We're talking competitively, Items and Fs are banned for a reason, anyone can win with items. A tier list isnt a popularity contest, this is based on tournament results, the characters matchups against other characters, and how "good" the character is all around
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The Official SBR Brawl Tier List v1.0
- Thread starter M3D
- Start date
- Status
Takumaru
Smash Lord
Reasons pls?
Killing potential
AnimeSnoopy
Smash Cadet
I neither said nor suggested that the game was completely balanced down to every character. What I suggested was that Sakurai gave out final smashes based on the character's standard combat effectiveness and vice-versa. No. He didn't balance everything out perfectly, but final smashes were part of the pro's and con's when these characters were designed. It's common sense.
Imagine MK with an FS like super sonic. It wasn't random. MK got a weak FS on purpose. Vice-versa with sonic.
Btw, Link and Mario are too low on that list. And I mean without Items.
Samuelson
Smash Lord
Wario and ROB will drop and Lucairo will be in the number 7 spot eventually. Look at the character rankings list, Lucario is about to pass Marth.
Zinc Elemental
Smash Journeyman
Yet for every bad character with a good final smash there are two top/high tier characters with a good one. You cited two examples, but that does not make a case. The tier list would be equally unbalanced even with FSs on.
This is kind of off-topic, though. This is a tier list for competitive play. Whether or not Sakurai decided to stick out his middle finger at competitive players by balancing things according to items on play (and I doubt he did), that doesn't influence this tier list in the slightest.
Also, if you're going to make claims about Mario or Link, at least give some reason. I (and obviously the majority of the SBR) think they belong right where they are.
AnimeSnoopy
Smash Cadet
"Brawl Tier list v1.0" = "Unaccurate first guess at Tiers"
We all know changes to this list are bound to occur. It's an early tier list "prototype" if you will. Anyway, lets see:
Final Smashes (Top):
Meta Knight: Weak
Snake: Good
DDD: Weak
GnW: Mediocre
Falco: Good
R.O.B: Mediocre
Only 2 good final smashes in top-tier and i'm having 2nd thoughts on Snake's FS atm.
Mario should be higher because of his dair and bair. Plus he's heavy yet still relatively quick.
Link can do the short-hop grapple hook attack that samus can do (Though not as effective.) His bair is good and his dair is deadly. His smash attacks have near DK/Bowser damage.
metaXzero
Smash Champion
How is ROB's FS mediocre?
And that's your only reasons for moving up Mario and Link? Horrible argument.
And that's your only reasons for moving up Mario and Link? Horrible argument.
Zinc Elemental
Smash Journeyman
It's inaccurate. Sorry, my OCD won't let you get away with that.
You underestimate ROBs.
Do you think there's a significant quality increase in the low tier FSs? There really isn't.
Link has some good characteristics, but he's got more significant weaknesses. Most notably his recovery...
Don't just point out a characters strenghts. You need to weight them against their own weaknesses and the (often greater) strengths of other characters.
cjrocker
Smash Ace
Fail.
Massive Fail.
KnightMare516
Smash Lord
hmm when will this be updated... cause as far as i know meta cant kill snake as easy and i believe there are more snakes then metas winning tournies. also why the hell is diddy not high tier... he is BROKEN his recovery isnt horrible as some of the others i mean this is brawl where u can FLOAT back to the stage lol. foward b and if u dont make it up b under to the ledge. and besides how man characters up b is a SPIKE!!!! lol diddy is **** sauce with his naners see ninjalink haha
Sonic The Hedgedawg
Smash Hero
in what way sir? much like sonic's it's capable of getting muliple kos or more than one on the same person
cjrocker
Smash Ace
I was actually referring to how he labeled Falco's landmaster as 'good' and not something like 'h4x.'
adumbrodeus
Smash Legend
I think something like "oh my God, oh my God, we're all gonna die" tier would be more appropriate for Falco's landmaster.
AnimeSnoopy
Smash Cadet
I'm typing from a wii. I'd go into more detail but i'm not at an actual keyboard. Oh and look at how Ken ate two back to back R.O.B final smashes at evo without dieing.
R.O.B FS = Mediocre.
**EDIT**
@cjocker
Go to Youtube.
Watch Sk92 vs. Darwin match 3
cjrocker
Smash Ace
Did you really use evo as part of your argument?
And I'm pretty sure the user 'cjocker' doesn't exist.
it bothers me that the sbr voting process overrode the tourney results thus far, and not vice versa. you can't assume everyone in the sbr knows a lot about each character's abilities right now. at that point people have to start generalizing, and that's when you run into problems. for the most part, those generalizations produced a fairly accurate tier list at this point in time, at least.
Superlocke
Smash Rookie
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2006
- Messages
- 12
LOL.
Ness better than Lucas? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Samuelson
Smash Lord
Mario is not heavy. Sakurai uses Mario to judge the how much all the other characters weigh. He is the most average you can get as far as weight and fall speed go.
gantrain05
Smash Master
yes.....ness is better than lucas, it seems only the backroom and you don't see that.
Superlocke
Smash Rookie
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2006
- Messages
- 12
Uh.. I guess we're the enlightened few? Lucas demolishes Ness in pretty much every aspect, I can't believe you actually think Ness comes close to him.
gantrain05
Smash Master
oh really? how many safe approaches does lucas have? how many reliable spikes? at least ness's yoyo can actually kill and can surprise opponents and not leave him wide open for 3 seconds after a Dsmash or an Usmash if he misses. trust me, i main both of them, and the only thing lucas has goin for him over ness is his Ftilt and his recovery, but that isnt saying much, seeing as both of them are easily gimped anyways.
OlimarFan
Smash Ace
True, in terms of weight and fall speed. Overall, I think he's actually slightly above average.
metaXzero
Smash Champion
You are using EVO as an argument? You might as well use it to say Falco's FS isn't that great....
Mario and PT are def not lower tier. They are middle to high imo. I gave up on using Samus, and have tried kirby and toon link, and I feel toon link is higher then kirby at least in my experience. Nice job on the list though. Nice to finally have one. I haven't decided on a main yet since they nerfed my samus, it has been rough trying to find a new character. Maybe this will help.
Neon304
Smash Apprentice
I think this list still need a lot of work, but it seems to be on the right track.
(a day will come when Metaknight falls down the list)
(a day will come when Metaknight falls down the list)
Smooth Criminal
Da Cheef
Metro Knight
Smash Ace
Egh, Link should be higher, 38th is a joke. I could bother explaining this, but just check out the Link forums some time.
hippochinfat!!
Smash Lord
He's still a really bad character. Most people on the Link forums would admit that.
Xyro77
Unity Ruleset Committee Member
I do admit link should be higher. If all of you people would do better with these characters and place better. you will see them rise in rank.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Yeah!
Unless you're Sonic mains
Laijin
Smash Hero
lol. DK is high tier.
LOL.
I agree with the rest of the list though. Although I would move Kirby higher or get rid of vertical tiers.
LOL.
I agree with the rest of the list though. Although I would move Kirby higher or get rid of vertical tiers.
Xyro77
Unity Ruleset Committee Member
wario doesnt win more.
M@v
Subarashii!
I hope you guys realize magnitude of how bad links recovery is? I dare to say its the worst recovery ever seen in a smash game, from 64 to now. Its THAT bad, and it ruins the character. If he has a decent recovery, say mario caliber, I dare say he could make middle tier.
adumbrodeus
Smash Legend
Unfortunately half the cast has infinite release grabs on him, and a good portion of the rest has good guarenteed options off release (sweet-spotted lightning kick ftw).
Basically, he really SHOULDN'T be getting as good results as he does, and over time he'll fall off. But currently he's popular enough and enough people don't know how to fight him to merit high rankings.
choknater
Smash Obsessed
link just lacks speed imo
he's manageable but he doesn't have really dominating factors
he's one of those characters that just doesn't have any "wow" material
imo if more people played him and he was discussed more popularly, he could get better. he has potential IMO, just as falcon and sonic do
it's super limited characters like ganon and jigglypuff that i can see not getting any higher
edit: adumbrodeus - just because wario can get gayed easily doesn't mean he is not an amazing character. his great aerial movement is a huge asset that overpowers many characters in the metagame. he is an unpredictable character, i don't think the release grabs will tear him down too much (until later when people start actually using them against good warios like futile...)
he's manageable but he doesn't have really dominating factors
he's one of those characters that just doesn't have any "wow" material
imo if more people played him and he was discussed more popularly, he could get better. he has potential IMO, just as falcon and sonic do
it's super limited characters like ganon and jigglypuff that i can see not getting any higher
edit: adumbrodeus - just because wario can get gayed easily doesn't mean he is not an amazing character. his great aerial movement is a huge asset that overpowers many characters in the metagame. he is an unpredictable character, i don't think the release grabs will tear him down too much (until later when people start actually using them against good warios like futile...)
Sonic The Hedgedawg
Smash Hero
Link has one of the best projectile games IN the game... and is quite powerful/heavy..... it's just his awful recovery limiting him so much... and it IS awful... trust me it is
notftomearth7
Smash Lord
Can someone explain to me the following:
Why isn't Ike at least high tier?
Why is Falco God Tier?
Why is anyone below Jigglypuff in tier?
Why aren't Lucas and Link high tier?
Why isn't Ike at least high tier?
Why is Falco God Tier?
Why is anyone below Jigglypuff in tier?
Why aren't Lucas and Link high tier?
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