The Never Ending List of Toon's AT's and Tricks / The Data Dump / Song of Brainstorms

[Sosuke]

Wow, that's kinda cool.

 

[demonictoonlink]

This is great and it should feel great. Make a replay and send it to me. I'll upload it. If you're lazy, I can do it myself, but I would just like to know.

 

[Legendary Pikachu]

Long time no visit... I see Fox and Sasuke and gang are doing quite nicely. Well done sir's and props Mcdingus.

@ McDingus: Oh... my lil bro Arc told me to tell ya that he highly appreciates your recent comment.

Thanks I'll update my bro.

I recently just found how to hack/semi-bypass youtube's low quality option. I can upload a fast-loading HQ vid of my brother performing it if you guys want. With music to boot. Credits will be given of course. :D

 

[demonictoonlink]

Yes, please ^
That would kick ***.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

@Legendary Pikachu: Good to hear from you again. So about the vid, sounds good man. You might want to put it off for a little bit though, as it's all still being tested and what not. So how about once I've added it, in other words, once it's all official and me and McDingus have come to a conclusion on how it's all going to be done/what's the best way to perform it, then I'll let you know. That is of course presuming that McDingus is cool with you making the video, I dunno, it's possible that he already had something planned. But pretty much, I'm just waiting to hear from McDingus again.
Thanks for the offer mate.

 

[Corpsecreate]

I just finished testing out this new tech with the Dsmash and oh man I love it. The easiest way I find to perform it is to start with a bomb in hand, short hop towards your opponent and without fast falling, as soon as you start moving downwards, drop the bomb behind you and instantly hit Dsmash as you land. I can do it pretty much every time. Dropping a bomb behind you like this is also useful for an unpunishable Usmash or Utilt since the bomb hits you almost immediatley after the hitbox for Usmash/Utilt come out. I also found from my testing that the most horizontal knockback from the Dsmash is gained when you hit with the very tip of the Dsmash hit.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

@Corpse: I quickly checked out the timing of the SH version (Invincibomb as soon as you start moving downwards) and it's pretty easy as well. Nice finds there Corpse! I've got to check out what you were talking about with the whole, hitting them with the tip of D-smash. Sounds too good to be true!

 

[Corpsecreate]

I just tested the tip thing once more. Turns out it makes no difference hehe. It only seems to make a difference when you do it on an enemy at low % where the 2nd part of the Dsmash also hits but maintains the horizontal momentum of the 1st hit (ie the old way)

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Oh ok. Doesn't matter. The rest of the info is great.


I'm begining to think, because there seem to be so many different variations of the one tech, that we might need to split this tech into more then one 'How to Perform:'. So we'll need to find the easiest way to execute it, the quickest way, the least situational way (In other words, if you were in the heat and pressure of a real battle, which way would you be able to hit your opponent with, without getting punnished, so the most realistic) and whatever. You know what I mean? Just a thought.

 

[Mota]

This is too good, still can't comprehend how this hasn't been mentioned before.

There'll be a lot of ways to perform this, as for the name, I have no idea yet lol.
-Feel free to brainstorm a name-

Those that wish to create a video go right ahead, I don't have the means to make a good quality vid, so best to leave it to those with teh skillz.

Agree with Corpse on the unpublishable part, taking 3% damage is better then getting grabbed or fsmahsed

After the bomb explodes, and you're sent into the air, you can nair/zair for spacing?

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

That's what I love most about having a thread like this. Not only can you check to see if it's been listed, but you can feel free to ask if it's known without having to make a new thread and risk being shot down.

As for a possible name. The first thing that came to me when you mentioned it was, The D-smash Bomb Gimp. And I was already seeing it fitting in next to the other D-smash Gimps and, as usual, I got ahead of myself.

I'll try to do more testing and find more ways to perform it tomorrow. Until then, keep testing and discussing this and hopefully by tomorrow I'll be able to officially write it up. (We'll see.)

 

[Corpsecreate]

First name that came to mind for me was Dsmash cancelling

 

[Mota]

How about:

1/2-Dsmash

0.5-Dsmash

Bomb Cancelled Dsmash ( BCD )

Dsmash Bomb Gimp sounds okay.

 

[Arc -The Fallen-]

How about:

1/2-Dsmash

0.5-Dsmash

Bomb Cancelled Dsmash ( BCD )

Dsmash Bomb Gimp sounds okay.

I second his opinion... lol..

Better yet... Dsmash Bomb Zip (DBZ (its over 9000!?)

 

[demonictoonlink]

Bomb canceled Dsmash is the best
Jerm

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Agreed. Bomb Canceled D-smash it is.

So is everything done then? Do I write it up? Unfortunatelly I don't have time right now, maybe later on tonight if not definitely tomorrw. We'll see.

So nothing more needs to be said? No more crasy ways to perform it? Speak now or forever hold......ok, sorry XD. You get it.

 

[Mota]

Nah mate, that's about it, can't find anything else to add on it.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Right, I've written it up. It's done.
So tell me what you think of it. Does anything need to be changed/added? As with all the techs in the list, if anything new is found out about it, I'll add it. So I guess I'm just saying, the more we find out about it, the more there will be to read about it. I mean, I still wanna test if there are any stages that it kills on (hopefully legal stages). I've got my hopes up for Jungle Japes. Does anyone know what stages have the closest horizontal blast zones?

Cool, I'm off to let Legendary Pikachu know that it's done.

 

[Mota]

Excellent description Fox.

I've tried it on the Smashville moving platform when it's at the extreme left and right part of the maps lol, it's a kill.

The bottom right part of Corneria & Japes sound pretty good.

Then there's the maps with walk-offs. Delfino, Castle siege, Rainbow ride, Mario Circuit and maybe more.

Have you tested slanted slopes? Possible more knockback and kill.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

So much to test! I'll add stages it kills on later in Stages: even though it works on all Stages. Like I'll go into more detail or something.

Slopes? I'm not sure. I would imagine that it would do the same as the slope variation of the normal D-smash Gimp. But who knows? I'll check it out as well. Heck, we'd be able to do it on the opposite side as well. What I mean is, with the D-smash Gimp using slopes, you need to stand further down the slope then your opponent facing the slope, well now we should be able to do it higher up the slope then our opponents and facing away from the slope. I have no idea what that would do......
I gotta get going.

 

[Mota]

Okay.

This is great and it should feel great. Make a replay and send it to me. I'll upload it. If you're lazy, I can do it myself, but I would just like to know.

I can upload a fast-loading HQ vid of my brother performing it if you guys want. With music to boot. Credits will be given of course. :D

DTL and Legendary Pika, if one or both of you could make a vid that would be much aprreciated

There hasn't been a -recap vid- recently.

 

[Legendary Pikachu]

I'll breeze through the findings and the post Fox entered in the Dsmash techs. Personal question for you McDingus... any song preference? Any song genre you DONT want to hear. I can pretty much flexible. How about real combat examples (me and my crew can make that happen).

 

[copacetic]

Alright I just started testing this out, but it might be a legit kill combo.
Ok so everyone basically knows about the zair to bomb throw to upsmash at low percentages. Well if you JC the bomb it hits the opponent at roughly the same time but you can throw it farther and you slide forward, and theres not much lag on it.

So I was facing a zelda and I manage to zair->JC bomb toss-> usmash when she was around 90% and it killed. It was on brinstar, so the weird heights of the floor mightve changed things, and the zair/bombs might have to be staled, but it could be an actual combo leading to a kill. I'll check it out more later

 

[Mota]

I'll breeze through the findings and the post Fox entered in the Dsmash techs. Personal question for you McDingus... any song preference? Any song genre you DONT want to hear. I can pretty much flexible. How about real combat examples (me and my crew can make that happen).

Awesome. Any music will do, anything easy to listen to, I listen to some techno and metal but that probably wouldn't work with the vid. Just chuck any music that fits well.

I've thought about how the vid would play out.

-First would be a very very brief tutorial on how it's done in the middle of FD (opponent on 40-50%)
-Then at the edge perform a normal Dsmash gimp and then the Bomb cancelled Gimp so we can compare the distances (both times opponent is at 0%). Then show a bomb cancelled dsmash on opponent at 45%, knock back is the same at any %

-At the edge, BCD a few characters and gimp them, Falco, Olimar, Snake and Link would be my choice for this.
-Some scenes where the BCD kills on walk-offs, Delfino, Castle Siege and on Smashville, when the platform is at the extreme right or left of the map.

-A couple examples of the opponent shielding or dodging the Dsmash and being hit by an instant Nair or Zair>Nair, since the bomb sends you in the air

-Maybe examples of an Olimar going for a grab or Falco Fsmash, a good opportunity to airdodge towards it and drop bomb>dsmash.

Well that's my quick run through, it's all optional, lol sounds like alot so remove or add stuff if necessary. Thank you

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

That sounds sweet. I can't wait to see/add the vid now.

I wonder how many characters cannot survive this if we simply grab the ledge when they try to recover and how many more cannot survive if we follow up with a Nair or something. There's got to be some characters that get owned by this like Link or Popo XD.

 

[Radori Nighthawk]

DTL and Legendary Pika, if one or both of you could make a vid that would be much aprreciated

There hasn't been a -recap vid- recently.

This. I REALLY need to see this.

 

[Legendary Pikachu]

That sounds sweet. I can't wait to see/add the vid now.

I wonder how many characters cannot survive this if we simply grab the ledge when they try to recover and how many more cannot survive if we follow up with a Nair or something. There's got to be some characters that get owned by this like Link or Popo XD.

Assuming the TL is GOOD and SEIZES THE DAY!

Then the chars that are doomed are:

1. Olimar
2. Link
3. Ike
4. Capt falcon (probably not cuz he's amazin'... lol)
5. Ganondorf
6. Bowser
7. DK (spike em')
8. Spacies (Wolf definitely; depends on their height choice of illusion (tether-hog, or rinse-repeat d-smash gimp if they illusion back on stage ~falco almost has frame advantage tho)
9. Possibly Zelda
10. Marth (still a toss-up of skill)
11. Icies (one will die... lol)
12. Lucario
13. Ivysaur and maybe squirtle
14. Mama's boy's (possible wavebounce lucas exception) snipe their lightnings with arrows
15. Mario maybe.

I might have missed someone... but here are the things from the stuff we sorta did so far and off the top of my head.

The vid will be coming *it's under way*.

 

[demonictoonlink]

Thanks for working on that vid. Should I do a recap? As McDingus said, there hasn't been one in awhile, although it is kinda HyRo's thing...

 

[Legendary Pikachu]

Whoa! SO MY BAD... sorry for double post.... plz forgive me! T_T

Thanks for working on that vid. Should I do a recap? As McDingus said, there hasn't been one in awhile, although it is kinda HyRo's thing...

I am assuming you mean a recap of all the AT's or techs? I don't really mind (I am technically a guest anyways). I still want to do this vid--I am used to doing individualized step by step tutorials for the the learning disabled... Lol (j/k about the disabled). Plus it gives me a chance to do my artworks and editing (i likies).

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Thanks for the list Legendary Pikachu! It all seems pretty accurate. It really got me thinking just how interesting the BCDG will make our matchup discussions from now on.

@DTL: It has been a while hasn't it. If you're keen on stepping into Hyro's shoes and making the re-caps from now on, you should definitely ask him first. Cause it is his thing, as you said. He might just say, he's too busy to make them anymore, so sure, knock yourself out. But you never know.

 

[Mota]

@LDPK: **** that's a good proportion of the cast, good stuff.

With match ups, the only problem is being consistent and BCD being second nature enough to land.

 

[Legendary Pikachu]

What do you guys think of doing it (bcdg) when they are about to land? If we assume that we can snipe a landing opponent, then the "doomed list" grows exponentially (they have no 2nd jump).... even for PIKACHU it'll be REAL challenging to get back on must skull bash and then QA, 1 full QA is almost not enough! Marth would be guarenteed dead and soforth.

 

[Radori Nighthawk]

So I was trying out the BCDS (Bomb cancelled down smash) I just can't seem to get that timing yet. X_X
Can't wait for the video. I <3 this board.

Marth would be guarenteed dead and soforth.

This is all I needed to read. Ok NOW I have to learn this...

We are movin' to the top guys. :3

 

[WindMajor]

I was thinking of doing a 2nd version of my bomb tutorial next weekend. I said I would do it for the summer but I never did... v_v

I was hoping to add all the stuff I didn't do, and make it more complete with frame/damage data and stuff, but all on video. If anyone wants to help, or at least do the same for lets say Boomerangs or Arrow techs, then that'll be cool too.

Also, for music, what I always do is use Smash music. Not everyone is going to be satisfied with techno, metal, or whatever. It's just better to put something that everyone is familiar with, like some Brawl soundtrack music. I'll post a link to it later.

Edit: Here's the link.

 

[demonictoonlink]

Meh, screw HyRo, I'll just make it. I'll put a few things in we haven't really mentioned also.

 

[Legendary Pikachu]

I got all the footage captured. Some pretty epic surprises in store. Now all i got to do is splice and organize the scenes, add music, and captions. The video should be up in *hacked quality* either tomorrow night or saturday morning.

The most amazin thing is, we made up a confirmed "OWNED" list:

1) Link (has no chance... can't even sweetspot 10% of the time... just BCDG and taunt... lol)
2) Mario (sorry Nintendo)
3) Ganondorf
4) FALCO
5) FOX
6) MARTH
7) ZERO SUIT SAMUS
8) OLIMAR ~ LOL's... but seriously hard to pull off against this guy... we find normal low damage d-smash gimp does a lot better in real combat cuz the pikmin detonate the bombs like 90% of the time (if they stick 2 you)
9) squirtle
10) Ivysaur
11) capt. falcon (almost can make it back on... need hacking software to truly confirm)
12) Ike
13) DK

On all of the above, BCDG is a ONE HIT KO (even @ 0%, yea... the set knockback)!!!!! The BCDG is done as far instage as the furthest arrow from the ledge of Final Destination! This is when the opponent still has a second jump!

Even if the opponent inputs INHUMAN amounts of DI, and uses their recovery to the best of its ability (including possible side-b's and stalling moves like mario's cape), if the Toon Link knows what a "hug" is, the opponent will get owned.

I repeat.... ONE HIT KO!!!

There are Null category where the opponent is unphased whatsoever (R.O.B., Dreamland, etc.) and there is the CHASE category, where the opponent can BARELY "land" (and i mean like a few pixels) on the stage from their best recovery option but can still be OWNED by chasing > spike or other aerial>edgehog before they make it to the stage.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Holy ****!!!! This is better then I thought! Like again, I already thought so much about it, but yet again, it has risen above my expectations. One Hit KO! That just sounds awesome.
Hype this vid! I can't wait, but lets make sure it's done right. Even if it means putting it off another day. This is gonna be huge.
(Marth and Falco, Both bad matchups, One Hit KO at any percent. Need I say more?)

@TWiNK: Sounds good man. I love how detailed your vids are, so I'm definitely looking forward to seeing another one of them.

What do you guys think of doing it (bcdg) when they are about to land? If we assume that we can snipe a landing opponent, then the "doomed list" grows exponentially (they have no 2nd jump).... even for PIKACHU it'll be REAL challenging to get back on must skull bash and then QA, 1 full QA is almost not enough! Marth would be guarenteed dead and soforth.

I would imagine that this would be insanely hard to land, what with all the timing and so on. But I think that this could potentially kill everyone. So this is definitely some info that I'll be adding. (I was planning to do an update of the info when your vid came out.) But yeah, that's an interesting thought. Thanks man.

 

[Mota]

4) FALCO
5) FOX
6) MARTH
7) ZERO SUIT SAMUS
8) OLIMAR ~ LOL's... but seriously hard to pull off against this guy... we find normal low damage d-smash gimp does a lot better in real combat cuz the pikmin detonate the bombs like 90% of the time (if they stick 2 you)
ONE HIT KO!!!

Omgmgoogmogomogomo!!1 HYPE!

Ideas for hyping? lol.

I already thought so much about it, but yet again, it has risen above my expectations.

F*** same here, when I first saw BCD, I didn't really rate it that high.

This is just too good, great work from everyone.
LDPK you sexy mofo! I could kiss you. No homo.

 

[Legendary Pikachu]

1 more legit hype....

If done sorta level on a water stage (Delfino, Pirate ship (banked)) the Bomb-Cancelled Dsmash Gimp is a
ONE HIT KO on ALL CAST except Bowser!

Since in water, DI is lagged and you skid a LOT farther. CAN'T MOMENTUM CANCEL IN WATER... LOL. It's really like skipping rocks on a lake... and Toon Link does it the best with living PEOPLE! O_O!!!!!

 

[NeverKnowsBest]

I seriously don't like what I'm reading.

=3