~The Olimar Matchup Thread~Review: R.O.B. or someone~

[Rapid_Assassin]

Peach isn't bottom tier garbage. You might come across one in a tournament, because I know a couple of people who counterpick Peach against Olimar because their characters do poorly against him.

And the last post was about ROB. So i don't see what you're complaining about.

 

[asob4]

ROB is win versus olimar
there's like no contest =/ maybe it's cause i play with some of the best ROB's but still
WoP owns oli, easy edge guards, doesn't die, priority, aerial range, and two projectiles, one of which stops pikmin dead in their tracks
only thing oli has against ROB is comboing since he is a decently heavy character and can't do **** when you're under him. even then it's impossible to kill him from up top

 

[Dr. Hyde]

ROB is win versus olimar
there's like no contest =/ maybe it's cause i play with some of the best ROB's but still
WoP owns oli, easy edge guards, doesn't die, priority, aerial range, and two projectiles, one of which stops pikmin dead in their tracks
only thing oli has against ROB is comboing since he is a decently heavy character and can't do **** when you're under him. even then it's impossible to kill him from up top

then you are saying that its playstyle that makes the characters better or worse? well that's fine but if you are saying ROB destroys Olimar I'll venture to say while I have lost to ROB before I have won a few.

ROB is at a slight advantage or slight disadvantage.

 

[Puddin]

Take away his Gyro and he is at a complete Disadvantage, ever fought a ROB, knocked him off the edge, and have him just jump on and off the edge using the laser and Gyro to get you away from the edge so he can get back on without worrying about you? take away his Gyro and all he has is his laser, which needs time to charge. While that laser is charging, without a Gyro he has no projectiles which gives Olimar the camping advantage, which racks up ROBs damage. Hold on to the Gyro long enough and you can even use it to KO ROB.

So the advantage in this match is kind of, well I guess you could say "situational" because the Gyro is a major part of ROBs projectile/camping game and can seriously put him at a disadvantage if you manage to get it.

 

[DanGR]

Please don't begin a flame war over peach. She's not bad, in fact she's very underrated. Anyways, I have some questions to add to this conversation:

What are Rob's main approaches? How to counter them? And what can you do to avoid the wop?

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

Rob's at a slight advantage anyway. The top stealing is a way to counter his main way to camp against you, and any top related approaches such as the glide toss.

 

[Overswarm]

Best thing for Oli to do in this matchup is to change characters.

 

[Puddin]

Har Har Har.

 

[Sudai]

So, I was directed here by DanGR.. I'm a ROB player and play with a fairly good Oli on a regular basis.

The Gyro isn't as all-important as you guys seem to be making it out to be. Sure, it's nice to have, but lasers recharge in 1 second. FTilt and FAir knocks pikmen away. ROB still has the camping advantage. Don't bother trying to out-camp him.

Approaching ROB: The best ways to approach are either well-spaced grabs (all but purple pikmen grabs out range most of our moves) or pretty much anything else you do that's well spaced. Oli is one of the few, if not the only character in the game that can out-range ROB AND has disjointed hitboxes. Learn to abuse your range much like a ROB does.

If you do decided to hold the Gyro away from us, don't just hold onto it. The best idea is to get to where there's nothing above you (either stand on top a platform or just find groundspace with nothing above) and smash-throw that ***** straight up. So long as the Gyro isn't stable on the ground, it won't disappear. If you're nimble enough to continually grab it on the way down and repeatedly throw it up, we're out of a Gyro for a large part of the game. Even if you only throw it up once, we're still SoL for at least a few seconds.

On the topic of the Gyro, don't expect to be able to just pick it up. If I notice someone moving towards the gyro and it seems that they're going to pick it up, I'll laser right at the gyro. It normally either hits before they grab it or right after, and on a seldom occasion, the weak laser is enough to knock the gyro right out of your hands.

On the topic of gyros. If the ROB is holding on to it and about to glide toss, >B toss a pikmen into it and then FSmash the ROB or whatever you want to do. Only thing we can do about that is spot-dodge or shield. If we don't actually glide toss, who the eff cares? You tossed a pikmen that may latch onto the ROB and you're essentially off scot free. Maybe a 4% laser (more if it's charged).

Off edge: Don't bother. ROB has one of the best off-edge games. Oli has one of the worst. He doesn't even have to leave the stage to **** you. Toss a gyro if you're going low, laser if you're level/high. Even if you're good with the whistle SA frames, it won't be much solace. You lose height and the ROB can just jump out to FAir you from there. If the ROB decides to chase you off instead of laser/gyro from the stage, you're screwed too. FAir ***** you. Trade hits = death. Whistle SA = ROB BAirs right after so you go even lower or you get stage-spiked if low or the ROB can just DJ DAir spike you for the kill. If you're awesome and Whistle SA BOTH of those, you're probably too low to do **** anyway.

Moral of the off-edge ****? ALWAYS try to recover really high. Like..really high. Double Jump + Laser goes high, but you should be recovering higher than that. Just watch out for a gyro being thrown straight up.

That's all I can really think of right now. I won't be checking this thread any more though, so PM me if you have questions about what I said. I don't mind being quoted from my PMs, I'm just too lazy to come back here again. XP

OH YEAH! Red Pikmen are your friends. Not being able to blast them with all his "booster" moves = suck.

 

[asob4]

if you guys really think it's even between ROB and olimar then you haven't played many good ROB's
ever heard of shadow? hugs? i play shadow on a weekly basis and played hugs just recently
i try to switch my playstyle around and there's no winning no matter which way you look at it, you're off the edge, then you're done for.
sure 0-80 combo is nice, but it's not gonna go much when he can kill at you at 0
that gyro idea is not that great of an idea. if you're holding it you can only spam pikmin and throw it which could be a smash or aerial which are much better
olimar is great but he doesn't stand much of a chance against ROB

btw shadow took 5th at UCLA VI using ROB exclusively

 

[Puddin]

lol, we like to pretend if we get the Gyro Olimar has an advantage because we know ROB kills him either way. Nice to have some ROB mains come help us out, other boards don't seem to like it when Olimar mains go to their "vs Olimar" threads though

 

[DanGR]

Thanks Sudai, I guess OS is right...we should just switch characters if we have a secondary. Either way, we're making progress. We've talked about gyros, laser, dtilt, and approaching, and edgeguarding. I guess that's everything unless y'all have anything more you'd like to contribute. I have a couple more questions:

Do you think Rob outcamps olimar like Sudai said? I'm not too sure.

Do Olimar's aerials help or hurt him when approaching?

 

[shrinkray21]

if you guys really think it's even between ROB and olimar then you haven't played many good ROB's
ever heard of shadow? hugs? i play shadow on a weekly basis and played hugs just recently
i try to switch my playstyle around and there's no winning no matter which way you look at it, you're off the edge, then you're done for.
sure 0-80 combo is nice, but it's not gonna go much when he can kill at you at 0
that gyro idea is not that great of an idea. if you're holding it you can only spam pikmin and throw it which could be a smash or aerial which are much better
olimar is great but he doesn't stand much of a chance against ROB

btw shadow took 5th at UCLA VI using ROB exclusively

last tourney I did beat a rob in a best of 3 but he later beat me in semi's...I agree...ROB is a beast against olimar...

this is AT LEAST 3/7 to ROB

 

[DanGR]

I was thinking 7/3 Rob anyways. good.

 

[Sudai]

I lied, I came back here. I like to go post my opinions of match-ups in other character forums because I feel it helps to evolve the Metagame. You guys should come post your Oli opinions once we start talking about them on the ROB boards. (I think it might be a long while though because we still have to talk about D3, DK, and Marth as our three top priorities. : x)

 

[DanGR]

Sure thing, just inform us.

 

[Kiwikomix]

Dag yo... the colors... they're amazing.

Although to be fair, I stole/modified them from the Wario boards first.

 

[Puddin]

I think we should do Wolf next week, I fought a friend who uses the Pokemon characters as his main, I don't know anything about him every using Wolf but when he used him today I didn't win a single fight. I came close a lot but when it came right down to it I just could not overcome Wolf. The number one problem was being GIMP'd, usually he would jump over me while I was recovering and use a Dair.

Eventually I learned to get around it, with things like DI'ing over a little, and using the rope and pulling it in fast. I even managed to GIMP him the same way with a yellow Pikmin once XD He didn't try to edge guard me much, my guess was because I GIMP'd him with the yellow Pikmin so he just decided it would be safe to come at me from the stage and avoid getting under me. The other thing is his incredibly long-ranged Fsmash, this **** thing out-ranges Olimars Grab AND Fsmash.

So yeah I think we should do Wolf next week. vs = :smiliegor Thats Wolfs blaster killing Olimar and his Pikmin

 

[asob4]

wolf is actually pretty easy
his moves are predictable and easy to avoid
most his moves send you up, which is good. whistle the bairs when he tries to WoP you and grab a lot. if they try to shine the pikmin off instead of lasering then get yellows on him.
he's very easy to combo due to his fall rate and weight. plus there's no greater irony than getting edgehogged by olimar. wolf's recovery is crap to say the least
easy win

i hate marth though, he's a bigger concern than wolf
all his moves eat pikmin and it's hard to get a grab in when they fair > fair > side b
he also can gimp olimar like no other (comparable to ROB) due to his aerial range

 

[Dotcom]

With the week ending soon we should come to a quick agreement of who's up next.

My vote Pit. just because yayayayayayayaya(you know what I mean.)

 

[Puddin]

I don't think Pit is that much of a problem for Olimar, yes he has two ways of reflecting Pikmin but all you have to do is whistle to get them off, if you're fast enough you can do it without taking any damage at all. I guess I'll change my vote to Marth "Hai guise! Wanna see my Fair?!"

 

[Dr. Hyde]

So yeah I think we should do Wolf next week. vs = :smiliegor Thats Wolfs blaster killing Olimar and his Pikmin

I'm gonna be harsh and say WRONG!!!

Just use a freakin yellow. It's the same thing with every person that just happens to be "new" to the match up, Olimar, or just doesn't play a Wolf. Forward Smash a yellow and laugh.

7/3 In Olimar's favor, not even kidding. And yeah fine I'll agree with ROB being the bane of all space man humanity once I play a good one. Listen to freakin Echo if he ever comes to this thread on the ROB match. He plays a ROB more than any of us I believe.

 

[Dotcom]

I don't think Pit is that much of a problem for Olimar, yes he has two ways of reflecting Pikmin but all you have to do is whistle to get them off, if you're fast enough you can do it without taking any damage at all. I guess I'll change my vote to Marth "Hai guise! Wanna see my Fair?!"

That so isn't my problem. It's the moves that take priority over Olimar's.

 

[DanGR]

I agree with marth this week. The OP will be edited shortly.

 

[asob4]

marth is gay, shield grabbing just doesn't work so well against him. i'm lost on this matchup.

 

[Puddin]

I don't know to much about the priority or anything, I'll test it later, but that is assuming you can even get in range with Marth =\ The one thing I find most annoying is that Pikmin attacking Marth will make him activate his counter, which can come a surprise for anyone that didn't know that and is probably rushing into a trap. I'll find out more later.

 

[whodat]

N-air and U-tilt are your friends vs Marth. Also Olimar is small so if Marth is spamming f-air then time it and run under him. I play against Marth all the time trust me it works. I know shield grabbing is hard, but when it comes down to it there are times when you can grab him. You just have to make the most out of your opportunities.

 

[Olimarman]

Marth in my opinion is probably Olimar's worst matchup. Mk can be dealt with if you know how, while Marth is just impossible. If your off the stage, just SA his aerials to prevent him from pushing you too far for you to recover. I agree with whodat in that nnair and utilt are great. For the most part all you can really do is just dodge and hit him with smash attacks whenever you can and watch for counter. Grabs won't do smack since Marth enjoys aerial combat. For the most part though have fun with this matchup and do whatever it is you really can to keep yourself alive. 8.5:1.5 Marth's favor, this matchup is gay.

As for next week, I say Mk since hes looked on as a horrible matchup for Olimar, but those with experience could probably prove it wrong.

 

[asob4]

N-air and U-tilt are your friends vs Marth. Also Olimar is small so if Marth is spamming f-air then time it and run under him. I play against Marth all the time trust me it works. I know shield grabbing is hard, but when it comes down to it there are times when you can grab him. You just have to make the most out of your opportunities.

yeah i agree with this
i haven't tried pivot grabbing him yet though which i think i should, or just roll more as opposed to trying to shield grab

good job winning that tourney with oli (or did you get second? lol)

 

[Puddin]

What about stages to bring Marth? I was just in a sort of mini tourney among some friends from another site and one of my first fights was against a Marth. I brought him to Luigi's Mansion but that didn't seem like a smart choice, or the best stage I could have gone to. The small space gives Olimar a bit of an advantage, but Marths range made up for it. As for the tourney I went on to the semifinals only to be killed by a Wolf at Final Destination Wasn't a big tourney, nobody but the people at the site knew about it so it really isn't worth mentioning. I don't know what stage to bring Marth though.

 

[nevershootme]

The most annoying thing about him is side b, excessive smash di is needed to even escape all 4 swings of his...

A few slices of his sword = diced pikmin. don't go crazy latching too many pikmin or else he'll "ken combo" your face

When recovering, do your best to super armor or dodge his f-air

one ultimate advice, don't get tipped from side-smash. otherwise it's kissing your fat helmet goodbye at 80-90%

overall, I can't really provide great advice since this matchup is extremely gay that i had to resort to alternative characters

 

[Olimarman]

What about stages to bring Marth? I was just in a sort of mini tourney among some friends from another site and one of my first fights was against a Marth. I brought him to Luigi's Mansion but that didn't seem like a smart choice, or the best stage I could have gone to. The small space gives Olimar a bit of an advantage, but Marths range made up for it. As for the tourney I went on to the semifinals only to be killed by a Wolf at Final Destination Wasn't a big tourney, nobody but the people at the site knew about it so it really isn't worth mentioning. I don't know what stage to bring Marth though.

Luigis mansion is ok... its really the best your going to get except for a grounded stage or a stage where your limited to vertical kos. If Marth is going to get you on the ground chances are youll be going horizontally, which luigis mansion lets him do easily. Shadow Moses, even though I ever see it legal in tournaments is great because theres no offstage play and Marth has a hard time koing vertically. Try grounded stages ( Shadow Moses, Mario Circuit), since platform stages are what Marth loves.

 

[asob4]

every stage is a marth stage
if it's legal i think norfair should be a good place to take him, hard to kill olimar due to multiple ledges and lava, easy to kill marth vertically
epic mind games with ledges

 

[Dotcom]

I hate bringing Marth to Norfair because of the ledge. Normally yay lots of ledges this would be great.. but No. It's crazy hard to do much offstage because the platforms are so short and he gets you off so easily. His edgegaurding skills rock, the only thing is that edgegaurding in this case is harder for Marth than it normally is, because there's more than one option. You will get lucky if Marth's Fairing you offstage and the wall of Lava comes to meet you because you both get damage but you aern't always dead.

I always bring him to FD(no ledge) and SVille. One big MOving ledge.
just always works.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

What about stages to bring Marth? I was just in a sort of mini tourney among some friends from another site and one of my first fights was against a Marth. I brought him to Luigi's Mansion but that didn't seem like a smart choice, or the best stage I could have gone to. The small space gives Olimar a bit of an advantage, but Marths range made up for it. As for the tourney I went on to the semifinals only to be killed by a Wolf at Final Destination Wasn't a big tourney, nobody but the people at the site knew about it so it really isn't worth mentioning. I don't know what stage to bring Marth though.

Pictochat or Brinstar. Pictochat to make it easier to kill him and I bring everyone that doesn't ban it there. Brinstar to make it harder for him to gimp you.

For neutrals, hope for Smashville or Pokemon Stadium. FD is hard to approach on, but you don't want to spend too much time on platforms within tipper range. Those stages have more space in between but still have platforms for mindgames.

 

[DanGR]

I think for now, we need to discuss how we should act and react to an approaching marth, and how to go about edgeguarding, recovering, and juggling-instead of stage CPs? we'd like to assume that our opponent gets to pick the next stage eh?

side note-watch mr x's lake forest tourney matches. specifically DSF's marth. He does a great job spacing his attacks against marth in that round.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Hmmm. I thought this match-up was even cuz Olimar is really gay with his pikmin, but it seems that more and more Marths and Olimar's give the match to Marth.

Interesting.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

Hmmm. I thought this match-up was even cuz Olimar is really gay with his pikmin, but it seems that more and more Marths and Olimar's give the match to Marth.

Interesting.

Please elaborate on how you think this is even. Most Marths I've played against who are any good at the game basically destroyed me in embarrassing ways. Granted I don't get much practice at the matchup like I have vs. some other random characters, and that might have something to do with it too.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Eh. Marth can't approach from the ground easily, since he will just get grabbed. He has to do aerial approaches, namely his fair. This makes him more predictable. Olimar can't play his usual game of throwing pikmin to rack up damage since Marth laughs at that. But if he plays defensively and relies more on grabs and getting in attacks when Marth rushes I think he can fairly well for himself.

It probably goes to Marth, but I don't think it's a total **** match like Wolf is. Wolf can just mindlessly spam moves that will tear through pikmin.

Marth vs Oli is probably 65/35 Marth. Maybe 70/30 at most.

Tell me what do you think of the match-up?

 

[asob4]

i find wolf a lot easier than marth >_>

well he may be predictable but even when playing defensively marth gets the better of me
fair > fair > forward b is just so annoying and i can't get through it

i do agree though, grabs are marth's bane. getting in those grabs is another story.
but after you get the grab, it's difficult to follow up in the air if he gets a moment to breath.
textbook combo works pretty nice though

maybe it's just cause the only marth i ever play is danimals =/

EDIT: after rewatching the mr. x vids vs DSF it seems purple pikmin toss is a huge attribute to beating marth. it throws off his game and stops his approach
spacing is HUGE, as always with olimar, but even more so against marth
knowing where his >b and fair stop is essential to this match up if you want to win