The Official Krystal Thread ;)

[Circus]

If Krystal has two gallons leftover, she can drink it if she's thirsty. =P

Good point.

I guess if they experience a drought after their tank-filling experiment, Wolf is **** outta luck.

 

[Brawlmatt202]

This has probably already been posted before, but I still feel like posting it:

http://www.alesiaglidewell.com/vo_games.htm

...Krystal confirmed? :o

 

[RDK]

**** you and your ridiculously convoluted analogies, Berkus!

 

[Boofer]

I'm gonna be honest. I sorta want Krystal because she's a female. However, my biggest reason for wanting her is the fact that she has a staff. Staffs are effing tight! Nobody else has a staff in the game. Plus, I think her look is a little more unique than Wolf's. Wolf looks a bit like Fox imo.

 

[Circus]

Actually, I would say Bowser, due to his being more important to the Mario games. His actions drive most of the stories of those games. Peach just tends to merely be a prop, kidnapped by him and rescued by Mario.

Take instead the case of Fire Emblem, and say that in a future SSB, Micaiah and Garnef (the dark priest who was a main villain of Marth's games) both are under consideration for inclusion, but only one can be chosen. Micaiah would be the one to get in, due to her being a primary hero of her game, and the Garnef being just a villain, secondary in importance to the hero.

I've never played an FE game, but I'm going to assume that by "primary hero", you mean that Micaiah is the main protagonist of the game (or at least on level with others)? In this case, she falls into the same position Samus is in. However, note that in this case, the gender is not a factor at all. Samus could be male and the game would be the same. The fact that she is a woman is not important, the fact that she is a heroine is. So it falls into the case (as I believe you actually stated yourself in this post) of heroes being more important than villains, which I certainly will not argue with. However, whether they are a hero or heroine does not matter. Micaiah would get in because she's a main protagonist who is critical to the story, not because she has breasts and and a va-jay-jay.

Really, the tragedy is, out of all Nintendo's series, the only ones with important female characters who do more than play the Damsel-in-Distress role (ala Peach/Zelda) are Metroid, Star Fox, Fire Emblem (and there they still are largely secondary to male characters, unfortunately - Micaiah will be the first who isn't), and a few minor second-party series (Golden Sun, Eternal Darkness, etc).

Zevox

No arguments there. In general there should be more important female characters.

**** you and your ridiculously convoluted analogies, Berkus!

You know you loved it. Only I can make an analogy involving pouring water this cool. *pops his collar and struts around for a while*

 

[Chepe]

Ah, having 3 Starfox characters isnt impossible peeps. So Falco I believe is still very likely. Yeah, I know many people like Wolf, but seriously after Krystal, Falco would look better on the lineup than Wolf simply because he isnt canine. But thats just me...

Its the same reasoning as wanting Ridley over Dark Samus (3 Samuses? -_-) and Micaiah for Fire Emblem (the series isnt all swords!). Starfox isnt all canines. Of course, this is all just opinion...

 

[Kal aMari]

Actually, only idiots who haven't even played the games would think that Dark Samus is ANYTHING like Samus beyond looks. I still have it in my sig, but I know it's not gonna happen...v_v

The canine rule says nothing about Starfox, though. If anything, that's a reason for them NOT to have Krystal OR Wolf.

 

[Brawlmatt202]

This has probably already been posted before, but I still feel like posting it:

http://www.alesiaglidewell.com/vo_games.htm

...Krystal confirmed? :o

*Not being ignored, here*

 

[Chepe]

Actually, only idiots who haven't even played the games would think that Dark Samus is ANYTHING like Samus beyond looks. I still have it in my sig, but I know it's not gonna happen...v_v

The canine rule says nothing about Starfox, though. If anything, that's a reason for them NOT to have Krystal OR Wolf.

Yeah I know, thats why I made it especially clear that it was just my opinion on the matter. I know Dark Samus would not be a clone of Samus, but it doesnt change my opinion of it looking dumb to have Samus, Zero Suit Samus, and Dark Samus on the roster... And of course theres no "canine rule", but to me Falco would look better with Fox and Krystal.

Take what I said lightly...

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

okay now for a short sweet argument sum up.

Fox:
Fox has got seniority and his own franchise. He's got the goods which is why he's in.

Krystal:
A female in the star fox series who is actually a very popular character with a completely unique quality of being a staff user. Aside from this, she was the main character in Dinosaur Planet. The fact that it got changed to a starfox title late in development does not change the fact that she's the only Star Fox character besides fox to have her own game. If anything, the fact that her game was stolen from her proves that she is owed something.

Falco:
enormously popular. The most popular character in the series actually, but, unfortunately, very similar to fox; also, nothing about him would out priortize fox so his inclusin is dependent upon decloning. Despite legacy, he is actually out prioritized by Krystal, though I'd give both a pretty good chance.

Wolf:
A fairly popular character, but plays a relatively minor role in most games that he's in. He has been in no more games than Krystal and less than any other SF character. He is, essentially, a bigger, meaner version of fox (down to physical appearance and profession). Nothing reallly sets him appart and the fact that falco, who has more of a chance than wolf, plays similar to fox as well, drops wolf's survival rating down to about nil.

Slippy and Peppy:
as old as fox and falco, but far less important or popular. With all the other SF characters taking more priority, they don't really have a shot.

ROB, Kat and Bill:
lesser characters still.... no chance.

Andross:
assist trophy and to huge to be playable.

Star wolf team members:
less important than wolf or any SF team member so no chance at all

 

[DraginHikari]

Basically, at this point, I just want Wolf in. I really don't give a hoot what else happens.

As long as I get the characters I want, I'm pretty much happy.

Biggest probably with that is there is no way for them to come up with a Roster that satifies everyone or even a majority.

 

[RDK]

You know you loved it. Only I can make an analogy involving pouring water this cool. *pops his collar and struts around for a while*

*SLUMPS DEFEATEDLY*

I know. I always come back for more.

 

[burrito]

But if Wolf has enough potential for a unique moveset, then why does it matter who as more? Krystal may have more potential, but she would still be using the same amount of it as Wolf would; that is, just enough to have a complete, varied moveset. Even if Krystal has more to offer, she and Wolf are both capable of having movesets that are equally unique from the other characters.

It's like Krystal has a 3 gallons of water to fill a tank that can hold 1 gallon. Wolf has 1 gallon of water to fill the same tank. They could both empty their gallons and they'd still fill the tank to the same level, so who cares that Krystal had 2 more gallons?

Right, as you said earlier, anyone has potential for a unique moveset, but the more you try giving a character a unique moveset, who doesn't have potential, the more you risk not staying true to their character, if you can't stay true to their character, it was basically pointless to add them. Unique movesets is why characters such as the Ice Climbers were added to the game instead of Balloon Fighter.

Anyways I think a better metaphor would be this: imagine Wolf and Krystal were faucets. You have to fill a 3 gallon tank. Water drips out of Wolf at 1 gallon per 5 hours, water drips out of Krystal at 3 gallons per 1 hour. You could fill the tank with Wolf, but why bother when it is much easier to fill the tank with Krystal?

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

The Official Krystal Thread: analogies welcome

Right, as you said earlier, anyone has potential for a unique moveset, but the more you try giving a character a unique moveset, who doesn't have potential, the more you risk not staying true to their character, if you can't stay true to their character, it was basically pointless to add them. Unique movesets is why characters such as the Ice Climbers were added to the game instead of Balloon Fighter.

Anyways I think a better metaphor would be this: imagine Wolf and Krystal were faucets. You have to fill a 3 gallon tank. Water drips out of Wolf at 1 gallon per 5 hours, water drips out of Krystal at 3 gallons per 1 hour. You could fill the tank with Wolf, but why bother when it is much easier to fill the tank with Krystal?

since when are Krystal and Wolf fluid commodities.

An other good way of looking at it may be this:

you fill a basket with krystal and a basket with wolf and you take both to market where you plan to sell them to Baron VonBrawl.

Everyone has brought characters to brawl and so everyone sets them on a large table filled with other such baskets. The baron begins to look at the baskets and he likes both krystal and wolf's equally. Then Baron looks at fox's basket and he sees that it looks a lot like wolf's but better. He takes fox's basket right away, but he then notices that a lot of what is left in wolf and krystal's baskets is the same as what he got from fox. So then, he begins to take out all the things that he already has.

Afterwards, he se's that krystal's basket is still over half way filled and wolf's is almost empty.... since he likes everything in it about the same, he judges that he'll take the basket with MORE of the good thing.... wouldn't you? I'll bet you Sakurai did

 

[RDK]

you fill a basket with krystal and a basket with wolf and you take both to market where you plan to sell them to Baron VonBrawl.

Everyone has brought characters to brawl and so everyone sets them on a large table filled with other such baskets. The baron begins to look at the baskets and he likes both krystal and wolf's equally. Then Baron looks at fox's basket and he sees that it looks a lot like wolf's but better. He takes fox's basket right away, but he then notices that a lot of what is left in wolf and krystal's baskets is the same as what he got from fox. So then, he begins to take out all the things that he already has.

Afterwards, he se's that krystal's basket is still over half way filled and wolf's is almost empty.... since he likes everything in it about the same, he judges that he'll take the basket with MORE of the good thing.... wouldn't you? I'll bet you Sakurai did

With that stupid, idiotic reasoning, you might as well take out Luigi, because he's like Mario.

 

[Kal aMari]

Yeah...the water analogy was a little better. Actually, a lot.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

With that stupid, idiotic reasoning, you might as well take out Luigi, because he's like Mario.

no it's not: I specified that what was left in krystal and wolf's baskets were worth the same amount.

While it's true that not much is left in luigi's basket after you take out what he shares with mario, what lugi's basket was filled with was worth FAR more in the first place.

As one of the cornerstones of the mario series: the definitive nintendo series, Luigi is made of diamond and wolf and krystal are made of perhaps quartz


@ Kal: mainly because it supported your view I suppose, but yeah I just figured that we're talking in random analogies so might as well continue with them

 

[burrito]

With that stupid, idiotic reasoning, you might as well take out Luigi, because he's like Mario.

While we were both looking at the specific factor of uniqueness. Of course there are other factors that can be considered. Luigi has popularity and important that overrides his lack of uniqueness.

 

[kaid]

I prefer a combination of the two analigies.

There is a tap, and it is called Sakurai's imagination. However, there is also containers that hold set amounts.

Returning non-clones simply take their Melee container, change it around a bit, and pit it directly into brawl.

Adventures is a container that contains 90% of what you need to create a Brawl character, requiring only a small aditional effort on Sakurai's effort in interpreting the staff combos into air moves and grabs.

Wolf, on the other hand, has access only to the Assault container, which contains only moves associated with Specials. While Snake has shown that Sakurai is willing to put projectiles into smashes and the like, this remains a smaller resource than Adventures.

 

[Brawlmatt202]

This has probably already been posted before, but I still feel like posting it:

http://www.alesiaglidewell.com/vo_games.htm

...Krystal confirmed? :o

DEFINITELY not talking to myself here...

 

[Sonallvegqu]

I'm all for Krystal. Smash Bros. does need more female characters. But, I probably recommend Krystal needs a new outfit. Those sketches in the first page seemed alright for a start, but, yes, I agree it is still not prefect.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I prefer a combination of the two analigies.

There is a tap, and it is called Sakurai's imagination. However, there is also containers that hold set amounts.

Returning non-clones simply take their Melee container, change it around a bit, and pit it directly into brawl.

Adventures is a container that contains 90% of what you need to create a Brawl character, requiring only a small aditional effort on Sakurai's effort in interpreting the staff combos into air moves and grabs.

Wolf, on the other hand, has access only to the Assault container, which contains only moves associated with Specials. While Snake has shown that Sakurai is willing to put projectiles into smashes and the like, this remains a smaller resource than Adventures.

good except for I'd be sure to add that, while Krystal's tap contains the only liquid of its type, Wolf's spigot dispenses primarily the same product as does falco's, slippy's, peppy's, fox's, pigma's, andrew's, panther's, leon's, Kat's and Bill's. and while it's better quality than most of those spigots, it's worse than some too, and either way it's stale compared to krystal's

@ BrawlMatt: We've responded.
It CLEARLY garuntees that she's in the game, but it doesn't say anything as to what role she performs. She could be an assist trophy or part of fox's storiline, but it's certainly good news.

 

[MegatronPwnsYou]

I'm all for Krystal. Smash Bros. does need more female characters. But, I probably recommend Krystal needs a new outfit. Those sketches in the first page seemed alright for a start, but, yes, I agree it is still not prefect.

It is probably going to be a mix of all of her outfits. Like Fox outfit.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

It is probably going to be a mix of all of her outfits. Like Fox outfit.

I doubt it just because Fox's outfits are all VERY similar. Krystal's adventure outfit, her true outfit, is drastically different from anything else that she wears

 

[lanky_gunner]

yeah i saw that brawlmatt. still a nice bit of info

but weird analogies. i just want to see Krystal. Wolf would be nice as well (better than Falco, in my opinion), but seeing that Fox costume...i'm not saying it's Wolf, but the similarity is uncanny.

Krystal for Brawl

 

[paralasalud]

LOL i've never posted in this thread before, nor have i gone into it.
i must say i'm pleasantly surprised with the clever analogies, albeit a little odd.

anyhow, i do support krystal, and since everyone is talking about him, i support her moreover wolf. she'd make an amazing pc.

 

[MegatronPwnsYou]

Well maybe like the assault top and the skimpy skirt?

 

[error_alt_delete]

basically krystal takes less to make good without straying at all from her character in adventures. wolf however takes alot more work to do so. plus wolf chances are lower due to a ceatain outfit...

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

As for the outfit, it's been said but I'll say it again:

Krystal from the starfox team doesn't offer much that other characters from the series don't.

Krystal from Dinosaur Planet, however, well, that's a different story. And that krystal is the one in the yellow tribal costume, not the one in the blue spacesuit.

Honestly, it would be awesome if she were in her adventures attire for brawl because it would actually be more true to her character than any of the starfox games were

 

[MegatronPwnsYou]

Wait Wolf in a skimpy skirt?

 

[roy_owns]

Wait Wolf in a skimpy skirt?

...? I don't get it.

 

[Kal aMari]

Play Command and tell me she can be replaced by anyone on the team. Really, she's, like, one of the most important wingmen in that game. Falco beats her for various plot reasons, but...she's very important to the game, moreso than Adventures.

Unless you're saying the "real" Krystal is a damsel in distress with butterfingers who seems to flash her thong all over the place...

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Play Command and tell me she can be replaced by anyone on the team. Really, she's, like, one of the most important wingmen in that game. Falco beats her for various plot reasons, but...she's very important to the game, moreso than Adventures.

Unless you're saying the "real" Krystal is a damsel in distress with butterfingers who seems to flash her thong all over the place...

no the krystal from the game that got replaced by SFAdv.

She was its original star before fox stole the game from her.

 

[Ralph_Marquee]

no the krystal from the game that got replaced by SFAdv.

She was its original star before fox stole the game from her.

That is true...but the title is StarFox adventures.

 

[Kal aMari]

Oh, you mean DINOSAUR PLANET. I see. That's different.

The problem with that Krystal is simple: she doesn't exist. I liked her better there than in Adventures. But we know NOTHING about her. They changed almost everything to fit Star Fox into the mold, including Krystal herself.

Plus DP Krystal fits even less with Command Fox than Adventures Krystal.

EDIT: I'd like to add that, if you're saying we give her THAT outfit, then I think it's a better option than Adventures. Definitely not as likely, but I think that'd be a good compromise...there's still the issue of giving folks their latest/updated appearances, and I can't see them breaking that chain.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Oh, you mean DINOSAUR PLANET. I see. That's different.

The problem with that Krystal is simple: she doesn't exist. I liked her better there than in Adventures. But we know NOTHING about her. They changed almost everything to fit Star Fox into the mold, including Krystal herself.

Plus DP Krystal fits even less with Command Fox than Adventures Krystal.

EDIT: I'd like to add that, if you're saying we give her THAT outfit, then I think it's a better option than Adventures. Definitely not as likely, but I think that'd be a good compromise...there's still the issue of giving folks their latest/updated appearances, and I can't see them breaking that chain.

Yeah, she definitely won't get the DP outfit since the game wasn't released (unfortunately) but that Krystal's nearest couterpart is the adventures Krystal. The command krystal has almost nothing kept over from the original character so I'd hate to see that krystal make it in over the krystal that deserves it.



Anyway... we've talked about all this before. Let's talk about something that we haven't talked about: Character intros are back now. What would Krystal's be?

- Didn't the staff have a move where it coul unlock a doorway allowing you to teleport somewhere? Anyway it was pretty obscure so I doubt it.

- Arwing, but that would make her too similar to fox's and likely falco's and space isn't really where she belongs anyway.

-on the back of a pteresaur like how she entered SFAdv, DP and GCNs everywhere.

-something entierely different

(my vote's for the pterasaur)

 

[Kal aMari]

There was a teleport thing caused when Fox released a Krazoa spirit. It could be something similar. If not, then the Pterosaur is the next best thing, even if it's similar to Fox's.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

There was a teleport thing caused when Fox released a Krazoa spirit. It could be something similar. If not, then the Pterosaur is the next best thing, even if it's similar to Fox's.

But it's similar to fox's in a quite briliant way:
sure the act of ariving in a space plane vs. a flying reptile are similar in that a flying object brings the character in and drops them off, but I mean it's different enough to show that, wheras fox is all space pilot, Krystal is the adventuresome fox from Dinosaur Planet.

Personally, I'd love a game like dinosaur planet that starred Krystal to make up for what happened to her.

 

[error_alt_delete]

But it's similar to fox's in a quite briliant way:
sure the act of ariving in a space plane vs. a flying reptile are similar in that a flying object brings the character in and drops them off, but I mean it's different enough to show that, wheras fox is all space pilot, Krystal is the adventuresome fox from Dinosaur Planet.

Personally, I'd love a game like dinosaur planet that starred Krystal to make up for what happened to her.

the release of a game with the same elelments, just different protagonist wouldnt sell well. especialy if they had the same techniques.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

the release of a game with the same elelments, just different protagonist wouldnt sell well. especialy if they had the same techniques.

It'd have to have a different storiline and not all the techniques would have to be exactly the same... b ut it was a good game, the only thing wrong with it was that Fox just didn't belong and you could tell.... Krystal on the other hand... who knows... maybe after she's been in brawl for a while she'll get enough fans to support her getting a game.