The Complete Mario Matchup Thread

[aeghrur]

Lmao, somebody must've Bokurolled you A2. This fight's always rather exciting for me. You just can't let them run around.

Best tools vs Sonic are Ftilt, fireball, and SHNair. All 3 are good at keeping his spindash at bay; fireball stops it and Ftilt/Nair plow right through. This particular insanely iconic pairing is pretty even in the sense that neither party can play the way they normally would vs the other. Mario can thoroughly keep Sonic's approaches predictable with fireballs/Nairs/Ftilts, and they rack up damage at generally the same speed. We also kill a fair bit earlier with Fsmash and Usmash. Keep your Usmash fresh. I cannot stress this enough. Having a fresh Usmash is like having a full bucket for oil panic in this matchup. Usmash eats right though most of Sonic's attacks and is about as fast. It'll also be killing around 130-140%.

On the other white-gloved five-fingered hand, we have Sonic who will rarely be gimped but will actually be the gimp artist in this matchup because of his insane recovery. Spring will usually be a successful gimp if your second jump is gone, but if you conserve your recovery options, it shouldn't be too big a deal. Another thing to mention, when Mario Fsmashes, the shieldstun and moderately low cooldown is typically sufficient enough to avoid any staggering damage in most cases. Sonic is an exception, meaning Sonic can punish pretty much anything with a grab, which can also mean a free 20% for him. Therefore, only Fsmash when you're sure. Also remember than good Sonic players will have you walking right into their Fsmashes with their haXX0rZ mindgames...so learn to read their intentions.

Finally, cape isn't AS effective in this matchup as most others because of how slow it is and how ineffective it is for gimping Sonic (teardrop). However, if you catch a Sonic offstage without his doublejump using his sideB, for God's sake cape him. It's a free KO. He's moving extremely slow and is begging for the cape. By all means, oblige his wavering stock's final request. Cape the **** out of him.

Edit: Also, their best stage is Yoshi's. FD is good for them too, but they can do some ******** **** on Yoshis. Ban that if you don't feel comfortable playing that stage. I swear I didn't mean to type this much.

<3 This man is sooooooooooooo right.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I like this...

So therefore, no character except Ness, squirtle, charizard, olimar and maybe lucas are going to be KO'ing you if you shield camp lol?

Goes for Sonic in particular considering all his KO moves are really slow and not all that safe on shields.

majority of characters, Sonics throws happen to put the enemy in very unfavourable positions. a d/bthrow at the edge is going to limit your options a lot and uthrow becomes a game of chance whether the sonic player reads or predicts an airdodge to KO from it. Not too many characters have multiple throws (that dont KO) which put the enemy in a variety of comprimising positions. His throws may not outright KO you but they dont give you many choices in how you want to recover from them, lest you get KO'd from the follow up aerial

D-throw sucks (tech in front of him and punish). B-throw sucks even more for offstage positioning since it doesn't do anything special except make them face backwards, which often works in favor of the recovering character when they have a more spammable back-air. U-throw -> U-air is complete BS and nearly impossible for Sonic to land unless his opponent is stupid.

Mario doesn't have surefire ways to KO from shieldcamping either, but he has better throws in general (B-throw KOs earlier than any of Sonic's throws, Mario's D-throw is more problematic for the most part), and more reliable shield pressure and out of shield options. And better mindgames on shield for setting up into KO moves for that matter.

 

[vato_break]

Actually, how about this.

Are any of you familiar with JWN3D? He's a Mario from Vegas... pretty good... good enough to get on the Vegassmash PR... granted with T.Link as a back-up, but regardless he can get it done...

Still doesn't ring any bells...? I don't want to continue on with my idea if none of you haven't even heard of the guy, but it's understandable, Vegas is like in the middle of nowhere for WC, and anything further than that is just "lol wtf that's uncharted?"

i've heard of jwn3d pretty good mario.3rd best WC mario =)

 

[Camalange]

Good luck with that Camal, Boss quit playing Barlw.

This makes me not want to post anymore.

That being said, fireball camping is good. They come out pretty fast, and stop him from running around with impunity. D-air is also good since it's hard for him to react to and good for punishing his lag. N-air is also awesome for its priority.

So like...I was following what you were saying until...

The main thing in this matchup is as long as you are shielding, he can't do anything that can kill you. He has to trick you or punish something laggy to land a KO move.

lolwtfwhuuut?

Just a reminder that SH Fireballs aren't all that great. Use them sparingly. They are rather slow and Sonic can easily run and powershield them. It's best used to try and interrupt an approach or something, not as a camp from the other side of the stage tool.

Don't play this matchup on FD just because it's completely gay and unfun.

FD is good against Mario, yes. lol

Best tools vs Sonic are Ftilt, fireball, and SHNair.

I disagree with Ftilt, I do agree with Nair, Bair, Dair, and Fireball.

All 3 are good at keeping his spindash at bay; fireball stops it and Ftilt/Nair plow right through.

Well, Sonic won't be approaching with Spindash, it's used as a punisher. But if a Sonic gets to hasty with it, Mario certainly has enough options to stop it I suppose, but that's nothin' huge cuz just about any attack can beat a Spindash ^_^

We also kill a fair bit earlier with Fsmash and Usmash. Keep your Usmash fresh. I cannot stress this enough. Having a fresh Usmash is like having a full bucket for oil panic in this matchup. Usmash eats right though most of Sonic's attacks and is about as fast. It'll also be killing around 130-140%.

Mario does have better onstage killing options than Sonic. Probably Mario's biggest advantage, but I'll go more into that later.

On the other white-gloved five-fingered hand, we have Sonic who will rarely be gimped but will actually be the gimp artist in this matchup because of his insane recovery. Spring will usually be a successful gimp if your second jump is gone, but if you conserve your recovery options, it shouldn't be too big a deal. Another thing to mention, when Mario Fsmashes, the shieldstun and moderately low cooldown is typically sufficient enough to avoid any staggering damage in most cases. Sonic is an exception, meaning Sonic can punish pretty much anything with a grab, which can also mean a free 20% for him. Therefore, only Fsmash when you're sure. Also remember than good Sonic players will have you walking right into their Fsmashes with their haXX0rZ mindgames...so learn to read their intentions

^^this. Mario has better onstage killing options that Sonic, meaning better range and KO power, but Sonic can kill very efficiently offstage, and you won't ever be gimping him.

Finally, cape isn't AS effective in this matchup as most others because of how slow it is and how ineffective it is for gimping Sonic (teardrop). However, if you catch a Sonic offstage without his doublejump using his sideB, for God's sake cape him. It's a free KO. He's moving extremely slow and is begging for the cape. By all means, oblige his wavering stock's final request. Cape the **** out of him.

lmao, this is true. I just hope Sonics aren't foolish enough to use a SideB to recover with no double jump xD however it does happen through misteaks and the like, so go for it xD

Edit: Also, their best stage is Yoshi's. FD is good for them too, but they can do some ******** **** on Yoshis. Ban that if you don't feel comfortable playing that stage. I swear I didn't mean to type this much.

This is also true. Mario's best bets are probably Smashville and BF (although BF is my favorite stage >_>)

All Sonics do is bait. Just stand there, and let them come to you, don't even bother fireballing imo.

The moment they come to you, throw out a shnair it outprioritizes everythign they have.

oh don't let them get stock or % lead, they intend to run out the clock trust me lol.

Bokurolled?

Well, in either case, Sonic has a shield...Nair is a safe shield pressure option, but Sonic's whole metagame revolves around approaching with shield, like KID said. Fair/Uair OoS are both very good options for Sonic, as well as OoS grab (poor range, but Sonic has a fantastic grab game)

Goes for Sonic in particular considering all his KO moves are really slow and not all that safe on shields.

Mario may have better kill moves with Fsmash and Usmash, but Sonic's Fsmash still has great range. No guaranteed set ups, but considering most of our kills will be coming from things like Bair edgeguarding, Dair semi-spiking, Stage spiking, etc, I think there's a good balance here which both characters can kill in their respective domain. Mario kills onstage, Sonic kills offstage.

D-throw sucks (tech in front of him and punish).

Not all characters benefit from the Dthrow tech. I can verify later tonight if Mario can do anything out of it, but for most characters DI up is the best responce to a Dthrow.

B-throw sucks even more for offstage positioning since it doesn't do anything special except make them face backwards, which often works in favor of the recovering character when they have a more spammable back-air.

That doesn't sound like it "sucks" to me. Sounds like it's doing it's job of getting you offstage.

lol, just because it leaves your back towards us, you really think just doing a Bair after Bthrow will destory all chances of followup? Bthrow throws you far away and is used to get you offstage, so it's not like we plan on just aggro rushing you down after a Bthrow. We then get into gimp/edgeguard mode, which is where Sonic excels.

U-throw -> U-air is complete BS and nearly impossible for Sonic to land unless his opponent is stupid.

The only time Sonic's go straight for Uthrow > Uair is when you are at 0%, which is guaranteed to hit.

Sonic can do a lot out of Uthrow. Say you decide you're just going to airdodge. That's easy enough to punish with another regrab or delayed aerial since it leaves you so low to the ground. Nothin' special.

But say you want to just Nair or Dair immediatley after the throw to stop any followups. Sonic can bait this reaction but foxtrotting away and starting a sideB, acting as if he might attack with it, instead he shield cancels it to block your aerial, shield grabs, and continues doing his thing.

I know this kinda counts into "mindtricks" but let's think about it. These are the options Sonic has out of throws, and if you're going to come in here with the crap about Sonic getting beaten out by Shield camping and that his grabs suck, it makes me laugh.

Mario has a good Dthrow > Juggle game along with a few mixups that work well at low percents, like pivot grabs/utilts whatever, so if we're including those, we'll include Sonics.

Please don't try and argue that Sonic has a bad grab game.

Mario doesn't have surefire ways to KO from shieldcamping either, but he has better throws in general (B-throw KOs earlier than any of Sonic's throws, Mario's D-throw is more problematic for the most part), and more reliable shield pressure and out of shield options. And better mindgames on shield for setting up into KO moves for that matter.

I still don't get if you're trying to say that characters in Brawl can only kill with throws. In this case I could say any character can't kill if I stay in shield, and considering both our characters have grab followups and OoS options, we can drop this subject now.

>__<

 

[A2ZOMG]

lolwtfwhuuut?

Just a reminder that SH Fireballs aren't all that great. Use them sparingly. They are rather slow and Sonic can easily run and powershield them. It's best used to try and interrupt an approach or something, not as a camp from the other side of the stage tool.

That's all Fireballs need to do. They come out fast enough to interrupt approaches.

That doesn't sound like it "sucks" to me. Sounds like it's doing it's job of getting you offstage.

Anybody can easily DI Sonic's B-throw, basically making it near-useless since ANYONE can recover easily from that with the exception of like...Link.

lol, just because it leaves your back towards us, you really think just doing a Bair after Bthrow will destory all chances of followup? Bthrow throws you far away and is used to get you offstage, so it's not like we plan on just aggro rushing you down after a Bthrow. We then get into gimp/edgeguard mode, which is where Sonic excels.

Still more options for Mario to use, as if he didn't have enough to get back safely in the first place. You can't gimp a good Mario that knows how to DI unless your name is Metaknight or G&W.

Sonic can do a lot out of Uthrow. Say you decide you're just going to airdodge. That's easy enough to punish with another regrab or delayed aerial since it leaves you so low to the ground. Nothin' special.

Oh cool, and Mario can do this better with his lower-lag aerials (srsly, Mario's D-air is awesome) and more flexible aerial mobility.

Please don't try and argue that Sonic has a bad grab game.

If Sonic had anything that resembled a good grab game, he would probably be high tier. But he doesn't, so obviously he's mediocre. Sonic can rarely, if ever KO you after getting a grab since all his throws are weak and have extremely unreliable setups. This is why shielding a lot against him works, since his reward for getting past shield is rather low overall.

Mario's setups aren't particularly reliable either, but his grab game overall is more practical for positioning (Mario's F-throw is also more useful than Sonic's due to better angle, I mentioned D-throw too), and if necessary, KOing since Mario can usually KO most characters at 160% with a B-throw.

I still don't get if you're trying to say that characters in Brawl can only kill with throws. In this case I could say any character can't kill if I stay in shield, and considering both our characters have grab followups and OoS options, we can drop this subject now.

Mario overall has better options from grab (marginally better setups, and a more existent option to KO from grab), and his OOS options BY FAR are superior especially when cross-ups are factored.

Oh yeah and whatever, this matchup was already beaten to death. I'll leave it at neutral or 55/45 Mario.

 

[Kinzer]

Oh, I thought JWN3D would be unheard of. I don't even know how many YT vidjas he has, if any, that's the problem with Vegas... nobody records (or anymore). :<

Well, I don't know how much respect you all have for him or how good you think he is, but since he's right in my city I'll see if I can get a couple of matches with him... I did play him sometime ago where we went even (and long before that he would be 3-stocking me 'cause I sucked :<). I wasn't paying attention to what he would do/what I could take advantage of back then since it was just a couple of friendlies, but the next chance I get I'll be sure to pay extra attention to how the match is played out and if any of you want my opinion on the MU after that, I'll give it to you. :3

Also TC1, are you here by some chance...? Or maybe you're Vato-Break on SWF...?

 

[da K.I.D.]

Mario's Fireballs/D-air say "hi".

D-air keep in mind is safe on block. Links to either a N-air or U-air before he lands, which is also pretty safe on block.

Links to either a N-air or U-air before he lands, which is also pretty safe on block

which is also pretty safe on block

pretty safe on block

rofl. i dont think ive ever heard that term before. either its safe or its not

 

[A2ZOMG]

D-air's safety, like many attacks, depends on the matchup. Vs someone like Bowser, obviously it's not very safe, but against Sonic who doesn't have a very fast B-air, it's perfectly safe. Either way, it's quite difficult to punish out of shield on reaction even if you do have a fast enough option since Mario can N-air or U-air before he hits the ground, and even if you hold shield through that, he can Jab before you can do anything else (assuming Mario lands behind you, which he almost always will when he spaces D-air).

I'd like to see Sonic attempt to compare to that...not forgetting that Mario has a 3 frame Up-B and a 9 frame Up-smash.

 

[vato_break]

Oh, I thought JWN3D would be unheard of. I don't even know how many YT vidjas he has, if any, that's the problem with Vegas... nobody records (or anymore). :<

Well, I don't know how much respect you all have for him or how good you think he is, but since he's right in my city I'll see if I can get a couple of matches with him... I did play him sometime ago where we went even (and long before that he would be 3-stocking me 'cause I sucked :<). I wasn't paying attention to what he would do/what I could take advantage of back then since it was just a couple of friendlies, but the next chance I get I'll be sure to pay extra attention to how the match is played out and if any of you want my opinion on the MU after that, I'll give it to you. :3

Also TC1, are you here by some chance...? Or maybe you're Vato-Break on SWF...?

No i am not tc1, but i can see why you would get us confused

Anywho i have my fair share of experience vs a couple socal sonics (2quik,phoenix).What i know from the matchup is you can't let sonic get a lead because you will simply be unable to hit him due to his fast ground speed and this forces you to approach him and in my opinion this is where sonic shows his true color...Moves i tend to use alot in this match are alot of fireballs,dairs,nairs.the only way mario will gimp sonic is if he spikes him or grabs him out of his upB which both are pretty difficult.Mario can kill a bit earlier and has quite a few setup's to do so.I say this matchup is even...if mario didn't have a projectile this would lean in sonics favor but, fireball spam is very effective against sonic because sonic is left with fewer options.Agianst sonic i suggest going to a small stage so he can't run away >_> 50:50.

 

[da K.I.D.]

D-air's safety, like many attacks, depends on the matchup. Vs someone like Bowser, obviously it's not very safe, but against Sonic who doesn't have a very fast B-air, it's perfectly safe. Either way, it's quite difficult to punish out of shield on reaction even if you do have a fast enough option since Mario can N-air or U-air before he hits the ground, and even if you hold shield through that, he can Jab before you can do anything else (assuming Mario lands behind you, which he almost always will when he spaces D-air).

I'd like to see Sonic attempt to compare to that...not forgetting that Mario has a 3 frame Up-B and a 9 frame Up-smash.

i dont play many marios but what I do know is that i dont think theres a character in the game that can attack from the air, hit sonics shield, land behind him, AND NOT get hit by an up air out of shield.

i believe his up air is 5 frames

oh yea. and i agree with just about everything vato said, tho I think sonic beats mario slightly, but thats just me

 

[A2ZOMG]

i dont play many marios but what I do know is that i dont think theres a character in the game that can attack from the air, hit sonics shield, land behind him, AND NOT get hit by an up air out of shield.

Don't be stupid. Mario gets to SH D-air, THEN N-air or U-air BEFORE he hits the ground, and then once he's behind you after N-airing or U-airing, he gets to Jab. You're pretty much not punishing his D-air on your shield without a good Up-B out of shield.

i believe his up air is 5 frames

Up-air is then at least 10 frames from a jump. Assuming Sonic's jump out of shield is 7 frames or so, that means it comes out frame 12. Mario only has a -6 advantage from perfectly landing a N-air/U-air right above the ground (which is easily achieved through SH D-air). If he is behind you, your fastest out of shield option (grab) is useless and you are stuck in a frame DISADVANTAGE.

Basically Mario has better options on shield, better OOS option, fireballs, better KO moves, while Sonic just....runs away the entire time and doesn't have much of anything that really stands out otherwise.

 

[da K.I.D.]

sonic can up air between marths SH double fairs, why cant he do the same between marios aerials?

 

[A2ZOMG]

sonic can up air between marths SH double fairs, why cant he do the same between marios aerials?

Marth has at least 20 frames of lag between SH double F-airs.

Mario only has 10 or so frames of lag between D-air -> U-air/N-air.

Obvious winner on shields is Mario.

 

[da K.I.D.]

Marth has at least 20 frames of lag between SH double F-airs.

Mario only has 10 or so frames of lag between D-air -> U-air/N-air.

Obvious winner on shields is Mario.

exact numbers would be nice

 

[A2ZOMG]

Hmmmm...

perfectly buffered U-air out of shield from Sonic comes out at frame 11 at best. add another 4-5 frames for reaction time and needing to reach the C stick to properly execute, that's more like frame 15-16.

Now no good Mario main is ever going to mess up the buffer time for D-air->N-air. D-air has a -10 advantage from our frame data, so D-air -> N-air has just a -13 advantage. Basically you have a 2 frame window to perfectly execute something that is very difficult to buffer that has relatively low reward and moderate risk. Overall I'd say Mario is significantly safer here.

 

[Camalange]

Anybody can easily DI Sonic's B-throw, basically making it near-useless since ANYONE can recover easily from that with the exception of like...Link.

Um...hence why it's used to GET YOU OFFSTAGE THEN EDGEGUARD OR GIMP. What is there not to understand? You act like this game is about One Grab = One Stock. Not every character is ICs.

Still more options for Mario to use, as if he didn't have enough to get back safely in the first place. You can't gimp a good Mario that knows how to DI unless your name is Metaknight or G&W.

Yes, because Mario's recovery is so incredible >_>

I'll give props that Mario's UpB is a very safe attack due to it's high priority, but remember that Dair semi-spike thing I mentioned? Yeah, that's enough to kill Mario...that's how I gimped Boss on his first stock.

I'm not bragging because I still lost the set to him (thanks to Luigi), I'm just pointing out I have experience against who was the best Mario.

1. If Sonic had anything that resembled a good grab game, he would probably be high tier. 2. But he doesn't, so obviously he's mediocre. Sonic can rarely, if ever KO you after getting a grab since all his throws are weak and have extremely unreliable setups.

1. You are brilliant.

2. Yeah, because Mario is so high on the tier list himself. +8

3. I never said that Sonic would kill with grabs. Why would I have to? As mentioned, this game isn't about getting a grab and killing, I don't understand your mindset. You act like people don't get hit by smash attacks. That's why they're in the game, TO KILL. Sonic has good enough grabs and speed in order to follow up and give you a hard time. You sir have never played a half decent Sonic.

This is why shielding a lot against him works, since his reward for getting past shield is rather low overall.

Grabs? Sonic has a great grab game. Or not, because you know so much about Sonic.

Mario's setups aren't particularly reliable either, but his grab game overall is more practical for positioning (Mario's F-throw is also more useful than Sonic's due to better angle, I mentioned D-throw too), and if necessary, KOing since Mario can usually KO most characters at 160% with a B-throw.

I'm not denying that Mario has a good grab game, but I still don't get why I have to worry so much about dieing to a Bthrow against Mario, or killing YOU with a throw...

You say that no good Mario that can DI will get gimped. I can say no Sonic will die at 160% from a Bthrow because Sonic has one of the best Momentum Cancels. FF Fair to DownB is great. DownB cancels ALL MOMENTUM UPON RELEASE. Sonic can live to very high percents, and add that to his amazing recovery I'm not so worried about gimping Mario...it's not too difficult.

Mario overall has better options from grab (marginally better setups, and a more existent option to KO from grab), and his OOS options BY FAR are superior especially when cross-ups are factored.

I agree that Mario has safer OoS options, and I already covered my opinions about each character's grab game.

Oh yeah and whatever, this matchup was already beaten to death. I'll leave it at neutral or 55/45 Mario.

55/45 it is then, because I do feel Mario has a SLIGHT advantage. I'm done here.

 

[vato_break]

What does posting haunter mean? Does it add more importance to your post? just wondering..

 

[KirinBlaze]

It's a Sonic Boards thing. Kinda like our LOLNESS.

I've played plenty of Sonic's in Tournament. This is 55:45 Mario. We have a SLIGHT advantage since we can camp him and since our Nair stops a lot of his approaches. Other then that it's pretty even in terms of what one can do to the other and vise versa. I still find the Match-Up incredibly boring though. xD

 

[Browny]

Sonic's dair semi spike is good hopefully soon enough people will recognise it and put it as like, his 4th KO move behind f/dsmash and bair lol

 

[Camalange]

It's a Sonic Boards thing. Kinda like our LOLNESS.

I've played plenty of Sonic's in Tournament. This is 55:45 Mario. We have a SLIGHT advantage since we can camp him and since our Nair stops a lot of his approaches. Other then that it's pretty even in terms of what one can do to the other and vise versa. I still find the Match-Up incredibly boring though. xD

^^
and yes, the story behind Haunter is too long and too mindblowing.

Kirin, it's a shame you can't go to No Maps :/ I wanted to play your Mario/Link combo.

 

[Matador]

Omg the Sonic boards. They always deliver ^_^

No offense to Shado or Boss, who I love dearly....

....pause....

But I don't know if Boss knows the Sonic matchup as Mario or plays it as well as he should. The times that I've played Kojin, Shado, and SM5 we've gone pretty even, though we admittedly (and regrettably) haven't been able to sit down and have a ****-load of friendlies. Either way, I find that the matchup is very much even, and have from the start. The only reason I'd give Mario the nod would be Usmash being so amazing for KOs, which is so incredibly important for this matchup since it's the only distinct advantage we have. The whole camping thing is really dependent on the Sonic's playstyle...and whether or not they'll really let you run away and fireball them to death.

 

[Famous]

Lol, Boss only played MalcomM at CoT4 and all matches went to the last stock...Same thing happened when I played Malcom at Apex...

I've played both Malcom and Kojin after pools for around 3 hours straight and I can draw up some conclusions

Mario ground game completely topples Sonics, especially on small sized stages such as battlefield...All of Sonic's approaches can be stopped just with Nair.

Sonic can be good for gimps offstage at times since he has the ability to clip our 2nd jump away with the last piece of his Fair...

Its hard to kill sonics with a spike mid percentages due to his insane vertical recovery...I remember pulling off many spikes just to see malcom/kojin upb grabbing the ledge

Sonic only has 3 kill moves while we can kill sonic with a variety of moves including Utilt and Dair...

Meh, I can go into the Mario/Sonic matchup meta-game but I'm too tired atm

EDIT
As far as the matchup being boring...It wasn't really boring at all playing Malcom/Kojin...It was fun showing/learning new set-ups as we played...It really depends on the player I guess

 

[KirinBlaze]

^^
and yes, the story behind Haunter is too long and too mindblowing.

Kirin, it's a shame you can't go to No Maps :/ I wanted to play your Mario/Link combo.

Yeah work's a *****. :\
I'll be at SNES and Viridian City though. :D
Lawz said you guys might be at VC.

 

[Matador]

EDIT
As far as the matchup being boring...It wasn't really boring at all playing Malcom/Kojin...It was fun showing/learning new set-ups as we played...It really depends on the player I guess

Yeah, always seemed to be a fun matchup to me.

 

[Veggi]

I think the amusement I get from that matchup will die down in time. The first time I played a good Sonic it was rather awkward playing against him. He would repeatedly put springs under where I spawned, so I would fly up in the air and be like "omg!! Don't die!". It scared me really bad the first time he did that to me. Also, I thought spin shotting was when you used down b and then pressed up until I played with him. I've never actually seen someone use spin shot before until that time, lol.

 

[jmanxiv]

Fire balls break SOnics momentum and mario has a better air game. Sonics last long but can't KO marii.

 

[Inferno3044]

From all of this, 55:45 Mario sounds right. I have appreciation for Sonic mains now since they will give input but not say things dumb like its 65:35 Sonic.

 

[_Kadaj_]

http://allisbrawl.com/video/video.aspx?id=20538

Lol

 

[Camalange]

Yeah work's a *****. :\
I'll be at SNES and Viridian City though. :D
Lawz said you guys might be at VC.

Yeah, hopefully we can go to VC. That would be loads of fun ^_^

 

[Inferno3044]

I'll probably be at VC, but probably not SNES cuz I don't have anybody to give me a ride

 

[hippiedude92]

Hm I got 2-0'd by Kai's Sonic in low tier singles lol. And Kirin said he went close up with him and basically gave him a Mario practice. I have alot of Wes practice but after playing Kai, it looks pretty boring imo lol.

Took me a while to realize after my 2nd stock in game 2 on Frigate cp, to what l was doing wrong lol. MU is looks so repetitive though. Basically he just really baits you and you just **** up because your too slow >_>.

Btw Kai's **** with Sonic.

 

[Inferno3044]

With Sonic, it's really about not making mistakes and keeping your guard up. If you screw up, he will punish you. Obviously the way to stop this is to always have your guard up and don't mess up, but that's impossible. We are human and we make mistakes. Another way to help is to stop his momentum. Any way possible will help. SHnair, fireballs, and FLUDD will help. I've played some people and I lost because I couldn't stop their momentum. If you stop it, then it will be easier. We kill better and have a better air game.

 

[Camalange]

FLUDD won't work on Sonic, he's too fast for that xD
It won't be gimping, and it pretty much gives Sonic a free grab.

 

[KirinBlaze]

FSMASH THAT SPINDASH.
All day son.

 

[hippiedude92]

Sonic should be banned from low tier events lol.

 

[KirinBlaze]

Why? He's terrible.

 

[Inferno3044]

Sonic is mid tier now. It's supposed to be PT and below. Whether he should be mid tier or not is not my care.

 

[KirinBlaze]

Everyone, including most Sonic Mains, know Sonic is know where near as good as some of the people he's Ranked with. Yes he is good and can be quite devastating in the correct hands, however when being compared as a Character to most of the cast he is in fact quite bad. Sonic Mains just got their **** together and did work in tournament. Much like we have to do if we wish to see your character take his rightful place in Mid Tier.

 

[Inferno3044]

Kirin you better show up at VC. I'm probably gonna suck, but you should represent

 

[KirinBlaze]

Don't worry, I'll be there. The venue is only like..not even an hour away. I was surprised when I learned how close it was.