Legend of Zelda The Milk Bar [Archived]

[PhillipthaGoober]

It does make a very amusing Halo Hack though, Watch this Video on YouTube.


I have that hack. Its fun.

 

[Spire]

On the topic of a futuristic Zelda. Firstly, you would have to take into account how much larger the world would actually have to be designed (which is relative to both the land AND its denizens, meaning much more expansive, diverse, and "evolved" species). Hyrule would definitely have to be perhaps... four, five, maybe even six times as large as it is in TP in order to give it that futuristic, expansive feel. Civilization grows outwards, so Hyrule Castle/Town would be much, much larger.

To note: the future would be very different for the two parallel timelines - those which are currently represented by TP and WW/PH. TP's timeline would most likely be the candidate for a futuristic Zelda, as Hyrule still remains intact in its time, and would of course be the surefire world for a futuristic rendition.

If TP is based about 100 years after OoT, we can obviously see the technological growth between the two games, which mainly introduces that in that century, ironworks have been used a lot, as seen in the Goron Mines/Death Mountain, Lakebed Temple, Lake Hylia, Hyrule Castle/Town, and many other places. Now, in order to get to a futuristic level, we're talking perhaps 300 - 500 years from our modern time, so in Hyrule, perhaps 800, or even a 1000 years into the future.

Link would definitely NOT be a senior citizen as previously stated, this game would be based centuries after any known Zelda, with a new Link, a new Zelda, and the returning Ganon. You see, the Goddesses create a new Link and a Zelda whenever Ganon returns from its banishment to terrorize Hyrule, Ganondorf being of course, Ganon's "human" form, or its most relative and "fitting" form for the world that it must associate with. Ganon is Hyrule's darkest spirit - its 'devil' if you will, and in order for it to effect Hyrule, it must somehow take the form of a denizen relative to that world, and as seen in OoT and TP, a Gerudo male - a very, very important person to a tribe of thieves bent on power and supremacy; entirely ideal for the dark lord to rise from, eh?

That being said about Ganon, its human form "Ganondorf" was killed at the end of TP, not banished like seen in OoT, but actually killed. So, if this game is based a good handful of centuries later, then Ganon may not return in human form, as the Gerudo were obviously missing as a tact race from TP, rather inbreeding with the other denizens of Hyrule, blending their cultures together. The Gerudo's purpose were to bring Ganon into the world, and once doing so, they no longer served a purpose, so they assimilated in with the rest of Hyrule (as they felt oppressed in OoT, having to live in the desert). So, what form might Ganon take in a future Zelda? Well, it would obviously take a human form so that it could fit in easily with the world, but the tribe of its origins remains a complete enigma. Could the Zora perhaps hold hatred towards the rest of Hyrule due to a misunderstood dethronement of their current King, only to have Ganon's Zora form rise as their new leader, leading an attack on the rest of Hyrule? Who knows...

It's also important to take into account that if this game is based in the future, that Hyrule would not be closed off, and would most likely have communications with countries around the globe. That being said, this could potentially open up the world of Zelda tenfold, introducing many, many new lands, peoples, and innovation to the series. Also, that being said, Ganon could easily rise in the form of any other race, species, or perhaps... even as a machine.

Anyways, I know this game may be a little too much to grasp, but as far as friendly idea development goes, I'm game to continue conversation.

 

[Chief Mendez]

See, maybe that sort of thinking excites certain people, but to me, the Zelda setting, characters, and plot have always been simple vehicles for the real meat of any Zelda experience, which is the gameplay. Zelda doesn't need to focus on plot, characters, and setting going forward so much as it needs to inject it's game formula with some new ideas.

You've gotta' remember: the whole franchise was born from Miyamoto trying to communicate his childhood memories of exploring caves to a generation of young kids, not of him trying to tell this legendary tale of Hyrule and It's Peoples.

What Spire III describes above sounds much more like Mass Effect than Zelda to me, which doesn't have to be a bad thing: Mass Effect is an awesome game. But I don't think it suits Zelda. Maybe the Zelda universe, but not the Zelda games. If Nintendo wanted to make a game like that (which is another matter entirely: Nintendo really has never made a long, convoluted RPG, or even a large, convoluted virtual world like Spire III's, and I don't see them doing so anytime soon), I'd really appreciate them leaving the 'Zelda' moniker out of the affair.

My ideal Zelda plot leave most of the experience to the imagination. This is why Link is mute. Ocarina of Time is such a great game for alot of reasons, but one of the bigger, less-acknowledged ones is that everybody experiences it according to their own personality.

I know a number of people play it and see Link getting into all these romantic relationships with (almost) all the female characters he meets in the game (I, personally, think he's always going to be with Saria).

Some players go through it imagining Link as this demon-slaying beast--a man's man who never let his feelings get the better of him.

And my little brother plays the game just to fish and play with the frogs in Zora River.

Now, look at a more recent game, like Twilight Princess. Is there really any doubt about how Link feels about his experiences throughout the course of the game? He's got a soft-spot for Ilia, he feels protective of Colin, and he's got something going on with Midna. All the characters he meets, he feels a certain way about.

And I don't like it. I didn't like Ilia--at all. I thought Colin was a nancy-boy who should act more like Talo. And I thought Midna was a cocky little munchkin who somehow got all dignified and weird at the end of the game.

Yet Nintendo took that away from me. I had the same issue with Windwaker to an extent, but the pain was eased somewhat because that game was the only other Zelda game to really make me feel like I was playing a true sequel to the original game (what with the whole open world where you could go anywhere and stuff).

There' a very, very fine line that Nintendo should walk when they make these games concerning the fourth wall. The key is that Link the Character shouldn't be making friends and getting involved with people, rather, You the Player, navigating Hyrule in the guise of Link the Character, should be the one calling the shots, fighting the battles, discovering the secrets, and saving the day.

So for one thing: keep Link mute.

Two thing: having Link emote is fine, just not during plot conversations. If a giant, fire-breathing dragon burst forth from the bowels of the earth to confront him, he should be shocked and awed, yes. But if a Goron's talking to him about how he wants Link to go into this abandoned cave and kill some fire-breathing dragon, he shouldn't be confidently nodding at the end and striding right into said cave during the same cutscene.

Three thing: Give the player alot more stuff to do without the aid of cutscenes and plot points. In other words, sidequests. Let me climb the vast mountain range of Hyrule, searching every nook and cranny, crevice and canyon for long-forgotten treasures and strange finds. Let me save up my rupees and buy a boat, to sail the endless oceans in search of adventure (even if said adventure boils down to nothing more than "defeat these monsters to get some rupees or items"), and even, if I so choose, find the Master Sword, defeat Ganon, and save Zelda.

ARE YOU TIRED OF READING YET? GOOD, THAT'S WHAT I WANTED TO HEAR!

And another thing--give us items we'll use more than once during the freakin' game. Sure, the Spinner was a neat item, but outside of the Arbiter' Grounds, it was only useful for getting to like, two or three chests, and then once more to climb a staircase in Ganon' s Castle.

Also, the player needs better rewards for searching every nook and cranny of Hyrule. I got quite tired after a while in the last two console Zeldas of slogging my way through some monster-infested cave I bombed open just to be rewarded with--GASP!--50 rupees. It wasn't so bad in WW, since there were always those huge Tingle Debts looming over you (not to mention your 5,000 rupee wallet), but TP really angered me sometimes by not letting me even take the sh*t I worked so hard to get with me: "You found 5 rupees! Sweet! But--oh, wait, you can't possibly fit the thing in your wallet, so let's just put it back where we found it."

An easy solution is to reward players with magic meter upgrades, which you could even split into four, a la Heart Pieces. And why not tool upgrades (Hookshot >>> Longshot)? Bring back the useless-collection quest (Golden Skulltulas). Make a trading quest as good as Windwaker's and as rewarding as Ocarina's.

A fresh innovation that would gel with the "everyone experiences it differently thing" would be to (if Nintendo's bold enough) adopt a Fable/San Andreas-esque character building structure. So if all the player does as Link is ride Epona everywhere, eventually (and invisibly--no numerical stat-building here) their horsemanship will improve, and Epona will move faster and handle tighter. If all you do is swing your sword (i.e. fight monsters) all day, in time your attacks will start to do more damage, and Link's arm muscles will ever-so slightly grow.

And bring back Tingle.

/rant

 

[urdailywater]

I enjoyed WindWaker/TP more tbh.

Don't get me wrong, they're all great games. I am planning on buying OOT on my Wii in fact, it just didn't touch the story like it should have.

I have no bad comments on OOT though. I'm glad they made a second version in fact because the first one was too easy. (even though Windwaker was easier).

Great games. Nintendo didn't ruin this franchise badly like they did Pokemon.

EDIT:

I actually loved the water temple. I actually thought the Forest Temple was a bit harder. Why does everybody hate on the Water Temple?! Because they're waterphobic or something?!

To tell you the truth the only reason I couldn't stand the water temple was because of bad memories in Banjo Kazooie / Super Mario 64.

Brr..

 

[Spire]

See, maybe that sort of thinking excites certain people, but to me, the Zelda setting, characters, and plot have always been simple vehicles for the real meat of any Zelda experience, which is the gameplay. Zelda doesn't need to focus on plot, characters, and setting going forward so much as it needs to inject it's game formula with some new ideas.

You've gotta' remember: the whole franchise was born from Miyamoto trying to communicate his childhood memories of exploring caves to a generation of young kids, not of him trying to tell this legendary tale of Hyrule and It's Peoples.

Well yes, this was the basic concept for the first Zelda, and of course remains throughout the series, but it also tells a tale, enveloping good, evil, and everything between and outside of that conflicting realm, but most importantly - the connections between everyone and everything. The conceptuality behind "the parallel" is a very, very striking element to the series, contrasting Hyrule with Termina, Ganon with Majora, Zelda with Midna, TP with WW, and many, many other instances. Connectivity and objectivity between all in the world of Zelda play extreme roles in the continuity of the series, and its overall interest.

What Spire III describes above sounds much more like Mass Effect than Zelda to me, which doesn't have to be a bad thing: Mass Effect is an awesome game. But I don't think it suits Zelda. Maybe the Zelda universe, but not the Zelda games. If Nintendo wanted to make a game like that (which is another matter entirely: Nintendo really has never made a long, convoluted RPG, or even a large, convoluted virtual world like Spire III's, and I don't see them doing so anytime soon), I'd really appreciate them leaving the 'Zelda' moniker out of the affair.

Hey, I take no offense. I was merely stating what I would see an ideal "future" Zelda game as, regardless of whether or not I would want to ever see it.

My ideal Zelda plot leave most of the experience to the imagination. This is why Link is mute. Ocarina of Time is such a great game for alot of reasons, but one of the bigger, less-acknowledged ones is that everybody experiences it according to their own personality.

I know a number of people play it and see Link getting into all these romantic relationships with (almost) all the female characters he meets in the game (I, personally, think he's always going to be with Saria).

Some players go through it imagining Link as this demon-slaying beast--a man's man who never let his feelings get the better of him.

And my little brother plays the game just to fish and play with the frogs in Zora River.

Precisely. The reason why so many hale Ocarina of Time as their favorite game is because it left so much to the imagination, and is why countless fan-art, fan-music, fan-fiction, and fan-love all come in response to that game, because it was, and still is our game. They gave you the world of Hyrule in its first ever 3D rendition, and let you play it how you wanted to, regardless of its mostly linear story.

Now, look at a more recent game, like Twilight Princess. Is there really any doubt about how Link feels about his experiences throughout the course of the game? He's got a soft-spot for Ilia, he feels protective of Colin, and he's got something going on with Midna. All the characters he meets, he feels a certain way about.

And I don't like it. I didn't like Ilia--at all. I thought Colin was a nancy-boy who should act more like Talo. And I thought Midna was a cocky little munchkin who somehow got all dignified and weird at the end of the game.

There' a very, very fine line that Nintendo should walk when they make these games concerning the fourth wall. The key is that Link the Character shouldn't be making friends and getting involved with people, rather, You the Player, navigating Hyrule in the guise of Link the Character, should be the one calling the shots, fighting the battles, discovering the secrets, and saving the day.

So for one thing: keep Link mute.

I honestly feel so much closer with the heavyset, mustached carpenters running amok in Kakariko in OoT than I do with 99% of the characters from Twilight Princess. And the reason? Because Link did not show his emotions in OoT; because WE were Link and WE chose who we cared for. In TP, we're more so just a helping hand to the already written character "Link" who has his own feelings. It's quite contradicting when Link is mute, but shows emotion towards specific others. It invites you to embrace Link and become him, but it keeps you in the doorway, only able to view the inside of the house rather than actually step in and do with it what you want.

Three thing: Give the player alot more stuff to do without the aid of cutscenes and plot points. In other words, sidequests. Let me climb the vast mountain range of Hyrule, searching every nook and cranny, crevice and canyon for long-forgotten treasures and strange finds. Let me save up my rupees and buy a boat, to sail the endless oceans in search of adventure (even if said adventure boils down to nothing more than "defeat these monsters to get some rupees or items"), and even, if I so choose, find the Master Sword, defeat Ganon, and save Zelda.

And another thing--give us items we'll use more than once during the freakin' game. Sure, the Spinner was a neat item, but outside of the Arbiter' Grounds, it was only useful for getting to like, two or three chests, and then once more to climb a staircase in Ganon' s Castle.

Also, the player needs better rewards for searching every nook and cranny of Hyrule. I got quite tired after a while in the last two console Zeldas of slogging my way through some monster-infested cave I bombed open just to be rewarded with--GASP!--50 rupees. It wasn't so bad in WW, since there were always those huge Tingle Debts looming over you (not to mention your 5,000 rupee wallet), but TP really angered me sometimes by not letting me even take the sh*t I worked so hard to get with me: "You found 5 rupees! Sweet! But--oh, wait, you can't possibly fit the thing in your wallet, so let's just put it back where we found it."

Completely agree with everything above. I have stated my opinions before about what you have said, and I feel that it is a very necessary addition to the series. Zelda has always teased me with adding land that I would die to explore, but am not allowed to. In TP, if you stand atop the perched tower on the tallest cliff, you can see canyons and mesas for miles, but not only are we given none of that to explore, but the Death Mountain trail is void of interest entirely. I wanted to explore so much more of the Snowpeak and Desert Provinces, but I was very, very limited, and that bothered me.

Just something to add - we need bigger, tougher enemies in the field. Seriously, the Gerudo Desert and the Snowpeak Mountains are probably the most hostile environments, but all we get to fight are Ice Keese, White Wolfos (which in TP are simply white wolves, not werewolf-like monsters as seen in OoT) and Moldorms and Leevers in the desert. Really bland and non challenging.

And bring back Tingle.

Remember Purlo from the STAR game in Hyrule Castle Town in TP? He's basically Tingle entirely - witty, "poetic", and really wants to rob you of your rupees, and to refresh you of his appearance, wears similar green clothing with a pointed hood, and carries a blue clock. Tingle in a nutshell.

 

[SkylerOcon]

How about we bring back Purlo for the STAR game and Tingle for... multiplayer help? Like in Wind Waker, you could connect your game boy to the Gamecube and the other person could get Tingle to help. Why not do this with the DS so that you could actually have Tingle there in a full 3D environment, just controlled by the DS. I think that would be cool.

Anyway, a Future Zelda could introduce a lot of interesting things to the storyline. Midna is about to die (maybe Twilight People live really long?) and Zelda is the daughter of a corrupt politician that helps Ganon. It could do so much to the series.

Oh yeah, and why don't we have options so that you could have Link effect the dialouge. Like, when prompted for something you can say 'yes' or 'no'. That way, we keep our own reaction to the game, but we have more input with it.

 

[JJR.O.B.]

The final boss of TP was tooo easy. I went into the final battle with 5 hearts left (i was to lazy to go and heal myself) and came out of the battle with full health. I pwnd Ganon.

 

[derek.haines]

How about we bring back Purlo for the STAR game and Tingle for... multiplayer help? Like in Wind Waker, you could connect your game boy to the Gamecube and the other person could get Tingle to help. Why not do this with the DS so that you could actually have Tingle there in a full 3D environment, just controlled by the DS. I think that would be cool.

Anyway, a Future Zelda could introduce a lot of interesting things to the storyline. Midna is about to die (maybe Twilight People live really long?) and Zelda is the daughter of a corrupt politician that helps Ganon. It could do so much to the series.

Oh yeah, and why don't we have options so that you could have Link effect the dialouge. Like, when prompted for something you can say 'yes' or 'no'. That way, we keep our own reaction to the game, but we have more input with it.

Lordy, it does sound promising, but imagine trying to sell that game to already jaded Zelda aficionados. Trying to get people acclimated to the mere fact that it was cel-shaded in WW was a big enough pain.

Still, if it was done right... Awesome sauce.

 

[Spire]

Lordy, it does sound promising, but imagine trying to sell that game to already jaded Zelda aficionados. Trying to get people acclimated to the mere fact that it was cel-shaded in WW was a big enough pain.

Still, if it was done right... Awesome sauce.

Yeah, I'm with you on this one. However, I am (and I'm guessing this applies to you guys also) a diehard Zelda fan, and I feel that the futuristic shift would be extremely beneficial, if not somewhat "necessary" for epic storyline expansion. Placing a Zelda game far in the future would open a HUGE space for other Zelda titles to be implemented, a good 1000-year gap between TP and ZF (Zelda Future).

Plus, who's to say that Link would use a gun? I see him using a kickass, revamped Master Sword, an automatic-mechanical bow with an array of arrows, an assortment of bombs, and just about a futuristic revamp of all of his classic items, along with many new items.

Oh, just a side note, which applies merely to "the next Zelda", futuristic or not. Rupees need to be worthwhile in collecting - as in, you should be able to buy from a stock of many, many optional items, equipment, perhaps even a house, vehicle, etc, etc. I hate that rupees feel so extraneous in the Zelda games. It's like you just collect them to get past certain obstacles in the game, and they really, really don't feel like currency. I want a total upgrade to the rupee system in the next Zelda. Perhaps you want to buy armored pauldrons, gauntlets, or a helm to add to your classic green garbs? Perhaps you want to buy new parts to customize your bow? Perhaps you want to buy a longer rope for your grapple hook so that you can scale buildings? WE NEED MORE STUFF!

 

[derek.haines]

Plus, who's to say that Link would use a gun? I see him using a kickass, revamped Master Sword, an automatic-mechanical bow with an array of arrows, an assortment of bombs, and just about a futuristic revamp of all of his classic items, along with many new items.

Oooh... I like the idea of a totally revamped, but ultimately similar item line-up. The sword could be more of a lightsaber sort of thing, and his shield could be a laser-based one generated spontaneously whenever needed. The hookshot would make the transition from being a mechanical chain-based device, to being a Batman-esque device that could implant itself into most surfaces for Link to climb or swing. He could have a multi-functional upgradeable gun-thingy, which shot different types of bombs in addition to arrows.

He could have anti-gravity boots too. And much more cool stuff.

 

[Darkslash]

If it Is in the Future some things that have been known to the Series has to go


The Green Tunic: The classic tunic will most likely go. Laser will burn it. Plasma blades will cut though it. It has to be something extraordinary. Technology fused with the blessing and Magic of the Gods. Maybe this new Magic Armor can be fused with Upgrades. Instead of having 3 sets of Armor why not 1 that changes in a Menu.

Starter Sword: Of course if its in the future it won't be a Sword of metal. It would be a VibroSword, Plasma edge sword, or a Sword with a Beam Cutter. What sword exactly would be the main thing.

Master Sword: The old Master Sword we have known is probably has to leave or be Upgraded. It won't likely cut the armor of militants and won't slice Biomechanical(sp?) Monsters of darkness( If they are going to do that). Once again fuse Technology with Magic and the God's blessings.

Magic: Magic is now long forgotten because its in the Future. So maybe Link,Zelda and Ganondorf are the only ones to wield the long forgotten art.

Maybe im blabbing my head off. But i think in the future these things have to go.

 

[SuperRacoon]

Yeah that has always somewhat annoyed me about the franchise, you have so much money but nothing spend it on, besides spare arrows and bombs, (which are usually easy to just find), potions (which you often don't need, because the AI of LoZ has always been pathetic at best) and maybe an item here and there that you only have to buy once.

The rupees had the most value in the first LoZ followed closely by the rupees in LttP, because they actually got used, Zelda II didn't even have rupees, all the rest, almost don't need rupees. So yeah, collecting rupees is a waste of time, it'd be nice to see that changed.

 

[Grunt]

Really? ... Well I played through it without it. It's a shame that bosses aren't harder though.. xD

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=W8WrsKr7r-4

 

[Spire]

If it Is in the Future some things that have been known to the Series has to go


The Green Tunic: The classic tunic will most likely go. Laser will burn it. Plasma blades will cut though it. It has to be something extraordinary. Technology fused with the blessing and Magic of the Gods. Maybe this new Magic Armor can be fused with Upgrades. Instead of having 3 sets of Armor why not 1 that changes in a Menu.

Starter Sword: Of course if its in the future it won't be a Sword of metal. It would be a VibroSword, Plasma edge sword, or a Sword with a Beam Cutter. What sword exactly would be the main thing.

Master Sword: The old Master Sword we have known is probably has to leave or be Upgraded. It won't likely cut the armor of militants and won't slice Biomechanical(sp?) Monsters of darkness( If they are going to do that). Once again fuse Technology with Magic and the God's blessings.

Well, his green tunic certainly comes in contact with fire, lava, crap like that in the Zelda games, but remains intact. Perhaps however, he could have body armor with some fabric to give it the tunic feel, along with similar coloring.

As for his sword, look at Final Fantasy 7 and 8. They're in futuristic settings, but still use swords. Of course, it would have to look futuristic - and please, drop the purple hilt, because it never matched well.

 

[Darkslash]

My original idea was that Its the Future where there is no Triforce( in the first parts of the game), No Magic and no god blessings. At first Link will have the same things like other warriors but half way though the game he will find out of the Triforce, the Gods, Magic and Ganondorfs plan.

 

[XACE-K]

My original idea was that Its the Future where there is no Triforce( in the first parts of the game), No Magic and no god blessings. At first Link will have the same things like other warriors but half way though the game he will find out of the Triforce, the Gods, Magic and Ganondorfs plan.

Than WTF would be the point of going to futuristic temples? He would visit them just for the heck of it? Or would it be some test to see if he's a good warrior?

 

[klapaucius]

How about a sequel to TP where a way to the Twilight has been discovered, and a war is about to break out between the two sides?
Each faction has its own Chosen One they believe is destined to be the next Hero: Midna's young son fighting for the Twilight, a teenage Colin fighting for Hyrule, and a third for the mysterious secret society which watches from the sidelines. Each one would have a different play style (sword-focused, balanced, and magic-focused, respectively) and they would encounter each other several times.

 

[SuperRacoon]

Well, I have mixed feelings about a futuristic Zelda, on the one hand, as derek.haines has mentioned, a futuristic Zelda opens up a wide variety of options for cool gadgets and items and such, at the same time though, you have to give up a lot of the tried and tested familiar things that end up just so out of place, (can you imagine using a boomerang in a futuristic setting? looks kinda silly, but there are ways to replace that though.) Someone mentioned a few posts back final fantasy and it's successful leap into a futuristic setting, and it worked out really well, why can't it work for LoZ?

It has also been mentioned that Metroid already occupies the spot of Nintendo's futuristic franchise, really though, a futuristic Zelda would not be like Metroid, largely because of the element of magic throughout LoZ. If I could parallel this to Blizzard's StarCraft and WarCraft, the Universes are completely different between the two, and as such how time lines are approached must also be completely different. Suppose we were to set StarCraft in the past. It's looking and feel would ultimately reflect the real world Renaissance era, whereas if WarCraft were to be placed in the future, it would be more like the fantasy universe of Star Wars.

So anyway, that's just my thoughts on a Zelda set in the future, it probably only created confusion, Spire III, i sent you another PM

 

[Spire]

How about a sequel to TP where a way to the Twilight has been discovered, and a war is about to break out between the two sides?
Each faction has its own Chosen One they believe is destined to be the next Hero: Midna's young son fighting for the Twilight, a teenage Colin fighting for Hyrule, and a third for the mysterious secret society which watches from the sidelines. Each one would have a different play style (sword-focused, balanced, and magic-focused, respectively) and they would encounter each other several times.

This doesn't make any sense, as it breaks the storyline completely. The Twilight Realm is at last at peace under Midna's reign, and so is Hyrule, as Ganon has been defeated.

 

[SkylerOcon]

I missed a lot.

But, I think that if Zelda Future ever came to be, we should be done with the Bow and Arrows in that game altogether. Replace it with a gun.

On the topic of the Master Sword, that HAS TO STAY. Same sword, same mismatched purple hilt (sorry, Spire), but maybe the Gods came down and messed with it. New steel, maybe even a lightsaber. But I still prefer a steel rendition.

Link's tunic has to stay as well. The hero's garb is just... sacred ground for Zelda, just like the original 12 are for Smash. As somebody else said, it's survived fire, water damage, and plenty of other stuff. Also, note the chainmail under Link's tunic.

Item upgrades are a logical step. Not for the Master Sword, but for guns and other items. Link also needs to buy items. This has already been talked about, so I'll just make a list of items that I think would work:

- Armor upgrades
- Ammo magazines
- Different guns
- Scopes
- Silencers
- Maybe some future technology? Like bombs you can place on the ground and then control them and blow them up?
- Buying your new boots instead of finding them

Also, vehicles might work but what about Epona? I think Epona was just introduced in OoT and has only appeared in three games, so I'm not sure if she really holds any significance to the series. But still, in the future vehicles will undoubtedly replace the horse. So um... yeah. Sorry, Epona fans.

Also, with the WiiMotion plus, maybe they could find a way to integrate this into the nunchuck to. I'm talking about this because the ability for Link to fight enemies with guns with just his sword wouldn't work. Maybe that 1:1 could give us some pretty nice shield control. You could shield yourself from the bullets and charge up to attack with the sword.

 

[derek.haines]

I missed a lot.

But, I think that if Zelda Future ever came to be, we should be done with the Bow and Arrows in that game altogether. Replace it with a gun.

On the topic of the Master Sword, that HAS TO STAY. Same sword, same mismatched purple hilt (sorry, Spire), but maybe the Gods came down and messed with it. New steel, maybe even a lightsaber. But I still prefer a steel rendition.

Link's tunic has to stay as well. The hero's garb is just... sacred ground for Zelda, just like the original 12 are for Smash. As somebody else said, it's survived fire, water damage, and plenty of other stuff. Also, note the chainmail under Link's tunic.

Item upgrades are a logical step. Not for the Master Sword, but for guns and other items. Link also needs to buy items. This has already been talked about, so I'll just make a list of items that I think would work:

- Armor upgrades
- Ammo magazines
- Different guns
- Scopes
- Silencers
- Maybe some future technology? Like bombs you can place on the ground and then control them and blow them up?
- Buying your new boots instead of finding them

Also, vehicles might work but what about Epona? I think Epona was just introduced in OoT and has only appeared in three games, so I'm not sure if she really holds any significance to the series. But still, in the future vehicles will undoubtedly replace the horse. So um... yeah. Sorry, Epona fans.

Also, with the WiiMotion plus, maybe they could find a way to integrate this into the nunchuck to. I'm talking about this because the ability for Link to fight enemies with guns with just his sword wouldn't work. Maybe that 1:1 could give us some pretty nice shield control. You could shield yourself from the bullets and charge up to attack with the sword.

Epona would become E-PoNA (Electronic Police Navigational Aparatus, i.e., a stolen police motorcycle that OWNS). And who needs shields if Link get's some duck-and-cover gameplay similar to Gears of War? Or, he could make use of his environment as his shield, grabbing chairs, manhole covers, or enemies as necessary.

I like the bombs idea. Something similar to those mouse-bomb thingies from various games... Except you could laser-guide their positions using the IR pointer. Awesome.

 

[SkylerOcon]

I want to keep the Sword and Shield. Still though, the ability to grab an enemy and use him as a shield would be great.

An E-PoNA would be good, but um... Link's a good guy? Stealing from cops is a no-no. So something else needs to take place of the Police.

Oh, and the boomerang needs to be replaced with some type of gun that works like one. But, just not a boomerang.

 

[derek.haines]

I want to keep the Sword and Shield. Still though, the ability to grab an enemy and use him as a shield would be great.

An E-PoNA would be good, but um... Link's a good guy? Stealing from cops is a no-no. So something else needs to take place of the Police.

Oh, and the boomerang needs to be replaced with some type of gun that works like one. But, just not a boomerang.

I dunno, in a more modern or futuristic setting someone like Link, operating outside of the established rules and laws of society and of his own volition, would be regarded as an outlaw. Stepping on a few toes and breaking a few rules in the name of the greater good has never been outside of Link's moral compass. In a fantasy setting, there is little or no law and he would be able to function as he needed to accomplish his goals. Modern and futuristic settings would have Link working apart from, but along side (or perhaps in opposition to) the established peacekeepers of the world, and would likely have him breaking more than a few laws along the way.

Instead of the boomerang, maybe a gravity gun? That could be shweet. It has been done though...

 

[SkylerOcon]

Gravity gun? I can already hear the Half-Life fanboys complaining.

Regardless, we still need something to take place of a boomerang. The gravity gun would come close, but it wouldn't be the same.

 

[Chief Mendez]

Remember Purlo from the STAR game in Hyrule Castle Town in TP? He's basically Tingle entirely - witty, "poetic", and really wants to rob you of your rupees, and to refresh you of his appearance, wears similar green clothing with a pointed hood, and carries a blue clock. Tingle in a nutshell.

Only he was mean and weasely about it. Tingle outright wanted your money because he's a greedy...

Y'know, I think I'll save my energies for later in this post. TINGLE >>>>> PURLO

Why not do this with the DS so that you could actually have Tingle there in a full 3D environment, just controlled by the DS. I think that would be cool.

This would be awesome! Link runs around as usual on his quest, and Tingle tags along. Unlike the Tingle Tuner in WW, the Link player could actually see and interact with Tingle in the game. Both players would see the same thing, but because the screens aren't shared, there would be no camera issues. Of course, the DS graphics wouldn't be as pretty, but whatever.

And in each dungeon, there'd be an optional door that can only be opened by Tingle. Inside is a mini-dungeon that rewards the player with a Tingle-specific item (like the Tingle statues in Windwaker, only useful and non-sticky this time).

Oh yeah, and why don't we have options so that you could have Link effect the dialouge. Like, when prompted for something you can say 'yes' or 'no'. That way, we keep our own reaction to the game, but we have more input with it.

Link, won't you help me defeat Ganon?

No.

What? Please, I really need your help.

No.

What? Please, I really need your help.

No.

What? Please, I really need your help.

No.

What? Please, I really need your help.

No.

What? Please, I really need your help.

(God, alright...fine) Yes.

Oh I just knew you'd say yes! Thank you so much!

-------------------

Sound familiar? This time-tested mechanic is a staple in most every story-based game that's ever been made, and remains today as a great evil of videogame writing. There are a few games out there that buck the trend (most BioWare games, actually), but in those instances, there's a lot of extra work that goes into the storyline, because if the game lets the player say "No, I won't help you defeat Ganon.", then what? Does the game end? Does Ganon win and rule Hyrule for all eternity? What does Link go and do then? Game writing is generally a way more complicated affair than movie, television, or novel writing, which is compounded by the fact that most game writers aren't even up to par with most B-movies.

Really, what was the last videogame you played that had no plot holes or unexplainable quirks? The simple addition of a free-minded factor (i.e. the player, YOU), makes telling concrete stories almost entirely impossible, because for every player who's totally absorbed in the world the developer has made and who will more or less go along quietly with the plot, there are three people who will dispute every turn the plot takes and try their darndest to go against the grain.

Now, I know it's impossible to please everyone all of the time, but let me once again bring up Shadow of the Colossus. The game has a total of 6 characters, not including the Colossi, spirits, and wildlife. One of these characters is in a coma for 99% of the game, one is a horse, and two of them don't have any speaking parts. Aside from the main character calling his horse, he never speaks either. The only person who does speak in the game is an unnamed religious official who appears shortly twice in the game.

And yet the game is around ten hours long, and is the most beautiful piece of art the videogame industry has produced in years. It's plot is deeper than 99.9% of other games, simply because it takes the free-minded factor of The Player and uses it to it's fullest extent. There are no characters telling you where to go or what to do, no flashing arrows directing your movements...just one short cutscene at the beginning and a few lines of text that give you a general idea of What's Going On Here, and how to use your sword.

I exxagerate only a little when I say that the next Zelda needs to be almost exactly like SotC. The landscape shouldn't be completely barren, there should be talking NPCs, and there should be the typical Zelda tropes of dungeons, bosses, chests, and items.

But the plot should be simple. Link should have an overarching goal from the beginning ("Ganon has returned, you must stop him"), and then the whole world should be open to him. It's up to the player to determine where to go next and what to do next. The game should never tell you "Oh, you got the Stone of Water, now you need to go to Death Mountain, cuz' the Gorons have the Stone of Earth." Through the game, hints should be dropped instead (Random NPC conversation: "Yup, I hired a troop of Gorons to help me plow my fields this year--that's why they're so perfect, those Gorons sure know how to work the soil.")...

...Wow. I've gotten a bit off-track, eh?

Well, I'll end with an example of why Nintendo won't do this (they can't): in TP, when Link finds Ilia again, and she's lost her memory, Telma asks Link if he knows her. There's no option to say yes or no. Link just looks forlornly at Ilia, and says nothing. So Telma's all "whatev'", and drops it.

GODF*CKING**** that p*ssed me off This completely took me out of the game. I suddenly felt like I wasn't in Hyrule, on an epic quest to save Hyrule. I suddenly realized I was just playing a flawed videogame. In a game like Zelda, the fourth wall needs to stay firmly intact, and this was sadly not the case in TP. By adding so many artificial plot-links to Link, they completely killed the Zelda experience.

If Nintendo must satiate the players who hated Windwaker so much with a game like Twilight Princess by making a "deep" storyline, they sure as heck had better do it right.

...Uh, /rant, I guess. Sorry.

and please, drop the purple hilt, because it never matched well.

I think your eyes are broken--it looks blue to me. They should change it up a bit though. In ALttP it was silver all over with a red grip...

 

[SkylerOcon]

Well, you shouldn't be given the option to not defeat Ganon. I was talking about just the option to say yes or no to side quests, and it could effect your relationship with NPCs.

There shouldn't be an option to not fight Ganon. I don't want to be able to have an Evil Link.

 

[Darkslash]

Okay my take on a possible backstory of future Zelda.

Ganon broke the seal and took over the future world. Ganon took over the world because the world forgot about the Legend of the Hero (Hence the name of the Series its Self the LEGEND OF ZELDA). Then a resistance group is formed and relearns the Ancient art of Magic and the Legend of Old. The Resistance fuses Magic with Technology, thus making a chance against the corrupt Police and military. Link just so happened to become involved with the resistance though a freak accident with his friend Zelda. The game starts out from this freak accident. Its here where Link does his becoming of Age(one of the original pillars of the first Legend of Zelda). He then is made a regular. But then during one encounter(the first playable part of the game) his comrades except for him die by a mysterious Bio Weapon. Link then recognizes that its this same monster that caused the freak accident. He is then saved by a white light that then drops a disc. Turns out he was wearing a one of a kind armor that downloads Data and then his armor transforms. well that disc turns out to be Hero Garments.

Gah my Fanfiction side is taking OVER!

EDIT: About that choose your own choice. It sounds alot like early ingame Golden Sun. you had a choice to stop the Mars Adepts and save the World. If you said yes then you play the game. If you said no the game ends and you die.

 

[derek.haines]

Really, what was the last videogame you played that had no plot holes or unexplainable quirks? The simple addition of a free-minded factor (i.e. the player, YOU), makes telling concrete stories almost entirely impossible, because for every player who's totally absorbed in the world the developer has made and who will more or less go along quietly with the plot, there are three people who will dispute every turn the plot takes and try their darndest to go against the grain.

Now, I know it's impossible to please everyone all of the time, but let me once again bring up Shadow of the Colossus. The game has a total of 6 characters, not including the Colossi, spirits, and wildlife. One of these characters is in a coma for 99% of the game, one is a horse, and two of them don't have any speaking parts. Aside from the main character calling his horse, he never speaks either. The only person who does speak in the game is an unnamed religious official who appears shortly twice in the game.

And yet the game is around ten hours long, and is the most beautiful piece of art the videogame industry has produced in years. It's plot is deeper than 99.9% of other games, simply because it takes the free-minded factor of The Player and uses it to it's fullest extent. There are no characters telling you where to go or what to do, no flashing arrows directing your movements...just one short cutscene at the beginning and a few lines of text that give you a general idea of What's Going On Here, and how to use your sword.

I exxagerate only a little when I say that the next Zelda needs to be almost exactly like SotC. The landscape shouldn't be completely barren, there should be talking NPCs, and there should be the typical Zelda tropes of dungeons, bosses, chests, and items.

But the plot should be simple. Link should have an overarching goal from the beginning ("Ganon has returned, you must stop him"), and then the whole world should be open to him. It's up to the player to determine where to go next and what to do next. The game should never tell you "Oh, you got the Stone of Water, now you need to go to Death Mountain, cuz' the Gorons have the Stone of Earth." Through the game, hints should be dropped instead (Random NPC conversation: "Yup, I hired a troop of Gorons to help me plow my fields this year--that's why they're so perfect, those Gorons sure know how to work the soil.")...

...Wow. I've gotten a bit off-track, eh?

Well, I'll end with an example of why Nintendo won't do this (they can't): in TP, when Link finds Ilia again, and she's lost her memory, Telma asks Link if he knows her. There's no option to say yes or no. Link just looks forlornly at Ilia, and says nothing. So Telma's all "whatev'", and drops it.

GODF*CKING**** that p*ssed me off This completely took me out of the game. I suddenly felt like I wasn't in Hyrule, on an epic quest to save Hyrule. I suddenly realized I was just playing a flawed videogame. In a game like Zelda, the fourth wall needs to stay firmly intact, and this was sadly not the case in TP. By adding so many artificial plot-links to Link, they completely killed the Zelda experience.

If Nintendo must satiate the players who hated Windwaker so much with a game like Twilight Princess by making a "deep" storyline, they sure as heck had better do it right.

...Uh, /rant, I guess. Sorry.

Wow, that was magical. A Zelda game in the vein of SotC would be fantastic beyond belief, but I think we'd all be remiss if we let Zelda become a little TOO open world and sandbox-y. The game, no matter what it was, would have to have a bit of linearity to it to maintain the steady stream of narrative that has anchored the series for all these years.

Otherwise, we'd start out the game and be told how to play and where to go first, so we'd go there and do what we needed to do. Then, there'd need to be some sort of a hint as to where to proceed next elsewise it would descend into the realm of trial-and-error, talking to everyone until SOMEBODY takes pity on you and says that their uncle is a swordcrafter/shieldmaker/fisherman and maybe you should check him out sometime.

I absolutely think that opening up Link's world is the next step, however. Give us a huge, expansive Hyrule and a ton of reasons to explore the whole place. Don't lock anywhere off to us that wouldn't be locked off to your average denizen of Hyrule. That's an element of many games that has annoyed me to no end for many years.

 

[Chief Mendez]

Well, you shouldn't be given the option to not defeat Ganon. I was talking about just the option to say yes or no to side quests, and it could effect your relationship with NPCs.

There shouldn't be an option to not fight Ganon. I don't want to be able to have an Evil Link.

Well, it was an example, but you see what I mean.

The issue is that having a complicated storyline leads to your character (Link) interacting heavily with other characters, which alot of the time the player doesn't agree with (or even makes sense to), which is a necessary evil in most games, but one of the prime reasons that Zelda is such an amazing series is that most of the time, the games avoid that evil.

For an example, just look back at the Ilia-amnesia thing above.

So if this *******ized future-ized Zelda is ever made, it would (almost by necessity) have a much more complex plot than any previous game in the series. Which would inevitably lead to situations similar to the Ilia thing, which we see from experience Nintendo doesn't know how to handle with a tabula rasa like Link.

Bottom line: if you want a story-heavy Zelda, be prepared for a Link with a mind of his own. And of course, I'm sure nobody wants that...

Spoiler

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2IsTEjsQ34

 

[Darkslash]

*falls down a water fall* EXXXXCUUSSSSSSEEE MEEE!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQgqH5N2K3g&fmt=18

Any ways

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcvdT2C31oc

What a future zelda might be. I know its a Hoax but i was believing it my self

 

[Chief Mendez]

start out the game and be told how to play and where to go first, so we'd go there and do what we needed to do. Then, there'd need to be some sort of a hint as to where to proceed next elsewise it would descend into the realm of trial-and-error

You realize you just gave us a complete and exhaustive walk-through of the original Legend of Zelda?

It obviously wouldn't be as sandbox-y as Shadow of the Colossus, simply because there are other people in Hyrule, whereas there are only birds, lizards, and sixteen stone behemoths in Shadow.

As an example, let's say in Twilight Princess, Midna tells you you have to collect the Mirror Fragments, and proceeds to tell you what she's picked up about them: there's one to the north, south, east, and west. As you go to those places, the local yokels drop hints through their conversations with you about the odd sandstorms in the desert/odd whirlpools in the lake/odd creatures in the moors/odd whozit in the whatzit, and you go exploring until you find it.

I never again want a Zelda where I find a Mirror Shard, and am then shepherded back to my "base of operations" to be told by my "allies" where to go next. At the very least, let me tackle my dungeons in any order, a la Ocarina of Time. Sure, I might not be able to complete them, but don't artificially shut me out for the sake of your generic plot.

 

[derek.haines]

You realize you just gave us a complete and exhaustive walk-through of the original Legend of Zelda?

It obviously wouldn't be as sandbox-y as Shadow of the Colossus, simply because there are other people in Hyrule, whereas there are only birds, lizards, and sixteen stone behemoths in Shadow.

As an example, let's say in Twilight Princess, Midna tells you you have to collect the Mirror Fragments, and proceeds to tell you what she's picked up about them: there's one to the north, south, east, and west. As you go to those places, the local yokels drop hints through their conversations with you about the odd sandstorms in the desert/odd whirlpools in the lake/odd creatures in the moors/odd whozit in the whatzit, and you go exploring until you find it.

I never again want a Zelda where I find a Mirror Shard, and am then shepherded back to my "base of operations" to be told by my "allies" where to go next. At the very least, let me tackle my dungeons in any order, a la Ocarina of Time. Sure, I might not be able to complete them, but don't artificially shut me out for the sake of your generic plot.

Oh, I completely agree there. There need be no shepherding of Link at all. Less obvious hints would be appreciated, certainly. No more, "Link, my grandfather used to make swords. Maybe you should give him a visit in the Castle." Subtlety is a virtue. Heck, let me just stumble upon it and get whatever it is that I need without even knowing I needed it. Then, when I find out that I needed it I feel even better about myself.

I just don't want them to drop Link in the middle of a field, sword and shield in hand, and expect him to figure it out himself. The boy can't even talk, at least throw him a bone about where to go. Open world games also open the possibility of endless bits of wanderings due only to the fact of not knowing where to go next. Your "base of operations" needs to exist in one form or another as a repository for information about your quest. With no "journal" or "quest log" to track your progress, the game has usually used a sidekick of some sort to keep the player updated with where they should be focusing on next. This need not be the case anymore because it does hand-hold a bit, but there does need to be a way to get some sort of bearing on what has been accomplished thus far and what still needs to be done.

 

[Chief Mendez]

No more, "Link, my grandfather used to make swords. Maybe you should give him a visit in the Castle."

Oh Lord, I completely forgot about those. The colored words have basically become a joke in my circle of friends. It's a total riot to repeat the sentences with them audibly--they almost always sound like the character's talking to a three year old who got separated from his mom in an airport.

Yeah, ax those.

I just don't want them to drop Link in the middle of a field, sword and shield in hand, and expect him to figure it out himself.

Well, they wouldn't. There'd be an introductory sequence along the lines of Windwaker's, but from then on, you'd be basically on your own.

Your "base of operations" needs to exist in one form or another as a repository for information about your quest. With no "journal" or "quest log" to track your progress, the game has usually used a sidekick of some sort to keep the player updated with where they should be focusing on next. This need not be the case anymore because it does hand-hold a bit, but there does need to be a way to get some sort of bearing on what has been accomplished thus far and what still needs to be done.

I think the sidekick does as fine a job as any in this regard. Sure, Navi was annoying, but consider this: if she had said "What would Saria say?" only when you loaded your save, and never again until you turned it off then loaded it again...

I think that solves that problem.

 

[derek.haines]

Well, they wouldn't. There'd be an introductory sequence along the lines of Windwaker's, but from then on, you'd be basically on your own.

Just so long as we've got something to introduce what the hell is going on, I'm okay. I thought that WW's intro worked pretty well at setting the framework of the game, and I'd also like to see some increased freedom from that point on.

I think the sidekick does as fine a job as any in this regard. Sure, Navi was annoying, but consider this: if she had said "What would Saria say?" only when you loaded your save, and never again until you turned it off then loaded it again...

I think that solves that problem.

The problem is, keeping the sidekick is going to keep the sentence "Sure, [insert sidekick here] was annoying..." coming from everyone following every release. It is a feature fairly unique to Zelda, however, so keeping it as a staple makes sense. I suppose it is a better option than incorporating a hub you'd have to keep venturing back to.

If it were that futuristic Zelda we've been coming up with, maybe it would take the form of a PDA or even a little robo-fairy. META-NAVI.

 

[SkylerOcon]

They could just give Link a super powered NAVIgational device. It'd be a horrible pun, but it'd make OoT fans happy.

I pretty much agree that Nintendo needs to give more hints to where Link needs to go rather than a subtle shove. "Hey, Link go see my friend who owns a bomb shop in Castle Town." needs to be something like: "Try looking around different towns. You may find somebody."

Better than pretty much telling you where to go, at any rate.

 

[Darkslash]

It seems kinda weird when they tell you EXACTLY what to do next.

Any ways about NAVIgation, maybe that could work.

And how about brining Link's Sword Beam back? It hasn't appeared in any 3d Zelda game. Maybe it could work if the swords are fused with Technology. Swing it hard enough to create a Laser Shockwave so to speak.

 

[The Fail Tracer]

I agree with the above post, we REALLY need the Sword Beam back, it was awesome, and it always gave me a reason to always have my health at max.

Zelda's my second-favorite game series (first being Smash), I can't believe I've never posted in this thread before...

 

[Darkslash]

I agree with the above post, we REALLY need the Sword Beam back, it was awesome, and it always gave me a reason to always have my health at max.

Zelda's my second-favorite game series (first being Smash), I can't believe I've never posted in this thread before...

Yea in Phantom hourglass there was a sword beam but it really wasn't a true one. I was like.

OMG A SWORD BEAM!!!*slash* wait I didn't lose heath? Aww..

Sword Beam Ideas in a Future Zelda

~ only accessible with the Master Sword.
~Heath has to be full (duh..)
~Secret Technique

 

[Chief Mendez]

It hasn't appeared in any 3d Zelda game.

O RLY?

http://www.kasuto.net/image/officialart/majora_oni_link.jpg

I do agree though, it should come back. But yeah, keep it as a totally optional, secret reward for people looking to get everything in the game. And it wouldn't work on bosses, just regular enemies. Only usable at full health, too.

 

[Darkslash]

Do the Light disc count?

Make it a hidden technique.

Hmm if the next Zelda is going to have the Sword Beam, motion plus can do some thing like

~if you put more energy into your Swing a Larger and stronger Sword beam comes out
~regular swings have smaller and weaker Sword beams