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I think Mii Beast/Titan's weapon of choice could be their thicc belly and hefty headbutts - maybe even some real rough stuff like biting. Still a physical fighter, but very different from Brawler.So, I think our new Mii classes should fit in with the old Mii classes, first and foremost. To find out what exactly that means, we can look at traits from the three other Mii classes.
So, with all this in mind, what gaps are left by the original three Mii classes, and what could potentially fill them? Well, here's my ideas, starting with the best and working to the more out-there ones.
- They are intended to be anyone you want them to be. This is why their movesets aren't specific references to anything Mii-related, and why we even get character-based costumes for them in the first place. They're intended to let your favorite characters, or even you yourself, join the battle.
- They're based on common character types in Smash. Barehanded fighters, swordwielders, and projectile users have been part of Smash for ages. In a sense, making a Mii based on a character you like is sort of like giving them a safe, by-the-book moveset similar to previous characters of this nature without any special gimmicks. Also, many Mii specials are based on specials from other characters.
- They're based on common character types in fiction. Perhaps this overlaps with the second point, but I think it's worth looking at this separately. We had more pentuple-jumping orb characters than we had characters with gun arms when the Miis were introduced, but I think it would have been a bit of a mistake to have a Mii Puffball in lieu of the Gunners. After all, characters with gun hands, or characters with guns in general as Gunners get abstracted to, are much more common than puffballs.
- Their weapon is the biggest identifier of their class. Literally, in the case of their stock icons in Ultimate. Brawlers use fists, Swordfighters use swords, Gunners use guns. When a character's appearance can be as varied as a Mii, it's a great benefit, I think, to have a unique weapon as a class's visual anchor.
- Finally, and a bit less important, they have an associated default color, which is designed to pair well with the others. The original three have the primary colors of pigment - red, blue, yellow. To pair well with those, we could add green, then purple, and then maybe orange, then pink; depending on how many classes we wish to add, of course.
...I tried thinking of more classes, but really, most of them ended up feeling too specific. Really, I think the ones I mentioned are the only ones I could see being broad enough to really work... and even then, all of them feel a bit dodgy for one reason or another. The Mii Mage's staff is not held too differently from the "swords" of some Swordfighter costumes; the Beast doesn't have a good weapon lined up at all; and the Dual-Wielder/Ninja/Whatever feels... I don't know, the Dual-Wielder name blatantly sucks and "Ninja" feels too specific.
- Mii Mage: Well-trod ground at this point. Like the Mii Gunner, there's not many characters with this class' specific weapon (Gunner had Samus and Mega Man, who was introduced in the same game) - our only staffwielders are Palutena and Ashley. However, just like Mii Gunner, there's quite a few more characters that suit this class more generally: Peach, Rosalina, Zelda, Ness. The Mii Mage's normals could be inspired by the sort of elegant, graceful staff-fighting you tend to get from mage characters... and don't really get from a Swordfighter. I don't see them as a "pelt with projectiles" character like the Mii Gunner is, but more of a midrange character with a couple of projectiles on them. A good fit for purple or green, and strikes me as being female by default like the Mii Gunner is.
- Mii Beast: Maybe also called the Mii Titan, or Mii Heavyweight or... something. This class is inspired by heavyweight characters like Bowser, King K. Rool, Ganondorf, Donkey Kong, or King Dedede. It's certainly a unique mechanical niche for the Mii Fighters, and a longstanding character type in Smash. Feels a bit like a green class to me. My main issue with this is: what weapon would they use? Characters like this normally use their fists, but that's the same thing the Brawler does. Claws, maybe (that's why I chose the Beast name), but I'm not sure how many character costumes we could do with those. Maybe if we animate them carefully, a Mii Beast could look like they're punching, using claws, or using a knife or something; but that feels a bit hard to execute.
- Mii Dual-Wielder: Not what it should actually be called. I'm including this one mostly off of the strength of its weapon. I think a Mii that dual-wields swords stands out from the rest perfectly and still has a fair amount of characters that could be repped by one. Maybe this could be that Mii Ninja y'all are talking about.
Why use a weapon when they are the weapon? With this, I'm imagining body slams and grapples for days. Almost as if Bob from Tekken and Zangief did the Fusion Dance.Mii Beast: Maybe also called the Mii Titan, or Mii Heavyweight or... something. This class is inspired by heavyweight characters like Bowser, King K. Rool, Ganondorf, Donkey Kong, or King Dedede. It's certainly a unique mechanical niche for the Mii Fighters, and a longstanding character type in Smash. Feels a bit like a green class to me. My main issue with this is: what weapon would they use? Characters like this normally use their fists, but that's the same thing the Brawler does. Claws, maybe (that's why I chose the Beast name), but I'm not sure how many character costumes we could do with those. Maybe if we animate them carefully, a Mii Beast could look like they're punching, using claws, or using a knife or something; but that feels a bit hard to execute.
Don't forget using heavy stuff as improvised weapons like cars, telephone poles, boulders, trees and more.I think Mii Beast/Titan's weapon of choice could be their thicc belly and hefty headbutts. Still a physical fighter, but very different from Brawler.
I think Mii Beast/Titan's weapon of choice could be their thicc belly and hefty headbutts - maybe even some real rough stuff like biting. Still a physical fighter, but very different from Brawler.
Why use a weapon when they are the weapon? With this, I'm imagining body slams and grapples for days. Almost as if Bob from Tekken and Zangief did the Fusion Dance.
I mean, yes, this is all very plausible stuff for a moveset, but I'm not sure it's as... immediately visually obvious as "this one punch, this one slash, this one shoot", is my point. Can't really put "big body" on a stock icon like you can with a fist, sword, or gun.Don't forget using heavy stuff as improvised weapons like cars, telephone poles, boulders, trees and more.
You sure about that?Can't really put "big body" on a stock icon like you can with a fist, sword, or gun.
Smash Miis are already completely detached from their origin.Perhaps this is just me, but I'm really sure I can visualize a "titan" mii working to the same degree as the other classes. The others still have a standard mii as the base character, merely holding a different weapon. What we're discussing right know seems to be some sort of Hulk/Zangief type character, which changes the whole build of a mii, to where its no longer a mii, and simply a customizable character named mii.
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vs.
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If we make some fat bulky titan mii, It would really only be a mii in face and name only, based on the descriptions I'm hearing at least. Not to mention that the heavy characters in smash don't exactly have a consistent weapon/playstyle beyond being heavy to be represented with this mii.
Its less so that they match the function of normal miis in their home games, but rather the three mii fighters right now all have the same body type of a standard mii. Presumably a fourth one would too, and I can’t see a Titan Mii sharing the same build as the current miis, unlike a Mage mii for example, who could easily have the same stature as the other three simply with a different weapon.Smash Miis are already completely detached from their origin.
The anatomy, outfit, and overall vibe/aesthetic have nothing in common with normal Miis. They don't even use Guest Miis as their faces in renders.
Not to mention that a lot of Mii costumes (Sans, Cuphead, Vault Boy, Bomberman. Black Knight) are intentionally designed to not resemble Miis.
They... don't though.the three mii fighters right now all have the same body type of a standard mii.
Perhaps “standard” was the wrong term.They... don't though.
These are almost the utmost opposites you can get out of "medium sized late-teen-to-young-adult cartoon male human" proportions-wise. One has visible ankles, knees, shoulders, and elbows; fingers; and a slightly protruding chest - the other is just a bunch of cylinders.
Not to mention: there was never a guideline for how Miis should be shaped in the first place. Some games they have feet, some games they don't. Some games they have arms and fingers, some games they just have floating balls for hands. Some games they're rendered with a level of anatomical correctness, others they've got cylinders for torsos.
In Nintendo Land they get buff and turned into some weird springy vehicle contraption
Oh yeah, and uhh... y'know...
Perhaps “standard” was the wrong term.
I’m mainly talking about how the official art of the three mii fighters have them all at pretty much the same height and dimensions. They have different outfits of course, but to me at least they all seem to be built similarly, if not identical. I assume a fourth mii class would continue this trend, and don’t see how a huge buff titan mii could do so.
imo a fourth mii fighter would have the same dimenions as the other three, to maintain visual cohesion as one of the mii fighters. A titan Mii would cease to feel like a mii, personally, when the dimenions of a smash mii have already been established (within a certain range of course).
Agree with you, Winnie the Pooh.
So you think a whole character should not be added... because of visual cohesion in promo art?? Am I reading this correctly? What is this faux-OCD logic? I'm trying to be civil, but this take is so bizarre I can't even come up with a response.
So you think a whole character should not be added... because of visual cohesion in promo art?? Am I reading this correctly? What is this faux-OCD logic? I'm trying to be civil, but this take is so bizarre I can't even come up with a response.
But doesn't that defeat the whole point of a customisable fighter? To be limited to a single body shape? Anyway, it doesn't really matter what the initial design philosophy was - look at Donkey Kong. In (our universe's) Smash he only uses one or two moves from his games (the hand slap, and the punch which could be considered a reference to DKC2's ending), when Diddy Kong was added he used 3 or 4, give or take (2 of his specials, the cartwheel, probably a small few others), now come K. Rool almost his entire kit is a reference to something or other - down to a minigame from Donkey Konga of all things being referenced. A reverse extreme would be Bowser Jr. and Game & Watch - two characters who focus on having tons of different unconventional weapons. Mr. Game & Watch uses something from a G&W game for every single move with naught an exception, while some of Bowser Jr's moveset is references to established elements and some of it is things that have never appeared in a Mario game before or since.View attachment 321080
Yes.
My interpretation of the miis is that they’re more or less supposed to be the same base model/structure/whatever you wanna call it, with a different weapon/playstyle. Its not just promo art either, I’m pretty sure the default mii’s for all three classes are also just as visually/dimensionally similar as their official arts are.
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Less sticking to promo art, and more of what I believe to be the design philosophy behind the mii fighters in the first place.
Potentially, but the original three mii fighters already have the same body shape. They were introduced that way in Smash 4, and it was a trait carried over into Ultimate, even though they got new designs. As you showed earlier, Mii's designs vary from game to game, so they were designed intentionally in both installments to all have the same shape, so I think it makes sense for a hypothetical fourth mii to follow the trend. Unless we're going to overhaul the whole Mii fighter system to have both the weapon and build choosable separately, like in Skylanders Imaginators (real ones will know), I think we should keep a potential new mii with the same build as the rest.But doesn't that defeat the whole point of a customisable fighter? To be limited to a single body shape?
So, I'm really not grasping what you're trying to say but as far as I can tell it's "Sakurai designed the Miis to be similar, so a 4th Mii should also be consistent with this philosophy."Potentially, but the original three mii fighters already have the same body shape. They were introduced that way in Smash 4, and it was a trait carried over into Ultimate, even though they got new designs. As you showed earlier, Mii's designs vary from game to game, so they were designed intentionally in both installments to all have the same shape, so I think it makes sense for a hypothetical fourth mii to follow the trend. Unless we're going to overhaul the whole Mii fighter system to have both the weapon and build choosable separately, like in Skylanders Imaginators (real ones will know), I think we should keep a potential new mii with the same build as the rest.
Yeah, I mean if three characters were introduced alongside each other all looking virtually identical, except for their weapons (and hair/face/outfit which are all customizable), and a fourth one were to join these three, I think it should/would follow the same design trends, of being a similar build but with a different weapon.So, I'm really not grasping what you're trying to say but as far as I can tell it's "Sakurai designed the Miis to be similar, so a 4th Mii should also be consistent with this philosophy."
Why should we stick to Sakurai's supposed "vision" or "philosophy" - which he has never publically said or even alluded to in words I should add - if we don't agree with it?
For the Mii Mage, we would reassign several existing outfits while adding a few more. Some ideas that could be utilized would be Kamek, Eggplant Wizard, Yuga, etc. as well as generic costumes.Just something I realized and wanted to point out:
If we add a new Mii Class like Mage or Titan, we will probably need to make exclusive costumes for them. As much as I love the idea of a Mii Titan, I can't think of any costumes that would only work on that class (besides maybe a sumo outfit or something of that nature.)
I was about to ask about that. Good to knowFor the Mii Mage, we would reassign several existing outfits while adding a few more. Some ideas that could be utilized would be Kamek, Eggplant Wizard, Yuga, etc. as well as generic costumes.
Mr Bison's outfit and hat?Just something I realized and wanted to point out:
If we add a new Mii Class like Mage or Titan, we will probably need to make exclusive costumes for them. As much as I love the idea of a Mii Titan, I can't think of any costumes that would only work on that class (besides maybe a sumo outfit or something of that nature.)
Possible Titan CostumesFor the Mii Mage, we would reassign several existing outfits while adding a few more. Some ideas that could be utilized would be Kamek, Eggplant Wizard, Yuga, etc. as well as generic costumes.
Im at a loss at the big body Mii class since there aren’t any current possible costumes available but I suppose Mike Haggar, Yellow Devil, Metal Face, and others could potentially work.
Here's one I got for a possible outfit:
AgreeI say a new Mii is warranted. It adds more versatility to a character class that needs versatility and allows for more freedom in how Mii characters are represented.