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Guide Taj's Character Match-Up Discussion

Taj278

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Your opponent isn't following up his throw well enough, can if you can tech from a down throw without using the higher platform (flatland) before you get kneed, then you could've jumped > airdodged/ teleported, or did an aerial instead of teching at all.
 

SDC

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There was a state here, it's gone now...
Your opponent isn't following up his throw well enough, can if you can tech from a down throw without using the higher platform (flatland) before you get kneed, then you could've jumped > airdodged/ teleported, or did an aerial instead of teching at all.
Soo, what is the best course of action when I am grabbed and dthrowed? DI away and down and go for the tech? High and away, try to escape? How can I minimize the damage best?
 

KAOSTAR

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didnt mean to post it yet cuz it wasnt done but **** it

Falcon is a motha***ka. He definitely has a strong advantage vs mewtwo. Every move he has can combo, and thats literally.

How well u play vs falcons is a pretty good measurement of how efficiently you can play mewtwo. Its a good test of your offense and defense and how quickly you can turn one into the other. When you catch falcon with a dtilt(I usually go 2 dtilts into grab) you better make the most out of it. dthrow into some tech chases and make sure to zap him during grabs to rack up damage. You have the most control over falcon when he is teching, grabbed, or offstage.

Basically you throw a few shadowballs to slow falcon down and use your WD and teleport to keep falcon coming at you. When he makes a mistake or miss spaces u capitalize with grab and go from there. work on getting him offstage as soon as possible. In my experience tho, grab or dtilt are often the easiest to punish with but Ive found that an instant djc fair puts them in a better position for fatter combos and its much harder to react to.

You have to just practice keeping your own space because falcons goal is to invade it. shield DI(away) and smash DI all of his moves(except at higher percents and knees) hard up away(sometimes down and away) to keep his combos and pressure as short as possible. Dont contest any aerials, and surprise him during his dash dance with quick tilts shadowballs and occasional dash attacks.

Fsmash is surprisingly good for edgegaurding falcons who try to fake landing on stage and then fade back. The best options are to keep falcon low, avoid sending him up. Bair combos and if ur a pimp like me use reverse upair and ledgecancel ****.


Things to keep in mind:

Falcons think that they can combo you to infinity and beyond. But thats where m2 can recover from. At lower percents DI everything away. SDI is the best if possible. The best way to end a falcon combo is to go off stage far enough to where he has to stop and recover or be forced to die. Or to DI up and away far enough to cross up with a teleport or to di out of it. Its a terrible Idea to try to fair trade or nair trade because u will almost never win. Falcon is hella heavy so fair wont kill often and nair will earn u 1 percent on falcon and a loss of stock to u lol.

Falcon isnt TOO bad until he grabs you. Its possible to do decently vs falcon, but it requires you avoid getting grabbed. especially at the edge. You shouldnt be getting hit by loose aerials.

You have to stay mobile! M2 is fairly easy for falcon to pressure with nairs or aerials into jabs or gentleman. When falcon is simply spacing nairs on m2s shield you are actually in a pretty bad position. Falcon can chase your WD or your roll with grab or react to it using nair which puts u in the same situation you were previously in.

Watch your WDs. falcon is quick and can catch you during the time of WD that you cant do anything.

Falcon will typically aerial through you, or be landing where u would WD back to. Unless they are clearly gonna fall short you dont want to WD back and try to dtilt. Thats one of the best ways to eat a knee.
 

KAOSTAR

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When I watched the taj vs ss match I saw something that was pretty legit and seemed to help alot. Instead of WDing back to avoid nairs and knees altogether I saw taj WD back just enough so that he could instead CC the weak knee and second hit of the uair.

Thats a pretty good way to counter falcons approaches, because it can be hard to WD back far enough so that you are completely out of range to land a tilt.

Also instead of shielding gentlemen you can let your shield up and CC dtilt or something.
 

KAOSTAR

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yes maybe and also no. at low percents, any ranged or quick move can punish a spaced bair. hit stun is very low. so things like cc or asdi toward m2 can get u hit even if u hit them.

mid and high percents its ok to use...but u need supreme spacing since the hit box and m2 hurt box are so close...not very disjointed. so chances are u will get beat if they have any sort of range.


m2 bair is really solid at high percents even if u trade aerials....assuming u won't die.

pro tip. since m² approaches on the ground alot many people get accustomed to jumping to punish dtilt, or especially if u have them at the edge they will try to jump over m2....WD in and quickly turn around and bair...u will **** them when they jump.

ive found bair is decent 4 punishing predicted jumps. u can fade away and often teleport as a retreat since bair has short cool down.

:phone:
 

Taj278

TIME TO GET PAID!
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I may resurrect this thread. I have some new ideas with the Jigglypuff matchup I want to explore if I come back to this game. :p
 

DarkDragoon

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Yes he does.
Although he seems to do more Link and Samus whenever I see him.

I wish he wasn't allergic to cats so he'd come visit more often. LOL
-DD
 

Dru2

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If this thread isn't dead, could I ask for some advice on the Luigi matchup?

There's this guy in my scene who mains Luigi and I have not been able to win a full set from him once. Here's a few videos from a tournament that happened over the weekend.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRm-N69rztM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiybqLX0sdI
I'm Dru2. Forgive me, I'm pretty sloppy, so if you see any wavedashing to a random jump, SD's, or something to that effect, you can chalk that up to botched tech or just being stupid.
The biggest problem I have with Luigi is his aerial game. All of his aerials outprioritize so much of Mewtwo's moves, and some of them can kill at surprisingly low percents. Sometimes I can bait them and shieldgrab, but most of the time they just push me out of range to punish or do anything to him.

Thanks in advance.
 
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Dru2

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Thanks for the advice.

Yeah, I definitely have some bad habits I need to get rid of. The forward throw was a mess up, btw. I use Forward Smash instead of Down because it comes out quicker, so it catches him off guard more. However, I'm sure I could make the Down Smash just as useful if I got better at reading, though I shouldn't be using smashes much in the first place.
The problem with trying to punish Luigi when landing, I feel, is that he's safe until he hits the ground because of his aerial hitbox staying out so long, and his landing lag is so short that he'll be ready for me trying to punish him. Note that I haven't tested this, and I (hopefully) could be wrong about how quick he is. I use full hops to avoid Luigi's aerials or getting shieldgrabbed/punished OOS. Even if he's not shielding, I feel like coming at him with a short hop Nair will just make him come at me with one of his aerials and it'll beat out mine. Don't know what I was thinking not using more shadowballs. Looking back, he can't deal with them well at all.

Also, you may think I'm a better Mewtwo player, but judging by what you know, you're probably better. I may act fast, but I honestly don't think much when playing. I just do things, which is probably why I throw out a lot of unnecessary moves. Sometimes it works out, and evidently sometimes it doesn't.

Again, thanks for the help. I'll keep all this in mind.
 
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SuperShus

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Hey Dru2,

There are some aspects of play that I saw that seemed to just be spacing/tech issues.

Try djc fair out of shield sometimes. You can often combo better with fair than grab. Remember, against heavier characters, it's harder to combo with throws.

Ftilt can be the safest thing that hits people horizontally! However I didn't see you use it very often, it can be good for whacking people away from the ledge who aren't sweet-spotting. Make sure to angle it up and down so you hit your target, even though it doesn't seem to make a big difference. Other edgegaurds are jump off and back air over and over dj teleport back, and dmash. Space that dsmash carefully! It's hard to hit, but the hitbox is bigger than the graphic is.

There were a few times where your djc techskill betrayed you. Make sure you can chain djc moves without making mistakes. Make sure you can do them and turn around and to them in the other direction. Make sure you can djc a fair and turn around grab. If someone unsafely does a crossup on the back of your sheild, djc a nair, and follow up with whatever is appropriate.

Practice dtilt into fair for when people DI your dtilt in. There was a time where you could have killed luigi on yoshis when you dtilted him because he DI'd in, but instead you did another dtilt which traded with one of his moves. Then you tried to do a usmash and he just punished you for it.

One thing that really got you punished is predictable teleports, especially from the ledge. It is necessary for every mew2 who wants to do well to learn to invincible stall on the ledge. If you don't, people will charge smash attacks on stage waiting for you to teleport back on. You can't ledgedash because of your dj, and you can't really ledge hop air very safely, which only leaves you with get up attack(bad), tournament winner(bad), normal getup, roll on, and teleport on. This means we'll be doing a lot of teleports. If we are doing a lot of teleports, that means we'll be getting read a lot! That means we need to figure out a way to shake it up! Watch the way Taj ledgestalls here in SC4. He's rising up above the ledge and teleporting diagonally down back to the ledge, rinse repeat. The reason this is good is because you have the option of teleporting to many places all over the stage or back to the ledge. If the enemy stays on the stage, you get free ledge. If the misspace too much, you can normal getup, get up attack, roll, even tournament winner, or any of those usually 'bad options'. If they try to take the ledge from you, just teleport and center stage can quickly be yours. You can even anticipate that your opponent will try to take back their lost control of the stage rashly(especially since they'll feel robbed by a low tier) and go for a read. Mew2 can also do the same stall as fox, away on the control stick, upb towards the ledge- which is easier... but if you don't dj to get up higher and create options for yourself, all you can do is grab ledge, or choose a laggy option like telporting straight up, or almost straight up.

Anyway, work on that and you'll get to Grand Finals next time. ^^
 
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SGJet

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Ey Metwtwos let's makes some noise on these SmashBoards! Not enough activity going on here!
 
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