ULTIMATE DOUBLE POST
Mahone:
Nair through turnip --> stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyH3PMRBP_c&feature=related#t=29
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyH3PMRBP_c&feature=related#t=1m1s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyH3PMRBP_c&feature=related#t=2m58s
If you just watch their sets from APEX, you'll see it a ton
It's really good
Wow, thanks a lot for that, i really didn't visualize it working that well, i need to go back and watch all of those matches again, but i really appreciate you going through them and linking the time, next time i won't be so lazy, and i'll watch them first before asking.
Something else I noticed is that you're really obvious when you're gonna go for grabs. But you do such typical Jigglypuff things (FJ Bair, falling Uair into the shield) that it's really easy for you to just not do the Uair and land > grab if you wanted to hit him.
Ugh, you make me feel so stupid lol. The whole time i was playing him i was thinking "ok, i got him to shield, now i need to take advantage", then everytime i tried to grab he would know, and at the time i was like "wow, hes reading me so well", but now that i watch the matches, i was SOO obvious. I was like just walking up to him expecting him to shield... not realizing that he was shield because i was doing something like falling upair, so i needed to grab in situations like that, rather than just doing nothing to grab... if only i could think clearly during the match... hopefully when i have less things to think about matchup wise, i'll be able to concentrate on that stuff more.
You seem fairly hesitant to capitalize on some of your openings. Possibly out of fear / nervousness. If Peach whiffs a D-smash right in front of you after you've landed, that's a free move. Maybe a Rest.
Here's an example of what I mean from your match.
Ya, i have a bad habit of reflexively wavedashing back, because i just wanna be safe and keep bair spacing all day, but even in other matches, i have recently noticed that i don't react enough to situations like that, iv'e kinda already planned on wavedashing back and don't think about why... so much to work on 
Small stylistic thing... I think it's better to throw Peach off the level if it's an available option than it is to throw her above you. This applies to most characters.
Ya, i probably just messed up the throw, since i have always liked off the stage more than upthrow, even though the great MANGO upthrows, i feel like the positionally advantage is greater when they are thrown horizontally, since i think this is where jiggs is best in the matchup. I feel like in this matchup, unlike others, you want to be horizontal more than under her, since bair is so good, but i'd like to know your thoughts. And just to clarify, i think being under her can be good, but unless its at high percent its usually only gonna be an upair that you can hit with, where you have to bait the dair or space, whereas horizontally you can get multiple bairs relatively easily.
This is sort of what I mean by "You do your Bairs too close to them, while moving into them." You were at advantage here, since he was put offstage, but you did the Bair so close that he was able to stuff it with his Nair before your hitbox could protect you (and probably kill him / lead to an offstage combo). This is a situation where being aware of your other options is really good. Actually, this is where a shield grab, Nair, F-smash, or whatever would have been really good. Or do the Bair earlier, or retreat with it. Either way, at this proximity, even at advantage, Bairing towards them can be risky.
Wow, i didn't even catch that but your totally right. Also, on top of what you said, he was mixing up nair and airdodge in that position, so if i had just shield grabed or wd back fsmashed, it would have covered both, i don't know why i thought bair was better, again it was most likely my spammy mentality.
This is going to sound awkward, but you have to do more effective mixups. Your current style seems a lot of aerials and U-tilts for your main form of pressure. When you go for grabs, you're usually starting them from a dash or roll or whatever to get yourself close to them. The troublesome part of your aerial game is that it's all countered by the same option. You tend to double or single aerial (double if FJ, single if SH) and then you go into U-tilts on landing (sometimes you cross up). The issue is that them blocking beats this and after the U-tilt they can WD away or whatever. Mix in grabs more. For instance: forgo the second aerial in your FJ and then land, autocancel, grab. It's really annoying and will encourage them to find alternative methods out of shield to beat it. Other forms of really good pressure you should play with involve movement and space abuse... just jump around their shield, or land in front of their shield at a safe distance, or crouch in front of their shield at a safe distance. See what their defensive tendencies are from there, and punish. The more things you make them have to do when they block, the more chances you have to get silly Rests, or combos. By integrating grabs, waiting, and empty jump feints, you force them to revise their defensive choices constantly and that places a lot of pressure on them. Which is great for you, because you have a game-shifting, momentum-crushing OHKO move. And the more defensive things (like roll, sidestep, jump) they have to do, the more chances you have to land moves that lead into it, or the move itself.
Wow... just wow, i feel like you just summed up how to play jigglypuff in this paragraph. I hate that this all makes so much sense, and that i'm capable to tell others this same information, but i can't implement it in practice. It's so hard to practice these things against good players, because whenever i try to incorporate empty hops and new stuff, i feel like its so obvious that i get ***** and then get scared to try it, and since i don't usually get much time to practice, i tend to stick with what i know. But I'm gonnna start to try to do all of this stuff, even if it means i get *****, and i'm gonna record a lot more and upload, so hopefully you can see my progress and help me along the way... i promise if you do ill like mm 20 times at pound five or something... so i'll basically give you 20 bucks lol.
Also, from rewatching, I noticed you try to force kills a lot with F-smash. Don't. Trying to force kills with any character vs a quality character is a good way to lag yourself up and give them free moves and either lessen a gap, take the lead, or increase their lead. Patience. Sometimes the risk is worth it, particularly if you'll win the game or make up a ton of ground from it. But you really go for it way too much and he punishes you for it.
I agree, i get impatient and just throw them out hoping, but that's not gonna make me better so i need to stop doing it.
edit:
I also noticed you get punished for landing Bairs a lot. This will not do. You have to space these much more safely. Jigglypuff without using her aerial mobility to keep herself out of peoples' CC range and whatnot is remarkably punishable. But with her aerial mobility abuse, hits become super safe and that's one of her biggest strengths. Protecting yourself from CC and similar defensive shenanigans are a big part of extending Jigglypuff's stock.
I'm glad you brought this up. I understand what you are saying, but the reason for all (or most) of my misspaced bairs is that i am trying to combo into more bairs. I always see hbox do bair->bair->bair combos, and i feel like if you do the safe spacing bair you don't have time to catch their di with another bair... so my question is how does he know?? Is he just sure the bair is going to connect, or is he maintaining a perfect spacing where he can weave out or move in... i just don't understand how he does it.
