The eternal debate: How will Brawl be controlled? CONTROLLER DISCUSSION HERE

[Dylan_Tnga]

VERY VERY COOL TOPIC!!!!

I didnt even know there were buttons behind the numchuck as I have never seen, touched, or played on a WII in my life.

Very very cool explinations on how to shffl, c-stick aerials, and wavedash! perfect topic for my concerns. You're pretty smart.

Ill stick with the GC controller though (IF wavedashing is still in the game)

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

But you're forgetting about all of those "non-gamer" gamers Nintendo's always trying to include.

No, im not forgetting about them. I just choose not to include them in my views on how a game should be made or controlled because non-gamers can go **** themselves.

Seriously, ''non gamers'' ''people who havent played smash before'' As if a game like Brawl is for them.

Question... has any true video gamer NOT PLAYED SMASH YET? then why the **** does sakurai explain how to recover on his page? Ive known how to recover in smash brothers since I was 12 years old. And I'm 19 now.

Ok. lets think back to the NES days. Have any of you even tried some of the NES games? Heck theyve been out since the 1980's and people still find some NES games (Cough, ghosts and goblins) to be harder than most other games out there.

So we're working our way backward, from the NES, with games so difficult you want to throw a small child out of a window, to the SNES, the PERFECT all around consol... to the N64 and gamecube, slightly easier consols (In my opinion) but still challenging...

to this new philosophy.

GAMES ARE 4 EVERYONE!!!

NO. THEYRE NOT. THEYRE FOR ****ING GAMERS.

OLD PEOPLE SHOULDNT BE PLAYING VIDEO GAMES. THERE, I SAID IT. NOW MAKE A NORMAL **** CONTROLLER YOU *** ******* NINTENDO.

super japanese fun time bull****.

ARGH.

Non gamers can go **** a cat.


P.S Im not raging at you DacVack, just at this new stupid gaming policy.

 

[Dacvak]

No, im not forgetting about them. I just choose not to include them in my views on how a game should be made or controlled because non-gamers can go **** themselves.

Seriously, ''non gamers'' ''people who havent played smash before'' As if a game like Brawl is for them.

Question... has any true video gamer NOT PLAYED SMASH YET? then why the **** does sakurai explain how to recover on his page? Ive known how to recover in smash brothers since I was 12 years old.

I'M NINTEEN NOW.

Non gamers can go **** a cat.


P.S Im not raging at you DacVack, just at this new stupid gaming policy.

Why would this new gaming policy bother you in the first place? It's not like you have to use these controls. We already know that you and I are going to use the Cube controller. So why should we give a f*ck what they do with the Wiimote?

"Seriously, ''non gamers'' ''people who havent played smash before'' As if a game like Brawl is for them."

Are you ********? Smash Bros is one of Nintendo's biggest franchises. TONS of people play this game that normally don't play video games. Here's a great example: My brother, my college roommate, drunk people at parties, my ex-girlfriend. And those are just people I I'm sure you can think of other people who play Smash 64 or Melee. Not everyone is a pro.

"has any true video gamer NOT PLAYED SMASH YET?" There are a lot of Halo 2 and Xbox junkies who refused to get a GayCube (ahem), so I'm sure they'd be new to the series. I know a couple people like that, too. Of course, they'd probably prefer a Cube controller, anyway.

And finally... "Non gamers can go **** a cat." That's just a wonderful attitude to have. You do realize that the main reason the Wii exists is BECAUSE OF THEM, right? Nintendo could have made another Cube, or a 360-like console... Nope, they catered to the non-gamers. And guess how that's turning out for them? Guess what. Non-gamers are saving our industry.

~Dac

 

[Sidius]

It's all about the money...more non-gamers=more money...i wonder if they're gonna release a white and blue wavebird just for the h*** of it

 

[Plomid]

change topic name
"The not so eternal debate : choose what ever the f*** you want"

 

[Dacvak]

It's all about the money...more non-gamers=more money...i wonder if they're gonna release a white and blue wavebird just for the h*** of it

I certainly hope so. Although, I prefer wired controllers, anyway. Idea situation would be if they released both. (And if the wired controllers had, like, a LONG wire this time.)

~Dac

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

It's all about the money...more non-gamers=more money...

*insert star of david*


Screw technology. We had it better in the SNES days. at least then games were made for people who liked video games.

Now its like hey grandma, think you can't keep up with the youngins due to the arthritis in your thumbs and your lack of ability to play with a normal video game controller..

you're in luck. Now, you can wave your hands like a ****ing ****** and play a game that way instead of the way the gods of gaming intended it.

 

[Dacvak]

*insert star of david*


Screw technology. We had it better in the SNES days. at least then games were made for people who liked video games.

Now its like hey grandma, think you can't keep up with the youngins due to the arthritis in your thumbs and your lack of ability to play with a normal video game controller..

you're in luck. Now, you can wave your hands like a ****ing ****** and play a game that way instead of the way the gods of gaming intended it.

Yeah, you're right. It was much better when video games weren't ever-expanding and popular. It really pisses me off when I go to a video game store to find so many different types of games to choose from... There shouldn't be games for everyone; JUST ME!

Oh wait. That would be stupid.

~Dac

PS: Nice racist comment. I'm sure anyone who's Jewish really appriciates it.

 

[AsbestosBlatant]

In this thread: People badmouth each other over control schemes that haven't been adequately explored.


Anyway. I don't see why motion sensing would be such a bad thing. You'd probably just flick the controller one way for a smash attack, the rest could be easy breezy. Really, if you don't like it there's no reason to debate over it, just use the Gamecube controller.

also

Am I the only one that's going to opt to use the Resident Evil 4 chainsaw controller?

 

[Dacvak]

In this thread: People badmouth each other over control schemes that haven't been adequately explored.


Anyway. I don't see why motion sensing would be such a bad thing. You'd probably just flick the controller one way for a smash attack, the rest could be easy breezy. Really, if you don't like it there's no reason to debate over it, just use the Gamecube controller.

also

Am I the only one that's going to opt to use the Resident Evil 4 chainsaw controller?

I swear to God, I took that controller to a Smash tournament once. I got the greatest response EVER. XD

The Analog stick takes a little getting used to, since it's at that odd angle.

~Dac

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Why would this new gaming policy bother you in the first place? It's not like you have to use these controls. We already know that you and I are going to use the Cube controller. So why should we give a f*ck what they do with the Wiimote?

Because it will increase the ammount of scrubbage, both online and offline.

Example : Oh my god, you cheap GC controller user. The GC controller is for the gamecube, you are cheap. At least I have honor.

Just dont give more ammo to scrubs... please nintendo..

Are you ********? Smash Bros is one of Nintendo's biggest franchises. TONS of people play this game that normally don't play video games. Here's a great example: My brother, my college roommate, drunk people at parties, my ex-girlfriend. And those are just people I I'm sure you can think of other people who play Smash 64 or Melee. Not everyone is a pro.

thats what I am saying... like, exactly what im saying. Who hasn't played smash before? So why does Sakurai feel the need to explain the basics? 99% of the people who will buy brawl will either have played melee or ssb64 before, or at least know how the game works, without the help of smashbros.com

There are a lot of Halo 2 and Xbox junkies who refused to get a GayCube (ahem), so I'm sure they'd be new to the series. I know a couple people like that, too. Of course, they'd probably prefer a Cube controller, anyway.

Halo sucks compared to smash and I dont want halo filth invading this beautiful game. They can just play gears of war on their xbox 360 and give Bill Gates another billion dollar blowjob.

And finally... "Non gamers can go **** a cat." That's just a wonderful attitude to have. You do realize that the main reason the Wii exists is BECAUSE OF THEM, right? Nintendo could have made another Cube, or a 360-like console... Nope, they catered to the non-gamers. And guess how that's turning out for them? Guess what. Non-gamers are saving our industry.

Lol, you're talking as if the WII is a good idea for a console.. the ONLY game I play to buy on it is brawl.. and because you can use a GC controller. And I dont even know if im gonna buy brawl or not until I know if the wavedash exists, im not wasting my time or my money when I could just play melee like I always do.

I hate the wii. I hate xbox and the 360. I hate the ps3.

I basically like.. melee. Super smash 64 among other nintendo 64 games...

and SNES, which has yet to be topped in terms of gameplay. And it never will be. why? Because Final fantasy 3, A link to the past, Chrono Trigger, Killer instinct, among many, many other super nintendo titles are miles, and miles ahead of any other game.

 

[Toasty!]

I dunno man I think its held on its side for a reason. And I don't think they will use motion sensing for brawl because...

*With motion sensing

I lol'd pretty darn hard. Good Job.

 

[Toasty!]

Awesome. I might use the Wiimote + Nunchuck so I can learn along with the pros and learn to PWN, as everyone is way ahead of me with the GC. -_-

 

[Eaode]

that's pretyty cool, although the only thing I don't like is having to press 2 buttons at the same time to do B attacks, that miht be off-putting to new players as well...


what's even crazier is tha he confirmed a wiimtoe only control scheme o_O;;

 

[Problem2]

-Dylan Tnga, ****, you're such a basher.-
Look, Nintendo usually tends to be predictable. You can look at the previous model, expect some gimick changes, expect some good changes, expect a few good fixes, and you got the sequal. Nintendo's so far has rarely taken out useful glitches that have been used competitivevly, (such as snaking in Mario Kart), nor has Sakurai. L-cancelling stayed in from SSB64. Infact it changed from a glitch to an actual game mechanic. Why do you think they will x-out Wavedashing?

-It's not SSBM2, it's SSBB-
Personally, I don't want the same thing as Melee. They've been working on it too long for it to be just that, plus they stated they were remodeling from the ground up. The core will stay the same such as the focus and rules, but the gameplay, the moves, even balance will be changed, and that's what I'm looking forward to. If you want to play something similar to Melee, then go PLAY Melee. You prefer all the games of the past anyways.

-The controls-
Oh wah, the Wii remote can be turned sideways and be used as a controller and all the noobs are going to be playing that way. It doesn't matter because noobs always find something to grip about, and when you convince them they're wrong they just shout "I don't care!". The Wii remote is just a new alternative that's going to be used to refresh the game when everything else gets old. Little options and additions go a long way, that's why SSBM is so much better than SSB64, even to casual gamers. You have Event Matches, Home Run constests, Multiman melee, more stages, and even more characters. You're much less likely to get bored.

Heck, I might even try to use the Wiimote online to see how well I can do with it. (I won't be complaining or surprised if I lose though)

 

[Shai Hulud]

I'm firebombing some kids if Brawl gets gimped.

 

[Adi]

This is an interesting proposal however the one thing I noticed immediately is that one would have a very hard time linking together c-stick with other moves in general, particularly the b button. An example of this off the top of my head is the drill shine, which is very very hard to do with this scheme as when switching from the c-stick to the b-button that fast, you''ll pretty much have to slide over the A, which could just result in a jab instead.

 

[red stone]

you could always use the A button for drillshines.

actually, only the b button moves are affected if you use the dpad for aerials. linking anything from the dpad to an a button move like a jab or tilt is easier than on the gc controller because the dpad is so close to the A button. also you can link an aerial to a smash by pressing the dpad again for a smash once you've hit the ground.

but i see your point. if you use the c stick for all aerials, you might run into problems with the drillshine on fox, the pillaring on falco, and the......well that's all i can think of for now.

but again, using the A button is plausible for this situation.

 

[Eric the Lone]

soon we'll be concocting a "control scheme tier" i imagin

i wonder if it goes as far as say, one type of control is better for fox, because its very easy to perform the waveshine, while say another type of control it is cake to float cancel, thus its better suited for a peach, you think it will go that far??

I REALLY like the sound of that to be honest. Then again it'll be a whole new dimension of the "teers don't exiist!!" argument. Eh, so what.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

-Dylan Tnga, ****, you're such a basher.-
Look, Nintendo usually tends to be predictable. You can look at the previous model, expect some gimick changes, expect some good changes, expect a few good fixes, and you got the sequal. Nintendo's so far has rarely taken out useful glitches that have been used competitivevly, (such as snaking in Mario Kart), nor has Sakurai. L-cancelling stayed in from SSB64. Infact it changed from a glitch to an actual game mechanic. Why do you think they will x-out Wavedashing?

-It's not SSBM2, it's SSBB-
Personally, I don't want the same thing as Melee. They've been working on it too long for it to be just that, plus they stated they were remodeling from the ground up. The core will stay the same such as the focus and rules, but the gameplay, the moves, even balance will be changed, and that's what I'm looking forward to. If you want to play something similar to Melee, then go PLAY Melee. You prefer all the games of the past anyways.

-The controls-
Oh wah, the Wii remote can be turned sideways and be used as a controller and all the noobs are going to be playing that way. It doesn't matter because noobs always find something to grip about, and when you convince them they're wrong they just shout "I don't care!". The Wii remote is just a new alternative that's going to be used to refresh the game when everything else gets old. Little options and additions go a long way, that's why SSBM is so much better than SSB64, even to casual gamers. You have Event Matches, Home Run constests, Multiman melee, more stages, and even more characters. You're much less likely to get bored.

Heck, I might even try to use the Wiimote online to see how well I can do with it. (I won't be complaining or surprised if I lose though)

Good points, actually.

The core will stay the same such as the focus and rules, but the gameplay, the moves, even balance will be changed, and that's what I'm looking forward to. If you want to play something similar to Melee, then go PLAY Melee. You prefer all the games of the past anyways.

True. And I will be playing melee if theres no wavedashing in brawl. I wont buy it, look at it, or acknowledge it's existence.

Fingers crossed for brawl, my friend. I hope for the same things that you do... I want a whole new game! I want new techniques, new charaters, new movesets, new weights, new tractions for all the characters, I want it mixed up so that when chudat or azen play the game they wont immediatly win every brawl tournament they attend.

But, some of the great things in melee, most specifically the airdodge (brilliant implement) and the results of the airdodge should stay in brawl.

Like you said, Z cancelling was a glitch, then it became part of the gameplay, maybe that will happen with wavedashing..

My main concern as to them taking out WDing is their new attitude :

Games arent for gamers. Games are for everyone, including old people.

I dont like that, because I was born into gaming, like many of you here. Gaming is a hobby, a passion, and at times even a lifestyle.

I dont like that gaming has to be changed to include people who dont normally play games just so nintendo can make more money. Gaming is for gamers, sports, cards, pool, other actitives, etc are for non gamers. If you want to play video games, why not become a gamer?

I think the wii-mote and this whole motion sensing thing is just a gimmick to attract people. Face it, no matter how good you are at waving your arms like a seagul, you would do MUCH better with a gamecube controller in your hand.

A controller fits your hand, your thumbs control precise movements.. just like an instrument like the piano...

Gaming, is in the fingers, not in the movement of your body, thats sports such as gymnastics, or skateboarding. Why does gaming have to be about movement of your body when we have things like dancing and sports? gaming is a focus around the mastery of ones reaction time in the brain transfered into detailed movenet according to this reaction time in ones fingers.

You cannot hope to emulate the precision of a thumb controlled joystick with arm waiving, no way, never no how.

So, if Brawl shares this same attitude, wherein video games are supposed to be watered down to appeal to the masses rather than the dedicated gamers who devote hours of their time practicing melee for tournaments, bi-weeklies, etc... then maybe theyll remove ALL of the advanced techs, so that more people will buy it.

Thats my fear, and until the game comes out, or sakurai tells us on his site I wont know if my fears are confiremd or not.

Im going to be really, really sad if Brawl sucks and is more focused on appealing to non gamers than to the people who have a love and a passion for the game.

Shai, ill join you in firebombing some **** if Brawl sucks.

So yeah, call me a basher but im just ****ing worried that theyll ruin my favorite game in existence. Smash brothers.

 

[Stryks]

So wait, ur saying u wont buy the game or wont play it if wavedash or any of the advance techniques is taking out? If thats what u mean than man sorry but thats just plain n00bish...

If ur afraid to learn new techniques or to forget the old ones, then to bad, its possible that theyll take out WD, and I who use WD like hell as part of my stategy aint really that worried, If I wanna get better at smash im bound to leave melee cause brawl will become the new hit, less melee tournaments will be held, and more brawl tourneys will, thus If I ever want to consider myself a pro Im going to have to learn the new brawl either way, hell we may find better, easier and more adv. techniques in brawl, and I for one cant wait to play it...

and if thats not what u mean then ignore my post XD

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

So wait, ur saying u wont buy the game or wont play it if wavedash or any of the advance techniques is taking out? If thats what u mean than man sorry but thats just plain n00bish...

If ur afraid to learn new techniques or to forget the old ones, then to bad, its possible that theyll take out WD, and I who use WD like hell as part of my stategy aint really that worried, If I wanna get better at smash im bound to leave melee cause brawl will become the new hit, less melee tournaments will be held, and more brawl tourneys will, thus If I ever want to consider myself a pro Im going to have to learn the new brawl either way, hell we may find better, easier and more adv. techniques in brawl, and I for one cant wait to play it...

and if thats not what u mean then ignore my post XD

Yup. Thats what I meant. Glad to hear you have such a positive attitude towards a non ssb64 version of melee that lacks wavedashing but I however, don't.

I might play it at a friends house (doubtful because no friends of mine would buy it if there was no wavedashing)

But yeah, without wavedashing, on a smash bros game that isnt ssb64 *I love that game and play online every day*

I would be -GARBAGE- at the game. I would have no hope of ever making it out of pools in a tournament, so why would I even bother.

Even if melee tournaments diminish, they will still be held, even if its at a brawl tournament all I have to do is not enter for brawl

And in the worst case scenario, melees tourney scene completly dissapears (wont happen) Ill play with my loyal friends.


Glad to hear YOU will still play Brawl if they remove the flavour from it, but I wont.

 

[Sandy]

Is wavedashing really that important?

 

[Wolfblade]

To Sandtiger: It depends on your character, and playstyle. If you master it, it is a very useful technique. If you don't have it mastered, but can still do it relatively well you can use it to gain some helpful distance in certain situations. If you use Link then don't bother Link is awesome.

I just saw the update on the controls. I'll be gunning for the Wiimote and Nunchuck first. I hope they have some motion sensing with that one, or at least something with shaking the chuck.

I don't think anyone could be dissapointed about being able to use any of the 4 control types. Can't wait to find out how they will all be used.

 

[Stryks]

Flavour? its just a small dash attack, I doubt the game will be a failiure without wavedash, it aint important, its an advance technique yes, but who says they wont buy the game or consider it the flavour of melee or complaining that it wont be in brawl is just plain n00bish, even if its an advance technique, true pros find their own techniques, an use already discover ones in their own way for a strategy, true pros will find a way to live without wavedash in brawl...

Like rhyme said to me once: Brawl is a new beginning, a fresh start... If people start complaining saying: "Withouth wavedash the game is nothing" then either there a bad player, or dont want to improve and Im more than ready for brawl, if I have to learn the basics again so be it, as long as I can make a name for myself

 

[Wolfblade]

Flavour? its just a small dash attack, I doubt the game will be a failiure without wavedash, it aint important, its an advance technique yes, but who says they wont buy the game or consider it the flavour of melee or complaining that it wont be in brawl is just plain n00bish, even if its an advance technique, true pros find their own techniques, an use already discover ones in their own way for a strategy, true pros will find a way to live without wavedash in brawl...

Like rhyme said to me once: Brawl is a new beginning, a fresh start... If people start complaining saying: "Withouth wavedash the game is nothing" then either there a bad player, or dont want to improve and Im more than ready for brawl, if I have to learn the basics again so be it, as long as I can make a name for myself

Like that last part. I want to start over and develope even better skills in the long run. I said before I main Link, so wavedashing is not a part of my game with him anyway.

And, like I said before, I hope there is some motion sensing stuff with the Mote and Chuck control style. I'm Dying to learn new ways to play one of my favorite games. Never logged more hours on a game than on Melee, and I know Brawl will go beyond that.

 

[Eaode]

Isn' this thread kind of pointless, now that it's confirmed?

 

[dynamic_entry]

Isn' this thread kind of pointless, now that it's confirmed?

"the not-so-eternal-debate: how will brawl be controlled"

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Flavour? its just a small dash attack

how the hell is it an attack? I never wave-smash btw. I use wavedashing purely for spacing. If I cant space, I cant do ANYTHING. I rely on wavedashing for spacing more than anything, really. And occasionaly for techchasing but I mostly dash and crouch cancel or JC grab.

Without spacing though, my shiek is nothing, my fox is nothing, my CF well he has bad spacing to begin with hes already nothing, my mario is HYPER NOTHING without spacing. Etc, etc. HOw the heck am I going to space without the wavedash? You find a way for yourself, ive spent 3 years developing my spacing game and im not doing it all over again.

I have no problem learning new moves, new combo, new techs, new character specific weights, but I will not re learn spacing. That takes so many years to get, and its so intricate.

, I doubt the game will be a failiure without wavedash, it aint important, its an advance technique yes.

Lol, the game wont be a failure, no matter what its gonna sell millions upon millions of copies. And people will love it. Without wavedashing, I won't.

but who says they wont buy the game or consider it the flavour of melee or complaining that it wont be in brawl is just plain n00bish, even if its an advance technique, true pros find their own techniques, an use already discover ones in their own way for a strategy, true pros will find a way to live without wavedash in brawl...

Thanks for calling me a n00b. Yes, my opinions, not my skill at melee are what you should base my level of skill off of.

Thank you for the lecture, mr ''True pro'' I hope with your ''true pro'' skills we'll see your name in the top 3 at the next big smash tournament? ''True pro'' give me a ****ing break.

Like rhyme said to me once: Brawl is a new beginning, a fresh start... If people start complaining saying: "Withouth wavedash the game is nothing" then either there a bad player, or dont want to improve and Im more than ready for brawl, if I have to learn the basics again so be it, as long as I can make a name for myself

Ok, fine. I'm a bad player. I mean im good enough now so that after the next tournament im going to get voted onto the power rankings in eastern canada for melee, but hey since I Have a negative attitude towards a non wavedash smash game, I'm a bad player.

OR, I don't want to improve. I love these negative alternatives!!!!!

Yes, I dont want to ''improve'' because I wouldnt want to play brawl without WDing.

Hey genius, improve at what? Smash? I think I can still play melee, and I doubt your ''true pro'' experiences in brawl are going to help you in melee. So what the heck game is my improvement going to be hindered in, melee, or brawl? Brawl obviously because I wont play it.

This makes your statment redundent because how could I improve / decline in skill in a game I never play?

Likewise, if you're telling me that because I dont want to play brawl for whatever reasons I have, that im going to not improve in melee, then um.. where's your proof of that..

I happen to be a very open minded smash player IN MELEE. I love playing people much better than me, im always changing my game and taking advice, making videos, putting in 10+ hours a week training with my crew.

But of course because of my opinions, I wont improve. Riiiiiiiiight.

Yes, my opinions are what characterize my playstyle.

How stupid are you?

I wouldn't call you names, and I wasnt going to until I saw that you were dissing me. I think its uncalled for on both of our parts.

Sure ive written this now, and im about to post it. So yeah the only reason Im insulting you and being sarcastic is because you managed to piss the **** out of me with your insults and your little elitist ''true pro'' bull****, that has no foundation in the game of smash itself.

 

[red stone]

You just not got on to the power rankings?! lol jk

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

You just not got on to the power rankings?! lol jk

hahhahaha, nah im not on them yet. But I can take out people at the bi-weeklies that are between 10-15th spot.

The people above 10th still own me, and the top 3 or 4 **** me.

 

[Flak]

...if theres no wavedashing in brawl. I wont buy it, look at it, or acknowledge it's existence.

haha yes you will you thrash keyboard playing dumb****

 

[arrowhead]

i hope they re-release GC controllers. i don't want to have to get used to another controller once my GC ones break

how the heck is just the wii remote going to work for this game?

 

[Flak]

very good topic. i especially like the rating you gave for the advanced techniques.

 

[petre]

dylan, i have to ask though, what are you going to if melee tournaments do vanish? are you just going to stop playing anything competitively, after building your smashing skills for years? not saying you shouldnt play melee, but if you play smash because you like the overall style of smash bros games and you like playing competitively, then you are going to need to switch to brawl sooner or later. you make it sound like you play melee just cause it has wavedashing, which sounds pretty stupid to me. "money? experience? nah, i go to tourneys so i can wavedash!"

oh, and you say youd suck at brawl if it doesnt have wavedashing just cause of that? is wavedashing all you ever focus on and practice? im pretty sure youve picked up alot more than how to space properly through a wavedash with all the experience youve got. if you havent...well...then ignore this whole post. but i think youd be suprised at how much better youre going to be than 99% of the people that get this game when it first comes out even if theres absolutely no advanced techs in the game at all. and youll only get better from there. because lets face it, even if a technique or two are different, its still going to be smash. if you really refuse to play a smash game that doesnt have wavedashing, then you fall under the category of 'scrub' yoruself at a competitive level, setting outside restrictions on your game, for whatever reason. and im assuming that since youre making the power rankings, then you ARE concerned about this game competitively. so it just doesnt make sense to me.

not trying to bash you or anything, im just confused about why you actaully play this game.

 

[MastaWeeji]

I've had an idea for the Wiimote controls since i've heard of the existance of Brawl.

The Wiimote with nunchuck has just about the same amount of buttons as the GC controller, only lacking a d-pad next to the analog stick, and lacking a c-stick.... but you only use a d-pad for the up button, and i always thought "it would be interesting if they implemented the c-stick as motion sensing." push the wiimote up, up smash, down, for down smash, so on... simple and useful... Of course, it would be even easier to pull off a dair without fastfallin, if you ever had a problem getting to your c-stick. As for the rest of the buttons, there are enough of them, but some buttons are unable to be reached normally... how i would map it is:

GC Controller --> Wiimote
-----------------------------
A Button --> A Button
B Button --> Down on the D-pad
X/Y Button --> Left or Right on the D-pad, whatever's comfortable
R Button --> B Button (i don't use L at all, so i would need B to do R's stuff, or i'm screwed...)
L Button --> Z on the Nunchuck
Z Button --> C on the Nunchuck (this will take some time to get used to)
Up on D-pad --> 1 Button
C Stick --> Wiimote Directional sensing (of course slow speeds wont go beyond the deadzone)

How's that? if anything, they should have it so you can map controls yourself as an option.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

dylan, i have to ask though, what are you going to if melee tournaments do vanish?

They wont.

are you just going to stop playing anything competitively, after building your smashing skills for years?

No, Ill play competitive melee / ssb64 like I do now.

if you play smash because you like the overall style of smash bros games and you like playing competitively, then you are going to need to switch to brawl sooner or later.

No I don't. Screw Brawl.

you make it sound like you play melee just cause it has wavedashing, which sounds pretty stupid to me. "money? experience? nah, i go to tourneys so i can wavedash!"

Nah, wavedashing is like... one skill out of hundreds of things that I love in melee. And by itself .. um.. it sucks. You're confusing me with nubs who just learned how to wavedash and think that it's pro. its not. Its easy, I never said it was difficult to do.

But its a cog in my playstyle, without it, id have no spacing and my game would collapse. But obviously I wouldnt be as good as I am now if I hadent mastered the more important skills in Melee, duh.

oh, and you say youd suck at brawl if it doesnt have wavedashing just cause of that? is wavedashing all you ever focus on and practice? im pretty sure youve picked up alot more than how to space properly through a wavedash with all the experience youve got.

Yeah for sure I've got other methods.. and there are characters I rarely wavedash with like captain falcon, but I still do use it from time to time for spacing.. So yeah I do have other methods, but wavedashing is my main one.

Remember, I play ssb64 online and I have spacing and mindgames in that, and theres no wavedashing there.

I wouldnt have enough spacing though, id get pwnd by anyone I played.

but i think youd be suprised at how much better youre going to be than 99% of the people that get this game when it first comes out even if theres absolutely no advanced techs in the game at all. and youll only get better from there. because lets face it, even if a technique or two are different, its still going to be smash.

Meh, maybe. Depends on how good falcon is because I plan to main him from the start (if WDing is in)

if you really refuse to play a smash game that doesnt have wavedashing, then you fall under the category of 'scrub' yoruself at a competitive level, setting outside restrictions on your game, for whatever reason.

Heck no. Im not a scrub, I never will be and If I say anything remotly scrubby I have given permission to my smash friends to literally BREAK MY FACE. I hate scrubs that much.

If I didnt play the game at all, I couldnt be a scrub. I wouldnt critisize it, id watch pro matches on youtube, I might attend a tourney. I wouldnt play though

Scrubbing about no WD would be if I went to a tourney, lost (Like I would, without wavedashing) then blamed the lack of wavedashing for my loss.

If I ever choose to play brawl with no wavedash (highly unlikely) I would never, ever, ever John about wavedashing. I hate scrubs. I ****ING HATE THEM.

and im assuming that since youre making the power rankings, then you ARE concerned about this game competitively. so it just doesnt make sense to me.

not trying to bash you or anything, im just confused about why you actaully play this game.

I play this game because its been my favorite game since I was 12 and ssb64 came out and id spend like 3 hours a day killing level 9 comp teams.

I play this game for a million reasons. Wavedashing is not one of those reasons, it is meerly a technique I consider essential to my playstyle in SSBM. and I highly doubt that in brawl without it I could come close to being as good relative to the rest of the community as I currently am at SSBM.

 

[ph00tbag]

Honestly, Dylan Tnga, I think you're waaaaay overreacting. Let's say they take out everything that makes Melee Melee. WD, L-cancel, SH, FF, and a host of other things. Yay, the nubs are happy.

Wait, someone finds a weird bug in the design. Now you can, oh I don't know, reset after an airdodge as any character through some tantra-esque manipulation and laser-quick reflexes. The game moves further into the air, with airdodge resetting defining the recoveries of many characters, or leading into surprise attacks. Jumping becomes the new rolling. Depth appears out of nowhere.

Both examples are kind of extreme, but they illustrate the point that new exploits will be discovered by people who push the game to its limit. Strategies will still develop no matter how dumbed down the game is. The people who play the game at the highest level will make it that way, and will force the game to be fun. And only if the game fails to be fun upon being forced to will it truly suck, but it takes a truly horrible game for something like that to happen.

Furthermore, I think you vastly underestimate Sakurai's understanding of the way Smash is played and the mentality of those playing it. I also think you underestimate his passion for making it fun for everyone. You are included in that. Sakurai knows that there are people who enjoy the depth of Melee, and he will keep that in mind, because he's a game designer for the love of God. It's what he does.

 

[-=Marth_n_Roy=-]

To the Topic Starter
Or a Mod that doesn't mind editing the original post

At the bottom of page eleven (on maxed post-per-pages)

Red Stone has post the best (IMHO) description of a future Wiimote layout. and should either be quoted, linked or both, in the original post in this topic.

which can be found http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=2452258&postcount=439 Alone.

Out of everyone's proposed layouts and control schemes, Red Stone's has my highest endorsement (for what is worth)

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Honestly, Dylan Tnga, I think you're waaaaay overreacting. Let's say they take out everything that makes Melee Melee. WD, L-cancel, SH, FF, and a host of other things. Yay, the nubs are happy.

****ing nubs. Lemme outta my cage I want at em I want at em!

Wait, someone finds a weird bug in the design. Now you can, oh I don't know, reset after an airdodge as any character through some tantra-esque manipulation and laser-quick reflexes. The game moves further into the air, with airdodge resetting defining the recoveries of many characters, or leading into surprise attacks. Jumping becomes the new rolling. Depth appears out of nowhere.

Kickass! Some pro just ***** the nubs game. Now they can call him cheeeep.

Both examples are kind of extreme, but they illustrate the point that new exploits will be discovered by people who push the game to its limit. Strategies will still develop no matter how dumbed down the game is. The people who play the game at the highest level will make it that way, and will force the game to be fun. And only if the game fails to be fun upon being forced to will it truly suck, but it takes a truly horrible game for something like that to happen.

True, actually. I dont think the game will suck without wavedashing. I think that I will suck AT it without wavedashing due to my spacing game being destroyed

Furthermore, I think you vastly underestimate Sakurai's understanding of the way Smash is played and the mentality of those playing it. I also think you underestimate his passion for making it fun for everyone. You are included in that. Sakurai knows that there are people who enjoy the depth of Melee, and he will keep that in mind, because he's a game designer for the love of God. It's what he does.

Yeah I trust Sakurai, but not nintendo. My main fear is this new ''games are for everyone'' attitude, so that instead of making it challenging it would just be eye pleasing and there would be no depth to the game on purpose to sell it to a larger ammount of people because lets face it, theres soooooo many scrubs (that should be hanged) out there compared to people with a good gaming mentality.

But thats just paranoia, I doubt it would go that far.

Anyhow I have NO doubts about this game being great. But without the wavedash I could never - ever - be great at it.