Desh
Smash Ace
i made the LETS GO MANGO avatars (sloppilly)
while i was at home during genesis.
blow me.
while i was at home during genesis.
blow me.
-
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Stuff About Puff
- Thread starter MaNg0
- Start date
- Status
SyOn
Smash Journeyman
Tamoo
Smash Master
Roneblaster
Smash Hero
mang0, how do i win the biggest melee tournament ever without using a top tier character?
jkjk
congrats, i dont think anyone doubted you, but armada shocked us all.
jkjk
congrats, i dont think anyone doubted you, but armada shocked us all.
RestInPeace
Smash Ace
Mango, how do you learn your opponents so well?
idea
Smash Master
Mango, how do I learn to opponents?
Banks
Smash Hero
Mango
can you
read me a bed time story
can you
read me a bed time story
Vijin
Smash Ace
Mango, I've got a question about the marth match-up.
You say to use your shield a lot. I notice that when a marth is short hopping at you that's when you put your shield up. But what if the marth is on the ground and he's dash dancing, waiting to land a grab? Just wondering how you get in close using your shield, but avoid being grabbed at the same time?
You say to use your shield a lot. I notice that when a marth is short hopping at you that's when you put your shield up. But what if the marth is on the ground and he's dash dancing, waiting to land a grab? Just wondering how you get in close using your shield, but avoid being grabbed at the same time?
Twin_A
Smash Champion
I'm no expert with Puff but my guess would be to crouch if they approach and look to be grabbing (crouch to rest)
idea
Smash Master
marth can still grab a crouching puff, he just has to dash grab. and maybe one of the other types of grabs...?
and...i dunno, his advice makes sense if you try it =P shield is good vs. marth.
yeah, now that i'm picturing it...marth is gonna space aerials on you. they hit your shield from far away, otherwise you could shield grab him. then you hit him with stuff after he's hit your shield.
if he's grabbing a lot, use aerials or crouch anyway (they could still mess up).
something like that. i have a feeling i'm missing something here.
and...i dunno, his advice makes sense if you try it =P shield is good vs. marth.
yeah, now that i'm picturing it...marth is gonna space aerials on you. they hit your shield from far away, otherwise you could shield grab him. then you hit him with stuff after he's hit your shield.
if he's grabbing a lot, use aerials or crouch anyway (they could still mess up).
something like that. i have a feeling i'm missing something here.
ice-
Smash Journeyman
Just watched the grand finals,
those rests are too good.
How do you punish rolls that well >_>
those rests are too good.
How do you punish rolls that well >_>
Da Shuffla
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2008
- Messages
- 1,810
I've heard a lot about the importance of spacing, but after watching Genesis vids, I really understand. Good job, Mango and Hbox.
RestInPeace
Smash Ace
Jiggs vs Marth = my worst Jiggs matchup. Help. I do that shield stuff, but I just suck in the matchup.
dudutsai
Smash Lord
Marth is also one of my worst matchups. You really have to read your opponent, because marth will always be able to do something to you provided you don't see it coming. When you space with empty hops, don't full hop cause you will get fsmashed
Tamoo
Smash Master
Marth is one of my fav matchups cos I play gainst marths all the time, Ive even beaten the best marth in UK in tournament once, just on matchup knowledge alone.
Shielding is great obv, i also really like nair, one thing I do is nair right at the base of their shield, autocancel and crouch, wait for the shieldgrab and rest. Also land the nair behind them and ftilt, fsmash or grab them.
I think the most important thing in this matchup it to know where to DI once you get grabbed. Good marths will always look for the optimal follow up to a fthrow or dthrow, as they have the option to fsmash, dash attack and fair/bair. Just DI to limit their options as much as possible.
Shielding is great obv, i also really like nair, one thing I do is nair right at the base of their shield, autocancel and crouch, wait for the shieldgrab and rest. Also land the nair behind them and ftilt, fsmash or grab them.
I think the most important thing in this matchup it to know where to DI once you get grabbed. Good marths will always look for the optimal follow up to a fthrow or dthrow, as they have the option to fsmash, dash attack and fair/bair. Just DI to limit their options as much as possible.
idea
Smash Master
i'm starting to realize the power of doing things for no reason =P
marth has faster aerials, puff is largely aerial-based...so this is a problem. i think mostly you space fairs at him, be really careful about approaching, but also don't camp, cause marth is better at that since he has range and speed.
shield is really good. i only have a vague understanding of why this is.
edgeguarding is important. ledge invicibility + nair or fair...or just jump out and hit him quickly. it sounds easy but i can never do any of that correctly =P
also, force him to up-b on stage, then rest.
the way kirbykaze explained it to me (how does he know so much about this game <_<) is that, vs. marth, you want to not be between where the middle of his sword hits to the end of it. that's where marth feels comfortable. so you have to not be in that general range. one good way of doing that is by putting pressure on him (now you're close to him). and since he is faster and has more range, that's where the doing weird stuff comes in.
that nair-crouch-rest thing sounds cool too, i should try that.
marth has faster aerials, puff is largely aerial-based...so this is a problem. i think mostly you space fairs at him, be really careful about approaching, but also don't camp, cause marth is better at that since he has range and speed.
shield is really good. i only have a vague understanding of why this is.
edgeguarding is important. ledge invicibility + nair or fair...or just jump out and hit him quickly. it sounds easy but i can never do any of that correctly =P
also, force him to up-b on stage, then rest.
the way kirbykaze explained it to me (how does he know so much about this game <_<) is that, vs. marth, you want to not be between where the middle of his sword hits to the end of it. that's where marth feels comfortable. so you have to not be in that general range. one good way of doing that is by putting pressure on him (now you're close to him). and since he is faster and has more range, that's where the doing weird stuff comes in.
that nair-crouch-rest thing sounds cool too, i should try that.
Vijin
Smash Ace
So it's only Marths running grab (not jump-canceled) that can grab a crouching Jigs?
Even his normal standing grab will miss a crouching Jigs? Interesting.
ALSO, Mango I hope you finish the list. Do you have any experience fighting Docs? Pills are such a b*tch for Jigs.
Even his normal standing grab will miss a crouching Jigs? Interesting.
ALSO, Mango I hope you finish the list. Do you have any experience fighting Docs? Pills are such a b*tch for Jigs.
soap
Smash Hero
u got lazy and stopped making the character names larger font with goofy colors
this gives your guide a wall of text appearance, jus sayin.
this gives your guide a wall of text appearance, jus sayin.
dudutsai
Smash Lord
Marth's standing still grab always misses a crouching jiggs, but his running grab can also be dodged if you get the timing of the crouch right.
Vijin
Smash Ace
As far as I'm aware, marth has 3 grabs.
Neutral grab (standing in place grab)
Running grab
And jump cancel grab (which you can do while running.)
You can duck everyone of Marth's grabs except a jump-cancel grab.
Tamoo
Smash Master
jump cancelled grabs are the same as standing grabs, they can both be ducked
its the dash grab that cannot be ducked, unless timed right, as dudutsai posted
its the dash grab that cannot be ducked, unless timed right, as dudutsai posted
idea
Smash Master
he can also boost-grab, i believe (dash attack, and cancel the attack animation with a grab)
honestly i'm not sure if marth can do that, but if he can, maybe that can grab a crouching jiggs too.
all you really need to know is that you can crouch under marth's grab, but it's not gonna work every time.
honestly i'm not sure if marth can do that, but if he can, maybe that can grab a crouching jiggs too.
all you really need to know is that you can crouch under marth's grab, but it's not gonna work every time.
Vijin
Smash Ace
Well I just tried it last night. I experimented with all 3 of his grabs and his running grab was the one that missed every time. I don't know how timing is going to matter if a Jiggs is already ducking. You're either ducking or you're not.
idea
Smash Master
oh, i think that's because not all of it reaches low enough to grab jiggs...only the back of it or something like that. and the grab range is not the same on every frame, so maybe you have to do it earlier? or later? i remember KK trying this once and saying that it did work but only grabbed at a weird part of it.
maybe marth's other grabs are the same way. standing grab almost always misses me when i'm crouching.
maybe marth's other grabs are the same way. standing grab almost always misses me when i'm crouching.
Tamoo
Smash Master
idea is right, the dash grab changes its grabbox throughout the animation, which is why it seems to work sometimes and not in other cases. Standing grabs, and jumpcancelled grabs should always miss
Vijin
Smash Ace
Anyway, a Marth who knows this knows that he can grab a crouching Jigs. Which usually resutls in big damage. Where's Mango?
RestInPeace
Smash Ace
Oh my goodness. The autocanceled Nair -> Crouch to bait for shield grabs is absolutely genius. Genius because it works against all characters, I think.
And Marth is still my worst matchup. Its way harder than campy Foxes. I think Foxes aren't that gay after you get past the fact that they can run away and laser you. But when they camp that way, I just ignore them completely, or Nair through them if I'm far to dodge some. It hardly does any damage, so to me it seems more of a mindgame than anything. Makes you badly space yourself if you try to dodge it, which just lets him shoot you more. That's what I've noticed watching tournament vids.
I also learned to always SH Nair vs Spacies, because it lasts long enough to completely block out a side+B, and if you're consistent, an edgecancel will lead you into another SH nair... lol. I can poke the FireFox that way :D. That, or I can be more like HBox and just do the Nair to start with and FSmash the FireFox as it comes. HBox is amazing vs Spacies. Amazing.
And Marth is still my worst matchup. Its way harder than campy Foxes. I think Foxes aren't that gay after you get past the fact that they can run away and laser you. But when they camp that way, I just ignore them completely, or Nair through them if I'm far to dodge some. It hardly does any damage, so to me it seems more of a mindgame than anything. Makes you badly space yourself if you try to dodge it, which just lets him shoot you more. That's what I've noticed watching tournament vids.
I also learned to always SH Nair vs Spacies, because it lasts long enough to completely block out a side+B, and if you're consistent, an edgecancel will lead you into another SH nair... lol. I can poke the FireFox that way :D. That, or I can be more like HBox and just do the Nair to start with and FSmash the FireFox as it comes. HBox is amazing vs Spacies. Amazing.
Tamoo
Smash Master
Isnt it just
hehe, I actually learnt it from a random scrub jiggs here in the UK, he had no idea what he was doing, but I was marth against him and he autocancelled a nair on my shield and crouched whilst i shieldgrabbed, and i saw that opportunity to rest and was like woah, that could really help.
And Hbox is **** amazing vs spacies, I wish I could do that ****
HT F8
Hostile Takeover
I have a big problem with Puff vs Marf, it gives me a headache. T_T
So I just go Sheik. ^_^
But yeah I seem to have a lot of trouble vs Sheik... it just seems like every single thing she does out prioritizes my Nair/Fair/Bair... it's like playing a Marf, except with priority instead of range. >_<
Any general tips on the tilt vs aerial and air vs air battle against Sheik?
So I just go Sheik. ^_^
But yeah I seem to have a lot of trouble vs Sheik... it just seems like every single thing she does out prioritizes my Nair/Fair/Bair... it's like playing a Marf, except with priority instead of range. >_<
Any general tips on the tilt vs aerial and air vs air battle against Sheik?
ETWIST51294
Smash Hero
I just started maining jiggs for teams a while ago and shes my 2nd best now. Can I get some tips against peach?
idea
Smash Master
tilts: crouch, wait
aerials: avoid hers and use yours; guess where she's about to jump and aerial in that place
sheik is weird...she doesn't have all the advantages she's used to having, but she is still really good. crouching is useful...i have to do that more.
not even crouching and waiting there, but crouching and wavedashing around. it makes sense, if you think about it...at any point where you would have been standing up, you might as well be much harder to hit and automatically crouch canceling.
KK told me the other day that i should fair on his shield then crouch.
this matchup doesn't feel overly hard to me, but i have to be very patient. definitely more so than vs. a marth.
oh, and up-moves are good on her. if she's above you, try to get upairs and stuff, cause sheik moves slowly horizontally in the air, and her dair sucks. this also means you can rest her reliably with uptilt and upair. she is unable to move for longer than you'd expect.
haha, haven't i posted about this before? probably to you in particular =P
i really just try to hit her with aerials while avoiding turnips. when i feel uncomfortable in tournament vs. a peach, i pretty much only use bair. seems to work.
upair and uptilt rest are pretty good, too. uptilt seems harder to get since she's always spacing aerials at you. rest is also pretty safe against peach cause she can't punish it very well if you miss.
Cia
das kwl
Look at the OP. that's why it's there. And his info is surprisingly helpful.
JJfox
Smash Cadet
You learnt nair though shield to fsmash from me, right? Not this trick. Please don't say I'm the random scrub jiggs. lol xxIsnt it just
hehe, I actually learnt it from a random scrub jiggs here in the UK, he had no idea what he was doing, but I was marth against him and he autocancelled a nair on my shield and crouched whilst i shieldgrabbed, and i saw that opportunity to rest and was like woah, that could really help.
And Hbox is **** amazing vs spacies, I wish I could do that ****
Tamoo
Smash Master
Nooo no its not u lol, its sumone called Daly in our crew hehe,
and yeah, I learnt a lot of nair tricks from you, calling you a random scrub would be like calling me a random scrub lool
and yeah, I learnt a lot of nair tricks from you, calling you a random scrub would be like calling me a random scrub lool
hungrybox
Smash Legend
to fight peach:
you bair the **** out of her. Its nearly impossible to beat a well-spaced bair.
ban yoshi's.
a mediocre peach will downsmash when she is next to you. YOU CAN HOP AND REST :D
another tip: she is the easiest to rest out of up-tilt. She's the perfect mix of heaviness, floatiness, and a relatively large target thanks to that dress.
she will throw turnips and try to fair you with turnips. Just float over them.
you can poke by doing a forward nair into her shield and retreating before you hit the ground.
Never hold down or crouch cancel. EVER.
if she dash attacks into your sheild its a free rest.
when she is off the stage, go after her - grab the edge if she approaches it - her parasol will fall right thrugh you. if she is at high % and recovering from a big hit, up air her. jiggs uair > peaches dair.
back throw -> bair spam is SOOOO Good, man.
you bair the **** out of her. Its nearly impossible to beat a well-spaced bair.
ban yoshi's.
a mediocre peach will downsmash when she is next to you. YOU CAN HOP AND REST :D
another tip: she is the easiest to rest out of up-tilt. She's the perfect mix of heaviness, floatiness, and a relatively large target thanks to that dress.
she will throw turnips and try to fair you with turnips. Just float over them.
you can poke by doing a forward nair into her shield and retreating before you hit the ground.
Never hold down or crouch cancel. EVER.
if she dash attacks into your sheild its a free rest.
when she is off the stage, go after her - grab the edge if she approaches it - her parasol will fall right thrugh you. if she is at high % and recovering from a big hit, up air her. jiggs uair > peaches dair.
back throw -> bair spam is SOOOO Good, man.
idea
Smash Master
does nair go through parasol sometimes? i could swear i've done that before. grab the edge, nair as she tries to parasol under you...i might have still had ledge invincibility, but i have a habit of waiting too long and using it up <_<
it might also have been...not hitting the very tip of the parasol, but another part of her with less priority?
for whatever reason, ledgehop nair seems to work against peach. especially when it stagespikes her.
it might also have been...not hitting the very tip of the parasol, but another part of her with less priority?
for whatever reason, ledgehop nair seems to work against peach. especially when it stagespikes her.
hungrybox
Smash Legend
restore invincibility
punish
punish
- Status