TDB: SEASON 2! LEON (RE4) vs LARA CROFT

[UncleSam]

There's no indication how much of their bodies are made up of plant cells and/or animal cells

Heck, it can be a new "plantimal" cell which can still allow for it.


In cutscene, Red display no fire
In cutscene, Purple have unrealistic earthquakes
In cutscene, White can use poison
In cutscene, Blue don't do much other than be amphibious
In cutscene, Yellow give off electricity via their cheeks

Just for clarity

cutscenes and gameplay are very different things
if white doesn't get exhaling poison because the only time it showed up was a 15 second cutscene, then how would yellow not apply to that?

 

[REL38]

cutscenes and gameplay are very different things
if white doesn't get exhaling poison because the only time it showed up was a 15 second cutscene, then how would yellow not apply to that?

Cutscene = Canon

White should have poison

I've explained numerous times as to why it's legit
For instance, enemies are immune to inhaled poison

Enemies are also immune to electricity

Status ailments/damage of electricity and poison are null because it would be adding too much.

There are barriers of electric nodes and poison spouts
Implementing status/damage ailments would require enemies to take damage from these obstacles


Electricity should be very much available as it is canon

Cutscene = canon

 

[Nova9000]

@ REL

I can't even be mad at you for tht 1.

Spoiler

And I was going to do the same thing in a different matter...

 

[JOE!]

sam, you are saying that pika's entire weight is nitrogen...

he has no mass taken up by his skeleton, mucles, fur, organs, spagehtti, etc?


I seriously, seriously doubt he coudl do this much damage 9also, the elec arc vid you posted was made by a POWER PLANT)

if you push for this, imma givin' zard and bowser fire breath

 

[Sieguest]

Cutscene = Canon

Yet you push for Zard having no Fire Breath....


and yeah ONE cutscene and then never shown again totally justifies it,
if that's true then maybe I should push for Pika's surfboard in earnest.


@JOE!- IMO it'd be about time.

 

[UncleSam]

sam, you are saying that pika's entire weight is nitrogen...

he has no mass taken up by his skeleton, mucles, fur, organs, spagehtti, etc?


I seriously, seriously doubt he coudl do this much damage 9also, the elec arc vid you posted was made by a POWER PLANT)

if you push for this, imma givin' zard and bowser fire breath

Animals eat their weight in food and you don't see them having no organs.
You people wanted a limit and I calculated a limit, is it THAT hard to get by you?
you also can't just give it to them, I just said this like LAST PAGE, you need to put forth solid evidence.
This is what this thread has become now, just slapping things on a character that you want to win without any sort of backup and it apparently being okay because you're the OP

 

[JOE!]

why cant i just give it to them?

all they need is a false pallet, is that so hard to ask since you are giving pika the ability to hold 13lbs or nitrogen in it's body without inflating/posioning itself?

 

[REL38]

Yet you push for Zard having no Fire Breath....


and yeah ONE cutscene and then never shown again totally justifies it,
if that's true then maybe I should push for Pika's surfboard in earnest.


@JOE!- IMO it'd be about time.

False Pallete?
How he make it?

Give Pika a surfboard
Not like he can use it

 

[Sieguest]

False Pallete?
How he make it?

Same way you justify Pikmin poison...

it's evolutionary.... >_>


Surfboards enough to bash the hell out of Diddy.

 

[REL38]

Same way you justify Pikmin poison...

it's evolutionary.... >_>


Surfboards enough to bash the hell out of Diddy.

Then go ahead

Also, those arms can't pick up a surfboard, much less swing it

 

[Sieguest]

but, Ive got 'em on the ropes!


So I said I'd come with Pikachus weight in nitrogen and I got approx. 428.571 mol of N giving pikachu 428,571,000 watts at one time before having to recharge.
sorry lucario you're cool and stuff but you just got owned.
...
and so did Diddy.

Animals eat their weight in food and you don't see them having no organs.
You people wanted a limit and I calculated a limit, is it THAT hard to get by you?
you also can't just give it to them, I just said this like LAST PAGE, you need to put forth solid evidence.
This is what this thread has become now, just slapping things on a character that you want to win without any sort of backup and it apparently being okay because you're the OP

why cant i just give it to them?

all they need is a false pallet, is that so hard to ask since you are giving pika the ability to hold 13lbs or nitrogen in it's body without inflating/posioning itself?

Just want to set some things straight...

1. Having your body weight in Nitrogen is a biological impossiblity. You'd poison yourself, among other bodily ramifications, more specifically in your circulatory system, you wouldn't have enough oxygenated cells to provide for your body.
Unless you're talking about an organism that doesn't need a plethora oxygen of to survive, or is adapted to be resilient to being over Nitrogenated (lawl made up word) then no, only about a fraction of your body weight at an extent.
2. The only reason some animals can eat their weight in food is due to the reason of how much room they have for their stomach to expand.

3. Nitrogen is able to be absorbed, and in the case of such an evolutionary struggle, usable. And due to the plentifulness of it in nature, that's plausible. You don't even need a full mol of the stuff to produce lethal wattage. All that's needed is enough for a base voltage of 500, meaning a very small amount (of nitrogen needed).

Then go ahead

Also, those arms can't pick up a surfboard, much less swing it

Have you not heard of planking? duh....

 

[UncleSam]

oops you guys I made a mistake.
I've been using Nitrogen double bond.
Nova said triple.
let me redo the number.
If so Guest what is the limit?

anyway I'll be back with a new number (which is bigger JOE, cry more)

 

[JOE!]

so you are stuffing more nitrogen into pikachu..?

you do realize he needs room for organs and ****, right?

 

[UncleSam]

ignore this?
lol it somehow posted twice, that's new.

 

[UncleSam]

why cant i just give it to them?

all they need is a false pallet, is that so hard to ask since you are giving pika the ability to hold 13lbs or nitrogen in it's body without inflating/posioning itself?

you asked for a number btw and I gave a number, we can't really calculate how much he can hold maximum.
And srsly just giving them doesn't work that way in reality, you aren't god.
plus it makes every bit of work people do look like a waste of time.

so you are stuffing more nitrogen into pikachu..?

you do realize he needs room for organs and ****, right?

Wow I specifically said "BOND"
do you know what a chemical bond is?

 

[JOE!]

1) what work? those characters would still have the options found by others while they were stripped of fire, but now they have a deadly ranged ability to boot

2) i know what a chemical bond is, but you were statign earlier that he would have 13lbs of nitrogen in his system. Then you said he'd have more nitrogen

wtf?

 

[UncleSam]

1) what work? those characters would still have the options found by others while they were stripped of fire, but now they have a deadly ranged ability to boot

2) i know what a chemical bond is, but you were statign earlier that he would have 13lbs of nitrogen in his system. Then you said he'd have more nitrogen

wtf?

I said it would be triple bond which gives off more energy then double bond.
oh and I was right in the first place I was using triple bond, the sign for that on wikipedia SO looks like a double bond.
They weren't stripped they were proved they didn't have said part to support whatever they have.
Unless you can show that they do they can't support it.

 

[Sieguest]

If so Guest what is the limit?

To be honest, not a clue on exactly what number, but you definitely couldn't have your body weight in Nitrogen for sure, if that were true with the way animal body systems are constructed, they'd poison or other bodily functions may become hindered due to gas pressure in some areas causing unwanted effects.

so you are stuffing more nitrogen into pikachu..?

you do realize he needs room for organs and ****, right?

Remember that gases move to fill the container, they can flow around organs and such. The problem lies in that too much Nitrogen will create unneeded pressure on these organs, and/or other things such as poisoning.

you asked for a number btw and I gave a number, we can't really calculate how much he can hold maximum.
And srsly just giving them doesn't work that way in reality, you aren't god.
plus it makes every bit of work people do look like a waste of time.



Wow I specifically said "BOND"
do you know what a chemical bond is?

Hmm, I'll say something on the fire later... as I still find it quite ridiculous (and hypocritical) on some people's parts (not listing names) how some characters get the benefit of assumption despite artist's rendition while others are denied the same thing. And explanations used to qualify one trait cannot be used to qualify another.


As to the bonds, You still have a limit to the amount of Nitrogen that can possibly be holed up in the body, even though stating this limit is a moot point, as the breaking of Nitrogen bonds for use will create more than enough energy to kill.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I have said this thing before but... Why can't Pika store all his electricity in his tail? That way no organs will get destroyed by it's own electricity.

 

[Nova9000]

To be honest, not a clue on exactly what number, but you definitely couldn't have your body weight in Nitrogen for sure, if that were true with the way animal body systems are constructed, they'd poison or other bodily functions may become hindered due to gas pressure in some areas causing unwanted effects.

What I tried to tell US but couldn't word it correctly.

Hmm, I'll say something on the fire later... as I still find it quite ridiculous (and hypocritical) on some people's parts (not listing names) how some characters get the benefit of assumption despite artist's rendition while others are denied the same thing. And explanations used to qualify one trait cannot be used to qualify another.


As to the bonds, You still have a limit to the amount of Nitrogen that can possibly be holed up in the body, even though stating this limit is a moot point, as the breaking of Nitrogen bonds for use will create more than enough energy to kill.

Have you looked at what I sent you regarding fire breathing at all? Smh...

I have said this thing before but... Why can't Pika store all his electricity in his tail? That way no organs will get destroyed by it's own electricity.

You would have to go about proving why this is so, especially when all his power seems to stem from his cheeks.

@ JOE!

Unless someone comes and says otherwise, we all agree Link beats Ike. Let's finish this Rd.

 

[UncleSam]

I'm still waiting on a number guys.

 

[JOE!]

im still waiting on real proof as to why pikachu can be so stupidly specialized to do this, while still having normal life functions elsewhere, while you then complain about the thought of giving two other characters a friggen flap in their mouths.

 

[REL38]

Haven't they already explained how it works?

They've been going off internal function which we can't see.

We can blatantly see no false palletes.


Theorizing how an internal production of electricity is plenty different than giving a character a body part that is blatantly not visible in the throat.

 

[UncleSam]

im still waiting on real proof as to why pikachu can be so stupidly specialized to do this, while still having normal life functions elsewhere, while you then complain about the thought of giving two other characters a friggen flap in their mouths.

uhh like the last how many so pages have been explaining that duh.
and what REL said.

 

[JOE!]

true, but two things:


how is he gonna generate that much power in that tiny body without hurting himself when it goes through the cheeks

and

how much control would he have over this?

keep in mind the elec eel/catfish have their entire bodies devoted to this electrical manipulation, pika only has evidence of it in his cheeks and ocassionally stuff about his tail being a ground.

 

[UncleSam]

how is he gonna generate that much power in that tiny body without hurting himself when it goes through the cheeks

OMG this is like all the other MU's
you start asking questions that have already been answered.
anyway chemical bonding why do you think I've been talking about nitrogen all this time?

how much control would he have over this?

keep in mind the elec eel/catfish have their entire bodies devoted to this electrical manipulation, pika only has evidence of it in his cheeks and ocassionally stuff about his tail being a ground.

I also explained this.
what do you want me to repost the PM?
brb

Alright you guys.
as I just said in the thread, chemical reactions can take the place of ATP.
I'm just throwing it out there if it isn't effective we can go back.
Now the most abundant element that gives off the greatest amount of energy through chemical processes is nitrogen which is a natural element in the body. It is also in the air so small amounts can be inhaled.
take this table: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_bond#Strong_chemical_bonds
Nitrogens double bond N=N(which happens frequently btw) generates almost 1000 KJ/mol of energy.
activating this is easy, DNA creates proteins/enzymes which help the body (derp) Pikachu's DNA could have the ability to create enzymes that stay in the cheeks and initiate processes when squeezed.
Next, the chemical processes that convert energy to electricity (bear with me here still looking into this) heat is generated, whether this is enough to do this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_arc
I'm not sure yet.

Hmm...you may be on to something. But Nitrogen bonds are triple bonded, and the more bonds, the more energy released. Now, they happen often but dik if this occurs in the body often. Most of the time nitrogen is found in feces anyway. Also, would enzymes work in that matter?

enzymes force/break chemical bonds without the insane amount of energy needed to do naturally, without enzymes we'd all die because the reactions needed to keep us alive would go way too slow.

And wouldn't he need that in his brain as well? Like I was telling Guest the control thing is what I see as a problem. Since his body generates the electricity if it becomes too much it would be discharged. This would more than likely be done by receptor proteins. This means that he has no way to manage or control them; it's all innate.

The receptor proteins would tell the cells to create the specific enzymes, then the DNA in the nucleus is duplicated in the cells so the enzymes can be created and sent to the cheeks (or even, the cells in the cheeks have the correct information to create these enzymes themselves)

Now as far as the chemical processes, I'll wait until you get that information.

oh btw: http://www.unitconversion.org/unit_converter/energy.html
set the left to KJ and put the number as 1000 (approx what you find on the table) and on the right put watts/s.
anyway, ze chemical processes. Everybody knows how heat is generated right?
what's that? you don't? ok class listen up. When energy is expanded, heat is released.
...
wait up

The various shapes of electric arc are emergent properties of nonlinear patterns of current and electric field. The arc occurs in the gas-filled space between two conductive electrodes (often made of carbon) and it results in a very high temperature, capable of melting or vaporizing most materials. An electric arc is a continuous discharge, while a similar electric spark discharge is momentary. An electric arc may occur either in Direct current circuits or in alternating current circuits. In the latter case, the arc may re-strike on each half cycle of the current. An electric arc differs from a glow discharge in that the current density is quite high, and the voltage drop within the arc is low; at the cathode the current density may be as high as one million amps per square centimeter.[1]

re-reading this says that heat is a product of this arc. That means there just has to be two conductive electrodes (pikachu and its target).

Ok you win. Pika is the man.

here JOE

 

[Nova9000]

Me thinks you should change MU...
If you involve Samus maybe US will let you off the hook for now...
And US do you agree with my idea in regards to Zard, Bowser, and Yoshi maybe? Cuz Guest hasn't responded yet "stupid Wigglytuff".

 

[Sieguest]

I'm still waiting on a number guys.

Still waiting for you on a better number Sam.

Me thinks you should change MU...
If you involve Samus maybe US will let you off the hook for now...
And US do you agree with my idea in regards to Zard, Bowser, and Yoshi maybe? Cuz Guest hasn't responded yet "stupid Wigglytuff".

I've looked at it, but I've been studying too much history and other subjects for school, can't be bothered to posts wall of texts at the moment.

 

[JOE!]

sorry sam, i just lack time to really read through the pages rcently @_@
(work + college)

anywho, granted he has a chemical process to generate elec (owait, eel/catfish does too..) and uses some sort of muscle contraction to send out elec?

....

so, wheres the current he generates, or is it a random discharge?

for referance, here is how it's done naturally as of today:

The electric eel has three abdominal pairs of organs that produce electricity: the Main organ, the Hunter's organ, and the Sachs organ. These organs comprise four-fifths of its body, and are what give the electric eel the ability to generate two types of electric organ discharges (EODs), low voltage and high voltage. These organs are made of electrocytes, lined up so that the current flows through them and produces an electrical charge. When the eel locates its prey, the brain sends a signal through the nervous system to the electric cells. This opens the ion channel, allowing positively-charged sodium to flow through, reversing the charges momentarily. By causing a sudden difference in voltage, it generates a current.

The electric eel generates its characteristic electrical pulse in a manner similar to a battery, in which stacked plates produce an electrical charge. In the electric eel, some 5,000 to 6,000 stacked electroplaques are capable of producing a shock at up to 500 volts and 1 ampere of current (500 watts). Such a shock could be deadly for an adult human.

looking at this, our eel buddy makes it's shock by immediatley chaning the polarity of it's natural current, which produces a sudden change of voltage which sends the charge through it's environment.

what you suggest has pikachu break bonds to produce heat/charge, but there is no current there, just a sudden outburst.


(also, from the article (wikipedia) the eel grows to 6ft and weighs 45lbs, pika is a fraction of that but apparently can produce 9239172301293 x the pain?)

 

[Sieguest]

sorry sam, i just lack time to really read through the pages rcently @_@
(work + college)

anywho, granted he has a chemical process to generate elec (owait, eel/catfish does too..) and uses some sort of muscle contraction to send out elec?

Facial muscles.

so, wheres the current he generates, or is it a random discharge?

Paradox in of itself, electricity flows in a current from discharge, even random discharges follow a current, just this current carries an erratic pattern or has a point of termination, also, arcing the electricity in front of pika may also explain this. With two conductive ends and the air a dipole moment is possible, allowing for the for a "set" current between the user and target.(That's naturally how this energy behaves) One of those electroballs are examples.

looking at this, our eel buddy makes it's shock by immediatley chaning the polarity of it's natural current, which produces a sudden change of voltage which sends the charge through it's environment.

That's a given, the eel has to alter its polarity because it has a certain voltage to do life processes, such as how we have electrical pulses to regulate some bodily functions. (If I interpreted that correctly)

(also, from the article (wikipedia) the eel grows to 6ft and weighs 45lbs, pika is a fraction of that but apparently can produce 9239172301293 x the pain?)

Again, the difference is how the eel releases the energy, it has to provide the shock all around the body, so none of the elec is concentrated in any one spot, meaning low amperage resulting in low shock strength, the only reason the shock even damages the way it does is because some elements in the water conduct electricity. the fact that its bigger emphasizes the point, although the elec release may be proportionate to maturity in the eel.

Pika has a more concentrated release, leading to more amperage which leads to more power.

The last few sentences are even proven true in the last statement of the wikipedia article. Also, if you had an eel release this same charge in the air, I wouldn't be shocked at an amperage falling below one and reducing the power of the shock, due to its release system.

 

[UncleSam]

Still waiting for you on a better number Sam.

the only way I can calculate a max is if you give me a limit.
I can't satisfy your request unless you satisfy mine. I thought that was obvious.

Spoiler

apparently it never is

uhh Nova, if we change to Samus I'll do two at once it's not that hard.

As for fire it's okay for now I guess, IDK though, but methane is also a gas, you can't force it in one direction in an open space (said characters mouth)
so just work on positioning I guess.

 

[Nova9000]

I've looked at it, but I've been studying too much history and other subjects for school, can't be bothered to posts wall of texts at the moment.

Awww.
*being ignored because of the Wiggles*
Well I guess I could post it on here AFTER Rd. 5.

EDIT: @ US

If he has tubing then how isn't it possible? It would only happen when they need it to.

 

[UncleSam]

Awww.
*being ignored because of the Wiggles*
Well I guess I could post it on here AFTER Rd. 5.

Just post it when the next character this would apply to comes up.
now to defrag my SD card, the static on my songs are bugging me.

 

[Nova9000]

Just post it when the next character this would apply to comes up.
now to defrag my SD card, the static on my songs are bugging me.

Well the thing is after this Rd. I think JOE! was going to start using other characters. So before that, we were going to make our TDB list (i think). SO it would come up anyway, which is why I keep saying to postpone the Pika talk until the last MU.

 

[Sieguest]

the only way I can calculate a max is if you give me a limit.
I can't satisfy your request unless you satisfy mine. I thought that was obvious. qu

To be somewhat safe, I would suggest a quarter of its weight, maybe a third...
At that point storing it in chemical bonds will still provide plenty of energy to kill many times over, and not endanger life processes. An d it relieves the pressure situation discussed earlier, just a thought.

Spoiler

apparently it never is

This....

Awww.
*being ignored because of the Wiggles*
Well I guess I could post it on here AFTER Rd. 5.

If History teacher= Wiggles, then this is true x.x

 

[UncleSam]

To be somewhat safe, I would suggest a quarter of its weight, maybe a third...
At that point storing it in chemical bonds will still provide plenty of energy to kill many times over, and not endanger life processes. An d it relieves the pressure situation discussed earlier, just a thought.

took you long enough.
brb

1/3 is about 142,860,000 w/s*
1/4 is about 107,142,500 w/s

(*this number was rounded)

EDIT: oh and this is base, I never put it through any amps.
hmm come to think of it I never did that for the original number did I?
my bad lol

 

[Sieguest]

took you long enough.
brb

1/3 is about 142,860,000 w/s*
1/4 is about 107,142,500 w/s

(*this number was rounded)

EDIT: oh and this is base, I never put it through any amps.
hmm come to think of it I never did that for the original number did I?
my bad lol

Well, you had labeled your finding in watts x.x so it was kind of assumed an amperage....

In general electricity, the values you stated are based on an amperage of one. (6.28x10^6 [?]electrons for any given area at any given time.) Unless you go with what I've been saying about Pika having a base amperage of six, and due to rubber, is cut down to three amps.


VxA=W

if A is assumed 1 and you x amount for W then
V=W, so I'm assuming you used 1 since you just now thought about the amps.
luckily the equation is simple and the relationship between V and W is direct to A
so if A is three
3V=3W

(just multiply your previous numbers by three x.x)

 

[UncleSam]

stuff I already know.

I know that, check the conversion table I linked to, they have a watts per second, they don't define a amperage, though the amount of watts equals joules...
A joule gives off a watt? I guess that could work. but if the joules are giving off a base it's going to be amplified through Pikachu's amperage.

 

[Sieguest]

I know that, check the conversion table I linked to, they have a watts per second, they don't define a amperage, though the amount of watts equals joules...
A joule gives off a watt? I guess that could work. but if the joules are giving off a base it's going to be amplified through Pikachu's amperage.

Yes Joules give off watts.

Watts is the unit for power and

Power= Work (in joules)/Time (in seconds)

 

[UncleSam]

K, so just multiply everything by 6 3 guys.
EDIT: apparently 3.