The "Ask ChuDat" thread!

[zFlashyStyle]

Ok thankz bro~

 

[Kappy]

I know Chu's covered this, and he actually addressed it in his 'CG' answer section, but please, please remember that Kirby has no chain grabs. He has one guaranteed follow up, and that's Fthrow->Uair. If you have good SDI, anyone can get out of Kirby's combo after Uair. Anyone who gets a regrab (even on Falco) with a buffered Uair means that your opponent has less than stellar SDI, and you can abuse that HARD (I'm talking 50% with one grab).

But don't ever think that those are legitimate. It's abusing poor SDI.

The 'Chu Combo' is basically an answer to SDI, because instead of buffering Uair after Fthrow, you bait them expecting the buffered Uair and catch their SDI off-guard, maybe forcing a second jump and catching it (you can see in his video of the aforementioned combo that Ally was waiting for Uair and double jumped instead of SDI'ing because Chu waited). So, when you're looking at that list, please make sure you pay special attention to who he says you can use the 'Chu combo' on, because those are much more important to look at since you have a guaranteed 18% with a Fthrow-Buffered Uair on every character.

However, anything Chu says is guaranteed after Uair will indeed work if your opponent doesn't SDI. This is really important to realize, because it makes a big difference between dishing out 18% and 50% out of 1 throw.

I just wanted to throw that out there because a lot of Kirbies seem to have this mentality that he has legitimate throw strings and combos/chain grabs and this simply isn't the case. So keep that in mind when you're practicing, because then you'll be prepared for opponents who have awesome SDI and won't get caught by Kirby's throw strings.

Until then, go ahead and abuse those strings - I did until I taught all of my opponents how to get out of them. LOL.

 

[Wumbo105]

Until then, go ahead and abuse those strings - I did until I taught all of my opponents how to get out of them. LOL. [/b]

Ah, the fatal mistake lol.

 

[falln]

I just wanted to throw that out there because a lot of Kirbies seem to have this mentality that he has legitimate throw strings and combos/chain grabs and this simply isn't the case. So keep that in mind when you're practicing, because then you'll be prepared for opponents who have awesome SDI and won't get caught by Kirby's throw strings.

if by legitimate you mean guaranteed then yes you're right but kirby has different strings for each way your opponent chooses to escape after the initial 18% at which point it becomes a mindgame. the amount of potential follow ups kirby has and the amount of % that comes with it though its hard to call it illegitimate.

 

[Kappy]

Yeah, by legitimate I meant guaranteed. All mind games are totally legit. LOL. I should've clarified, my bad!

 

[zFlashyStyle]

Ok sounds good ill see wut i can do~

 

[MikeKirby]

Hey Chu, what kind of general tips you can give for a Kirby playing in doubles? What can Kirby exploit and what kind if mindset would one have to have? You're like the best doubles player out there!

 

[ChuDat]

I'm happy to answer any and all questions you guys have

First of all, thanks to anyone who answers basic questions or questions that have already been covered. It definitely saves time so I can concentrate on new questions

Fuujin - lol!

Magma Dolphin - No need for a video, thanks. The picture was enough. I was able to do the glitch after about 20 seconds of trying it out.

What should i practice as Kirby?And where can i find the CG list?I love the CGs!

The main thing you should practice is your back airs. Learn to short hop and fast fall first. Try short hopping a back air and fast falling. Do this a lot to get your fingers warmed up.

In training mode, you can practice forward throw --> up air. Get a good feel of it. Also, put the computer near the ledge. Jump off the stage and inhale the computer. Spit him out under the stage. Back air as he is trying to recover. That's pretty good practice.

Here's a good example of what I'm talking about. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EWKyT37KiY

@3:55

Out of time . I'll pick up with MikeKirbys question.

 

[Wumbo105]

Amazing job this weekend at Xanadu Chu! I'm glad you're coming back.

In that set against Lie, is that how you typically play against diddys? Or did you do things different since he wasn't being as aggressive as diddys usually are?

I still can't seem to handle the matchup very well =\

 

[Shadocat]

Chu

One thing is noticed when watching your set vs m2k was how extremely patient you were with attacking. Should we try that out too??

 

[Vinylic.]

I'll answer that.


Most definitely, basically because if you rush too match you'll end up being punished.
Once they try to break your combo, find another way to keep it going.

Like snake, for example.

From the first fthrow you make, snake will use grenade.
Don't uair. Try to grab again.

I recommend uthrow.

 

[Wumbo105]

I'll answer that.


Most definitely, basically because if you rush too match you'll end up being punished.
Once they try to break your combo, find another way to keep it going.

Like snake, for example.

From the first fthrow you make, snake will use grenade.
Don't uair. Try to grab again.

I recommend uthrow.

Shhhh. Chu is thinking.

 

[Kappy]

Yo Chu, that one grab you got on M2K after, like, a minute and a half of sitting there was amazing. LOL.

If you're talking about waiting for Air Dodges and the like, then that's general bait/read/punish game and patience is required to get in those reads. If you're talking about the stare-downs, then you can do that if:

1)Your opponent is impatient (and you KNOW it)
2)You have the % lead

That's really the only way to seriously use that method, IMO. I don't know if Chu has a different one, but I don't think those stare-downs were smart decisions since he wasn't in the lead and M2K is known to be super-campy, although he was getting impatient so I think with more time it could've worked. LOL. That grab was really hype, though!!

I'm sure Chu'll have a better answer when he has time to post, but I'd follow those two rules for now so you don't end up in a stare-down and get frustrated because of it. LOL.

 

[aqua421]

Any tips against pikachu and ike?

 

[CaptainKirby]

It's pretty much, you run in one direction, turn around, then Fsmash. When you turn around, the momentum causes you to slide back as you Fsmash.

This can also be done with down smash, which actually looks pretty neat, considering the move is otherwise completely stationary. You'll slide forward a bit while performing it, though not by much...

 

[Labernash]

Hey, some questions for ya -

What can lead into an Up-tilt?

I was having trouble getting back on stagee. Any tips?

What is the Gonzo Combo?

Is Kirby's Pivot Grab as good as it looked when my master used it on me in Kirby dittos?

 

[ChuDat]

Hey Chu, what kind of general tips you can give for a Kirby playing in doubles? What can Kirby exploit and what kind if mindset would one have to have? You're like the best doubles player out there!

Doubles is probably the best thing about brawl. Unfortunately, I'm currently in the singles "mindset" right now, but I'll still try to answer this question. I'll have a better answer once I start getting into doubles again.

Doubles is fun because there are more things to pay attention to. You can also be aggressive in doubles, which is usually my strategy. Some things you should remember when playing doubles is to PUNISH, work with your partner, save your partner, combo with your partner (probably the best part about doubles), and practice 2v1 as well as 1v2.

Punishing is very important in doubles because you get easy and free damage. Let's say a metaknight downthrows your partner. He will be in lag after the down throw is finished for about 1 or 2 seconds. This makes it easy to punish because you have so much time to throw out a move while he is finishing his down throw. For example, you could punish MK with a falcon punch. Even a warlock punch will work if you have good timing.

Working with your partner is important because you can also get free damage. Communication and strategy is important and can decide a match. Look at this example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4aTzSHb4fU

@4:26. It still hurts watching that video lol. But to get back to doubles, you can see here Chillin and I didn't communicate. Chillin could have said, "Chu stop wobbling" and went for an upsmash to win the tournament. I could have said, "Chillin let me kill him" (if you didn't know, me hitting Chillin during the wobbles messed up my timing, causing M2k to get out.), and I could have hit him with a forward smash during wobbling to win the tournament. Stuff like this will cause you to win or lose a grand final tournament set against the best players in the nation, so it's best to learn to communicate.

Strategy comes from communication, but before a match is played out. You can play offence, defence, risky, conservative, ect. Counterpicks also are involved in strategy, and ARE IMPORTANT! You want to take Diddy to Frigate. Take MK to FD. Ness to Yoshis. Developing a good strategy for your team will give you an easier time with your opponents.

Save your partner! If you see your partner is having a hard time with his opponent, go over there and hit the opponent. Also, make sure your partner recovers safely on the stage. I like to randomly hit my partners opponent as I'm fighting another opponent, but it only works because I'm good. This will distract your opponents partner, but you will probably be in a 1v2 situation. Your partner will be there to punish all of their mistakes, which makes it easier for your partner.

Comboing is really fun and racks up a lot of damage but it's the hardest part about teams. Here, you want to adapt to your partner. You have to know where their attacks will put the opponent. That's the only way you will be able to combo. For example, kirbys down air will send an opponent in front of him (without SDI, which 99% of people don't do so don't worry about it) so your partner should forward smash in front of kirby while the opponent is in stun. You should be able to answer these questions if you team with these partners. What does Marths down throw do? What about diddys down throw? What happens when snake f-tilts once? ect.

I haven't practiced a lot of 2v1 but I've practiced a lot of 1v2 (me vs 2 people). I've gotten really good at fighting two people, so my doubles skills naturally get better. When your doing 1v2, focus on getting your opponents to hit each other. You should also prevent your self from using laggy moves or laggy throws because you WILL die. Back airs, forward tilts, inhale, upthrow, uptilt, jab, pummeling an opponent while grabbed so the other opponent will either get hit by the pummels, or hit his partner (this happens quite often). There's a LOT you could do in 1v2, so get creative. Remember to get your opponents to hit each other so they are flustered and don't use laggy moves that will get you killed. Also, sometimes I like to put my self in between opponents, but you need really good spacing for that. Psychology wise, keeping your eyes on both of them and knowing your opponents will make things much easier for you.

To be more kirby specific, you should be the one killing the opponents. Down throw a lot. Kirby has the potential to bring back unwinnable games because he can inhale off the stage with an SD, how strong Fsmash is, and hammer (specifically aerial, but ground is good).

Alright that's all the time I have for today. I'll be back to answer everyone's questions!

 

[Kaffei]

Chu, this has nothing to do with Brawl but

How do I fight Fox in Melee. Like he's so fast and idk how to deal with pressure

 

[Shadocat]

LOL!! I kinda wanna know that too since i play melee as well.

 

[Strong Badam]

get him offstage and kill him

 

[Lucykinz]

Hi <(^_^)> I'm only learning this game and I have a few basic Kirby questions. First, does Kirby have any sort of chain grab and what characters can it be used on? Secondly, I never really use the inhale move, but if I were to, what characters are best to copy?

 

[Vinylic.]

I don't think Kirby can chaingrab, but he is capable of racking damages.

Like:
grab > fthrow > utilt > bair

To tell you what, when you grab, you have to specific on what you're doing. Or else, you'll be punished.
It takes time, but if you get the hang of it, things will get a little easier.

As for copying characters, click here to find out what's useful:
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12082004&postcount=33

 

[Wumbo105]

^^^ you forgot the u-air after the f-throw.
Nothing is guaranteed after the u-air, it's all dependent on how they DI.
Thats probably my favorite thing about maining Kirby. You pretty much create combos as you go depending on their position. It's very open-ended.

 

[Kewkky]

I think fthrow > uair > up-angled ftilt is guaranteed, never missed that string. I can't really say though, I have no one to try it out when I want to experiment, and my internet is pretty crap so I can't buffer my ftilt.

 

[t!MmY]

F-throw -> U-air -> F-tilt (high) is not guaranteed. With proper SDI even the F-tilt can miss, and it's not difficult to simply jump away from the Tilt even with mediocre SDI.

The F-throw -> U-air isn't even guaranteed in all cases.

 

[Kewkky]

The F-throw -> U-air isn't even guaranteed in all cases.

Sheik avoids the uair, and Luigi can nair it (along with any other characters with fast-enough aerials or invincible upBs). Pretty funny stuff... But the vast majority of the time it is guaranteed indeed.

 

[Wumbo105]

Oh yea i forgot about sheik. Also ZSS can do her little blue flip thingy to get out.

 

[Lord Chair]

Chu, in your matches against Coney @Xanadu:

1. You didn't seem to commit to uairs unless they were perfectly reliable. Wouldn't showing a willingness to uair (as in, presenting them as a threat) put more pressure on DDD when he's up in the air? What made you reluctant to uair?

2. What's your opinion on empty full hops in the DDD matchup?

 

[Pwnsauce!]

Hey Chu, I'm having a lot of trouble fighting Yoshi's. Can you give some advice? Whenever I approach on the ground, they just spam pivot grabs and it's really hard to get in. When I try to approach from the air, they spam eggs, or uair. I just can't seem to get up close to them.

 

[DEHF]

If I give you $20 will you main Ice Climbers in Brawl?

 

[Shadocat]

lol @ dehf posting in here.

I remember fighting a good yoshi for the first time......... not very pleasant.

All is can say is:

Watch out for the pivot f-smashes when you're at high %. yes , they will throw those out at you.

You're going to be seeing a lot of eggs, b-airs, and pivot grabs coming from yoshi. his air game beats kirby's.

try to take the fight to the ground. use short-hop b'airs and fairs when you can.

DO NOT stay above yoshi, he will kill you with a u'air(90% if fresh, and like 120% other wise)

try to find a way to safely approach.

 

[Kewkky]

I thought this was Chu's Q&A thread, Shadocat. o_o

I'd like to see what Chu says about all the questions asked so far.

 

[dettadeus]

Just out of curiosity, what's Kirby's frame advantage on F-Throw at low percents?

 

[ChuDat]

Sorry it's been so long. I've been busy with finals for the past two weeks.

Let's start with Kaffei!

Chu, this has nothing to do with Brawl but

How do I fight Fox in Melee. Like he's so fast and idk how to deal with pressure

Foxes like to do two things.

Full jump dair shine
and
Run at you and Nair

For the first one, figure out a way to beat his dair. You need a strong move with high priority. Since you use sheik, I recommend upair, upsmash out of shield, and maybe even uptilt.

For the second one, you have to run away aka dash dance, then grab. Easy.

Hi <(^_^)> I'm only learning this game and I have a few basic Kirby questions. First, does Kirby have any sort of chain grab and what characters can it be used on? Secondly, I never really use the inhale move, but if I were to, what characters are best to copy?

This is going to be a longgggg response but I'll try to make it as short and as readable as possible.

First of all, hello! I'm glad you're picking up kirby. He's a fun character to use because he has a lot of combos. Let me teach you some basic tricks.

The Gonzo combo:
This is the first combo I learned, and I learned it from Gonzo. It's forward throw, up air, reverse up tilt, and back air. Ike is probably the easiest to practice it on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EWKyT37KiY
Skip to 1:42

This throw combo will work on Fox, Falco, Wolf, Falcon, DK, and Bowser. Please note that at high level play, these combos will not work (but I still manage to get them to work, it just depends on how the opponent reacts), but it should work on your friends.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0JsaQJfpOc

As for inhale, the best characters to copy are:
Top
Falco - Triple laser
Snake - Camp
ZSS - Camp
Olimar - Camp

High
MK - Recover and beat MK's glide attack
Pit - Camp
Lucario - Camp
Rob - Camp
Samus - Camp/Strong and can kill
DK - Kills
Wario - Air grab
Sheik - Camp
Diddy Kong - Camp
Kirby - Air grab

Middle
DDD - More range
Fox - Camp
Wolf - Camp
Ike - Edgeguard

Low
Mario - Camp
Luigi - Camp
Pikachu - Camp
Jiggly - Kills
Toon Link - Camp
IC - Camp
Link - Camp
Charizard/Bowser
Marth - Break shield

Bottom
Game & Watch - Force G&W to approach. If he pulls out a bucket, then he is in lag so you can get a free hit on him. Bait.
Ivy
Squirtle - Edgeguard
Peach - Defense
Zelda - Defense
Yoshi - Short range grab
Sonic - Annoying

Useless
Falcon
Ness
Lucas
Ganon

Hm.. I'm actually going to make a thread about this.

Next question!

Chu, in your matches against Coney @Xanadu:

1. You didn't seem to commit to uairs unless they were perfectly reliable. Wouldn't showing a willingness to uair (as in, presenting them as a threat) put more pressure on DDD when he's up in the air? What made you reluctant to uair?

2. What's your opinion on empty full hops in the DDD matchup?

1. If Coney sees you upair, then he will down air. I'll take a good amount of damage + I'll be in the air. I want Coney to be in the air, not me. Also, waiting is better because it forces DDD to use 3 options.

1. Inhale
2. Back air
3. Air dodge

Notice I didn't mention down air. Down air has a lot of lag after he lands, so he is going to avoid using that move.

When DDD is in the air, I can easily react to anything he does. If he inhales, I can roll behind him for a hard punish. If he Back airs, I'll perfect shield and grab and if he air dodges, I can grab him. It's basically rock paper scissors, but I'll usually win because I know my opponent so well.

2. Depends. If you use a empty full hop to bait DDD while he is in the air, then you'll get down aired. That's not very good. If you use an empty full jump while DDD is on the ground, then he'll probably shield. That's good.

Hey Chu, I'm having a lot of trouble fighting Yoshi's. Can you give some advice? Whenever I approach on the ground, they just spam pivot grabs and it's really hard to get in. When I try to approach from the air, they spam eggs, or uair. I just can't seem to get up close to them.

Haha, I used to have trouble against Yoshis too until I fought Poltergust (best yoshi in the nation, I think?). Anyway, you want to use back air a lot. You have to grab him whenever possible. At low percents, use the gonzo combo. Then after that, you can stick to back airs and grabs.

That's the yoshi match-up. I'll tell you how to get around his pivot grabs. Run up to him until you are just out of range of his pivot grab. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pVnEAEJcr0&feature=relmfu (Skip to 00:10). He'll probably roll behind you. You can wack him with a forward smash or grab him and use the gonzo combo.

When he's in the air, follow him until he lands. Shield grab whatever he does.

Wait for an airdodge and forward smash him out of it.

Get really lucky with rolls and airdodges into him LOL.

If he uses his eggs, run up to him and grab him.

Once he doesn't know what you are going to do, you can run up to him and shield grab.

Watch out for upsmash or upair when you're in the air. Use you're jumps to get away from the up air.

That should work against Yoshi .

If I give you $20 will you main Ice Climbers in Brawl?

Hmm.... maybe .

I played Ice Climbers the first month it came out. I lost to an Ike player at the gamestop finals. After that, I retired from playing Ice Climbers. I'll need some more motivation to pick up ICs. I'm still working on Kirby and I'm still learning a lot. Maybe if like 20 people told me to pick up ICs, then I'll do it.

Ahhh yess!!! the last question!

Just out of curiosity, what's Kirby's frame advantage on F-Throw at low percents?

I don't know the exact amount, but I'm sure it's a few frames. If timed perfectly, I don't think MK can upair out of the forward throw, up air combo.

Please give me more questions to answer! I'm happy to give you guys all of my knowledge .

 

[MikeKirby]

Chu, I gotta say... What da HELL were you and Boss thinking at Xanadu?? It was, holy mother of God, FREAKIN' genius!! Best thing I've ever seen on Brawl! How'd you guys come up with that? Will you guys be teaming up again? 'Cause I would love to see more! Also, with a dangerous team gimmick like that, you could have gotten some surprise KO's just shooting out Boss from your inhale whenever someone recklessly ran to disrupt the bucket filling.
Now that's mindgames!

As far as a question goes, what have been your favorite characters and players that you've teamed up with so far?

 

[Kaffei]

Sorry it's been so long. I've been busy with finals for the past two weeks.

Let's start with Kaffei!



Foxes like to do two things.

Full jump dair shine
and
Run at you and Nair

For the first one, figure out a way to beat his dair. You need a strong move with high priority. Since you use sheik, I recommend upair, upsmash out of shield, and maybe even uptilt.

For the second one, you have to run away aka dash dance, then grab. Easy.

Oh right, I forgot at how much they dair. Thanks Chu! That's a really important one for me lol

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

Any Kirby vs Ness tips?

Coney and I agreed to do Kirby vs Ness next time we play in tourney.

 

[CaptainKirby]

Any Kirby vs Ness tips?

Coney and I agreed to do Kirby vs Ness next time we play in tourney.

In case you haven't seen it, here's a good vid to watch of Chu playing against GIMR's Ness.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIzeSg8jsro

 

[ChuDat]

Chu, I gotta say... What da HELL were you and Boss thinking at Xanadu?? It was, holy mother of God, FREAKIN' genius!! Best thing I've ever seen on Brawl! How'd you guys come up with that? Will you guys be teaming up again? 'Cause I would love to see more! Also, with a dangerous team gimmick like that, you could have gotten some surprise KO's just shooting out Boss from your inhale whenever someone recklessly ran to disrupt the bucket filling.
Now that's mindgames!

As far as a question goes, what have been your favorite characters and players that you've teamed up with so far?

Thank you! And thanks for the question!

My favorite characters to team with would be:
1. MK (we can both play aggressive)
2. Snake (I can play aggressive while snake camps with nades and keeps stocks. Omnigay)
3. Diddy Kong (Bananas! Kirby and diddy kong work really well together)
4. Lucario (Anubis)
5. Game&watch (bucket)
6. Falco (Triple lasers. Awesome against MK)
7. DDD (Down throw to anything!)
8. Marth (cool team combos)
9. Rob (fun)
10. Luigi (Luigi's up-b)

And my favorite people to team with are:
1. Chillindude (we won multiple tournaments)
2. Candy (took ally and mew2king down to game 5. We should have won the set because we were up 2-1, but it was decided it was going to be a best of 5 and not 3)
3. Ally (he's just really good in doubles)
4. Mew2king (also really good at doubles)
5. Junebug (worked well with him and placed 2nd at apex)
6. Fatal (also worked well with him and placed 5th at apex)
7. Boss (took out mew2king in teams!)
8. Atomsk (almost beat Azen and Mew2king back in 2008)
9. Logic (almost beat Ally and ADHD)
10. Inui (destroys boss and Logic in doubles!)

There's definitely more, like DEHF, Azen, Omni, Korn, Meep, Takeover, and Forte

Then there's others whom you probably never heard of. Exdia, Esoj, Taj, Axel, Yoster, Plairnkk, Mild, SheikSSBM, Dewdadash, Eskim0, Bolt, K9, and Alphazealots gf,

Any Kirby vs Ness tips?

Coney and I agreed to do Kirby vs Ness next time we play in tourney.

Here's a good one! Grab release, run and grab, grab release, run and grab, repeat until he is close to the ledge. Grab release, forward tilt. When he comes back, either down tilt or back air his recovery, then go for the gimp.

Inhaling and walking off the stage is really really good against ness (and lucas). When he releases, do a back air so you can get rid of his second jump, then gimp him.

Keep em comin!

 

[Wumbo105]

Regarding the Ness grab release to the edge, do you mean with or without pummeling? I'm assuming its ground release.