The New Match-up Chart

[prisonchild]

what did I just say bro

you said dair > techchase is something that everyone uses and has been in use forever. i was agreeing that dair > techchase wasn't a new concept, i was mainly disagreeing with you saying everyone uses it. there are a ton of falcons that haven't and don't.

 

[SheerMadness]

I dair tech chase into more dairs vs floaties. Don't see many Falcons doing that honestly.

 

[M!nt]

^ ur falcon is weird.

also samus mains are the best people.

 

[t3h Icy]

....

So umm, this thread is a gajillion years old. There's even a newer one, lol.

But if you guys want to, I don't mind making a fresh thread to do match-up chart stuff again, since most people are awful at these things lol. But if the consensus is to do that, I'd rather make sure we know how we want to do it (stages vs general, increment amounts, etc).

Also, Luigi is terrible vs Kirby.

*coug h*

 

[kys]

I dair tech chase into more dairs vs floaties. Don't see many Falcons doing that honestly.

I do this a lot, but I almost always miss the second dair, which in turn causes me to miss the follow up when I do actually hit it.

With the current people who are active on the boards, I don't think revisiting the matchup chart is a good idea at the moment. Yep, I went there.

 

[B Link]

me:

>tries dairing floaties with falcon
>99% doesn't lead to anything

I know, I know, I'm not doing it right. W/e who needs falcon dair when you have JIGGZ/YOSHI DAIR

Double falcon dair combo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWkUHGrLlcE&feature=plcp Maybe a triple dair is possible

 

[SheerMadness]

If you dair them while they're on the ground they pop up a little bit so you dair them back to the ground. Then you tech chase with another dair.

If you're decent at tech chasing it'll lead to several more dairs and or a KO.

Pwns the really light chars like Jiggs that you can't combo well.

 

[prisonchild]

what's the verdict on a link-dk matchup? i thought it would be really bad for me (as link) but it wasn't nearly as bad as i thought it would be. even on peach's castle and dream land i was able to use projectiles to space.

it also helps that dk is slow and a huge target.



but yeah, was it just my friend adjusting poorly to the matchup or is not bad for link in general?

 

[The Star King]

It's not bad.

 

[B Link]

Meh, I think it's a pretty bad match-up on DL at least. DK gimps link like a boss, projectiles or no projectiles.

 

[Yobolight]

I'm starting to think Samus isn't that bad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=UuTy9DO66gs

 

[The Star King]

Everybody "isn't that bad". In the sense that every character can be successful in this game.

 

[Battlecow]

Jousuke is the freaking man, that's for sure

no character in 64 is unusable. One of the reasons why it's a great game.

 

[Olikus]

I'm starting to think Samus isn't that bad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=UuTy9DO66gs

omg jousuke iis so ****ing crazy.

 

[Frogles]

not impressed

maybe because that video is three years old >___>

 

[Yobolight]

Ballin4life's Ness is up there with Firo's IMO.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaD-urUAmt0

 

[Battlecow]

His performance against IBKellenIt is not grounds for his being better than anyone. No offense, IBKellenit.

and looking cool is not the same as being good

Ballin IS (really freaking) good, but I don't think he's gonna beat firo with tertiaries.

 

[ballin4life]

i doubt it...

 

[B Link]

I'm starting to think Samus isn't that bad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=UuTy9DO66gs

That's the japanese version

 

[The Star King]

Ballin4life's Ness is up there with Firo's IMO.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaD-urUAmt0

*sigh* Youtube monsters

Seriously dude

stop

 

[asianaussie]

the day smash 64 gets youtube/video monsters is the day i rejoice, because that means one more person is interested in the game

 

[The Star King]

maybe "youtube monsters" isn't the right term

people who judge skill off of youtube videos alone without having had played either player

 

[mikeduncan23]

His performance against IBKellenIt is not grounds for his being better than anyone. No offense, IBKellenit.

and looking cool is not the same as being good

Ballin IS (really freaking) good, but I don't think he's gonna beat firo with tertiaries.

HAHAHA I got a great laugh out of that with obviously being the friend of Kellen's. But Battlecow is absolutely right that was not an accurate representation. Too funny

 

[Izuhu]

not impressed

maybe because that video is three years old >___>

If anything that is impressive, because if he still plays, imagine his skill now.

 

[The Star King]

You don't have to imagine because there are recent vids, lol

 

[Olikus]

not impressed

maybe because that video is three years old >___>

maybe because your an brainless potato.

 

[Frogles]

your an brainless...

must be a foreign joke i dont get.

 

[The Star King]

"foreign joke i dont get" pretty much sums up Olikus himself

 

[Izuhu]

Well fuark me for not caring to see if the video was actually recent or not.

 

[Yobolight]

I found this new guy called "Star King".

I can tell by watching this Youtube video that he kinda sucks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf1YcSEK58Y&feature=relmfu

 

[Olikus]

your an brainless...

must be a foreign joke i dont get.

you are foreign.

"foreign joke i dont get" pretty much sums up Olikus himself

too bad you dont understand what a potato is. go ask your uncle.

 

[Yobolight]

I am starting to think Samus is better against Ness than Link and Luigi.

 

[Yobolight]

I have gotten to the point with Yoshi where I never miss a parries anymore. After a lot of playing, I have decide that he probably better than Mario and equal with captain falcon.

 

[The Star King]

It is impossible to "never miss parries" unless you have 100% perfect reading which is akin to winning rock-paper-scissors 100% of the time, which is obviously unrealistic. And you'd be the best player in the world if you had that anyways. Or maybe your opponents are super braindead and never mix it up.

Though I agree with better than Mario. Don't agree with tied with Falcon.

 

[Yobolight]

It is impossible to "never miss parries" unless you have 100% perfect reading which is akin to winning rock-paper-scissors 100% of the time, which is obviously unrealistic. And you'd be the best player in the world if you had that anyways. Or maybe your opponents are super braindead and never mix it up.

Though I agree with better than Mario. Don't agree with tied with Falcon.

LOL, it is easy to never miss parries. All you have to do is tap z when a move is going to hit you, but that is probably not what you meant.

Let me break it down for you.
All characters have a certain amount of options within a specific situation of play

The overarching goal is to limit your opponent's options with spacing in order to limit uncertainty. You choose you opponent's options for them and parry them as they come.

The next thing to recognize is that a surprisingly high number of approach options are at least semi-telegraphed especially aerials. Your opponent's character's spacing says a lot about what they are going to do next.

The third and perhaps most important thing is frame counting. It helps a TON to find exactly how much a single frame is in real time and commit it to memory. The frame data chart becomes incredibly helpful here because you can count exactly when to parry every move.

It starts out hard, but quickly gets extremely easy. The best way to practice IMO is against CPU's because you are really forced to forget about you opponent's habits and just count frames.

 

[SheerMadness]

Haha Yobo...

He knows what parries are and how to parry. No need to explain it to him.

And he's right you can't parry everything. Not possible. No single person on this planet can accurately predict his opponent 100% of the time. Especially when you reach higher levels of play.

You really need to start playing online to get an accurate representation of what high level play is like. All of your views on competitive smash will quickly change.

 

[The Star King]

Sheer said it all. Are you gonna tell Sheer how to parry too? The guy who popularized parrying in the US in the first place?

Yobolight, ladies and gentlemen.

 

[Yobolight]

Sheer said it all. Are you gonna tell Sheer how to parry too? The guy who popularized parrying in the US in the first place?

Yobolight, ladies and gentlemen.

Thats me

 

[tacos]

rofl this guy

 

[Battlecow]

I mean he just said that he never misses parries. AFAIK that's perfectly possible. Parrying 100% of your opponent's moves would be impossible, but if you parry really conservatively/rarely and only when you know you have the read or whatever I can see you pretty much never missing.