Taco Bell Mafia: Game over. Who won?

[Ramen King]

Why is Inferno ignoring such a scummy hammer? He is sticking to his Vinyl bit even after Ruy has pretty much presented himself on a plate. So yes, Inferno is still scum.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

because his priority as a townie is to out his scumreads before the flip is posted.

And from his perspective, ryu's vote is probably not any worse than anyone else's, just another vote on a townie for a bad/made up reason.

ScumInferno would have an agenda in pushing for Zen/Vinyl as scum. The most obvious example would be that one of the two is his scumbuddy, who he's trying to clear.

ScumInferno would realize we're not going to trust his scumreads though, so him not mentioning Ryu's hammer doesn't benefit him at all.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

And as I said, if Inferno IS scum, you better be at least 100% cleared. Or you're dead.

 

[Ramen King]

 

[ranmaru]

Votecount 2.4

Inferno3044:Vinyl., Ramen King, Dtj Glyphmoney, Red Ryu
Red Ryu
Vinyl.: Inferno3044
Ramen King:
Rajam
Kary
DtJ Glyphmoney

Not Voting:
Rajam, Kary

Notes:
Lynch Scene coming up.

*= Currently being replaced
**= V/LA

With 7 players alive, it takes 4 votes to lynch
The deadline for Day 2 is October 18th, at 11:59 PM

 

[ranmaru]

Just a regular guy. He thinks he's better than others, since he is thicker than other tacos. This gives him alot of pride and confidence.

He treats others as inferior, and others were annoyed due to this. Others took this as a sinister attitude.

They easily murdered the guy for suspicion of being some mafia king pin. He was just another regular guy like the rest of them. Yet, no one cared.

Inferno was:

[COLLAPSE="flip"]

Chalupa Supreme, Vanilla Townie.[/COLLAPSE]

The deadline for Night 2 is October 16th, at 11:59 PM

 

[ranmaru]

Currently looking for a Zen Replacement.

Will extend the deadline by 24 hours whenever the replacement is in.

 

[ranmaru]

BadWolf replaces Ramen King. Welcome hi-- I mean. Welcome him later when you wake up.

Night has been extended to the 17th of October, 11:59 PM.

 

[ranmaru]

Crazy, and silly. He was one stubborn character. Others felt he was a stick in their plans, so they wasted em.

Badwolf was killed!

He was:

[COLLAPSE="flip"]

Mexican Pizza, Bodyguard.[/COLLAPSE]

Day 3 begins. Day 3. Deadline: October 27th, 11:59 PM EST.

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

laksdhgasl;hgl;
I read through 19 pages for nothing? Hate you guys.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Wtf I don't believe Zen was a PR.

Mass claim now, Rajam first then, Glyph then me, then Kary.

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Lol @ RR putting himself second to last.

I'm down for mass claim, but RR is going first.

 

[Rajam]

I'm Nachos Bell Grande, Vanilla Townie

Reads in a bit, I'm almost done reading

Scum leans / reads on Glyph and Vinyl, town read on Kary. Will detail more later

Also this is most likely lylo so don't rush with the votes

 

[Rajam]

Kary, do we lynch Vinyl Y/N?

Vinyl, read on Glyph?

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Rajam, no read on RR at all?

 

[Rajam]

No yet, put him as null meanwhile I finish. From the few things I have read on RR nothing calls my attention in a scummy sense though

Glyph who do you want lynched the most?

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Oh you're not done yet, okay that makes more sense.

And Rajam its pretty obvious from my posts today who I want. You'll understand why as you finish up yesterDay

 

[Inferno3044]

Ran told me to post. Go town!

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Lol @ RR putting himself second to last.

I'm down for mass claim, but RR is going first.

You first, lol at you after me.

Not after the crappy turn around from Zen to me you did.

 

[Rajam]

100% sold on Kary town. #430, #499, #567 among the main posts that give me the town vibes. His push for several directions and activity during the very end of D1 is also a town tell for me. If Kary hasn't claimed yet, he goes last deffinitely.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Well i guess I have to read this game then!

RIP Zen/Badwolf, thankyou for clearing yourself, you'll be missed.
also I miss Inferno, thank you for being town and pushing your reads.


RR don't push for thread power. Tell me why you should claim after Glyph, and who your scumreads are.

Reads/answers incoming after I get caught up.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

oh, and

DO NOT VOTE

@Vinyl; which two players are scum and why?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Because his grimy push onto me was gross, he dropped the Zen push on a drop of a hat over a really really reaching point. That alone destroyed my townish read on him.

I want Glyph and Rajam, Rajam is PoE since I think you an Vinyl are town.

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Because that is my only point and I did not explain further in a post yesterday that you have not even addressed

 

[Vinylic.]

I'm kind of agreeing with Ryu here. I already know I'm in a bad position, like always.

I do think rajam could be scum. Glyph for tomorrow maybe.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

@RR; why isn't that townGlyph pushing people on specific points?
Zen on his claim, you on your 'slip'?
I don't understand why his push on you was gross exactly :/

@Glyph: why did Inferno have to go before RR (given that if you had a gun, you would've shot RR), and why didn't you discuss it before voting?

@Vinyl; you have Rajam as more scummy than Glyph? What has Rajam done that is scummy?

 

[Ramen King]

good luck guys
go town
do your best
you can do it
yay town
yay tacos!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fJh7j3INmw

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Because that is my only point and I did not explain further in a post yesterday that you have not even addressed

Quote it, btw you're up to claim.

@RR; why isn't that townGlyph pushing people on specific points?
Zen on his claim, you on your 'slip'?
I don't understand why his push on you was gross exactly :/

It's gross transitions, no line of thought, no way he is trying to be legitimate in how he moves from person to person.

Zen > Ruy > Inferno.

It's gross and out of the blue. That's not town Glyph.

Zen was a PR, first time after 5 games of gambits. My slip is not a slip.

 

[Vinylic.]

Well the lurking, and his thoughts and questioning about d1.

He wasn't really trying, I believe.

 

[Vinylic.]

I wanna stick with zen logic here though.

What if I said Kary's too townie?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

@RR; whether you slipped or not is irrelevant to me. I find it interesting that town Zen was scumreading you though.

Surely Glyph is more likely to be scum with Vinyl given the way our waggons have gone?

If Rajam is scum then he's doing a helluva job in getting us to lynch one another.

How confident can you be in your Vinyl townread?


@Vinyl; what do you mean by 'Zen logic?' of course i'm town.
also, what was your read on BarDulL?

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

@RR; why isn't that townGlyph pushing people on specific points?
Zen on his claim, you on your 'slip'?
I don't understand why his push on you was gross exactly :/

@Glyph: why did Inferno have to go before RR (given that if you had a gun, you would've shot RR), and why didn't you discuss it before voting?

@Vinyl; you have Rajam as more scummy than Glyph? What has Rajam done that is scummy?

THAT BEING SAID. RR's play overall has been nothing I could really say set off any alarm bells. That doesn't excuse his slip, or even mean I don't want him lynched, it just means I can understand how someone who's not seeing the slip as the obvscum tell like I am would be hesitant to lynch him. If you read this and suddenly see things my way, fantastic! We'll lynch RR and ride off into the sunset (or the next day I guess). But if not, its not something I can really persuade you on. I could repeat my points, sure, but if you're not feeling them that's just how it is.

I did discuss it. RR was not a viable lynch candidate yesterday. Had you (and others, but mostly you) agreed with how damning the slip was/is then I would have happily switched the order.

But that wasn't the case, so I looked elsewhere. Inferno was the next best option, and I pursued that instead.

Now, however, we not only have the slip but ALSO his ridiculously scummy hammer. If we need more than that I can really go back and do a hard look into his play but I don't think its going to be necessary.



Also RR, you're pretty funny man! But jokes work a lot better when they're grounded in truth instead of just baseless accusations like 'hrumph he jumped from one to the other without explanation' when I DID detail my change in position each time.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Hmm ok.

Glyph, who's scum with RR?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Where did you show Inferno suspicion Glyph?

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Hmm ok.

Glyph, who's scum with RR?

Vinyl.

If my name was Red Ryu I would just leave the post at that, but I like to do this new thing called 'supporting your claims' so please bear with me I know its going to be obnoxious.

To be perfectly honest I had not really put much thought into who RR's scummate might be before this question came up. I generally avoid putting effort into something that has a chance of being completely useless (ie, if RR flipped town) but I'm confident enough in my stance to go ahead and push the extra mile.

So lets look at where we are right now. 5 players alive. Of those 5, I can immediately strike 3 from the list of potential scummates (RR can't be his own, I am myself, and if Kary isn't town I'd have to seriously consider not playing mafia anymore). This leaves Rajam and Vinyl.

Rajam and RR have very little interaction, but hell Rajam only has like 14 posts in the entire thread. Bardull v RR offers more to work with, but I really never found anything that jumped out at me.

But then there's Vinyl.

RR and Vinyl have a nifty history together this game, lets take a look!

Bardull why Vinyl town?

An innocent enough concern. Bardull comes out with a Vinyl town read with ... well pretty much nothing backing it. I'm including this post for the sake of being thorough, not so much for the overall case.

Dislike Soup, he's looking at surface level and nothing more, though I do think Vinyl is a shot in the dark right now.

Idk why people threw town reads on him already.

The only thing I'd want you to take away from this post is that he has Vinyl as 'a shot in the dark'. Can YOU guess what RR's read on Vinyl is? (I can't!)

So join me or I push a lynch on you? towards Vinyl

Honestly I don't even know what RR is SAYING here. Best I can tell, Zen is threatening Vinyl with being lynched if Vinyl doesn't jump onto the Soup bandwagon and RR feels the need to swoop in and defend Vinyl for some reason.

Vote: Zen

Vinyl is weak minded, I disagree with Inferno on both his pushes and don't like how he is pushing, Kary is a reach on a number of points, Vinyl doesn't look into his play with any understanding of Vinyl not being a strong proactive player.

Zen abused this yesterday, he made a threat onto Vinyl for not joining the wagon knowing he would follow if threatened with force. Vinyl is not strong willed and will not go off on his own without someone pushing it hard. Zen focused on this and strong armed him far harder.

Zen has constantly pushed for thread power, but at times I reread and try to think of why he makes certain pushes. Soup was legitimate, he pushed for a weaker player to be lynched off being bad and not being scummy. Zen I don't know why he is pushing Vinyl nor Glyph and is being constantly vauge with why he is making these assertions.

Also I do not believe he is a PR, this is a tactic to get credit to his thread power so people listen to him.

While I am ok with the Soup lynch, I am not ok with how he approached people around it.

I'm leaving this quote intact because I feel its an accurate representation of how RR actually feel's about Vinyl's slot. You'll notice he's openly shifted away from his 'shot in the dark' read and now is VERY clear that he just thinks Vinyl is bad at mafia.

And hey, so do I! I've been leaning town on Vinyl all game because, well, look at his play. Its not something you can hold to any real standard and try to take something away from. But again, just take note of his stance here despite no real justification or explanation (after all, why should he? No one asked him to!)

So why now Vinyl Zen?

We're getting into more familiar territory now. Why is RR concerned that Zen is voting Vinyl? Zen wasn't exactly shy about his reads and why he felt the way he did, so why even ask this?

(spoiler alert:

Spoiler

RR and Vinyl are scummates

)

I think he is a VT right now pushing the PR claim for added credit.

You think off he has something legitimate? I don't think he would lopenly claim to have a PR as a PR.



...uhh, I'm confused, where do you get a PR tell like only godfather or something from.

Also why the flip to Vinyl again, why where you on Glyph before?

Correction, VT or scum doing this, I read scum intent from how he handled other players on D1 like Vinyl with pushing him around.

If you didn't think he was concerned about the Vinyl lynch after that first quote, I'd really love to hear about your reservations after reading these two. Also, its a super nasty slip from RR but dead horse meet stick.

The why is the thing I want to know.

I don't think Vinyl is as much of a crap shoot at this point, even more so with seeing the end of Bust a Move mafia.

He isn't strong willed and I don't think D1 will ever be his best day, even then I think while minimal he is doing more than Utricked 3 mafia, where he had literally no content, which more recent games I feel like he has stepped up a little bit more.

But maybe you're STILL not sold on the connection. Boom, there's MORE (and note the time stamps of these posts too. These all take place in very rapid succession).

Now, imagine yourself in a mafia game (easy right). You have a read on someone you would describe as 'not as much of a crap shoot as it was earlier'.

Got it?

Now, look at these last few quotes. Are these the actions of someone who is on the fence on a read? ABSOLUTELY not. Had RR been toting a hard TownVinyl stance, THEN I could see posts like these making sense. But instead, RR does this very vague 'ohhhhh Vinyl is just bad at mafia but I'm not giving a read on him' over and over. In fact, I challenge you to read over those and tell me RR's read on Vinyl.

Vinyl's AtE is bad, but...he still is trying to do something, at some levels. I don't like the logic behind his responses, but I don't see it being strongly scummy. Vinyl isn't proactive, he sheeps whoever buddys him, I learned this on multiple game fronts. When he is scum, he doesn't contribute anything of value. To his town play, it's not far off, but I think look this over gives me a better look at his mindset. He is trying to put forth his own reads and get to a conclusion and base somewhere in there, yeah his reactions to pressure are bad, but they usually are, it actually looks like me in my earlier games where I reacted horrible to pressure.

Inferno is going into a tunnel mode, and I'm trying to see why he is pretty much doing the same as Soup or for that matter, why Soup was a town read on D1, I don't see a basis for it nor how he reached the conclusion. I'm not seeing his reads having merit either and him clinging to his vinyl scum looks like he made his conclusion already instead of analyzing Vinyl to judge a read. While some of Vinyl's AtE responses are hard to take serious, I wouldn't. Looking at his posts on him wanting to survive, do give me a sense of towny Vinyl. Even more his linking to Disney mafia seems to be him thinking and looking for difference, though not strong. Vinyl has a point that either alignment will go for it, but Inferno is brushing it off.

Vinyl at least seems to be trying, good or bad does not matter here, his intent is what is important.

Right now I'm like this;

Town: Kary,
I think is town: Glyph, Vinyl,
Idk: Rajam, Zen,
Scum: Inferno,

Rajam needs to be looked at more, I need to delve into what Zen is, I think he is scum in almost every game I'm with him, Inferno needs to go.

And then Vinyl was tied for second towniest in the game. For reasons like 'Looking at his posts on him wanting to survive, do give me a sense of towny Vinyl.' Because nothing screams town like self-preservation!

FAST FORWARD TO THE PRESENT

Because his grimy push onto me was gross, he dropped the Zen push on a drop of a hat over a really really reaching point. That alone destroyed my townish read on him.

I want Glyph and Rajam, Rajam is PoE since I think you an Vinyl are town.

Beep boop suddenly in Lylo Vinyl is town instead of 'ehhhhhhhh less of a crap shoot'.

Well gee though, maybe its just Vinyl's play right?! Maybe Vinyl really got his **** together and did something to prove himself townie, right?!

Well first off RR doesn't deem it important enough to even EXPLAIN why he's suddenly got a town read on Vinyl so we wouldn't know anyway, but if you can look me in the eye and say 'Vinyl's play has improved to such a degree that I consider him more townie than I did yesterDay' then congratulations on your entrance to politics.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So that wraps up the RR side, but are we done? Heeeeelllllll no! We still gotta pick through Vinyl's posts!

But hey, before we do that, lets play a game! Its a classic, most commonly known as 'Find where Vinyl mentions RR before the last post on page 12'. Ready GO!

...

Did you find any? Awwwwwwwwwwwww that's a shame. I couldn't either though so its okay.

Now Vinyl has been a very vocal poster. No one can deny that. So the odds that he should just somehow never get around to asking anything from or towards RR are pretty slim.

###WARNING! YOU WILL PROBABLY DISAGREE WITH THE NEXT PART!###

This is not the first time I've seen this happen, mostly because its something I did in my very first scum game, NBC mafia. I was aligned with X1-12, and found myself asking 'why don't I just never say anything to you at all? If we have no connections, we won't leave a trail for people to follow, right?'. On top of that, I got in the habit of talking to X1-12 in the QT instead of the thread. He warned me that people can pick up on not leaving any connections at all, and I'll be damned if he wasn't right.

I think the reason there is no mention of RR in any of Vinyl's posts is because he was already in contact with him via a quicktopic. And really, I don't think its a huge stretch for Vinyl to get the 'no connections' idea into his head at this stage in his play either (hell I came up with it with literally zero experience being scum).

###END THAT SECTION###

So there's that void, and then suddenly!

RR currently has a good stance. So that's pretty town. I would expect more.

There's Zen being forceful, but shows a bit of his soft side after reading soup's post. Still, I don't really want to see his current play very frequently, so I hope he better determination than now. Giving a town for this.

Rajam's nulltown, so I don't get why soup's fine with voting him. I like his observancy more.

Kary's kary, but the kind of kary that gives more meaning than seeing plain relentless agression to it. Town.

RR is town. Because he has a good stance. I guess he didn't have good stances before then? Or .... something?

Okay, let me break it down some more Vinyl.

We have several inactives. Yes Ryker's the MOST inactive but both RR and Inferno haven't exactly been the most vocal.

So I want to know why you're picking each person for cop/push later/whatever OVER the other inactives. I get that it works both ways, but why did you decide on the ones you put up first?

It from the kind of interest I'm looking at. You got Ryker posting a bit, but then there's RR going off with a good start, at least. Same with Rajam. So ryker stood out as a good push.

Inferno though is not looking like RR and Rajam if you could take a look at his posts. The last inferno I saw was more informative, despite his inactivity. He's still not doing anything as of yet. So if he were copped, that would be nice enough.

*brofist* @ Past Glyph for hooking me up with some more information to work from.

Vinyl goes out of his way here to lump RR and Rajam into the same category, and even further to justify them as not targets for investigation. Even Vinyl would know only saying 'don't investigate RR' would be a terrible idea, and so boom he lumps him in with Rajam (despite a VERY varied play between the two, especially when you take Bardull's play into account).

Skip forward to D2...

I think of inferno as scum, so he's got a **** ton to do to convince me he's not.

Why ryker got killed is something I wanna know, so I'll make some bias. Ryker has been the least active Yesterday and has not really caught up, what kary wanted didn't come out as he wanted it to be, which is to pressure him.

So I have the following people and make a reason on why they night killed ryker:

RR, Rajam: Random NK, possibly thinks he could be the potential cop.

Inferno: Random NK, possibly thinks he could be potential cop, spurs things up for townies to probably doubt him as scum.

Zen: NK Choice, probably spur things up but his play tells otherwise, disregarding him as scum, but potential.

Kary: NK choice to Spur things up.

Glyph: Either random or not, possibly to spur things up as well.


To add things to it, there's also the possibility of voting just because he has potential in finding scum, and I'm not exactly sure if it's because he can't compete with him.

RR and Rajam still being lumped together.

EBWOP: Ryker's a good player, and he has good potential in finding scum, but seeing how inactive he is, which his posts have been saying "brb" on day 1, I don't think he's either into it or busy, so scum can't really NK because he's a major threat unless they still think he can be tomorrow, but that's a doubt for me.

So why scum chooses to Kill ryker could only have no reason, or trying to spur things up. I think one of the following is not on zen's suspicion, but outside of it.

Inferno, RR, and Rajam are not much into the soup wagon, if I'm correct.

I'm not the best at reading Vinyl (I mean literally in this case, I can't read what he's saying) but this looks a HELL of a lot like him digging up town cred for those 3 for not being supporters of the Soup lynch. Inferno somehow makes it into the mix now. Yeah.

It's funny since I was thinking about glyph a few minutes after I made my previous post, but I just dropped it. I haven't paid much attention to him and so forth. I felt like glyph wasn't really there much toDay on the part with me and inferno, but on the other hand he's been productive since yesterday. I'm still calling town on him and I like his pressure vote zen, but I'll have to ask him to vote with me as well.

The reason why I voted soup was because I was threatened by zen. (I said this a couple of times.)


As for elaborating glyph and RR, I would wanna say glyph. I do like RR too, I just want to see more of him since he CAN give out good details.

Glyph is more town than RR, but also RR is town I just want to see more of him.

For someone who has a bigger town read on my slot, he spends a lot of time talking about his town read on RR here and very little on mine.

And that, again, brings us to toDay.

I'm kind of agreeing with Ryu here. I already know I'm in a bad position, like always.

I do think rajam could be scum. Glyph for tomorrow maybe.

I wanna stick with zen logic here though.

What if I said Kary's too townie?

Read these two posts. Literally these two posts alone (I believe) show Vinyl is scum.

We are in Lylo. Vinyl is willing to lynch:

-Rajam
-Glyph

And Vinyl is also putting forth that KARY could 'be TOO townie'. Guess what, you don't make a post like that unless you'd be willing to look into LYNCHING THEM.

So we see Vinyl willing to lynch EVERYONE EXCEPT HIMSELF AND RR. GEE AIN'T THAT SOMETHIN'




This took a very long time to write and is probably pretty rambling, but goddamnit I think we have this game on lock.

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Where did you show Inferno suspicion Glyph?

Okay, just one question and then I believe I'm ready.

@Inferno: Why, when it became clear that no one was following you on the Vinyl wagon (and still aren't) did you keep pushing the same points without deviation?

Also lesser questions that may have been answered and I missed them, still both at Inferno

-Why did you claim? Were you asked to?
-Who else besides Vinyl is scum?

Also, this.

 

[Vinylic.]

Holy ****, I don't even.

 

[Vinylic.]

You know what, I don't know how to say this but.......

I mean.

That was the biggest reach. With good reasoning. I know you made that up, glyph. I swear to GOD I think this is either you taking a risk or you are redoinkadoink serious.

 

[Vinylic.]

@Kary

Re-cap D1 with glyph and soup interaction, talking about me.
And them look at his post now.

Please tell me what you think of that, bro.

That's pretty much it. God help me all.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Vinyl, who's your scumbuddy?


RR, I think you should claim now. I appreciate you want Glyph to go first, but I don't think it's going to make much difference either way.