The Lucas General Discussion

[Chuee]

Not having a thread is just like saying, "I don't want them to know what they can do to me because I'm not as good of a player as them, and if they know, then I don't know if I can beat them."

I tell my friends/crew mates/other players all the time what they can do to Lucas out of a grab. Telling them just makes me try harder to not get grabbed. Ultimately it'll make you a better player.

Must do whatever possible to win.
/metanite

 

[Mekos]

naw nasty i disagree with you there buddy. Of course I would tell people i'm cool with during friendlies but not people I'm playing mms or in tournament.

I beat MikeHaze's and Zex's Marths. I doubt they knew all the gayness they could do to lucas and I surely didn't tell them! lol. I asked Zex why he didn't grab release me over and over when he got the grab and he said "because it doesn't work on lucas" ololololol. I said "okay". He still got a free smash every time, but I'm surely not going to tell him how he can give me 0 to 130% easily and get a free kill. It's their duty to know the match-up not mine.

 

[T-block]

That still diminishes your win though, no? Are you still confident against a Marth that knows the grab release? x.x

 

[rPSIvysaur]

If they don't know the MU, it's their fault.

 

[Chuee]

Doesn't matter if it diminishes the win. I want the win.

 

[Mekos]

it doesn't diminsh anything. It is yer job as a player to know all the matchups. If my opponent doesn't know the matchup that is his fault and that doesn't take anything away from the win. He just needs to come back next time with more knowledge. That is called "experience". "Experience" is needed in anything in life. And if you overcome someone because of their lack of experience that is their fault. You are not at fault for not telling them.

Yeah of course the games would have went differenly if they knew the matchup. That is what tiers are for. Based off of pure logic a higher tier character should win if both players know every option of both characters. But that is why we live to gain experience in the things we do in life and get better. lol hope that made sense hahaha

 

[Mekos]

and i am confident against a marth that knows the grab release. This marth uses it. U just have to get the first kill. Then run and punish the aggro. Mike haze and Zex did combos and smashes after the grab release. They just didn't grab me over and over. Also, I rarely got grabbed and punished when they tried. I had really good reads the whole match. Smash is all about reads.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UZTNfEC5X4
in this match the marth definitely knows the gayness and uses it.

Another tip: Alot of top marths like mikehaze like to ub b out of shield. So if u pressure their shield sometimes immediately shield. They will up b. And get a hard punish!

 

[Randum]

Edit:


Nevermind.

 

[~Nasty~]

Of course I tell the people I practice with, but honestly, I don't care if you can grab release > w/e I'm not going to tell you how to do it if it's in tournament. /no shame

That is what i meant. I wouldn't tell my opponent right before a tourney set. Maybe i'd tell him after the set was over or something... or not tell him at all. But i would never make it a point to tell him if it's a tourney match or a mm.

naw nasty i disagree with you there buddy. Of course I would tell people i'm cool with during friendlies but not people I'm playing mms or in tournament.

You misunderstood my post, sorry. I'm not saying I'd tell them in tourney. I'd tell them if we were practicing like on a daily basis.

It's their duty to know the match-up not mine.

If they don't know the MU, it's their fault.

I agree. But at the same time, if the people you are practicing with know the MU because you tell them it, then it makes it more difficult to win. They learn the MU from you, and you in turn know how to counter it better. One way of getting better at this game is by making the people you play with better. The better they get, the better you get.

It is yer job as a player to know all the matchups. If my opponent doesn't know the matchup that is his fault and that doesn't take anything away from the win. He just needs to come back next time with more knowledge. That is called "experience". "Experience" is needed in anything in life. And if you overcome someone because of their lack of experience that is their fault. You are not at fault for not telling them.

In tourney, a win is a win, so I agree with your first statement. If you are able to fill him with more knowledge and experience, he'll get better and you'll get better.

tl;dr
AGAIN: I'm not saying that I tell my opponents in tourney or before a MM. I tell the people I practice with so that they can utilize tactics against me that I'll see at a high level, competitive match. I'll know what to expect and I'll be prepared for it.

 

[KoozyK]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07HR-_ENEpk&feature=feedu

when the EFF was this dicovered?????

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Holy shirt, brb learning the Z-air Double Jump Cancel it's probably rediculously hard. T_T

F-tilt out of dash

my dreams have come true

I'm crying myself to sleep tonight out of joy.

****ting my pants too.

You have no idea.

Time to **** *****es with this technique.

 

[KoozyK]

Holy shirt, brb learning the Z-air Double Jump Cancel it's probably rediculously hard. T_T

F-tilt out of dash

my dreams have come true

I'm crying myself to sleep tonight out of joy.

****ting my pants too.

You have no idea.

Time to **** *****es with this technique.

i was thinking the exact same thing!!!! we have soo many more options now. good shiza japan. thank stingers for finding things as soon as they come out

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Come to Raleigh and practice this **** with me.

 

[KoozyK]

Come to Raleigh and practice this **** with me.

im honestly considering doing that next week. its sooooo worth it

 

[T-block]

Oh my god that is so good o.o

Is this hard to do? Seems like it is.

 

[KoozyK]

Oh my god that is so good o.o

Is this hard to do? Seems like it is.

ive only pulled it off 3 times and ive been at it for 2 hours now

 

[T-block]

From my understanding, it's jump, double jump as soon as you take off, and z-air on the first frame of your double jump? Which parts of those can be buffered?

Are you using custom controls?

 

[GimR]

It looks like it can't be buffered but who cares; This give you guys a lot of options

 

[Chuee]

Wait so is this like a wavedash or something.
Also no more using PKF for zap jump!
but I'm too lazy to practice this anyways

 

[prOAPC]

you can use it to recover, or it only works if you are on the platform?

 

[FightAdamantEevee]

you can use it to recover, or it only works if you are on the platform?

You can use it to recover, just buffer it after the PSI Magnet. Also PKF is still better because of the push, and the zair not having a push or a hitbox

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Do you still retain horizontal control during the tether?

 

[KoozyK]

this is killing my fingers. -__-

and i figured out the reason theres no video of this going full speed. its almost impossible to do consistently at will. i feel like im trying to do the pika infinite

 

[T-block]

Have you tried using different controls? Seems like it's the timing between the jump input and the double jump that's tricky.

Is this the same phenomenon that enables duster sliding?

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Hey Kooz

try different controls?

but for real, I can't make fun of someone using different controls for doing a z-air dash. If you find controls that work for this, use them. This should be huge for Lucas if we can pull it off consistently.

 

[Chuee]

Anyone tried the Zair jump?
I tried but I couldn't get it =(

 

[Boofy!]

metagame minute please

 

[FightAdamantEevee]

Do you still retain horizontal control during the tether?

Yeah.

Anyone tried the Zair jump?
I tried but I couldn't get it =(

Yea I can do it about 75% since I started practicing it like a week ago.

 

[Mekos]

I don't even understand how to read it or even know how to practice it lol
Kroozy come over and teach me!! I do already have altered controls tho

I wanna know how to do the running forward tilt. I don't care about the zap jump z-air.

 

[KoozyK]

Hey Kooz

try different controls?

but for real, I can't make fun of someone using different controls for doing a z-air dash. If you find controls that work for this, use them. This should be huge for Lucas if we can pull it off consistently.

dude if i change my controls anymore. i might as well use a xbox controller. nothing the only thing that is default right now is the joystick, control pad, and the a and b buttons..... -__- i should have listened and got good at cbouncing.

Have you tried using different controls? Seems like it's the timing between the jump input and the double jump that's tricky.

^^^my controls have been altered since i started lucas.

Kroozy come over and teach me!! I do already have altered controls tho

I wanna know how to do the running forward tilt. I don't care about the zap jump z-air.

dude we should play sometime next week. and no hope for me teaching you the dash cancel thats some extra level hard

 

[Mekos]

Well can someone explain it to me. I'm to slow to understand that vid. That slow motion gives me a headache lol.

 

[FightAdamantEevee]

So in regards to doing the zair jump, it's s00per d00per easy. If you're doing it from the ground, Y Jump then immediately hit up on the control stick if you have TJ on, then press L (or whatever your shield is, L is easier) + A. So it'd be: Y > Control Stick Up > L+A. If you're doing it too fast then it'll come out as an up smash.

If you're doing it after the PSI Magnet, after the PSI Magnet ends hold up on the control stick (assuming you have tap jump on), then press shield then A right after. I have X set to shield and that made this really easy to do. So for me it would be: Fullhop > PSI Magnet > Control Stick Up while it's ending > X > A right after.

Also, I haven't even tried whatever that other thing in the vid was yet. I probably should start soon.

 

[prOAPC]

if you can control the horizontal momentum, it is better than normal zap jump
for those with tap jump off, can we press the jump button twice, like, really fast? Or in my case, i have 2 jump buttons, (ZL and A), can i press A then ZL?

 

[FightAdamantEevee]

I tried it like 30 times and it didn't work, so probably not. You could try setting a shoulder button or Z to Jump, then the other one to shield. Like Y Jump > R/Z Jump > L shield + A

 

[rPSIvysaur]

FAE, have you been successful with the DJ Cancel?

 

[Fluttershy]

So it'd be: Y > Control Stick Up > L+A.

This should be possible on the wiimote+nunchuck then except the controls would be
C > (tap jump or another jump button) > Z+A?

 

[FightAdamantEevee]

Nope rPSI I haven't tried the DJ cancel yet, and yeah that should work on Wiichuku ZeldaMaster

 

[Chuee]

These ATs are too hard for me.

 

[~Nasty~]

LOL chuee!

I didn't get to test this stuff out yet... looks fun though.

 

[Chuee]

My techskill is low.
very low