The Official Michigan Brawl Power Rankings: Season 11 Images Up!

[Roller]

Somebody is just salty about the **** that was delivered earlier today.

#Friendlieswarrior

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

undefeated in bracket against you tho

 

[Roller]

Yoooooooooooo.


Maybe I'll have to go my main next time.

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

same here

 

[Sarix]

If you can't do anything worthy of note after having played for years, or even just a few months then you fall into at least one (but probably 3 or more) of these categories:

a) You aren't putting in enough effort compared to the rest of the state.
b) You aren't recognizing what facets of your game need to get worked on; and just keep practicing the same, suboptimal strategies, expecting better results and recognition for them.
c) You choose to play a bad character for the MI metagame (or in general)
d) You just don't have the heat of the moment, split second analytical skills required to do well at this game.
e) You don't care about the game.

If you meet ANY of the above criteria (compared to the rest of the state), you should NOT be on the PR. And should change your mentality/behavior accordingly if you hope to be in the future.

Hehehe, yeah I know where I fall in these categories. But in all honesty, yes I'm aware I choose to main a subpar character, yet I don't regret choosing my main. If I hadn't chosen
as my main I would probably understand even less about the game than if I had chosen a higher ranked character.

As nice as it would be to be PR eventually, my main goal is just to be known as a good Samus player in MI. Even as I continue to main with her I feel like I'm learning so much more because I have to proactively overcome my character disadvantages constantly, and if I were to use a better character it may eventually come to the point where it would be like taking the weights off my arms.

I don't disagree with what you are saying though Roller, you're bringing up very valid points. I'm just personally am more focused on being good with the character over being good in the state, obviously it they aren't completely separate, but I figure you understand what I mean.

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

the fastest way to learn the game is by playing a good character

 

[Juushichi]

No, you don't learn to play the game. You learn to play that character. That's why a lot of Falco players are bad. They know Falco ****, but don't understand how the game works. :x

Play who you want to learn the game.

 

[Hot_ArmS]

I meet roller's a and e criteria

 

[JTsm]

I meet A and somewhat E of rollers criteria.

 

[kd-]

There is nothing preventing anyone in Michigan from being the next Lain.

Time. Time makes fools of us all =[

 

[Sarix]

Time. Time makes fools of us all =[

Or is a luxury some of us can't afford as well.

 

[zyth]

I meet rollers a-d requirements honestly.

practice DKs wall of bair once a saturday then SD in Bracket

 

[What's The Point]

I meet rollers a-d requirements honestly.

practice DKs wall of bair once a saturday then SD in Bracket

if you honestly think SDs are your problem then you'll never improve.

 

[Roller]

@Chad: If you want it bad enough, you MAKE time. I practiced CGs last night from 2-4 am. (after having practiced in the afternoon, and hosted a smashfest).Don't tell me you're busy from 2-4am. You COULD practice. Watch the video at the end of my link if you haven't. I think it applies pretty well to the excuse you're making. Particularly the part where 50 cent and Beyonce are mentioned.

You have more than enough time, you just make decisions as to what is the most important thing to spend it on. job, school, reading, tv, sleeping, etc. If being the best isn't high on your list of priorities, then quite frankly, you don't want it bad enough. To quote the video. "Most people kind of want success. But they don't want it BAD." If you are choosing 8 hours of sleep over 5-6 hours of sleep and 2-3 hours of practice, you don't want it bad enough. If you choose to go see a movie, when other players are getting together to work on their game, you don't want it bad enough.

In Domo's post Meekspeedy linked to, he says it requires an "obsession" to become the best. I agree wholeheartedly.

A lot of you don't want it enough, and that is fine. It's cool to have other priorities, just don't expect to be ranked among people who have smash one notch higher on their list.




@Sarix: It sounds like being PR'd/the best is not your goal. That's fine, a lot of people play for a lot of other reasons. (It's certainly not the only reason that I play) But obviously the criteria for this goal wont apply to you, if it isn't the goal you have.

 

[Sparta Kick]

I meet roller's a and e criteria

I meet A and somewhat E of rollers criteria.

You both meet C as well.

Also, Roller's post was designated toward the people who complain time after time that they aren't getting better/are bad/lose to the same people.

 

[Zankoku]

If I hadn't chosen
as my main I would probably understand even less about the game than if I had chosen a higher ranked character.

I'm not entirely sure I see the correlation between character choice and pace of learning the game. I mained Sheik for a long time and the only thing special I learned out of that was how to hold forward and press A a lot.

the fastest way to learn the game is by playing a good character

...Possibly?

No, you don't learn to play the game. You learn to play that character. That's why a lot of Falco players are bad. They know Falco ****, but don't understand how the game works. :x

Play who you want to learn the game.

While I agree with the second part, the first one is really not necessarily true. Players choose to learn their character, or their fundamentals, or something else, or a combination of stuff, and while such a preference might end up influencing which character they choose, I really don't see how it works the other way around.

Time. Time makes fools of us all =[

You mean psychoactive drugs and alcohol, right? If you're not working jobs along with taking a full course-load or studying for med school or something, I'm pretty sure you have more than enough time. What holds most players who want to get up there in skill and recognition is a lack of dedication.



Also, what's up, Michigan? See everyone next month.

 

[JTsm]

You both meet C as well.

Snake is way too sexy not to play

 

[kd-]

My point with time is that even with the allotted time, not everyone can become the player they want to be. One can always spare time -

busy from 2-4am. You COULD practice.

even when they don't want to -

is a lack of dedication.

Anyone can be anything if they give it enough time, but it's going to take me a lot longer to be as good as Lain is/was* than it took him, even with the same or maybe a stronger practice structure. I could be twice as dedicated and have less than half the results. Some people just literally don't have the time to be good.

 

[Roller]

That's bs. If you are practicing the correct way, working on what you need to be working on, you can do just as well, assuming you don't have a mental disorder.

I played for hours and hours on wifi before coming here, and thought the way you did. That top players were just naturally better. But the truth is, I was just practicing entirely the wrong way, not working on or thinking through the aspects I needed to.

When I got here, tutu could dry **** me every time in horrible matchups. Players even well below being PRd could 3 stock me easily. I played with better players, and listened to what they said my weaknesses are, then reverse engineer better ways to deal with those situations. I still do this. Every week, multiple days per week.

I spend hours just working on situational techniques, like throwing grenades away while CGing. Hours. Do not for a second think that m2k has not spent countless hours analyzing what he should be doing in any given situation, and practicing each of those responses over and over until he can't possibly **** it up.

He has filled notebooks with research into the smallest details of matchups.

I'm guessing you don't do these things to improve anywhere close to as much as top players have.

The best invest more time and analysis into the game than I think you realize.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

No, you don't learn to play the game. You learn to play that character. That's why a lot of Falco players are bad. They know Falco ****, but don't understand how the game works. :x

Play who you want to learn the game.

As usual, you're wrong, To this day Notra is the best snake I've ever played against and he mained falco, now if you had said diddy kong/olimar/ICs? I would 100% agree.

I'm not entirely sure I see the correlation between character choice and pace of learning the game. I mained Sheik for a long time and the only thing special I learned out of that was how to hold forward and press A a lot.

I do the same thing and people say I'm good. L

You mean psychoactive drugs and alcohol, right? If you're not working jobs along with taking a full course-load or studying for med school or something, I'm pretty sure you have more than enough time. What holds most players who want to get up there in skill and recognition is a lack of dedication.

I disagree, some people are just naturally better than others and no amount of practice will ever overcome that

My point with time is that even with the allotted time, not everyone can become the player they want to be. One can always spare time -

even when they don't want to -


Anyone can be anything if they give it enough time, but it's going to take me a lot longer to be as good as Lain is/was* than it took him, even with the same or maybe a stronger practice structure. I could be twice as dedicated and have less than half the results. Some people just literally don't have the time to be good.

I agree, some people just don't have what it takes to be good at this game, without putting in a un-realistic amount of time, it's not about how they practice it's about just not having any kind of video game ability.

That's bs. If you are practicing the correct way, working on what you need to be working on, you can do just as well, assuming you don't have a mental disorder.

I disagree, the only people that become good are people that were able to be god in the first place.

I played for hours and hours on wifi before coming here, and thought the way you did. That top players were just naturally better. But the truth is, I was just practicing entirely the wrong way, not working on or thinking through the aspects I needed to.

The top players are just naturally better

When I got here, tutu could dry **** me every time in horrible matchups.

ludington says hi

I spend hours just working on situational techniques, like throwing grenades away while CGing. Hours. Do not for a second think that m2k has not spent countless hours analyzing what he should be doing in any given situation, and practicing each of those responses over and over until he can't possibly **** it up.

He has filled notebooks with research into the smallest details of matchups.

I'm guessing you don't do these things to improve anywhere close to as much as top players have.

The best invest more time and analysis into the game than I think you realize.

The best are also more gifted with smash ability than you realize. Also stop being conceited with the "If i can do it, you can do it too" bull****, you're naturally better than some people are at smash, stop pretending like you aren't.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

I should mention that I'm not one of those ****ty people that can never improve.

 

[kd-]

If I made smash my full-time job plus some, I still don't think I'd be able to be great. I understand the amount of practice the best have put into this game more than I think you think I realize :D This isn't the first time I've heard you talk about your practice; I have a huge amount of respect for you and I'm happy seeing your successful results.

 

[Juggleguy]

Well Brian, you gotta have a good amount of competitive talent to be one of the best at Smash. No amount of hard work can overcome a complete lack of talent. Everyone knows this and can see this in sports, and I think it's also true (albeit to a lesser extent) in Smash.

 

[Hot_ArmS]

shaq practiced free throws but after 15 years he was still terrible at it

 

[Sarix]

I'm not entirely sure I see the correlation between character choice and pace of learning the game. I mained Sheik for a long time and the only thing special I learned out of that was how to hold forward and press A a lot.

What I meant was that if I had gone with a character with less overall flaws and disadvantages I probably wouldn't have looked into the little nuances of the game as much to improve, at least pre-PS3 wise. When I picked up Samus it really forced me to recognize the overall pacing of Brawl and find ways to utilize as an advantage. Especially compared to my friend Torvus who uses higher tier characters and has studied up and practiced on how to use them effectively for roughly the same amount of time I have and the difference in knowledge and skill between us is noticeable.

Granted there are people who have put MUCH more effort than I have, but just between a friend and I who started at roughly the same time with characters with similar learning curves, I had to learn more about the game as a whole to be successful.

 

[JTsm]

Well you have to practice perfectly. You have to practice the means of being godly. That's how you get good.

 

[zyth]

all this talk about how uch ppl need to practice tbecome gdlike needs to go in the big MI discussion topic and not here dontu guys think?

 

[Roller]

Yeah, why discuss what it takes to become one of the top players in a thread dedicated to keeping a list of all the top players?

Time to take this to a social.

 

[zyth]

Yeah, why discuss what it takes to become one of the top players in a thread dedicated to keeping a list of all the top players?

Time to take this to a social.

+1

I'm sayin we should move this because this thread is about discussing who should be on the MI pr and why they shouldbe on there. now u guys are talkin about how to get better. productive, but the wrong place for it

 

[Roller]

I disagree.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

i agree with roller

 

[Damittom]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHJDRgVwcP8
^ This thread

Anyways I feel like this is the majority of MI's opinion towards smashfests and such (I know at times I treat smashfest as a relaxation) In all reality if we wanted to get better every smashfest should be treated as a hyperbolic time chamber. That's what I think separates those superior players such as MJG from the rest of us all though he doesn't get to play against others all the time when he does he makes the most of it and I think that is one of the points Roller is trying to make. (make the time you have to practice count)

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

you can be good at brawl without practicing

brawl is extremely easy. tech skill is almost a nonfactor. dont pretend this isnt true. i could learn ICs chaingrabs in like a week.

64 and melee on the other hand...

 

[Roller]

Learn the chain grab, perhaps. But being able to perform it consistently on every character at an unmashable speed is another story entirely. Not to mention the desynchs and learning how to deal with various strategies. Learning how to protect your nana is no small task either.

But you already know all this, or else you would have already picked them up as you've admitted to considering a few times.

Don't pretend melee is much harder. I learned how to wobble in a day, every form of desynch in 10 minutes during a single chat session with Fly, and several of their CGs in under a week. Wavedashing makes baiting, punishing, and approaching waaaaay easier than in Brawl. I'm actually pretty damn confident I could get PRd in Melee if I actually put effort into it. I can waveshine and do a few other tricks in melee too, but just as you would not be able to cg consistently at the proper speed after only a week of playing ICs, I can't waveshine a character across FD into an up smash or anything like that. Both games take practice to maintain consistency.
64 I don't pretend to know much about. But I will say that the tech skill required to play ICs in Brawl at a high level is greater than playing say.. Pikachu in 64. It's why I have to practice so often to keep my tech skill sharp, and you can unrust from 64 after I'm going to assume a few hours to a day tops.

Not claiming it is easier or more difficult to become a good player in one or the other. Especially because ICs are by no means the standard for Brawl Character tech skill, and Tech skill as a whole is only one component of a much deeper game. But the tech skill required to do what I do in Brawl requires at least as much practice as any other smash character. Especially yours, Mr. MeleeSheikMain.

If practicing isn't needed, then why do the people who win the tournaments always seem to be people who practice? Why is it that Lain went from getting top 3-5 at nationals to not making it out of pools at apex, and got 7th at a small-medium sized regional when he stopped practicing?

You can argue the points if you want. But at the end of the day, there's a reason you beat Sean, and lost to Pane, and you know it. You have infinitely more practice in the mk mu than the wolf one.

And wolf is broken.

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

uhhhhhh....

i dont play ics because they're boring and i wouldnt have fun playing them. i'm 100% confident i could do it if i wanted to.

lol @ saying melee isnt much harder tech skill wise because ICs are similar. i'd love to see what the melee ppl would say to that...

64's demand for tech skill is equal to if not greater than melee imo.

But I will say that the tech skill required to play ICs in Brawl at a high level is greater than playing say.. Pikachu in 64.

wrong.

i dont play melee. i choose shiek because she's easy, so what? i dont play the game. and you're just wrong. do you really believe CGing people in brawl is the same level of tech skill as top level fox play in melee or 64? melee peach? even brawl falco...

ally has won several large tournaments having not played for weeks at a time beforehand.

i beat sean because i understand the mk matchup. i dont understand wolf's moveset or his metagame at all. that could come with practice, or it could come by just sitting down and watching wolf matches. or something.

 

[Roller]

Ally can go a few weeks without practice after devoting hours upon hours of practice to this game for years. It's still his practice that prepared him. And I've heard many melee players suggest that ICs are among the most technical in the game. idk if you watch fly or wobbles videos too often, but commentators of their matches frequently compare the tech skill ICs require to play at a high level to that of fox.

Even in MI I've had people tell me they would never main ICs because they think it would be too difficult. Chad, a fox main himself has told me that multiple times.

Also. LOL@ICs in the 2 games being similar. Even the way they move is different.

As for everything else, you show me a buffered 0-death (120+%) cg on snake 3 times in a row, followed by one on say.. Lucas? and I'll show you any ATs you can do consistently in another game after less practice time.

Until that time, anyone can claim they can slay a bitty. Until I see the proof, I don't see any reason to bother listening to their views on which methods are best.

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

Until I see the proof, I don't see any reason to bother listening to their views on which methods are best.

how does this not apply to like everything you've said

 

[Roller]

the burden of proof falls on the accuser. You are trying to say what I claimed is false. If it is, prove it. I never cared enough to attack your claims as anything more than a defense of my own. I have nothing to prove to you.


In other words.
You can choose to believe what I'm saying or not. It doesn't effect me much either way. So I have no real need to prove anything. But if you want to prove to me/the community that what I said was wrong, and have the desire to change my opinion on the matter, then you would have to offer said proof.

People can disagree with me. I'm just sharing what I believe is the best way to improve. You don't have to agree. I threw it out there because I thought maybe someone would find it useful. If not practicing is making you into one of the best players in the state, by all means, keep at it. For everyone who would like a fresh perspective from someone who has improved recently, showing signs that his methods can yield results... Feel free to consider what I said.

For those who want to continue losing to players I have 3 stocked in the past few weeks.. Keep doing what you're doing.

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

For those who want to continue losing to players I have 3 stocked in the past few weeks.. Keep doing what you're doing.

dang i wish i was as cool as u

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

For those who want to continue losing to players I have 3 stocked in the past few weeks.. Keep doing what you're doing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8JCo190xc4