Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[SchAlternate]

It's from Groundhog Day; where Bill Murray repeats the same day over and over and over.

Seems like a fitting scenario Ridley is in.

 

[Iddis]

So how did my post get pushed up to the first one to page 1000?

 

[majora_787]

Seems like a fitting scenario Ridley is in.

Sounds about right. He only had what. Three relevant bits of news in the last 370-whatever days? And one of those bits of news was actually the absence of news. So uh... Yep. An average of one relevant statement every four months I guess.

 

[Deleted member]

Well first off, I just want to acknowledge the overall difficulty of making it.

But yeah, I was thinking specifically how or what Ridley's forward air would be. I imagine it would likely be a claw attack just like Charizard's, Mewtwo's, and Bowser's forward air. Of course, I think it would be more of a full looping slash (more akin to Mewtwo, although probably more exaggerated and with claw animations and effects aplenty) than just a small slash like Bowser does with his forward air.

When you initially use the move I think it could have a sweetspot akin to the classic "sex kick" neutral air. It would be a more reliable KO and would do more damage. f course unlike a sex kick it would KO at somewhat lower than averages percentages with a horizontally or diagonally KO.

Also like the sex kick it could have a sourspot in the second half of the move. This might lead to more combos, and obviously it would do considerably less damage. I always felt the combo potential out of sourspot moves in Melee was such a fantastic idea and addition to the game. Smash 64 and Brawl had a few of these moves, but none as pronounced as Melee.

From what I gather from what I saw and played, Smash 4 will have a lot of such followups and "combos" like Melee, only with more actual real fighting game "combos" that are inescapable with proper execution. I think the usage of moves as to when you use them and when you land them in regards to the duration of the move will be very key as to what your reasonable followup options are.

I could easily see sourspot forward airs for Ridley becoming like Brawl Toon Link's back air, where you can combo (or "smash combo" [not a truly inescapable combo]) the move with itself a bit, lol. Of course, with the forward air, you could potentially end it with a sweetspot forward air for a KO. As long as it's not too long (say 3 or 4 forward airs in a row at most), it sounds pretty freaking cool IMO.

Some questions:

Do you have any percentage estimates for the sweetspot and sourspot?

With regards to the "sex kick" idea I feel there may be some issues with it having such initial and late contact properties since Claw attacks such as Bowser's, Mewtwo's, and Charizards are quick sweeping motions that have a fairly short Damage Window. I feel that it is difficult to make a claw swipe have sex kick properties since it is a sweeping motion over a short distance in order to deal damage as opposed to actual sex "kicks" where the kicking leg is left extended for a short period of time. Perhaps the sweetspot and sourspot properties would be more akin to Marth's tippers? Wherein the tip would have good KO power (high damage percentage, knockback) and the inner region would have low damage and knockback so as to be comboable with itself and potentially other aerials.

I feel such "Tipper" properties would work better considering it is a claw swipe.

Furthermore, while certainly Smash 4 has hitstun enough to make combos possible, if the sourspot is during the second half of the move, I feel that the time it takes for the move to end and for another to be executed at a distance such that the opponent will only be hit by the second half of the move may be too long, even for "untrue" combos to be possible with repeated Fairs.

Therefore I ask: what are your ideas for the starting and ending lag of this move, and how long is your estimate for the Damage Window (for both Sweet and Sourspot)?

 

[Phaazoid]

So how did my post get pushed up to the first one to page 1000?

Probably was the mods, destroying evidence

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Some questions:

Do you have any percentage estimates for the sweetspot and sourspot?

With regards to the "sex kick" idea I feel there may be some issues with it having such initial and late contact properties since Claw attacks such as Bowser's, Mewtwo's, and Charizards are quick sweeping motions that have a fairly short Damage Window. I feel that it is difficult to make a claw swipe have sex kick properties since it is a sweeping motion over a short distance in order to deal damage as opposed to actual sex "kicks" where the kicking leg is left extended for a short period of time. Perhaps the sweetspot and sourspot properties would be more akin to Marth's tippers? Wherein the tip would have good KO power (high damage percentage, knockback) and the inner region would have low damage and knockback so as to be comboable with itself and potentially other aerials.

Not gonna lie, but I just can't take the word "sex kick" seriously. Sounds disturbingly too similar to something .... much worse. Even worse than Captain N Ridley or Judge Ridley.

 

[Phaazoid]

Not gonna lie, but I just can't take the word "sex kick" seriously. Sounds disturbingly too similar to something .... much worse. Even worse than Captain N Ridley or Judge Ridley.

The phrase has been used to describe certain nairs since at least melee. It may have stood out to me at one point, but it's part of my vocabulary when talking about the game at this point.

 

[majora_787]

Not gonna lie, but I just can't take the word "sex kick" seriously. Sounds disturbingly too similar to something .... much worse. Even worse than Captain N Ridley or Judge Ridley.

I'm sure Ridley's entire moveset will be made of sex kicks.

... What? Aerial moves? Ohhh. Oh, nevermind.

 

[Johnknight1]

So this is late @ Johnknight1 , but Best Buy didn't leave me with that impression at all. At the one I went to, everyone DIDN'T want Ridley, and there wasn't even a reason for it. They didn't think he was too big, they were just against his inclusion because they didn't like him.

Really=??? Wow, I'm shocked. Roughly 85%-95% of the people who mentioned Ridley or were talking about Ridley around me wanted Ridley. The rest didn't care, sans 1 guy who shot down every character. Literally every single one. No one liked that guy. Even one of the Nintendo reps wanted Ridley playable, lol.

Of course, the Best Buy I went to at San Jose (the home of Falco) and where you went (I assume somewhere in the Carolinas, the home of a guy who has a Medical Degree in pee pee) probably had very different Smash cultures and crowds. They're roughly 3,000 miles apart, after all.

I don't know much about the scene there for Smash, so I won't comment, but I will ask: what's the scene like there=??? I ask this so we can get a general pulse of what the smash fanbase is like there, and see why a lot of people there had these opinions.

 

[AustarusIV]

Hmm. The Smash community is a lot more diverse than I thought in their opinions. The Best Buy I went to was kind of indifferent to Mewtwo's inclusion in SSB4, while they bemoaned the (likely) inclusion of Chrom in this game.

Nobody talked about Ridley though, I don't know what they thought of him.

 

[Johnknight1]

Hmm. The Smash community is a lot more diverse than I thought in their opinions.

I think it makes things more interesting actually. Just from going to the 3 major cities in my area (San Francisco, San Jose, and Oakland) there's like 3 entirely different Smash communities, even though San Francisco and Oakland are only divided by bridges.

San Jose in general is just very much a more happy-go-lucky kind of community and area. They are so positive there, and that place is so freaking gorgeous. It's also the safest major city in America last I checked, so maybe that's a big reason why.

The Best Buy I went to was kind of indifferent to Mewtwo's inclusion in SSB4, while they bemoaned the (likely) inclusion of Chrom in this game.

My line was super hyped for the Sal leaks, all the Brawl characters and Mewtwo, Ridley, and K. Rool (especially after a batch of people saw Chunky) had a lot of supporters. It like they all generally agreed with me!

And another thing about San Jose I forgot to mention: Everyone in Melee and Brawl who enters tournaments that is from there has a decent to amazing Falco. It's just a rule. And true to the stereotype, the character people were most upset that wasn't confirmed was Falco (and Captain Falcon), lol!

Nobody talked about Ridley though, I don't know what they thought of him.

Man, I can't tell you how many jokes after people played matches inside the venue (the line was outside the Best Buy; both days the line reached over a thousand people) I heard about people saying "I PLAYED AS RIDLEY AND *insert comment here*"

The best one I heard was "I PLAYED AS RIDLEY AND HE WAS SO BIG HE BROKE OUT OF THE SCREEN!!" followed by "YOU HAD TO DO THAT RIGHT AFTER I WENT SUPER SAIYAN AS GOKU!!!"

 

[Phaazoid]

I was first in line at the Best Buy I went to. Then the line looked to be about 4 hours, so after I played my match I stood where the employees wouldn't yell at me and tried to film/watched other matches. There really wasn't much socializing, haha.

 

[majora_787]

The one I went to was in Texas, actually. But yeah it was weird. Though then again the same people who were adamantly against Ridley's inclusion wanted to play as Rosalina to see if her upskirts were censored. So uhh, do with that one what you will.

 

[Sigran101]

No offense, but I don't think you understand what bipolar means. It's not slang, nor was he using it incorrectly.

Oh, sorry, I took that the wrong way.

 

[Johnknight1]

I was first in line at the Best Buy I went to. Then the line looked to be about 4 hours, so after I played my match I stood where the employees wouldn't yell at me and tried to film/watched other matches. There really wasn't much socializing, haha.

I went the 1st day 10 minutes before it started and I was about the 1,500th person in line, and I never got to play Smash WiiU (but I got to play Smash 3DS), lol. I went 5 hours early the 2nd day and I was maybe 200th in line. I was lucky enough to get in line and play a second time that day, lol. Also at my venue everyone was talking, and everyone was mingling. Except for that one guy who hated everything (ironically he was the one token guy who didn't put on deodorant), everyone was super friendly.

Like I said, I can't tell you how many times I heard Ridley brought up. He was easily the most brought up unconfirmed character that hasn't previously been playable in Smash Bros.

The one I went to was in Texas, actually. But yeah it was weird. Though then again the same people who were adamantly against Ridley's inclusion wanted to play as Rosalina to see if her upskirts were censored. So uhh, do with that one what you will.

Texas has an insanely diverse smash scene, and they always seem to overhype their players, lol. I still remember at Rule 6 back 2 years ago when they hyped Kels up as the best smasher ever and our guy Phil (he commentated "The Wombo Combo" with HomeMadeWaffles, is the king of friendly trash talk, and is the best hype monger you will ever meet) who is roughly top 10 in NorCal just beat his face in in friendlies for half an hour.

But yeah, from what people who have been to or are a part of Texas smash have told me, Texas has a few cliques of lulzsy (and sometime downright mean) competitive players and quite a population of stupid lesser talented players from what I hear.

There's a big amount of nice Melee and Brawl players (although one area of the state was up until sometime this year just a bunch of Brawl players who hate all other smash games games; there was a TO there who refused to have any other smash game at his Brawl tournaments), and it's fairly healthy in the big cities (each city is super different), but man, there's a lot of lulzs there.

The Texas players I've talked to before have told me some of the dumbest and funniest stories ever involving Smash. From what I know to the ones I've talked to the ones are worth their weight in gold (mostly the people telling me these stories) and the crappy ones have a stank you can smell 50 miles away. So there's a lot of diversity there.

So you telling me you went to a Best Buy in Texas with your stories makes a lot of sense to me there, lol!

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

It's almost as if the Smash community is stupidly diverse and not the same anywhere and anytime.

 

[Johnknight1]

^^^ It's because it is.

I wonder how much of Ridleys moveset will be made up for Smash?

I imagine about half of the moveset will be roughly made up, just like it is for most characters. However, it won't be made up out of thin air, but rather, be inspired by a lot of things Ridley did, as well as just anything that fits him and smash mechanics in general.

Of all the newcomers confirmed thus far, the closest character to Ridley in that regard would be Little Mac in terms of how much of the moveset is straight from said character's original moves and games, how much is inspired by the character, moves that are made to fit the body type, and how much of the moves are just moves that are just "made up".

However I imagine Ridley's moveset would have less stuff "made up" than Little Mac's. I also doubt a lot of it would be based on the other similarly related content, since a lot of Little Mac's moves and skills are based off traditional boxing moves and historical attacks, as well as a few fighting games moves and features mixed in. Ridley consequently would probably have a lot of pterodactyl and dragon-esk moves in regards to fireballs, flamethrowers, movement, flight, claws, and tail moves, which is a different take on a way to fit the body type.

Really, Ridley's body type is so unique that it would undoubtedly be the centerpiece of his playable character build, with the unique skillset he possess being the second most definitive attribute of his playable character build.

 

[Malkior7]

I need another smash direct in my life

 

[Deleted member]

I need another smash direct in my life

I need Playable Ridley in mine.

 

[Malkior7]

I need Playable Ridley in mine.

and that's why i need a smash direct so I can get that

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

I need another smash direct in my life

Too bad it will happen during August Rush and the wait will be very dramatically suspenseful.

 

[majora_787]

Plus I really am not thinking we'll see Ridley in August. Characters for franchises like Metroid. Kid Icarus, DK, and Fire Emblem are probably being saved for post-release. I mean sure anniversaries and whatnot, but I could see Sakurai deciding not to care just to drag it out for another month.

 

[Deleted member]

Plus I really am not thinking we'll see Ridley in August. Characters for franchises like Metroid. Kid Icarus, DK, and Fire Emblem are probably being saved for post-release. I mean sure anniversaries and whatnot, but I could see Sakurai deciding not to care just to drag it out for another month.

It certainly wouldn't surprise me considering that Sakurai has completely passed over the mention of some franchise anniversaries in the past with regards to PotDs. This also goes back to Sakurai being plainly a Master Troll who likes leading us on although he claims he doesn't.

 

[majora_787]

It certainly wouldn't surprise me considering that Sakurai has completely passed over the mention of some franchise anniversaries in the past with regards to PotDs. This also goes back to Sakurai being plainly a Master Troll who likes leading us on although he claims he doesn't.

Which is funny because he also claimed he did. So basically who knows WHAT Sakurai likes.

 

[Phaazoid]

I went the 1st day 10 minutes before it started and I was about the 1,500th person in line, and I never got to play Smash WiiU (but I got to play Smash 3DS), lol. I went 5 hours early the 2nd day and I was maybe 200th in line. I was lucky enough to get in line and play a second time that day, lol. Also at my venue everyone was talking, and everyone was mingling. Except for that one guy who hated everything (ironically he was the one token guy who didn't put on deodorant), everyone was super friendly.

I went 4 hours early and was second in line. The first in line was some 11 year old kid, who was there alone, who had apparently gotten there at 4am. I was there at 8am. His parents must have been negligent as ****.

I played smash run once (as samus) while waiting for them to boot it up. Got to do a break the crystals event.

Then I played as Villager in the Wii U. Won, of course xD.

I tried entering the contra code, but I didn't unlock anything

I took some shoddy videos but there are enough good quality gameplay vids that I don't think I need to upload mine.

But as I said, yeah, there really wasn't much time to poll for Ridley.

 

[CrypticSpark]

I hope we get a eStore version of the demo for Wii U and/or 3DS, though might take a while since there was a promotion with Best Buy, and could happen to retailers in other counties. (Of Course not the exact same demo, would have to be fixed so it wouldn't brick consoles)

 

[Reality_Ciak]

I feel bad for everyone that waited so long. I went an hour and a half early and I was 8th in line (Toledo). Undefeated (I quit while ahead haha), Marth (3DS), Little Mac, and Villager. I mentioned Ridley in line and the arguement wasn't whether or not he can/will be playable, but mostly just people bashing Other M and not wanting to see it represented at all.

 

[IsmaR]

I went early, waited forever and a half (with my sister), and only heard mild character speculation every now and then (most people saying Waluigi was the only logical choice left for Smash). Someone actually took a portable TV so they could play Smash while waiting, so we were pretty much preoccupied with that.

I played as Samus both times and mentioned the Ridley being too big thing to the guy running the 3DS demo. He told me Samus was too big.

 

[DustyPumpkin]

Maybe I should go and get Tomadachi Life so I can go play around with the Ridley and Roidley MIi's

 

[majorasmaskfan]

Well general thread is locked so they did the same joke twice LAME.

 

[Deleted member]

Funny story time brought to you by me: so, my friends and I were discussing about E3 and one of them called me a prophet(lol, should have called me Sal) for predicting 2/3 of the Smash E3 reveals, the other than asks which was the other and I answer Ridley, he knows nothing about Metroid aside that Samus is a girl and Mother Brain exists(and ye thinks she is the main villain), I say he's the main villain and how MB appeared in two games only while Ridley appeared in all expect 3, explaining he's the kinda of rival-villain who isn't the final boss(I use the Pokemon games as example as I doubt the champion is the main villain and he knows s*** about Star Faix, so I can't use Wolf), he then asks for a picture of him, I find the Brawl artwork on my cellphone ad show him, guess what happens next! From his own words: "He looks to be 2m tall or even smaller than Samus herself"
That's why I love that he never played Metroid

 

[Deleted member]

Well general thread is locked so they did the same joke twice LAME.

I called it.

Silly mods playing stale jokes.

I only ask which mod did it this time around.

 

[IsmaR]

I had nothing to do with this.

 

[Deleted member]

Adding to my story, I mentioned the too big argument and he said: "Why should this be an issue?"

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Funny story time brought to you by me: so, my friends and I were discussing about E3 and one of them called me a prophet(lol, should have called me Sal) for predicting 2/3 of the Smash E3 reveals, the other than asks which was the other and I answer Ridley, he knows nothing about Metroid aside that Samus is a girl and Mother Brain exists(and ye thinks she is the main villain), I say he's the main villain and how MB appeared in two games only while Ridley appeared in all expect 3, explaining he's the kinda of rival-villain who isn't the final boss(I use the Pokemon games as example as I doubt the champion is the main villain and he knows s*** about Star Faix, so I can't use Wolf), he then asks for a picture of him, I find the Brawl artwork on my cellphone ad show him, guess what happens next! From his own words: "He looks to be 2m tall or even smaller than Samus herself"
That's why I love that he never played Metroid

Sorta reminds me of this friend of mine who also rarely played Metroid.

He thought that he'd be too big until I showed him his NES size.

Seems like the less people know about Metroid, the more receptive they are to Ridley.

 

[Johnknight1]

I went 4 hours early and was second in line. The first in line was some 11 year old kid, who was there alone, who had apparently gotten there at 4am. I was there at 8am. His parents must have been negligent as ****.

The first people in my line said they got there at 2 AM, lol. It didn't start until 12 hours later, lol.

I took some shoddy videos but there are enough good quality gameplay vids that I don't think I need to upload mine.

My brother took a video of the line the first day and of my last match on Smash WiiU, the latter of which I would have beaten a former top 10 ranked NorCal Brawl player if not for freaking some explosive item killing 3 people in the beginning. My Mega Man is balls man; apparently playing him like in a freaking Mega Man game is the idea, hence why HE'S BEEN PRESENTED LIKE THAT!!! I can't wait to see fools play Ridley like he's some sort of Ganondorf-esk character instead of a space dragon pterodactyl thing that has claws, wings, and a long tail.

Too bad it will happen during August Rush and the wait will be very dramatically suspenseful.

Funny you say a variation of the word "suspense", because in July or August I see us getting a "suspended" release date for Smash 3DS. (no really; I mean it)

They could show Ridley to show how the size of the game has been "expended" which caused it to be "suspended"

 

[Deleted member]

I can't wait to see fools play Ridley like he's some sort of Ganondorf-esk character instead of a space dragon pterodactyl thing that has claws, wings, and a long tail.

Inb4 Ridley in Smash 4 is a 2nd Captain Falcon Clone.

Now I want to see Ridley masquerading as Captain Falcon as his master plan to get in Smash 4.

Aaaaaand Inb4 Captain Falcon somehow doesn't make it back and Ridley's clever plan fails once again.

 

[IsmaR]

Would think people would try to play him as an overweight Charizard/winged Bowser before Ganondorf.

 

[Johnknight1]

Do you have any percentage estimates for the sweetspot and sourspot?

You mean for a specific move=??? Because in general the percentages for 64, Melee, and Brawl is roughly the same. The only big difference between the 3 is 64 has very little difference between the two (most moves just have universal knockback), Melee has a bit more sweetspots at the end of moves, and Brawl has a lot more sweetspots at the beginning.

Smash 3DS and WiiU as far as I can tell was kind of a combination of the 3. It felt like there were less big differences in sweetspots and sourspots than Melee and Brawl (thus like 64), a lot of specific sweetspots in the beginning of moves (thus like Brawl), and a lot of specific sweetspots at the end of moves (thus like Melee). But regardless, the sourspots were a lot more easy to combo or chain with like Melee than they were with the Brawl roster (barring Meta Knight and maybe a few other characters).

With regards to the "sex kick" idea I feel there may be some issues with it having such initial and late contact properties since Claw attacks such as Bowser's, Mewtwo's, and Charizards are quick sweeping motions that have a fairly short Damage Window. I feel that it is difficult to make a claw swipe have sex kick properties since it is a sweeping motion over a short distance in order to deal damage as opposed to actual sex "kicks" where the kicking leg is left extended for a short period of time. Perhaps the sweetspot and sourspot properties would be more akin to Marth's tippers? Wherein the tip would have good KO power (high damage percentage, knockback) and the inner region would have low damage and knockback so as to be comboable with itself and potentially other aerials.

It could have tipper qualities. I imagine this particular forward air idea to be a longer and slower slash, somewhat similar in animation and effect to Bowser's side B (specifically the Brawl incarnation of it). Granted, it probably wouldn't per say be a tipper like Marth has, but it could function more like Link's sword qualities with tipping and whatnot.

But yeah, Ridley being a good tipper is always good for business, especially since his bill was too big already!

I feel such "Tipper" properties would work better considering it is a claw swipe.

There are a few moves that have sweetspot/sourspot and tipper mechanics. I imagine there would be a knockback, hitstun, and/or damage percentage increase when hitting the blunt of the claw (which would be towards the tip, but maybe not right at it).

Furthermore, while certainly Smash 4 has hitstun enough to make combos possible, if the sourspot is during the second half of the move, I feel that the time it takes for the move to end and for another to be executed at a distance such that the opponent will only be hit by the second half of the move may be too long, even for "untrue" combos to be possible with repeated Fairs.

If the hitstun is what I think it is, due to the lack of smash DI and horizontal (side-to-side) DI, the combo should be pretty close to automatic sometimes.

As for the sourspot at the second half, I would compare it to a combination of Toon Link's back air in Brawl and Fox's back air in Melee (and kinda sorta his Brawl one too). For Fox's back air you can do a lot of chases and with proper timing a lot of chases or combos that stem from landing that move. Toon Link's back air in Brawl does the same thing, except it can combo into itself without landing.

If you combine a bit of both, it could truly have some great use on the back end, and when combined with the front end, it can be a dual purpose move that can at any time be a game changing move a lot like Fox's back air is in Melee. I don't know about the rest of you, but the prospect of that gets me hyped.

Therefore I ask: what are your ideas for the starting and ending lag of this move, and how long is your estimate for the Damage Window (for both Sweet and Sourspot)?

I would imagine the start up lag would be about 5-8 frames and the cooldown lag would be roughly 10-15 frames.

If the move was about 40 frames, I would make the sweetspot super strong and be in the first 5 frames, and I would have the sourspot be in the last 20 frames. As I said, it's fairly similar to various sex kicks. It also is similar to a lot of moves Fox in Melee has in general, which is partially why I like it so much!

But yeah, on top of that, I wouldn't give the most too much priority. If I were in charge of the hitboxes and whatnot, it have the standard priority for standard moves. Maybe in the first 5 frames it would have a bit higher priority, but that would be dependent on how well it KO's and how the game overall functions, specifically when playing as or against Ridley.

 

[Shagadelic_Baby]

Inb4 Ridley in Smash 4 is a 2nd Captain Falcon Clone.

Now I want to see Ridley masquerading as Captain Falcon as his master plan to get in Smash 4.

Aaaaaand Inb4 Captain Falcon somehow doesn't make it back and Ridley's clever plan fails once again.

inb4 landmaster