The Current State of the Poké Center

[ss118]

I would not have considered it spam had you put "I agree with Articanus", or "I think Articanus is wrong, give all the credit to Ultimario", or something to a similar degree that shows you are actually pushing the thread forward. I don't mind the jokes, just the fact that you showed either you have no idea what you are talking about(which I know you do), or just don't have anything to say on the matter. At all. In which case, do what I do to every single art thread or most threads in the pokecenter: don't continuously post in them.

 

[CRASHiC]

Arti, that's dumb and that's all I'm going to say on that. This is the internet, not the House of Represenative. This has a casual feel not a formal feel unless you are in the debate hall. Not every element in a movie has to advane the plot, not every post has to advance discussion.

 

[Wave⁂]

Just as a note, closing the social thread was the wrong thing to do. Cracking down on spam should be done with infractions, not punishing an entire board. As there's no longer a thread where people can socialize in the PC it will likely lead to MORE spam in other threads.

Thank you.








At that, would it be so bad if my post was simply "Thank you"? It expressed how I agree with PR. We share the same sentiments. In addition, I am also saying that PR said it in a way that I could not. One-liners aren't always bad.

 

[Fuelbi]

Well Firus, I can even link you a post (if I wasn't on my wii) Spire posted in the DR that'd he NEVER open the SR again, hell look in the announcement and he even stated it in there

Tery, some people still think it's been closed indefinitely, contrary what he's posted a million times

 

[Ryu Shimazu]

I don't know, if you make everything serious, to the point where you have to constantly think a whole lot before you post, it takes the relaxing feel out of being here.

Why not get in trouble for hardcore spam, and let the very small ones fly? If it's not completely ridiculous, I don't get why it matters. It just seems a bit overboard(lol pun) to me.

 

[M.K]

Like seriously.
When somebody brings something up that is actually correct and from a credible source, everybody on this godforsaken board ignores it and continues on with their own agenda.

If you want your social thread back, you prove yourselves, but this is definitely not a good way of doing so. .

If you want your social thread back, you prove yourselves, but this is definitely not a good way of doing so. .

If you want your social thread back, you prove yourselves, but this is definitely not a good way of doing so. .

How many times does it need to be said. If anyone misses it from here on out, I swear to god you must be the dumbest individual ever to exist on the planet. Because of posts like the one ABOVE which masks what Firus actually just said, we're gonna continue with **** like this:

"SOSHUL THRAD GONE 4EVAR"!???


"Wut?"

"NO!"

"LOL DIS SUX"

"I NO"

"LEZ REVOLT"

"KK"

"SOUNDS KUL"

"YUP"

"LOL (insert anything) IS TERRIBAD"

because of it. Just. Don't. Post anymore. (LOL +1, Top 10 , so legit!!!! NOT)

This announcement is completely correct that everyone on this board works on their own agenda, disobeys the simplest of rules, and masquerades their actions as "it's just a social thread". We've never had a social thread before, and we've proven that we can't handle it.
I would disagree that the social thread was closed because of the argument alone. Maybe the posts in straight Engrish were the cause, and maybe the argument was the straw that broke the camel's back , but this should be a HUGGEEE wake up call to everyone.
It's sad to see a board go downhill this quickly and miserably.

 

[ss118]

"Thank you" would have worked. At least we understand what you are trying to say, and we understand that 1 more member feels the way that PR does. It's very little, but it DOES push forward discussion.

crash, if you want internet go on /b/. everything can have the casual feel, but it doesn't mean that posts should be literally contentless. And before you say "my post did have content", let us consider what content your post might possess:

A) you wanted that guy to get credit. in which case you had no idea what was happening. in which case don't post....

B) you wanted to be funny and used a sarcastic "tone". Congrats. But now we have no idea what exactly your opinion on anything is: or maybe you don't have one. in which case don't post....

 

[Firus]

Guys, this is not the place to bicker about who's spammed where, as that's pretty much moot. I'm trying to get all of this out into the open and discuss this so you guys understand what's going on instead of just going straight into revolution mode, it's not time to play the blame/innocence game. There's been spam in here, and that's all that really needs to be said.

Thank you.

At that, would it be so bad if my post was simply "Thank you"? It expressed how I agree with PR. We share the same sentiments. In addition, I am also saying that PR said it in a way that I could not. One-liners aren't always bad.

That's why "Pointless" generally precedes "one-liners".

Well Firus, I can even link you a post (if I wasn't on my wii) Spire posted in the DR that'd he NEVER open the SR again, hell look in the announcement and he even stated it in there

I am well aware that he has said it's closed permanently, however, you asked where he had said that it may re-open and I was showing you.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Well Firus, I can even link you a post (if I wasn't on my wii) Spire posted in the DR that'd he NEVER open the SR again, hell look in the announcement and he even stated it in there

Tery, some people still think it's been closed indefinitely, contrary what he's posted a million times

It's incorrect to say that he's posted that a million times, since in reality all he needed was to post it once or twice, and by doing so he did the right thing.

Regardless of the casual feel of an onlime forum for gaming, there is definitely a need of decency when posting (Global Rules establishes this). I have obviously violated these rules in the past with stupid one-liners or etc. which have gotten infracted and for the right cause. The Snorlax Room was a case up where it was just getting out of hand. Because we were so used to doing so in our social thread, this spread into our other threads (like, SmashCAP, for example) which was incorrect.

Long story short: we Mukked up, and we're lucky to not have been heavily infracted already, so just deal with it and show Spire we as a community can engage in serious conversation between the members.

 

[Wave⁂]

Why does this thread exist? Are the mods looking for feedback? No. Do they care about our wants? No. Is this discussion going to change anything? No. Will the Snorlax Room ever be re-open? No... allegedly

 

[Pink Reaper]

inb4close?

^^^^ this is actual spam.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Why does this thread exist? Are the mods looking for feedback? No. Do they care about our wants? No. Is this discussion going to change anything? No. Will the Snorlax Room ever be re-open? No... allegedly

This thread was created upon Firus' moving some posts from the Q&A Thread because they didn't belong in there. Thus, because those questinos didn't pertain to Pokemon, so he moved them into this new thread.

 

[Mewter]

Everyone should just calm down.

It's a social thread. It shouldn't be missed.

 

[Falconv1.0]

...Why the hell are you here, Falcon? Literally every post I've seen by you in the PC has been ********, for lack of a better word. Kindly shut the **** up, stop trolling, and leave.

Flaming people you claim to be trolling sure gets you far doesn't it? I make posts about being frustrated because someone is saying something ignorant in my eyes, and I'm trolling, riiiight.

 

[CRASHiC]

Wow, Arti has no sarcasim indicator. He honestly thought I wanted Silent Verse to get credit and couldn't tell I was joking.

Falcon, everyone of your post in Pokecenter was MADE to cause response. that is the DEFINITION of trolling.

 

[Wave⁂]

Flaming people you claim to be trolling sure gets you far doesn't it? I make posts about being frustrated because someone is saying something ignorant in my eyes, and I'm trolling, riiiight.

Also, Firus could have just deleted the posts, why are they here?

 

[Firus]

Why not get in trouble for hardcore spam, and let the very small ones fly? If it's not completely ridiculous, I don't get why it matters. It just seems a bit overboard(lol pun) to me.

Spam is spam, and spam is against the Global Rules. Enforcing that isn't going overboard. There's a reason there's an infraction for Minor Spam and an infraction for Major Spam.

Why does this thread exist? Are the mods looking for feedback? No. Do they care about our wants? No. Is this discussion going to change anything? No. Will the Snorlax Room ever be re-open? No... allegedly

I already explained why this thread was created:

I'm trying to get all of this out into the open and discuss this so you guys understand what's going on instead of just going straight into revolution mode

But at this point we've ended in a circular argument and with everyone blaming everyone else and complaining because the Global Rules are being enforced, so I'm going to close it, at least until Spire comes back.

 

[Spire]

On the status of The Snorlax Room: it will remain closed until you guys can prove yourselves. Period. Socialize on UltiMario's server all you want, but until I see some ordination from the regulars here (outsiders who come in and post **** won't be detrimental to the progress of the PC, meaning your progress), no social thread.

Please remember that I've consistently spent time in the PC since I joined SWF. I care about this place and I care about you guys, but it is my job to enforce the global rules, and when I give warnings and no one listens time and again (really, I'm sure all of you remember seeing at least one of my, "please stop spamming guys or I'm going to start infracting," posts) consequences ensue. You brought this on yourselves, so only you can fix it.

 

[Tacel]

Dare I post after all of this?

Now, instead of pointing out what I think was done wrong, I'll point out a sollution.

- Be stricter. Give out more frequent infractions for spam. Nobody likes infractions, and those who receive them tend to attempt to clean up their act.
- Make a big, juicy announcement about infractions on spam being more frequent. Maybe make a thread (title in caps), sticky, and then lock. Everyone needs to see it. PM PokéCenter members if need be.
- Wait a couple days (give everybody time to see the announcement) and then unlock the Snorlax Room.
- Everybody happy!

I hope that I helped somehow.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Everyone should just calm down.

It's a social thread. It shouldn't be missed.

This.

It's a social thread people. It really isn't that big of a deal. If you really want to talk about some off-topic stuff then get on AIM or PM whatever's on your mind.

 

[UltiMario]

I don't think the rules say anywhere that you have to "earn" rights to a social thread. Technically I could go and make a thread right now "The Snorlax Room", and by global rules, you wouldn't be able to close it. Or do anything for that matter.

If you want us to follow the rules, Spire, you better start following them yourself. You're not as almighty as you're trying to make yourself out as when everyone realizes it's not just us that has to follow the rules, and you can't just make them up as you go along.

 

[Ryu Shimazu]

He has a point. (He could just start a new SR room)

By the way, can't you delete posts if you're a mod/Super Mod? You could just Delete posts + warnings, and eventual infractions.

God knows I've done my share of pointless posts probably, so coming from someone who has, that would work.

 

[Wave⁂]

I would like to point out that as the size of a community increases, so does the amount of spam and pointless one-liners. It's unavoidable.

In addition, Spire's premise that we are less productive than we were two years ago is utter bull****. SmashCAP, NU to OU, interviews, tournaments, OUR OWN ****ING GOD**** SERVER.

 

[Ryu Shimazu]

Not to mention all the good threads. Establishing a very successful Pokeswapping thread isn't easy. If you don't believe me, go to Gamespot. Also the Q&A is very helpful, and the Breeding thread is as well. I even learned something new a few days ago.

Just pointing out some DS/Wifi things on here that are nice.

Also, RMT is the best here than anywhere. Because of you guys, I have a sandstorm team I can actually win with. (Though it's going to change in B/W I'm sure)

But still, even though I'm focusing on Trainer Card, I've got an amazing BT team out of this place as well. And a few Pokes for my 'Dex.

 

[Firus]

I don't think the rules say anywhere that you have to "earn" rights to a social thread. Technically I could go and make a thread right now "The Snorlax Room", and by global rules, you wouldn't be able to close it. Or do anything for that matter.

If you want us to follow the rules, Spire, you better start following them yourself. You're not as almighty as you're trying to make yourself out as when everyone realizes it's not just us that has to follow the rules, and you can't just make them up as you go along.

Spire isn't making himself out to be "almighty" at all, and he's not breaking any rules by closing the Snorlax Room, so I don't know where you're getting that from.

I really don't know why you guys are so displaced by the closure of a Social Thread. It doesn't say anywhere in the rules that you have to earn a Social Thread because Social Threads aren't a granted right in the rules in the first place. Does it mean they're disallowed? No, but it means they aren't necessary either, and it means that keeping the thread closed if this spam continues isn't breaking the rules or making them up as we go along.

By the way, can't you delete posts if you're a mod/Super Mod? You could just Delete posts + warnings, and eventual infractions.

God knows I've done my share of pointless posts probably, so coming from someone who has, that would work.

Deleting and even editing posts is reserved for extreme situations, i.e. excessive spam, advertisements, inappropriate content, etc. Infractions and warnings yes, that was pretty much the point of the Announcement Spire made.

I would like to point out that as the size of a community increases, so does the amount of spam and pointless one-liners. It's unavoidable.

Maybe so, but that doesn't mean that as the community grows it's okay to start posting more pointlessly. It's not as if there are a ton of new members that are putting out the pointless one-liners, I'd say it's the veterans who are more guilty of it.

In addition, Spire's premise that we are less productive than we were two years ago is utter bull****. SmashCAP, NU to OU, interviews, tournaments, OUR OWN ****ING GOD**** SERVER.

We have projects out the wazoo, yes, but I'd say discussion was much more productive two years ago, which I'm pretty sure was the part to which Spire was referring.

Not to mention all the good threads. Establishing a very successful Pokeswapping thread isn't easy. If you don't believe me, go to Gamespot. Also the Q&A is very helpful, and the Breeding thread is as well. I even learned something new a few days ago.

Just pointing out some DS/Wifi things on here that are nice.

Also, RMT is the best here than anywhere. Because of you guys, I have a sandstorm team I can actually win with. (Though it's going to change in B/W I'm sure)

But still, even though I'm focusing on Trainer Card, I've got an amazing BT team out of this place as well. And a few Pokes for my 'Dex.

This is true, and we've had threads like that for a couple years now, and it's part of why Spire and I think the Poké Center is a good place and is capable of more than pointless spam and one-liners.

 

[Ryu Shimazu]

Deleting and even editing posts is reserved for extreme situations, i.e. excessive spam, advertisements, inappropriate content, etc. Infractions and warnings yes, that was pretty much the point of the Announcement Spire made.

Ah, I didn't know that. Learn something new every day. I just assumed you could delete posts and warn people if they messed up; it would definitely keep the whole "post count" thing from going out of hand.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

We have projects out the wazoo, yes, but I'd say discussion was much more productive two years ago, which I'm pretty sure was the part to which Spire was referring.

Hold on. The only possible reason why the '07-'08 PokeCenter was more "productive" in discussions was because there wasn't much to discuss. During that time, we pretty much had the Custom Pokemon Shop, the Next Gen. Ideas threads, the RMTs and RTPs. Granted these spawned HUGE discussions (especially the CPS and Next Gen. threads) but that was it. Everything else were the spammy "What is your favorite Water-type" threads that everyone took part in, which I can argue was more spammy back then that it was now. The RTPs weren't even supposed to be posted in back then, so they didn't contribute to discussions either. The current PokeCenter has a lot more topics to generate discussions on - SmashCAP, BOTW, our server, Black / White, just to name a few with the long-living RMTs. To say that the older PokeCenter was more discussion productive than current is not measuring the two phases on an equal level.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Tery, you suck. Stop double posting all the time you loser.

I / Smash World Forums hates my life.

 

[UltiMario]

This is true, and we've had threads like that for a couple years now, and it's part of why Spire and I think the Poké Center is a good place and is capable of more than pointless spam and one-liners.

Well, it was already doing well, so why did you change things and ruin it?

This place is suffering from Disco Room-idus. You change things to make them better, you make a terrible decision to do so, and end up making things worse.

 

[M.K]

What is better and worse in you people's opinion?
Your "better" is unsightly immature chaos, and your "worse" is a stricter environment that cracks down on this.
Make sure before you post that you have a clear understand of what is right and what is wrong.

Tery, discussion WAS more productive years ago. It doesn't matter that it was contained to a few threads, it's the fact that the majority of the posts weren't nonsense, spam, or unthoughtful crap. Having discussion in more than one location doesn't make it more productive.

And besides, theres your contradiction in itself. If you've got SO MANY AVENUES of discussion and thought, why is everyone in such a tiff about the Snorlax Room closing?
It's closed, move the **** on.

 

[UltiMario]

It's worse because of the sheer stupidity of the oxymoron that is banning socializing on a forum. It's not Spire trying to make things better, it's Spire just being stupidly harsh in order to achieve a goal that doesn't even make sense.

Also, we're 100x more productive now than years ago, you did what, have a huge-*** sprite thread, and that's it? That doesn't hold a candle to SmashCAP, the Tourneys that ACTUALLY FINISH NOW, NU to OU, and more. On post quality, it's the same as now. A majority of intelligent posts with a minority of others, so why crack down now rather than 2-3 years ago?

The Snorlax Room is a social thread, to SOCIALIZE. That's the point of the thread, and there isn't a force that can stop that.

I'm seeing this is getting nowhere. It doesn't look like the Snorlax Room will get unlocked due to Spire not stopping his hissyfit or whatever the hell happened to put him in the mood to lock it forever, so I'll just fix the problem myself, and by the rules, you can't do anything to stop it, since I'll be fixing it in a single post, which will not be stupid, pointless, annoying, but it IS a message. It'll follow all global rules, and it'll fix everything right up, and it'll definitely be for the good of he forum.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Tery, discussion WAS more productive years ago. It doesn't matter that it was contained to a few threads, it's the fact that the majority of the posts weren't nonsense, spam, or unthoughtful crap. Having discussion in more than one location doesn't make it more productive.

And besides, theres your contradiction in itself. If you've got SO MANY AVENUES of discussion and thought, why is everyone in such a tiff about the Snorlax Room closing?
It's closed, move the **** on.

Except I was only stating when I thought was more productive by Firus' standards. Everyone else is complaining, and I was bringing up a point to Firus' post.
I have not once complained about the closing of our social thread, in fact I have apologized to others because it was my fault that the thread was closed out in the first place.
I'm explaning the fact that we have more options so it shouldn't be that bad. People are just being dramatic.

 

[Zook]

I think the problem is is that there are two distinct groups which have formed in regards to what the Poke Center should be, and now that one of those groups is clearly in charge, the other is unhappy.

The first group wants the Pokemon Center to be an intellectual cocktail party. Generally, they have been here in the PC for quite a while. They desire that the PC becomes a creative hub, where everyone (for the most part) is taking place in one of our contests or projects. After all, the current PokeCenter culture is largely based on the Custom Pokemon Shop; wouldn't it make sense to stick to our creative roots?

The second group wants the Pokemon Center to be a Pokemon-themed Pool Room. Many of them believe that the community projects the first group starts oh so often are uninteresting, trivial, and/or pointless. From what I've seen, they believe the PC should be a place where we can chat a bit here, battle a bit there, set up a trade every now and then, and just generally have a good time. We all come to the Pokemon Center because we share and interest in Pokemon; shouldn't we be able to freely discuss it, no matter how inane it is?

Prior to recently, the two groups got along pretty well. The closure to the Snorlax Room, however, struck a huge gap between them. Most of the first group see this act as a way of 'cleansing the PokeCenter' in a way; with no thread made for off-topic posts, we aren't encouraging spam. The second group, though, generally sees it as a slap to the face, an act of getting rid of a place to just socialize.

How can we bring these two together again? Simple: create a new social room, but create and inforce rules. Mods should make sure that people aren't just posting one-liners. Pokemon discussion should be encouraged, but not mandatory. Make sure that people don't start to do what belongs in the Snorlax Room outside of the Snorlax room.

What I'm trying to say is that not everyone has the same 'ideal' for the PokeCenter, and no one should pretend that their way is what everyone wants. Some people like making up Pokemon and thinking about how certain Pokemon look like each other and whatnot; others don't.

First groupers, you may have power over this place, but you shouldn't try to force everyone else to join your projects.

Second groupers, stop spamming. You're making this place look like a spam board.

Everyone, make nice.

 

[Spire]

How can we bring these two together again? Simple: create a new social room, but create and inforce rules. Mods should make sure that people aren't just posting one-liners. Pokemon discussion should be encouraged, but not mandatory. Make sure that people don't start to do what belongs in the Snorlax Room outside of the Snorlax room.

This was my plan with "you'll earn your social thread back". Hence why the Snorlax Room will be locked forever, but if they play their cards right, they could get it back. Oh well, thanks for stealing my thunder

But otherwise Zook put it perfectly.

 

[UltiMario]

Apparently I'm an oddball, seeing as I'm somewhere in the middle of those two groups. Either that or Zook's details are just a BIT off, but the main idea is still rather solid.

I guess I beat Zook to it, we've got the new social thread, and hopefully we'll stay within the global rules for posting AND moderation.

So, with that back, assuming it stays there, would this conflict be resolved now? Socializing allowed and having global rules enforced, even if a bit more strictly, seems to put as at a balance somewhere.

Edit: And as soon as I post this, Spire goes and breaks the balance once again. Nice going there, mate.

 

[Mewter]

I think that if a social thread is allowed again, infraction-dishing should be more strict. It would be like a yard-stick to the wrist in that case, and could discourage additional "spammy behavior."

 

[Terywj [태리]]

I think that if a social thread is allowed again, infraction-dishing should be more strict. It would be like a yard-stick to the wrist in that case, and could discourage additional "spammy behavior."

I actually think that the results from the Snorlax Room should indicate that those people (myself included; probably first in mind) should be receiving infractions. Spire is too lenient.

 

[Wave⁂]

Spire, forgive me I don't believe the Snorlax Room will be re-opened for good behavior. You're obviously very mad at the community / some individuals. I would bet that you will never re-open a thread for which you do not care about, which you believe generates spam (since that must be why you closed), and which you believe is basically cancer.

Also Tery, if you get a 502 / 504 / other error, your post went through. Just re-open the thread in a new tab and refresh.

 

[UltiMario]

All I'm doing is trying to fix this mess.

All Spire's doing is being stubborn and denying us a right to try and fix it.

He agrees with what Zook says, and my Snorlax rooms follows the exact same ideals as the content in Zook's post, but he disagrees with me and locks my thread.

Someone explain this. Please.

 

[Spire]

Did I say you were ready for a new social thread? No. There is still a lot of murky water and until we clarify it, you get nothing. If anything, you've only prolonged your reward by making such a hasty move. You assume the conflict is just over; you leave loose ends untied and think that by taking the initiative to start a new social thread, that this would all be over. That's not how things work around here. In the courtroom, does the prosecuted stand up and to the judge, jury and audience say, "hey I have a solution so you guys don't need to worry about me anymore," NO. Patience is virtue and you show no evidence of sporting even an ounce of it.

Now I will ask you this: why do you need a social thread so badly that you break the level of respect that we uphold here and within this thread for eachother and for the Poké Center? Is it simply to defy Firus and myself? Is it because you absolutely need to socialize with the people here in a thread not dedicated to Pokémon specifically? Are you trying to prove something? And also, can you not simply wait until we decide when a social thread is appropriate?

Please, indulge me.