Super Smash Bros 4 (Wii U/3DS) Topic

[Deleted member]

I know I'm beating a dead horse here, but I feel this needs to be said:

Note: I will be using transformation when discussing the number of characters, not the number of slots. Sakurai considers Melee to have twenty-six characters and Brawl to have thirty-nine characters.

So far, we have received twelve characters (nine veterans and three newcomers) and there is also a very legitimate leak that if true, confirms Pac-Man, Mii and Little Mac on the roster as well, bringing us to fifteen. Along with other news, there is a ton of hype surrounding the new game. However, there is also concern about the roster as it has been confirmed that there will be universal roster (meaning the roster is the same on both versions). Because of this announcement, many people have been under the assumption that the roster will have a similar size to that of Brawl or just a slight increase (below forty-five characters). But when we take a look at all the information that's going around, this isn't likely to happen.

Take a look at the link that confirms universal roster. When Sakurai was discussing if all of the veterans from Melee and Brawl would return, he had this to say on the matter:

"The reality of the situation unfortunately is that there are certain limitations on the 3DS," Sakurai said. The 3DS and Wii U versions of the next Smash Bros will have the same library of characters.

"So we're forced into the situation where we may need to reduce some characters to a certain degree, but we're really working hard in order to include as many characters as possible."

At first glance, this would make most people overreact, especially for those expecting fifty or more characters. It seems as because the 3DS is as powerful if not more so than the Wii that a similar roster size to Brawl is inevitable, but when taking a closer look at it, nothing of such is indicated and as a matter of fact, the same quote seems to contradict this.

So we're forced into the situation where we may need to reduce some characters to a certain degree

Take a look at the bolded, especially at the "may" part. The "may" indicates that he hasn't cut any characters he's planned due to time constraints yet but that if time constraints comes in, he may have to do so. Yet he may not even be referring to cutting character. Take a look at the bolded underline of "to a certain degree". Notice that Sakurai never explicitly said that if time constraints gets in the way, he may have to cut characters, but that he may need to reduce some characters to a certain degree. That to me is not the same as cutting characters, but implies that he may be doing something else entirely to save time should time constraints coming up.

What he could be doing is should time constraints come up, he would modify characters to make them less complicated to deal with because of the 3DS. Like he would split up Pokémon Trainer's Pokémon or separate Zelda and Sheik. These fall more in of reducing some characters to a certain degree than outright cutting characters. Then take a look at this quote:

but we're really working hard in order to include as many characters as possible.

If anything, this contradict the notion that the roster will be of a similar size of that of Brawl. What Sakurai is saying is that he wants to include as many characters as he possibly can that he wants and that includes veterans. He wants to avoid having to cut a lot of characters like he had to in Brawl and is working hard to save characters. This, if anything, indicates that cuts will be as minimal as possible and that cuts will only be done if there is absolutely no other option left.

It also seems as the issue Sakurai is noting with 3DS is less due to the roster size and more due to mechanical issues. Take a look at this quote:

And while the handheld and console versions of the next Super Smash Bros. will feature system-specific stages, the game's moves, characters and items will be "nearly identical".

Now it is true that universal roster is confirmed, but why would Sakurai say that characters would be nearly identical if there is some difference between the roster? What Sakurai could be saying is that the while the characters are the same, there are at least a small difference occurring. So for example, Samus and Zero Suit Samus could end up being split on the 3DS version due to complications yet co-exist together on the Wii-U version. Same character but they may function different between both versions. So for those worried about veterans being compromise, the worry will hopefully only extend to the 3DS version.

Finally, there are some reasons why the roster could be large (relatively speaking). A big reason people are worried about roster size is because the 3DS is not able to handle as much as the Wii-U version, but the concern isn't as big as most people think. The Nintendo 3DS is able to handle up to 8 GB of space in a cart. Let's compare two games for example:

- Super Street Fighter IV had only 2 GB of space and yet retained all thirty-five of it's character. While sacrifices obviously had to be made to fit the game, the fact that all characters can fit in is pretty impressive.
- Tekken 3D: Prime Edition had forty-one characters with 4 GB of space.


Chances are that Super Smash Bros. will have 6 or 8 GB of space in order to fit in as much as possible. Considering that compression will likely be a lot better this time around (whereas compression was horribly done in Brawl) and Sakurai trying to include as many characters as possible, having a relatively large roster size increase like from Smash 64 to Melee and Melee to Brawl is not outside of the realm of possibility. Especially when factoring this into the equation:

"There will be a single player [campaign], but it won't be like the [Subspace Emissary] mode in Brawl," Sakurai explained.

Note that the Subspace Emissary took up most of the time developing the game. Not having a story mode like Subspace Emissary can only mean good things as it would mean more time spent on characters (and especially more things on other parts of the game in general, like online, balancing, stages, new game play mechanics, etc).

Another noteworthy thing is that Namco is capable of balancing large games. Namco has managed to handle a fifty-nine character roster for Tekken Tag Tournament 2 and the game was well received overall. It's only further evidence that with Namco's help, a large roster is certainly not outside of the possibility.

Sakurai has also planned an even larger roster expansion from Melee to Brawl. Back in Brawl, six or seven characters (depending on if the rumor about Plusle & Minun being added is true) were planned to be in the game but were dropped; Mewtwo, Roy, Dr. Mario, Dixie Kong (as Diddy Kong's partner), Toon Zelda/Sheik and maybe Plusle & Minun. Had all of them made the cut, Brawl's roster would have been forty-one/forty-two characters, nineteen/twenty more characters than before. Sakurai realizes that roster expansion is most definitely not everything, but that doesn't mean we won't see a considerable increase with SSB4 as well, especially with Namco helping out.

All of these put together doesn't indicate that similar roster sizes are inevitable and as a matter of fact, point towards a decent increase in the roster size. The concerns in regards to the roster are overblown and are mostly as a result of not putting things together properly.

That's not to say that there will be no cuts as they will probably happen (but for other reasons than time constraints unless the situation gets so dire) or that we will be getting more than sixty-five characters in the game, but when looking at the situation outside a surface point of view, it does show that fifty characters or more is very well within the realm of possibility and that cuts will probably be minimal if they happen. So for those worried about ten veterans getting the axe, don't worry, Sakurai will try to keep as many characters in as possible.

Thoughts? I want to bring this to GameFAQs in order to reduce the pessimism in regards to the roster. Still need to find links that prove that Brawl was horribly uncompressed.

 

[Starphoenix]

Isn't it possible that Mii and WFT might have the same symbol?

Have we even seen what WFT's symbol is?

She has a stretch pose as her logo. That won't be Mii's logo. My guess is a silhouette version of this:

Well, I don't entirely count AC due to actually being a series introduced in Brawl. But I think we might get 9 more besides that. I'm kind of doubtful on Pac-Man as is. What was Ninja Castle? I recognize the rest.

I'm counting it since it was just a stage before and there really has not been a series in that position before. We've had series with characters and no stages, but not the other way around until Brawl. Ninja Castle is just my Nintendo Land inspired easy way of saying Takamaru's series without having to Google the title every time and copy/pasting.

 

[ChronoBound]

Let me ask those who want or expect Wolf to be cut one question. If his specials were completely different, would everyone still want him gone?

They are Krystal fanboys still butthurt Wolf made it in over her. Hopefully Sakurai keeps both Falco and Wolf. The only new thing done with Star Fox since Brawl was a re-release of the only good game in that series (64).

I think the characters that are in particular danger of being cut are Snake, Sonic (we don't know Sakurai's stance on returning guests), Ike, Lucario, Toon Link, and Lucas. I think Falco and Wolf being series mainstays as opposed to being guests (Snake/Sonic), posterboys for their franchise at a certain epoch (Ike/Lucario), or basically a one-off character (Lucas), helps their situation. Toon Link at worst will simply be replaced with a new design of a child Link, and possibly a name change. Otherwise, its still the quicker, lighter, faster Link we have had since Melee.

Really weird though that we did not get any newcomers from veteran franchises though, and that the three other newcomers that are also rumored (Little Mac, Mii, and Pac-Man) are also not from veteran franchises. This number already matches Brawl's in terms of new series granted playable characters. I think there is a good chance that Sakurai may believe that there is simply too few characters left from veteran franchises left to place in that are worthy enough for Smash Bros. or fit the label of a Nintendo all-star.

Really, the only veteran franchise characters that come to mind that strike me as important to their franchises that have yet to be playable in Smash Bros. are:
- Ridley
- K. Rool
- Dixie Kong
- Toad
- Palutena

That's it.

As for those who keep saying K. Rool probably should not count due to him being absent for both DKCR and now Tropical Freeze. I have a feeling that the fat croc with the eye tic has not been ruled out yet for that game.

There is a fourth character in that game that has not been talked about yet (they want to keep it a secret for now). How cool would it be if K. Rool was the fourth character, and that his new design for Tropical Freeze was unveiled simultaneously with a confirmation for Smash 4 (of course this would have to happen before November considering when that is when Tropical Freeze releases).

It would also be pretty cool if K. Rool was somehow leader of the vikings (though all of the vikings seem to be so far to be animals from frigid environments).

The only other character I could see for the fourth playable spot in Tropical Freeze is Funky Kong, however, I think K. Rool would be a much better surprise for fans. Sadly, I think Funky is more likely.

I believe I still have an essay from 2009 talking about how Smash Bros. should go in the direction of adding more newcomer series. My how time flies.

 

[XStarWarriorX]

@SSBF, no offense but game faq's is ******** (its best to stay far away from that site imo), all those cut happy people can suck it, cause there won't be any cuts this time, I believe sakurai is gonna try hard to keep everyone from brawl, and possibly bring back some melee vets like mewtwo and/or roy. nice read btw, but those guys over there will still be cut happy no matter what is said... because its gamefaq's...

 

[bobadz]

Awesome read. SSBFan. And do it.

 

[N3ON]

Personally I think the WFT could've fit under the whole series category of "Wii", the same one the Mii would be in, but I guess Wii Fit and just general Wii (or if Sakurai wants to call it the Mii series) don't count as the same series. I guess Wii Fit could count as a spin-off series to Wii like the Mario spin-offs to Mario, but then it's a little weird that we got WFT first. Well getting WFT at all is still weird to me.

 

[Gargaglione]

As if anything could make me dislike her Smash presence more. Sigh. At least I can throw something else at the people who want to boot Lucario now!

I love Jigglypuff; her moveset's very unique and she's just fun to play with. My only complaint about Jigglypuff is her Sing move, because opponents wake up by the time you finish singing, so it's pointless. They really need to fix that. Also, even though I also like him, Lucario's probably gonna be booted anyway.

 

[bobadz]

They are Krystal fanboys still butthurt Wolf made it in over her. Hopefully Sakurai keeps both Falco and Wolf. The only new thing done with Star Fox since Brawl was a re-release of the only good game in that series (64).

I think the characters that are in particular danger of being cut are Snake, Sonic (we don't know Sakurai's stance on returning guests), Ike, Lucario, Toon Link, and Lucas. I think Falco and Wolf being series mainstays as opposed to being guests (Snake/Sonic), posterboys for their franchise at a certain epoch (Ike/Lucario), or basically a one-off character (Lucas). Toon Link at worst will simply be replaced with a new design of a child Link, and possibly a name change. Otherwise, its still the quicker, lighter, faster Link we have had since Melee.

Really weird though that we did not get any newcomers from veteran franchises though, and that the three other newcomers that are also rumored (Little Mac, Mii, and Pac-Man) are also not from veteran franchises. This number already matches Brawl's in terms of new series granted playable characters. I think there is a good chance that Sakurai may believe that there is simply too few characters left from veteran franchises left to place in that are worthy enough for Smash Bros. or fit the label of a Nintendo all-star.

Really, the only veteran franchise characters that come to mind that strike me as important to their franchises that have yet to be playable in Smash Bros. are:
- Ridley
- K. Rool
- Dixie Kong
- Toad
- Palutena

That's it.

As for those who keep saying K. Rool probably should not count due to him being absent for both DKCR and now Tropical Freeze. I have a feeling that the fat croc with the eye tic has not been ruled out yet for that game.

There is a fourth character in that game that has not been talked about yet (they want to keep it a secret for now). How cool would it be if K. Rool was the fourth character, and that his new design for Tropical Freeze was unveiled simultaneously with a confirmation for Smash 4 (of course this would have to happen before November considering when that is when Tropical Freeze releases).

It would also be pretty cool if K. Rool was somehow leader of the vikings (though all of the vikings seem to be so far to be animals from frigid environments).

The only other character I could see for the fourth playable spot in Tropical Freeze is Funky Kong, however, I think K. Rool would be a much better surprise for fans. Sadly, I think Funky is more likely.

I believe I still have an essay from 2009 talking about how Smash Bros. should go in the direction of adding more newcomer series. My how time flies.

Chrono, I brought this up in the Ridley topic, but I think Mewtwo, Roy Ridley,Dixie and K Rool have the highest chances of being playable, due to the fact Sakurai said he gets requests from all over the world.

And what does the Japanese fanbase think of the newcomers?

 

[---]

As if anything could make me dislike her Smash presence more. Sigh. At least I can throw something else at the people who want to boot Lucario now!

Sorry, not trying to make anyone hate on Jigglypuff. If anything I think Sakurai made the right call given her moveset and veteran status, it just wouldn't Smash without her.

 

[kackamee]

Stuffy Stuff

I think Olimar will get the Toon Link treatment.
He'll probably get replaced with one of the characters from Pikmin 3, but retain the same playstayle.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

@N3ON: She could've, but she apparently has her own Symbol. I guess it might be specifically the Wii Fit series? I mean, it does have more than one game.

 

[ChronoBound]

Nine new playable series:

- Animal Crossing
- Mega Man
- Wii Fit
- Punch Out!!
- Pac-Man
- Mii
- Ninja Castle
- Xenoblade
- Golden Sun / Sin and Punishment

Those are my guesses too. We could get hit with a few more surprises though like Starfy, Famicom Wars, or possibly some sort of bizarre retro character that is hidden. Its also possible Sakurai blindsides us and includes Mach Rider over Takamaru as the retro character.

 

[TheTuninator]

Olimar's apparently playable in Pikmin 3 MP, so I doubt that they'll cut him.

I'm not so certain that Takamaru will be the retro inclusion. If he's already experienced a semi-revival of sorts, Sakurai may look for a much more obscure retro franchise to give a shot in the arm.

 

[ChronoBound]

I think Olimar will get the Toon Link treatment.
He'll probably get replaced with one of the characters from Pikmin 3, but retain the same playstayle.

The problem is that no one from Pikmin 3 is really the main character. Olimar had the advantage of having a game to himself, and was basically the most important captain for Pikmin 2. Whereas, Alph, Brittany, and Charlie all seem equally important to me. Alph seems the closest to Olimar, but replacing Olimar with a far less well-known character (who also may end up becoming the least popular of the three captains of Pikmin 3), does not speak to me as a particularly wise decision.

 

[Holder of the Heel]

Irrelevantly posting Animal Crossing pictures for fun.

Spoiler

As for the topic, Wii Fit Trainer and Mii do not belong together in the same category. Mii represents the Wii as the avatars of those who play it, and there are games based on these. Wii Fit Trainer's series of games doesn't directly have to do with the Wii but rather the Wii Fit board, of which she represents. It has no extra ties of identity to the Wii itself unlike the Mii.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

How are you people taking those pictures and uploading the,?

 

[Hoots]

I know I'm beating a dead horse here, but I feel this needs to be said:

Thoughts? I want to bring this to GameFAQs in order to drown out the pessimism in regards to the roster. Still need to find links that prove that Brawl was horribly uncompressed.

Very nicely stated, SSBF. I think everyone here and in every other Smash community should read this. However, there is one thing that is missing, I believe. The main issue with the 3DS is not storage space, but I believe it is the AI system of having multiple characters in one (Olimar and IC's. NOT PT, Shielda, et al). While I don't think we should try to put a damper on our hopes, I think we need to consider these constraints.

Another constraint (that Sakurai hasn't mentioned, but comes from my vague knowledge of animation), could be that the 3DS cannot handle robust rigs/skeletons. I know this is a serious limitation in League of Legends. Characters generally have a limit in the amount of joints they can have. If the 3DS can't support characters that require elaborate rigging, it could be bad news for characters like Ridley.

Hopefully, Sakurai just mean that he needs to make them graphically worse in the 3DS one.

 

[Starphoenix]

I think the characters that are in particular danger of being cut are Snake, Sonic (we don't know Sakurai's stance on returning guests), Ike, Lucario, Toon Link, and Lucas. I think Falco and Wolf being series mainstays as opposed to being guests (Snake/Sonic), posterboys for their franchise at a certain epoch (Ike/Lucario), or basically a one-off character (Lucas). Toon Link at worst will simply be replaced with a new design of a child Link, and possibly a name change. Otherwise, its still the quicker, lighter, faster Link we have had since Melee.

I only see Toon Link, Solid Snake, Sonic the Hedgehog, Ike and Jigglypuff being in danger in any way, and Jigglypuff only marginally so now that she is going to be plugged because of the new Fairy type. At the end of the day though I only see Toon Link and Solid Snake being removed.

Really weird though that we did not get any newcomers from veteran franchises though, and that the three other newcomers that are also rumored (Little Mac, Mii, and Pac-Man) are also not from veteran franchises. This number already matches Brawl's in terms of new series granted playable characters. I think there is a good chance that Sakurai may believe that there is simply too few characters left from veteran franchises left to place in that are worthy enough for Smash Bros. or fit the label of a Nintendo all-star.

I don't think the trailer not having veteran newcomers is indicative of anything more than the fact that he just wanted to show off what he saw as two of the most broadly appealing characters, and one surprise.

Really, the only veteran franchise characters that come to mind that strike me as important to their franchises that have yet to be playable in Smash Bros. are:
- Ridley
- K. Rool
- Dixie Kong
- Toad
- Palutena

That's it.

I don't think that's all. I still say there is going to be one surprise that few will see coming like a Pokémon Trainer. I'm still saying it will be Waddle Dee, but I know most everyone won't agree.

As for those who keep saying K. Rool probably should not count due to him being absent for both DKCR and now Tropical Freeze. I have a feeling that the fat croc with the eye tic has not been ruled out yet for that game.

There is a fourth character in that game that has not been talked about yet (they want to keep it a secret for now). How cool would it be if K. Rool was the fourth character, and that his new design for Tropical Freeze was unveiled simultaneously with a confirmation for Smash 4 (of course this would have to happen before November considering when that is when Tropical Freeze releases).

It would also be pretty cool if K. Rool was somehow leader of the vikings (though all of the vikings seem to be so far to be animals from frigid environments).

The only other character I could see for the fourth playable spot in Tropical Freeze is Funky Kong, however, I think K. Rool would be a much better surprise for fans. Sadly, I think Funky is more likely.

I believe I still have an essay from 2009 talking about how Smash Bros. should go in the direction of adding more newcomer series. My how time flies.

K. Rool hasn't been ruled out for Tropical Freeze let alone Super Smash Bros. If Retro Studios managed to acquire David Wise knowing the reaction fans had towards his absence from the first title I highly doubt Retro won't throw a bone out there somewhere for fans.

Very nicely stated, SSBF. I think everyone here and in every other Smash community should read this. There is one thing that is missing, I believe. The main issue with the 3DS is not storage space, but I believe it is the AI system of having multiple characters in one (Olimar and IC's. NOT PT, Shielda, et al). While I don't think we should try to put a damper on our hopes, I think we need to consider these constraints.

Another constraint (that Sakurai hasn't mentioned, but comes from my vague knowledge of modeling), could be that the 3DS cannot handle robust rigs/skeletons. I know this is a serious limitation in League of Legends. Characters generally have a limit in the amount of joints they can have. If the 3DS can't support characters that require elaborate rigging, it could be bad news for characters like Ridley.
Hopefully, Sakurai just mean that he needs to make them graphically worse in the 3DS one.

The more I think about it the more I feel the problems with the 3DS is stemming from it's screen size.

 

[ChronoBound]

I'm not so certain that Takamaru will be the retro inclusion. If he's already experienced a semi-revival of sorts, Sakurai may look for a much more obscure retro franchise to give a shot in the arm.

If he wants to a retro character that has not gotten a modern makeover at all, my guesses are it would either be:
1. Mach Rider (with a dystopian biker theme)
2. Lip (with a re-design that makes her more similar to a magical girl)

 

[Holder of the Heel]

How are you people taking those pictures and uploading the,?

I get on a laptop, insert the SD card from my 3DS into it, and upload the pictures from it.

 

[Gargaglione]

The only new thing done with Star Fox since Brawl was a re-release of the only good game in that series (64).

Hey, although SF64 is the best in the series, the original Starfox is still great; Assault, Adventure, and Command were good too (not great, but good).

 

[ChronoBound]

I don't think that's all. I still say there is going to be one surprise that few will see coming like a Pokémon Trainer. I'm still saying it will be Waddle Dee, but I know most everyone won't agree.


K. Rool hasn't been ruled out for Tropical Freeze let alone Super Smash Bros. If Retro Studios managed to acquire David Wise knowing the reaction fans had towards his absence from the first title I highly doubt Retro won't throw a bone out there somewhere for fans.

I was talking about Nintendo characters left from veteran franchises that could be considered to be "all-stars". I know that there is a very good chance we will get a character not on that list.

As for K. Rool being ruled out, I was not talking about him being ruled out for Smash Bros., but rather people think K. Rool has totally been ruled out for Tropical Freeze.

Also, I was going to bring up how Retro listened to the fans by bringing back Dixie Kong, bringing back David Wise (this is a particular big one), and bringing back underwater levels. Considering another one of the big outcries about DKCR was the absence of K. Rool, I would not be surprised if he shows up somewhere in that game. Heck, Retro even listened to the complaints about the enemies in DKCR being too bland and generic (another reason why people preferred the Kremlings), and went with a viking theme (most of which consist of arctic animals) for the game's theme, with a positive reception so far.

 

[Deleted member]

I can see why you all hate GameFAQs.
Even though it is a small sample size.

The issue I have with GameFAQs is that they're hostile to other people in nature. It's like most of these people in regards to Fire Emblem won't accept anything but "Chrom is inevitable, deal with it."

Personally both should stay. I just don't understand the mindset that calls for Wolf's head because he is perceived as a clone while Falco is the biggest culprit. Wolf plays nothing like Fox and only his specials have a passing similarity to Fox and Falco. It just blows my mind.

They're closet Krystal fans trying to enact revenge because they perceive their princess got beat out.

Honestly, they shouldn't be blaming Wolf for no Krystal in Brawl, but rather, blame Sakurai for not knowing about Krystal.

Basically it boils down to gargantuan amounts of anal devastation due to their garbage characters not getting in and they want to point fingers at others.

Lucario and Ike are also very frequently pointed as character to axe because of the bullcrap "recentness" argument, which avoids exactly why they were good additions and why they're not nearly as easy to cut as people think.

Really, if people think cuts are so needed, they're going to have to suck up and accept that Snake, Sonic and Toon Link are all more likely cuts because unlike Lucario and Ike, they would go for reasons other than time constraints.

I also hate the mentality that if we cut characters, we get more characters overall. Which... isn't the case, the more characters that get cut, the smaller the roster is.

 

[ChronoBound]

Hey, although SF64 is the best in the series, the original Starfox is still great; Assault, Adventure, and Command were good too (not great, but good).

The original did not age well, but its better than the post-64 crap. Of the games after 64, Adventures is probably the most solid, but that game is a 8/10 at best.

Really, the negative reception to those games has survive the positive ones it had among some fans. In Japan, the reception among the post-64 games has been overwhelmingly negative.

 

[bobadz]

Hey, although SF64 is the best in the series, the original Starfox is still great; Assault, Adventure, and Command were good too (not great, but good).

Assault had great music, and multiplayer. Adventures would have been better as Dinosaur Planet, and Command doesn't exist in my eyes.

 

[Banjodorf]

Takamaru only got a slight makeover in an obscure game. I don't think we should count him out. Aside from that, I know some people who were left wondering who he was after Nintendoland. I don't see Sakurai missing that opportunity.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Assault had great music, and multiplayer. Adventures would have been better as Dinosaur Planet, and Command doesn't exist in my eyes.

I remember that game's multi-player. I constantly destroyed everyone, but I could only destroy others as Slippy, for some reason.

 

[ChronoBound]

Takamaru only got a slight makeover in an obscure game. I don't think we should count him out. Aside from that, I know some people who were left wondering who he was after Nintendoland. I don't see Sakurai missing that opportunity.

I still see Takamaru as incredibly likely for Smash 4. I was really surprised though that he was not among the first characters confirmed for Smash 4, and that he is not a part of the rumored second round of newcomers.

 

[Hoots]

The issue I have with GameFAQs is that they're hostile to other people in nature. It's like most of these people in regards to Fire Emblem won't accept anything but "Chrom is inevitable, deal with it."Honestly, they shouldn't be blaming Wolf for no Krystal in Brawl, but rather, blame Sakurai for not knowing about Krystal.Lucario and Ike are also very frequently pointed as character to axe because of the bullcrap "recentness" argument, which avoids exactly why they were good additions and why they're not nearly as easy to cut as people think.

Really, if people think cuts are so needed, they're going to have to suck up and accept that Snake, Sonic and Toon Link are all more likely cuts because unlike Lucario and Ike, they would go for reasons other than time constraints.

I also hate the mentality that if we cut characters, we get more characters overall. Which... isn't the case, the more characters that get cut, the smaller the roster is.

It baffles me that people think Sakurai is going to cut Ike, a character that has a unique move set/play style, is the mascot of the Wii FE games, and is very popular in Brawl. It makes no sense. I personally don't want ANY cuts, and if there are cuts, only Toon Link.

 

[ChronoBound]

It baffles me that people think Sakurai is going to cut Ike, a character that has a unique move set/play style, is the mascot of the Wii FE games, and is very popular in Brawl. It makes no sense. I personally don't want ANY cuts, and if there are cuts, only Toon Link.

The only way I can see Sakurai cutting Ike is if he is deadset on adding Chrom. And if Chrom was anything but the most recent lord, I don't think Sakurai would even give him a decent look.

 

[kackamee]

Who's looking forward to Diddy&Dixie chaingrabs tho? (:

 

[bobadz]

It baffles me that people think Sakurai is going to cut Ike, a character that has a unique move set/play style, is the mascot of the Wii FE games, and is very popular in Brawl. It makes no sense. I personally don't want ANY cuts, and if there are cuts, only Toon Link.

People like to see patterns that arent there. They think that because Roy was cut, Ike will be cut to. Ignoring the fact that Roy was planned to be in brawl, it's only happened once so it's not a pattern.

 

[Oasis_S]

Huh. Has there been any word on how Japanese fans have reacted to all the new Smash news? Seems like an interesting THING to look into.

I remember it being said there was a general feeling of PESSIMISM among the Japanese fanbase, I wonder if and how that has changed.

 

[Shorts]

At least somebody thinks so about Chrom. Besides Me and Diddy.

Roy has a much bigger fanbase/expectance here than a lot of other sites. Especially SerenesForest. It's Chrom/Lucina over there. With the unfrequent Anna/MUnit/Roy. And the rare anyone else. (Micaiah/Caeda/Lynect.)

 

[Deleted member]

Ike has the possibility of going the way of Roy (in terms of being a lower priority character, not of actually being cut, I mean), while Roy himself could just as easily be low-priority again.
That being said, the idea of Marth, Chrom, Ike seems quite likely at this point. With Roy as the distant 4th if he can be included.

In my viewpoint, the only cut low-priority character that is likely to not be this time is Mewtwo. (Dixie was under different circumstances, so I don't count her.)

 

[ChronoBound]

Roy has a much bigger fanbase/expectance here than a lot of other sites. Especially SerenesForest. It's Chrom/Lucina over there. With the unfrequent Anna/MUnit/Roy. And the rare anyone else. (Micaiah/Caeda/Lynect.)

To be fair Roy's fanbase is probably bigger than Chrom nearly everywhere else. Not just this site.

 

[Starphoenix]

Those are my guesses too. We could get hit with a few more surprises though like Starfy, Famicom Wars, or possibly some sort of bizarre retro character that is hidden. Its also possible Sakurai blindsides us and includes Mach Rider over Takamaru as the retro character.

Starfy I can definitely see happening. Reall I kind of toss Golden Sun, Sin and Punishment and Legendary Starfy into the same boat. I think Sakurai will dip back into his Assist Trophy pool and select another character, I'm just not sure whom yet. Common sense would dictate Golden Sun, and yet I cannot overlook how much Sakurai seemed to gush over Saki. Given how prone he is towards his own preferences at times you really cannot discredit that. Then there's Starfy. He has a history stretching back much farther than either two series and he is typically seen as Kirby's rival. He's just one of those characters that is always around and under the radar. All of this to say, who knows? He'll be looking at all three characters since all three series have had new entries since Brawl. But perhaps the deciding factor will be that Starfy was the star of his new game, the other two were not. Doubt it, but you never know.

I don't think there will be a token "retro" character like most people seem to think there will be. That being said I think Sakurai will build upon Takamaru and flesh him out more.

I'm not so certain that Takamaru will be the retro inclusion. If he's already experienced a semi-revival of sorts, Sakurai may look for a much more obscure retro franchise to give a shot in the arm.

The reason I see Takamaru becoming playable has less to do with his game/series and more to do with gameplay. He presents something to the roster that currently doesn't exist, and I think that is going to appeal to Sakurai this time around. Of course Nintendo Lands exposure doesn't hurt.

 

[kackamee]

Ike has the possibility of going the way of Roy (in terms of being a lower priority character, not of actually being cut, I mean), while Roy himself could just as easily be low-priority again.
That being said, the idea of Marth, Chrom, Ike seems quite likely at this point. With Roy as the distant 4th if he can be included.

In my viewpoint, the only cut low-priority character that is likely to not be this time is Mewtwo. (Dixie was under different circumstances, so I don't count her.)

The only sad thing to me is that there are some pretty cool villains/female characters that would be nice to add in from the FE series.

 

[Banjodorf]

Yeah, I imagine Mewtwo's going to be much higher priority this time, and "We're thinking about it!" all but confirmed it for me.

 

[ChronoBound]

Yeah, I imagine Mewtwo's going to be much higher priority this time, and "We're thinking about it!" all but confirmed it for me.

Mewtwo is both the most wanted character in Japan and in the West, and he is being promoted at the eve of Generation 6. I would almost say he is the highest priority for a Pokemon character being in Smash Bros. after Pikachu.