Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

[Kisae]

Finally managed to catch all the 60+ pages. Man it took me a while to read all of it but at the same time it was fun and I am glad to see so many new faces joining the thread!

I'm late but congrats for the 500 pages and congrats to Banjo fans for winning the tourney!

Now I'm more than never confident that Isaac is in. I know we can't be sure for nothing but at the same time like most of you said it, there is too many coincidences that I can't see those leading to nothing. Plus a friend has to give me 50 Swiss francs if Isaac is in base or Dlc so yeah Isaac may be in

Anyways let's keep up the good work, and the support for our Golden Boy!

 

[Luigifan18]

That part I understand. I never want to see Goku or any non-gaming character as playable in Smash ever. However, Sora was explicitly made to be a video game character first and foremost. I don't think he's comparable to Goku at all in that regard, who's an anime character with video game appearances not the other way around.

It's not Sora himself people are worried about (since, like you said, Sora himself is a game character), it's the slippery slope they imagine beneath him — Sora being a gateway to other Disney characters (like Mickey Mouse), and those being a gateway to non-game characters in general.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Besides, it's not like they haven't dappled with Nintendo before...

To think we could have had Dr. Wily in this scene...

 

[Confirmation]

I'm more than never confident that Isaac is in.

This should be our motto

 

[XenoWarriorX]

This should be our motto

Agreed.

 

[Gurein]

Finally managed to catch all the 60+ pages. Man it took me a while to read all of it but at the same time it was fun and I am glad to see so many new faces joining the thread!

I'm late but congrats for the 500 pages and congrats to Banjo fans for winning the tourney!

Now I'm more than never confident that Isaac is in. I know we can't be sure for nothing but at the same time like most of you said it, there is too many coincidences that I can't see those leading to nothing. Plus a friend has to give me 50 Swiss francs if Isaac is in base or Dlc so yeah Isaac may be in

Anyways let's keep up the good work, and the support for our Golden Boy!

He's in.

 

[Fire Tactician]

Huh, our Golden Boy did pretty well in another Italian poll apparently (as did Sora, lolz)- https://mobile.twitter.com/SmashBrosItalia/status/1047458904135913472?s=20

 

[Kisae]

I don't know if this remix was already posted but i really like it ! ^^

 

[Isaac4SmashUltimate]

Does anybody want a Dragon Quest rep here? I know I would want one. I honestly could see that Square Enix rep being a Dragon Quest rep if it isn't Geno.

That impact that the Dragon Quest series/franchise has given to RPGs is great. And Sakurai has a history in wanting franchises that has an impact in the gaming history with like Street Fighter and such.

 

[Olo]

The next Smash Direct will smash me directly in the heart and I will die

 

[Kisae]

He's in.

I really hope is my friend !

 

[Fire Tactician]

Dragon Quest would be a fantastic choice, though in the West, there are less people to talk to about it. It runs into the same issue as FF though with character selection? Do we get the OG protagonist that many modern players don't know? The newest? The one from DQVIII (please)? Slime? Joker?

There's no obvious rep. That's not a problem for choosing to rep it, IMO, but it does make discussion tricky, since, like Pokémon, there's no obvious choice for everyone to rally behind.

 

[Isaac4SmashUltimate]

We could go with what Bowser Jr with multiple characters in one. Or Erdrick...

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Does anybody want a Dragon Quest rep here? I know I would want one. I honestly could see that Square Enix rep being a Dragon Quest rep if it isn't Geno.

That impact that the Dragon Quest series/franchise has given to RPGs is great. And Sakurai has a history in wanting franchises that has an impact in the gaming history with like Street Fighter and such.

I don't dislike Dragon Quest, but I honestly can't think of a character from that series that I'd be interested in seeing. On one level I can appreciate the importance of the series....but on another level I'm just meh on the idea because none of the potential candidates excite me. I think I'd prefer if Dragon Quest got content in Spirits instead (similar to Monster Hunter) or if Slimes appeared as an assist trophy or an enemy in Spirits mode. (if it's some kind of subspace/adventure mode)

 

[Isaac4SmashUltimate]

I do think having a Dragon Quest rep could perhaps have more people talking about the games. (I still have to play them, sadly. I'm more of a Final Fantasy fan, but I can be a Dragon Quest fan as well.)

 

[LegendOfDragoon]

Dragon Quest would be a fantastic choice, though in the West, there are less people to talk to about it. It runs into the same issue as FF though with character selection? Do we get the OG protagonist that many modern players don't know? The newest? The one from DQVIII (please)? Slime? Joker?

There's no obvious rep. That's not a problem for choosing to rep it, IMO, but it does make discussion tricky, since, like Pokémon, there's no obvious choice for everyone to rally behind.

Erdrick or Slime are the only two that stand out at all.

Hero (VIII) might work as the most known worldwide, but Erdrick is a Phenom, with the first three games revolving around him and his descendants. Japan absolutely adores him. The Game director for XI actually carried a model of his sword out on stage when announcing XI. There is the issue that he's almost completely unknown outside of Japan, but if any character could overcome that barrier it would be Erdrick, IMO.

Slime... comes with his own issues. He would be the first apedal fighter in the game, it might make his animations clunky or awkward (Much like Steve) but if anyone could pull it off it would be Daddy Sakurai

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Does anybody want a Dragon Quest rep here? I know I would want one. I honestly could see that Square Enix rep being a Dragon Quest rep if it isn't Geno.

That impact that the Dragon Quest series/franchise has given to RPGs is great. And Sakurai has a history in wanting franchises that has an impact in the gaming history with like Street Fighter and such.

Personally, I want Yangus from Dragon Quest 8, but that is not as likely as the original Dragon Quest protagonist.
Edit: Erdrick would be the best bet as he is the one of the first, if not the first Dragon Quest protagonist that The States has seen; although, Dragon Quest was known as Dragon Warrior in The States.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Erdrick doesn't have much of a presence as a character outside of Japan though.

Hard to say if that would matter but it would definitely be an "out of nowhere" character for a lot of people in the west.

 

[Frosty Pops]

If we take a look at all the new characters and organize them in order of their first appearance we have:
August 6, 1986 (Metroid), September 26, 1986 (Castlevania),
April 21, 1989 (Super Mario Land), October 29, 1993 (Castlevania: Rondo of Blood),
November 21, 1994 (Donkey Kong Country), November 17, 2002 (Metroid Prime),
April 19, 2012 (Fire Emblem Awakening), November 8, 2012 (Animal Crossing: New Leaf), May 28, 2015 (Splatoon).
Edited: to hopefully be more concise. Also Isaac would be August 1, 2001 (Golden Sun)

I was talking retro as in the last game they were in. Like Frogger or something lol

Edit: Geno is early 90s and that was his last and only appearance.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Actually, the facts shown in the poll suggest that over half of Sora's voters came in from outside of reddit, and thus is the most "brigaded" character.

What I was referring to is the fact that Sora ranked high in the poll, so clearly people want him in Smash. There’s an overlap between KH fans and Smash fans.

Of course they consider it important. Which is why they immediately port it to other systems that aren't Nintendo a few years after remaining exclsuive.

And btw, 3 out of 13 releases on Nintendo is actually a very mediocre amount.






I'm not sure i understand you. My arguments are mostly that Nintendo Fans despite being so "important" since we get "important entries", we sure don't get any of the other entries.
10 entries missing from Nintendo Consoles are kinda significant with a series as "convoluted" as KH.

Why the hell are we left with such a small portion compared to any other platform? Why do we get the short end of the stick despite having "important entries"?

I hadn’t understood your point, but I think I do know. You’re pissed at Square Enix for not giving Nintendo fans the games on their consoles?

That’s a fair complaint, but I tend to blame Nintendo for not making consoles third-party devs want to support.

Does anybody want a Dragon Quest rep here? I know I would want one. I honestly could see that Square Enix rep being a Dragon Quest rep if it isn't Geno.


That impact that the Dragon Quest series/franchise has given to RPGs is great. And Sakurai has a history in wanting franchises that has an impact in the gaming history with like Street Fighter and such.

I’m all for Dragon Quest representation in Smash, but who would it be? While Slime is definitely iconic, can the series really be represented by a monster? Then there’s the protagonists; some of them don’t even have the luxury of a name or title, and while I can distinguish them, I’d hardly call any iconic.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Erdrick doesn't have much of a presence as a character outside of Japan though.

Hard to say if that would matter but it would definitely be an "out of nowhere" character for a lot of people in the west.

Erdrick would not come out of nowhere to be honest. His Game Boy Color remake came out at a time when Dragon Ball Z was taking The States by storm. He was known as "Goku with a Sword" in The States at the time; although, the game was not nearly as talked about as Dragon Ball Z itself.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I'm surprised more Golden Sun fans aren't Dragon Quest fans. Dragon Quest is like the last existing turn based RPG to still be getting games. The games are phenomenal but they're a problem for Smash. There's no character that carries from game to game, besides slime who is a terrible choice, and there's no stand out Cloud esque character that I can think of. It's in a weird spot. It could definitely benefit from being DLC though since XI is coming to Switch sometime in the near future.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

I'm surprised more Golden Sun fans aren't Dragon Quest fans. Dragon Quest is like the last existing turn based RPG to still be getting games. The games are phenomenal but they're a problem for Smash. There's no character that carries from game to game, besides slime who is a terrible choice, and there's no stand out Cloud esque character that I can think of. It's in a weird spot. It could definitely benefit from being DLC though since XI is coming to Switch sometime in the near future.

If I had to guess it is because Dragon Quest is more Light Hearted and Japanese in culture; whereas, Golden Sun is a little, but not much more serious and is more Western cultured based in its world.

 

[ZelDan]

I've played the 3DS versions of Dragon Quest VII and VIII. Which reminds me I've never actually beaten Dragon Quest VIII. Got stuck on a boss, had other games that I was playing/wanted to play, and just never went back to it...

 

[Frosty Pops]

All the "obviously I can't say anything about this because jobs will be lost if so" but then saying stuff like "yeah there's Incinerorar and Ken, and he's an echo, 500% sure" without taking care of the job of his "sources" just because they're not own by Square Enix doesn't make any sense to me.

I won't say I can't believe Incineroar and Ken or even the Square Enix rep are real because they might be, but I'll not give him credit if so because all this "leaks" were around the web some time before his claims, he's just giving himself credit.

I don't think he's a bad guy but at the same time I think he's trying to stuck people in a loop of "I know things you don't - I can't share it but maybe someday I'll do it, I don't know I don't know..." that doesn't serve his reputation well.

I don't know if he stole "everyone is here" but he stole the Ridley prediction from 2 other leaks, and stole Simon off another. Missed everything else until Isabelle and didn't even take a stance on if she was echo or no. I dunno if the other leakers really knew or made educated guesses like Simon. But all Verge does is check sources and check his odds when he finds these leaks. Then when he is 90% sure on accuracy he drops "his leak" and leaves himself a back door to escape from should his 10% miss rate come back to bite him.

Edit: spelling

 

[GoodGrief741]

Erdrick would be my go-to pick for a Dragon Quest Rep, although I didn’t know he was iconic in Japan. Even better!

I can think of a problem though. Given Sheik’s ambiguous blog post, I think they’re going to start trying to avoid spoilers. Does it make sense to include a character who only acquires the title of Erdrick/Loto at the end of the game as a twist?

I don't know if he stole "everyone is here" but he stole the Ridley prediction from 2 other leaks, and stole Simon off another. Missed everything else until Isabelle and didn't even take a stance on if she was echo or no. I dunno if the other leakers really knew or made educated guesses like Simon. But all Verge does is check sources and check his odds when he finds these leaks. Then when he is 90% sure on accuracy he drops "his leak" and leaves himself a back door to escape from should his 10% miss rate come back to bite him.

Edit: spelling

Vergeben didn’t leak ‘Everyone is Here’, he leaked no cuts from 4, and the return of Snake and Ice Climbers.

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

Erdrick would be my go-to pick for a Dragon Quest Rep, although I didn’t know he was iconic in Japan. Even better!

I can think of a problem though. Given Sheik’s ambiguous blog post, I think they’re going to start trying to avoid spoilers. Does it make sense to include a character who only acquires the title of Erdrick/Loto at the end of the game as a twist?

Mecha-Fiora in Shulk's final smash doesn't seem to be a problem. I believe the Sheik ambiguity is either just a translation goof or only the blog posts are spoiler-resistant. It makes no sense to scrap a potential character just because of possible spoiler issues.

 

[LegendOfDragoon]

I don't know if he stole "everyone is here" but he stole the Ridley prediction from 2 other leaks, and stole Simon off another. Missed everything else until Isabelle and didn't even take a stance on if she was echo or no. I dunno if the other leakers really knew or made educated guesses like Simon. But all Verge does is check sources and check his odds when he finds these leaks. Then when he is 90% sure on accuracy he drops "his leak" and leaves himself a back door to escape from should his 10% miss rate come back to bite him.

Edit: spelling

He never even supported Everyone is here. He called Snake Icies and Wolf, then said there was no cuts.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Mecha-Fiora in Shulk's final smash doesn't seem to be a problem. I believe the Sheik ambiguity is either just a translation goof or only the blog posts are spoiler-resistant. It makes no sense to scrap a potential character just because of possible spoiler issues.

Do you think the JP post for Shiek used language-specific gender-neutral pronouns? It could be why non-Eastern interns got confused.

 

[TappyBat]

who's edrick?

 

[Deleted member]

Isaac believe he's in as usual. Let's see what happens.

 

[Jupiter Ivan]

I'm surprised more Golden Sun fans aren't Dragon Quest fans. Dragon Quest is like the last existing turn based RPG to still be getting games. The games are phenomenal but they're a problem for Smash. There's no character that carries from game to game, besides slime who is a terrible choice, and there's no stand out Cloud esque character that I can think of. It's in a weird spot. It could definitely benefit from being DLC though since XI is coming to Switch sometime in the near future.

*Cough* Persona *Cough*

For me it’s the art style I can’t get behind when it comes to Dragon Quest. I know, for shame.

I’ve never been a fan of Akira’s style. That’s probably some heinous thing to say on the internet, but I like what I like.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

who's edrick?

Spoiler

Main Protagonist from Dragon Quest 3 (Dragon Warrior 3 in The States).

https://dragon-quest.org/wiki/Erdrick

 

[FlawedAI]

While this has nothing to do with either Kingdom Hearts or Dragon Quest, it does have to do with another Nintendo RPG, albeit a very, very new one. I just noticed while listening to some Smash music that the Super Mario Bros. 3 remix is by Akihito Honda, of Cygames, who are responsible for the brand-new mobile game Dragalia Lost (which is great, by the way). This makes me wonder: since Cygames is already involved, maybe we get Dragalia Lost content in Smash? The music is great, so I'd be 100% down for that. Any thoughts?

 

[TappyBat]

gotta be dlc if that were the case, or maybe next game.

 

[XenoWarriorX]

I hadn’t understood your point, but I think I do know. You’re pissed at Square Enix for not giving Nintendo fans the games on their consoles?

That’s a fair complaint, but I tend to blame Nintendo for not making consoles third-party devs want to support.

SE really doesn't have an excuse since Nintendo has a money-making machine that they can take advantage of. But of course, at every opportunity, they manage to screw something up. (I don't even want to go into detail on how incompetent they are right now, i'd probably take up this whole forum page if i did.)

The only way i could properly accept Sora is if SE takes this brilliant opportunity to announce some "ports" of KH games coming to switch. I would still probably be pissed since KH3 isn't even coming to switch, but it would still be better than nothing.

But if SE is gonna still be reluctant to give Nintendo fans anything of the franchise in the same vien that they treated them when it came to FF after revealing Cloud for smash (with them just NOW giving us ports of FF games), or how Konami is treating Nintendo fans when it comes to their franchises that are in smash, i'm just gonna shake my head.

Most companies would freak out at the opportunity to introduce themselves to player's wallets, but these 3rd party companies are run by flippin' morons sometimes.

 

[?!?!?!]

While this has nothing to do with either Kingdom Hearts or Dragon Quest, it does have to do with another Nintendo RPG, albeit a very, very new one. I just noticed while listening to some Smash music that the Super Mario Bros. 3 remix is by Akihito Honda, of Cygames, who are responsible for the brand-new mobile game Dragalia Lost (which is great, by the way). This makes me wonder: since Cygames is already involved, maybe we get Dragalia Lost content in Smash? The music is great, so I'd be 100% down for that. Any thoughts?

I haven't been following the game since its not available in Canada (rip) but I think if it's successful then it will probably get some music representation, the same way FEH did

 

[FlawedAI]

I haven't been following the game since its not available in Canada (rip) but I think if it's successful then it will probably get some music representation, the same way FEH did

Yeah, I agree. Like I said, I wouldn't mind that whatsoever. But, I could definitely see Eudan (the hero) as a character for DLC if we're super lucky but hopefully by the next game, if Dragalia Lost is successful.

 

[Deleted member]

If we're going to be throwing stones of lacking personality, it's probably wise to vacate this glass house first.

Not that any of those personality arguments ever really matter for Smash. Daisy shows how far a distinct personality will get you.

I'm well aware of the fact that Isaac only emoted once in the original game.

It's just difficult for me to rationally explain why I'm against Sora's inclusion, considering that some of my arguments are rather silly. All that I can say comfortably is that there are a small handful of characters that I'm dead-set against being in Smash, and Sora just happens to be one of them.

 

[Luigifan18]

I'm well aware of the fact that Isaac only emoted once in the original game.

It's just difficult for me to rationally explain why I'm against Sora's inclusion, considering that some of my arguments are rather silly. All that I can say comfortably is that there are a small handful of characters that I'm dead-set against being in Smash, and Sora just happens to be one of them.

I'm going to guess that one of your arguments is "If Sora, then Mickey; if Mickey, then Shrek and Goku".