' rather than actually play on a stage for the sake of playing Smash. I realize the wording/thought alone sounds dumb, but if Ridley were as fast/dangerous/"well, Ridley" as he was in the games, then the stage wouldn't even be legal or fun by friendly/party Smash standards. If they're going the boss route once again, with the added twist of being a hazard, then it'll be even worse than his Brawl boss appearances in terms of "sluggishness" and "accurately representing how he is in Metroid" just to give even the casualest players a chance to beat him. Which in truth, is why many of us are absolutely against the idea of making Ridley a glorified piñata over a playable character.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

In reading through the last few pages, I get the feeling I'm kind of lucky that I missed what went down here in the last hour and a half.

Cyclical arguments about the bigotry of Ridley Supporters and Detractors and the evidence each base supports, that must've been a fun time.

Especially because i just finished my next size comparison its the last post on the previous page.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

They're hardly going to translate exact gameplay for a mechanic/reason like this. If they made the boss hazards such a omni-present factor in a match (which is hard enough to imagine considering how obtrusive the Yellow Devil is now), then people wouldn't pick the stage to play so much as to play a Bowser-Party-esque minigame of 'avoid the hazard' rather than actually play on a stage for the sake of playing Smash. I realize the wording/though alone sounds dumb, but if Ridley were as fast/dangerous/"well, Ridley" as he was in the games, then the stage wouldn't even be legal by friendly/party Smash standards. If they're going the boss route once again, with the added twist of being a hazard, then it'll be even worse than his Brawl boss appearances in terms of "sluggishness" and "accurately representing how he is in Metroid" just to give even the casualest players a chance to beat him. Which in truth, is why many of us are absolutely against the idea of making Ridley a glorified piñata over a playable character.

Gotcha. It still seems to me like he IS going to be a boss though. If he is hopefully what we've seen isn't fully representative of his behavior and speed on the stage. Not to mention that the Pyrosphere is pretty huge so they could give him decent speed. Or maybe he could switch between going in the background and foreground.

 

[IsmaR]

I don't doubt the distinct possibility of this point. Nor deep down do I think anyone has since the Direct.

Even trying to "make the best of it," it's hard thinking of a middle ground between his Boss appearances and his hazard-ness in DoA: Dimensions.

Though I guess anything is better than the Dyna Blade clone again.

 

[BlueBubbee]

just something I made I hope this helps for a size comparison

Spoiler

this is absolutely not perfect.

Thank you for restoring hope to our Ridley-centric hearts

 

[majora_787]

Because Ridley has no reason to move to a character at that speed. When he moves that slowly in a Metroid game, he's already close to the player, or is attacking with ranged attacks. If Ridley was spewing fire at Pikachu in the direct, the slowness would've been fine. But he does nothing, and that speed would never let him catch up to a player. Might as well give him the Quad Laser while we're at it.

He really DOES do nothing. Comparing direct footage to Yellow Devil gameplay, Yellow Devil attacks at an average of once per second and DIES in the time we see Ridley during the april Direct.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Thank you for restoring hope to our Ridley-centric hearts

And this doesn't?

 

[BlueBubbee]

And this doesn't?

And what doesn't

 

[majora_787]

And what doesn't

It's a link.

 

[AustarusIV]

In Brawl, Ridley's attacks involved him moving swiftly around the stage. Here, his shadow moved sluggishly across Pyrosphere, with no apparent interest in Pikachu.

I was doubtful of his chances ever since the Direct, but seeing footage of him in Brawl again made me reconsider my thoughts. He's still sort of 50/50 in my eyes, but the longer we go on without Ridley, the more cautiously optimistic I'm going to get.

I don't doubt the distinct possibility of this point. Nor deep down do I think anyone has since the Direct.

Even trying to "make the best of it," it's hard thinking of a middle ground between his Boss appearances and his hazard-ness in DoA: Dimensions.

Though I guess anything is better than the Dyna Blade clone again.

Somehow, I think the reason Sakurai put Pyrosphere in SSB4 was so that he could "thank" Team Ninja for their efforts in developing Other M by reusing the same stage from DoA.

 

[majora_787]

In Brawl, Ridley's attacked involved him moving swiftly around the stage. Here, his shadow moved sluggishly across Pyrosphere, with no apparent interest in Pikachu.

I was doubtful of his chances ever since the Direct, but seeing footage of him in Brawl again made me reconsider my thoughts. He's still sort of 50/50 in my eyes, but the longer we go on without Ridley, the more cautiously optimistic I'm going to get.



Somehow, I think the reason Sakurai put Pyrosphere in SSB4 was so that he could "thank" Team Ninja for their efforts in developing Other M by reusing the same stage from DoA.

I dunno, that IS where Ridley is fought. If you were to use a stage from Other M I'd imagine one of the top picks would be the Ridley battle platform. Even Frigate Orpheon in Brawl is technically where Meta Ridley is first encountered.

 

[Kamiko]

Or maybe he could switch between going in the background and foreground.

I actually like this idea. Aside from the part where it means he's a boss of course.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

I actually like this idea. Aside from the part where it means he's a boss of course.

Lol, you mean having a character whose "unique" factor is being able to switch between going into the background and foreground? On top of that, having the ability to take someone with you...O boi idk but dat cray mayne

 

[BlueBubbee]

It's a link.

Now I feel dumb, I didn't notice that...


EDIT: Yes, yes that very much makes me more confident.

 

[Snagrio]

Lol, you mean having a character whose "unique" factor is being able to switch between going into the background and foreground? On top of that, having the ability to take someone with you...O boi idk but dat cray mayne

It sounds more like a gimmick that would work for someone like Mr. Game & Watch or Paper Mario, not Ridley.

 

[IsmaR]

I dunno, that IS where Ridley is fought. If you were to use a stage from Other M I'd imagine one of the top picks would be the Ridley battle platform. Even Frigate Orpheon in Brawl is technically where Meta Ridley is first encountered.

Sakurai probably knows that when it comes to Metroid/in addition to lava, nobody gives a **** unless Ridley was there/is involved.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

It sounds more like a gimmick that would work for someone like Mr. Game & Watch or Paper Mario, not Ridley.

Yeah I know right? Not to mention people could have visual issues with overlapping characters, and it doesn't really have much to do with Ridley's character or abilities at all. But as a stage boss, that big boi could fly and go whereva he wants.

 

[Kamiko]

Yeah, I was talking about Bossley going in the background, not Playabley.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Yeah, I was talking about Bossley going in the background, not Playabley.

Wow sorry, I read that wrong.

 

[CrypticSpark]

So far we've had two stage hazard bosses confirmed for certain, the Yellow Devil for Wii U, and the Dark Emperor for 3DS.

And like people above have stated before, the likes of twinrova and kamek aren't like the boss stage hazards I just mentioned, as you can't interact with them, as far as I'm aware we haven't been given that much on the Dark Emperor, but the Yellow Devil can be killed by the players rewarding the person who get's in the last hit, which I'm guessing will be the same case for the Dark Emperor, but likely a caged Mii helping out the person who last hits the Dark Emperor.

But what what would Ridley do? It's not like he's going to explode in a similar fashion to the Yellow Devil, or he has a hostage like the Dark Emperor who could potentially help you as a reward, then there's the question will the 3DS version have something similar, or how would it's own version of how a pyrosphere Ridley boss hazard work.

People are quick to point out he's a stage hazard but not so quick to point out how he would work, he clearly won't work like the Dead or Alive stage hazard he clearly follows Pikachu, and if he was in the background his shadow wouldn't be where it was.

 

[Kamiko]

Wow sorry, I read that wrong.

Eh, it's the internet. It happens.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

But what what would Ridley do?

Ridley ken do so much mayne lik shoot fyerbalz swyp u w/claws n tail stab u w/tail grab u en hit u wid fyerbalz ram into u grab u n lift u up but not sho u wayr u want 2 b n tayk u wayr u want 2 b. also do dat wall scrayp thing or tayk u w/him when/if he goes bakk to his hole

and wen he ded he ken jes fall 2 de bakkground en den after a fyew secs get bakk up en fly into de hole jes lik in udder m and den come bakk wheneva

jes lik wen de yellow devil coms bakk after u deefeet him and he ded, he jes coms bakk from de ded

c?

HE DED

BUT DEN HE GET BAK UP AND SCREMS, DEN FLY HIMSELPH INTO WOL

DEN WEN HE DUN BEING IN HOL HE COM BAK 4 U

 

[BlueBubbee]

Ridley ken do so much mayne lik shoot fyerbalz swyp u w/claws n tail stab u w/tail grab u en hit u wid fyerbalz ram into u grab u n lift u up but not sho u wayr u want 2 b n tayk u wayr u want 2 b. also do dat wall scrayp thing or tayk u w/him when/if he goes bakk to his hole

and wen he ded he ken jes fall 2 de bakkground en den after a fyew secs get bakk up en fly into de hole jes lik in udder m and den come bakk wheneva

jes lik wen de yellow devil coms bakk after u deefeet him and he ded, he jes coms bakk from de ded

c?

HE DED

BUT DEN HE GET BAK UP

DEN WEN HE DONE BEING IN HOLE HE COM BAK 4 U

 

[Shinru202]

Dark Pit at the end of Palutena's trailer. DARK PIT CONFIRMED /confirmation bias

I'm guessing that Dark Pit would be a stage boss in the Palutena Temple stage...well...because in the end of the Palutena Trailer,
Dark Pit appears behind Palutena in the Palutena Temple stage.

Palutena: "Dark Pit, you just dropped in to crash my party?"
Dark Pit: "Uh huh"

Anyways, that's my guess. What do you think?

 

[BlueBubbee]

I'm guessing that Dark Pit would be a stage boss in the Palutena Temple stage...well...because in the end of the Palutena Trailer,
Dark Pit appears behind Palutena in the Palutena Temple stage.

Palutena: "Dark Pit, you just dropped in to crash my party?"
Dark Pit: "Uh huh"

Anyways, that's my guess. What do you think?

I'd personally prefer him as an Assist Trophy, but I see where you're coming from and it makes perfect sense.

 

[Kamiko]

I'm guessing that Dark Pit would be a stage boss in the Palutena Temple stage...well...because in the end of the Palutena Trailer,
Dark Pit appears behind Palutena in the Palutena Temple stage.

Palutena: "Dark Pit, you just dropped in to crash my party?"
Dark Pit: "Uh huh"

Anyways, that's my guess. What do you think?

You've hidden Ridley pretty well in this post, I'm still looking for him.

Ridley with Camoflage down B confirmed!

 

[Deleted member]

I'm guessing that Dark Pit would be a stage boss in the Palutena Temple stage...well...because in the end of the Palutena Trailer,
Dark Pit appears behind Palutena in the Palutena Temple stage.

Palutena: "Dark Pit, you just dropped in to crash my party?"
Dark Pit: "Uh huh"

Anyways, that's my guess. What do you think?

Dark Pit would have to be a DAMN fast Stage Boss to be anything close to a "threat" on that stage, considering it is Hyrule Temple 2.0.

Of course, the other boss characters we've seen, while to be fair are much larger than Dark Pit, are fairly slow.

Dark Pit would have to move at speeds above Bunny Hood-wearing Captain Falcon to keep up with the fighters and cover all that space.

That's why I think it is fairly unlikely that he would be a boss on Palutena Temple.

But I digress from the topic of this thread.

Apologies in advance for that.

 

[BlueBubbee]

You've hidden Ridley pretty well in this post, I'm still looking for him.

Ridley with Camoflage down B confirmed!

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Dark Pit would have to be a DAMN fast Stage Boss to be anything close to a "threat" on that stage, considering it is Hyrule Temple 2.0.

Of course, the other boss characters we've seen, while to be fair are much larger than Dark Pit, are fairly slow.

Dark Pit would have to move at speeds above Bunny Hood-wearing Captain Falcon to keep up with the fighters and cover all that space.

That's why I think it is fairly unlikely that he would be a boss on Palutena Temple.

But I digress from the topic of this thread.

Apologies in advance for that.

On that big a stage, only an Ultimate Chimera-level stage hazard could make Dark Pit a remote threat...And the Orne already covers that.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

"Now I don't want to say that post was not related to this thread, but if the off-topic police are here these guys better demand some lawyers."

 

[PlTe]

I'm guessing that Dark Pit would be a stage boss in the Palutena Temple stage...well...because in the end of the Palutena Trailer,
Dark Pit appears behind Palutena in the Palutena Temple stage.

Palutena: "Dark Pit, you just dropped in to crash my party?"
Dark Pit: "Uh huh"

Anyways, that's my guess. What do you think?

I think he would be better as an alternate costume. He was already alternate in Brawl. Just make his voice acting different, switch up his weapon color scheme (different bow/arrow, purple energy for Power of Flight, different orbitars, and a different arm)

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Ridley confirmed as Ultimate Chimera, Orne, and Dark Pit.

 

[Snagrio]

It's super effective!

 

[NintenRob]

Kirby seemed pretty out of place in that trailer, either way.

And, yeah, I think the majority would've rather had Air Ride 2 or Kirby in Mario Kart 8. Rosalina in Smash is just...eugh.

 

[darksamus77]

The comments are so toxic it hurts! it just proves my point that no matter how much evidence you present, they won't accept it

"Mewtwo would be a 10x better choice than Ridley!" I do hope Mewtwo gets in, but 10x? No, he's 1000x better than Chorus Men though.

"It's like telling an atheist to prove God isn't real." Well, that's closer to the truth because we have the same evidence as detractors do and it's up for interpretation. This is a valid statement and opinion (and please no flame wars about religion, I'm merely picking a few)

"It's conspiracy grade cherrypicking, confirmation bias, and conjecture." No, we're interpreting the SECONDS of video we've been shown to try to get a better grasp on things. No one's saying he's 100% in, I'm pretty sure, until he's announced/revealed to be playable. Actually, the biased ones are usually detractors because they're narrow-minded and meet most arguments with TOO BIG NO WAY IS RIDLEY PLAYABLE RIDLEYF4GS

"It's not that people think he can't be in, it's that they don't WANT him to be." I rest my case.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Both sides can be biased as crap dude, these are opinions after all; as for me I really don't want him in because it doesn't seem intuitively right for the game, and I have to try and use logic and non-logic and reasoning and unreasoning that doesn't always support my opinion that well. It's really the same for the supporters too. We can't prove anything yet and besides the shadows we haven't been shown concrete jack.

 

[TheWozny]

To those of you who love Metroid Music, what do you think of Shinesparkers Metroid Album? I really enjoyed the Ridley-remix that was included(credit to Prophetik for making the actual song).