The Complete Mario Matchup Thread

[Mario_ 101]

Let me just slip in real quick a thing that I've noticed some of the scrubby jiggz I've fought do; they use rollout as a recovery move. Mario can FLUDD this throwing the trajectory of the attack off, and if jiggz doesn't land on the stage right after the move she'll probably fall down and die. Also Mario's n air goes through rollout pretty nicely.

 

[Inferno3044]

Lol noobpuffs.

We have actually done almost everyone B tier and up. Here's a list of people we didn't discuss in order of their tier list placement:

King Dedede
Pikachu (the Pikachu mains didnt show up)
Peach
Fox
Wolf
Shiek
Zelda
Ike
Lucas
Ness
Yoshi
C. Falcon
Link
Ganondorf

Personally I've heard of some good Peach players in the NJ/NY area so I guess my preferance is Peach. Either her or Lucas.

 

[jmanxiv]

I suggest D3 to get the top tiers done with

 

[A2ZOMG]

DDD is another straightforward matchup...don't get grabbed, juggle him, edgeguard him, and bait his grab so that you can punish him.

As for not getting shieldgrabbed, D-air is very valuable. DI behind him, follow up with N-air/U-air immediately afterwards for more shield pressure.

And reverse F-smash outranges his grab any day of the week. Bait that grab for a free F-smash.

 

[Inferno3044]

I used to think D3 wasn't hard without the infinite. I was wrong. Don't get grabbed with his broken grab range is is extremely difficult. What I do is camp like your life depends on it, try to bait the grab (which i heard if you SH cape they cant grab you. not sure how it works), and punish. Once you're in, keep the pressure. At low percents you can Utilt him to mid 30's or 40's and then Uair chain. Rack up the damage. Gimping him isn't extremely hard, but its not easy. My favorite thing to do against him is when he tries to ledgeguard me by using bairs then get a stage spike. At my skill level, I almost need a stage spike or gimp to beat D3.

If you stage strike for the first stage strike FD. It's not fun because it's a long stage and the CG will last longer causing damage. Ban Delfino. They can get walk off kills and wall infinites which are for some reason legal. If you don't ban that, then ban Castle Siege for the possible walkoffs. I think SV would be a pretty good CP. It's small and camping the platform would help.

I think we actually discussed this on their boards. They said 80:20 w/ infinite (which is normally banned) and 65:35 without it both in their favor of course.

Should I get the D3 mains?

 

[A2ZOMG]

I'd say 6/4 DDD. Even with the infinite, you can just mash out until really high percents at which you would be dying at anyway.

As I was saying though, D-air is a godsend since DDD basically can't shieldgrab it if you know what you're doing.

 

[jmanxiv]

D3 has pretty slow aerial movement but his bair has crazy priority, mario should just camp the hell out of him, and dair Ding behind him, also the crappy D3s can be caped when they recover

 

[hippiedude92]

You pretty much lose a stock if you get CG to the edge and edgeguard wall'd to death lol.

 

[Matador]

I'd say 6/4 DDD. Even with the infinite, you can just mash out until really high percents at which you would be dying at anyway.

As I was saying though, D-air is a godsend since DDD basically can't shieldgrab it if you know what you're doing.

Can you/Do you consistently do that?

 

[Mario_ 101]

Vs. D3 you have to be smart about your approach tactics (if you do HAVE to approach him) If you try to jump in right at him you'll get shieldgrabbed.. You have to be smart and space well to win this matchup, otherwise you'll get wrecked from his CG's.

 

[A17]

I play against JP all the time... my friend practically mained her after using her so long after a random selection of characters.

Rollouts for a recovery is a 80% chance she'll get caped.. on ground, simply cut it off with a fireball.
Fairs have more range than most of our aerials, except maybe for bair.. but it's gotta be timed.
I'd limit the use of Fair meteors, and use more bairs and uairs when she's off the stage, increasingly the likeliness that the aerial will finally send her off the stage. If that still doesn't kill her, if you've got FLUDD filled up and know when she's out of jumps, push her away with it as her up B probably won't save her.

In times where you find she's kicked you pretty far off the stage that you can't recover... if you find that you are positioned between her and the stage, start caping or fludd her in attempts to take her out as well.

Also, if they hop towards you, it's probably going to be a fair or bair, so I'd shieldgrab or smash that, whatever fits the situation

 

[jmanxiv]

The most important aspect of facing D3 is Spacing, if you play agressively and don't watch were you land D3 will destroy you.

 

[Inferno3044]

The most important aspect of facing D3 is Spacing, if you play agressively and don't watch were you land D3 will destroy you.

And due to the fact that my spacing is terrible unless I really think about, I'm bad at this.

The only ratio I see for this is 60:40 D3 w/o infinite. Does anyone else have a ratio? And what ratio w/ the infinite?

you guys just wanna move on to another character? I'm not 100% sure who's in my region but I will talk about any character.

 

[:mad:]

Watch those double posts, man.

I say we just move on, since there's no a lot you can do about Dedede.

 

[Matador]

I just want to know...

Is there anyone here who can consistently mash out of the infinite?

If so, then I think the matchup is 60:40 with and without the infinite.

 

[BSP]

I think mashing out would be pretty hard at the higher percents, but possible at lower.

I can't do it, i suck at getting out of grabs fast

 

[Inferno3044]

Watch those double posts, man.

I say we just move on, since there's no a lot you can do about Dedede.

Sorry about that. I meant to add it as an edit.

I just want to know...

Is there anyone here who can consistently mash out of the infinite?

If so, then I think the matchup is 60:40 with and without the infinite.

I think's its impossible to mash out of it until it stales. I played ADHD using D3 because he wanted to be gay with the infinite and I love him enough to not hold a grudge (probably the only reason he won). I got hit about three times before I mashed out and thats only at low percents. I highly doubt you can mash out of it at anytime. If that was true, any character can mash out of his CG's taking away that advantage. As said, it's like impossible to mash out at higher percents (like low hundreds) which you should be dying at anyways from a Utilt or something. With that, I say its 70:30 w/ infinite. I'm assuming it's agreed that it is 60:40 without it unless SHOOP DA WHOOOOOOP!! happens. Stole that from the D3 boards.

 

[HeroMystic]

I just want to know...

Is there anyone here who can consistently mash out of the infinite?

o/

With a quick enough reaction, I can get out within the jab up until 120%. At that point though it wouldn't really matter.

 

[Famous]

I just want to know...

Is there anyone here who can consistently mash out of the infinite?

I can but the matchup still sucks...Didn't we do this matchup already?

 

[Inferno3044]

o/

With a quick enough reaction, I can get out within the jab up until 120%. At that point though it wouldn't really matter.

Well I guess that's true, but won't he still grab you a few times racking up some extremely easy,inescapable damage? I think it might have to stale to get out easier.

I can but the matchup still sucks...Didn't we do this matchup already?

The D3 boards did it. Not us.

 

[Famous]

Wow really?...I need to catch up on the boards

 

[Matt07]

Someone give a shout to the Dedede boards to help us discuss more stuff.

 

[Inferno3044]

I think I put it on their social thread since they locked their MU discussion. I know I posted it there, but I got no reply. Is 70:30 Dedede w/ infinite sound reasonable?

 

[Matador]

o/

With a quick enough reaction, I can get out within the jab up until 120%. At that point though it wouldn't really matter.

I can but the matchup still sucks...Didn't we do this matchup already?

You guys need to teach me.
Every time I mash enough to break out, I end up doing something ******** like Fludding afterwards.

What do you press, and when do you start mashing?

 

[Famous]

I rotate the analog while pressing a,x,y and z...

I may be pressing the R trigger as well sometimes

 

[Inferno3044]

I rotate the analog while pressing a,x,y and z...

I may be pressing the R trigger as well sometimes

Do you break out before he does a Dthrow once or after he does it a couple of times? That's what I really want to know.

 

[Famous]

You either break out right before he does D-throw or right when he grabs you the 2nd time...You have to be quick about it though

 

[Inferno3044]

You either break out right before he does D-throw or right when he grabs you the 2nd time...You have to be quick about it though

You have some fast fingers then. Too bad I doubt this would work for the regular CG because its so much quicker since he doesn't have to pummel. Famous, what's your opinion of the ratio with the infinite since you might be the only one of us who are quick enough to do it that quickly?


EDIT: quick enough to do it that quickly? No wonder I do bad in english. If this MU is done. Let's move on. It's practically Pikachu, Peach, Fox, Wolf, Shiek, and low tiers. If we wanna do a really quick one, Kirin could just make a giant post for Link. Pikachu might be a threat though. Whatever you guys decide.

 

[Matt07]

Hmm...I'm thinking Peachy next.

 

[Inferno3044]

I'm putting 70:30 Dedede w/ infinite unless anybody says otherwise.

Peach discussion starts now.

 

[:mad:]

It's 95:5 with the infinite.

Guaranteed damage into a kill move means you will probably lose.

 

[HeroMystic]

95:5 is lol, but I don't see this budging from 70:30. Considering D3's kill strength (freaken U-tilt) and how incredibly easy for him to rack up damage, and how Mario has very limited options... yeah.

 

[Inferno3044]

It's 95:5 with the infinite.

Guaranteed damage into a kill move means you will probably lose.

That's just crazy. w/ infinite means you really gotta focus on your spacing. And play somewhere with platforms. Do NOT play this on FD. Probably his worst stage is Norfair but if it's banned like it is in NJ, then go to Brinstar or Yoshi's. Also, you can button mash out of it like Famous said.

Matchup over. Peach is next cuz Matt says so and nobody else said anything.

 

[Veggi]

Matchup is 50:50 imo. I've played this matchup a lot against a Peach from the Peach boards named BattleTanx Commander or something along the lines of that. It was on wifi, but eh, it was a green connection.

Peach is hard to edgeguard because she can just keep coming back if you cape or FLUDD her and her horizontal recovery is ridiculously good. That means she'll be making it back from all of the aerials you hit her with. The only way she won't make it back is if you meteor her, but her recovery is versatile enough that fair'ing her will be difficult. Even though it's doubtful you'll ever gimp her, you can tack on a lot of damage while she's off stage. FLUDD is a very nice tool to halt one of her aerials and give you a chance to knock her back out. If you FLUDD Peach while she's floating, she goes up to an uncomfortable position that makes her much easier to hit back out and also makes her waste her float.

Up b OOS is useful to nail the dead time Peach has from when she hits your shield to the time she touches the ground and it's also useful to knock her out of her float camping. Fireballs are an advantage, but not that major, she doesn't have much of a problem getting around them, but fireballs are still pretty good as an approach tool.

Cape isn't very good in the matchup, it's near useless for gimping because it gives her parasol and float extra vertical distance, she can literally just hold torward you while she's in her parasol and no matter how many times you cape her, she just floats back. Against her aerials, it's probably best to FLUDD them, wait for them to be over or out space them with an fsmash.

Kill wise, Mario has the advantage, his fsmash will kill early and it's nice if you can knock her out of one of her aerials with it or if she misses an fsmash. Up angled fsmash is better to knock her out of her aerials. Mario can set up up smash or an aerial if he hits Peach while she is attacking with an aerial. This is useful for getting a kill. Mario can also get some kills if you up smash her when she tries to come down on you.

Peach's recovery is much better than Mario's and Peach is rather good at edgeguarding. Peach is also really good at edgehogging, she can latch back on with her short second jump quickly or float at level with the edge and grab it when you up b. Mario needs the edge pretty bad, so it's not good for him. Turnips are also a threat while Mario is offstage, cape them or airdodge if you have enough time to get back. Sometimes avoiding the turnips can be very inconvenient though.

 

[hova]

Peach ***** Mario

the end.

 

[Veggi]

You main Ness.

 

[Matt07]

I've seen some tournaments results from Hova, I'm fairly certain he plays Peach.

 

[Inferno3044]

Where did you get that completely false fact? It's probably even. If not then its 55:45 Peach at worst. I don't have much Peach experience but from what I know, I don't think it's Mario's advantage and it sounds even from what Veggi said. I can be wrong though.

 

[Veggi]

I've seen some tournaments results from Hova, I'm fairly certain he plays Peach.

I have been fooled.

Well played, hova. Well played.

 

[hova]

i got my false facts from playing Boss's scrubby azz Mario

Boss sucks, Mario is tight

Peach ***** Mario

I once gimped Azen with a triple cape in Mario dittos

too goodz??