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Starcraft Discussion

Alphicans

Alphicans

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Oh God... You have no idea dude. I've tried to come up with so many mech builds, and they all lead to disaster. The best I've come up with is a very quick expo into a wall in, with an attempt vulture harass into goliaths and expo ASAP. The problem with mechs is that mutas are gonna **** you early on. I know there are some maps that reward mechs very well ie. Destination. Actually destination I would advise going mechs due to how the map is layed out, and the easy access to expos.
 
M@v

M@v

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On a different SC front here, who are Use maps settings players? Phantom and Diplo(diplo rules, not deathmatch) are 2 of my favorites. I can use my smash mind games in Phantom :chuckle:
 
Winston

Winston

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Alphican said:
Oh God... You have no idea dude. I've tried to come up with so many mech builds, and they all lead to disaster. The best I've come up with is a very quick expo into a wall in, with an attempt vulture harass into goliaths and expo ASAP. The problem with mechs is that mutas are gonna **** you early on. I know there are some maps that reward mechs very well ie. Destination. Actually destination I would advise going mechs due to how the map is layed out, and the easy access to expos.
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You make it sound like mech build is generally not viable.

For quite a while pro terrans went mech in almost half of proleague games.

2 factory fast vultures forces the zerg not to overexpand and play defensively a bit, from which you can expand and transition into your midgame of pumping goliaths and defending against mutalisks. Range upgraded goliaths + turrets do a decent job of this. A few tanks + mines also to defend against possible hydralisk rushes.

Then once you have enough goliaths so that mutalisks aren't a huge threat anymore you can get more tanks and move out. It's a pretty strong build. After you get past the initial window where your unit count is very low then you have a long window where you are really strong. Also you don't need to worry about things like microing vs lurkers.

There's also the "fantasy build" style of mech, with fast starport/armory for vulture drops and valkyries to defend against mutas, which transitions into goliath/tank with valkyrie support.
 
D

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mech is viable on certain maps

it's great on zergs that spent their entire starcraft learning how to fight marine and medics.


It's unfortunately much more boring :( in my opinion at least. To me it's an alternative for the people who simply aren't good enough with marine/medic to keep up with high level zergs.

See the terran progamers Upmagic and Fantasy
 
Mogwai

Mogwai

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I want to expect better of you, but I know not to
i hated them from the z perspective until I realized that once I had hydras and speed ols I could take like 5 expansions while the T was just trying to get a reasonable sized blob to kill me. you have to play it mad differently, and that's why it succeeds so much, but ultimately, I think mech is worse than typical SK style builds. It also seems like the T never gets a big enough Vessel cloud with this strat since so much gas goes into their army.

This thread helped me get over mech:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=85543
 
Winston

Winston

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sMoke2jointz said:
mech is viable on certain maps

it's great on zergs that spent their entire starcraft learning how to fight marine and medics.


It's unfortunately much more boring :( in my opinion at least. To me it's an alternative for the people who simply aren't good enough with marine/medic to keep up with high level zergs.

See the terran progamers Upmagic and Fantasy
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Haha, I don't see it as boring as an alternative standard build. The gameplay itself isn't nearly as interesting (medic marine you have small fights going on all over the map and much more exciting micro scenarios) but just seeing a change of pace is always interesting to me. Besides, I love seeing valkyries in play (in Fantasy's mech variations).

Mogwai said:
i hated them from the z perspective until I realized that once I had hydras and speed ols I could take like 5 expansions while the T was just trying to get a reasonable sized blob to kill me. you have to play it mad differently, and that's why it succeeds so much, but ultimately, I think mech is worse than typical SK style builds. It also seems like the T never gets a big enough Vessel cloud with this strat since so much gas goes into their army.

This thread helped me get over mech:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=85543
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T doesn't really get a vessel cloud with the mech strat because it doesn't need to...

vessel cloud is good vs lurkers and ultras, units which mech is inherently good against.

as far as taking lots of expansions goes, early vulture play should force the zerg to stay on two bases for a while and build units rather than just getting eco up. When zerg starts taking a lot of bases the terran should be able to get his 3rd base up as well and start powering out the most powerful army type in the game. (Nothing really beats a terran mech army; medic/marine would probably hold this title if it weren't for the various types of splash damage that wipe them out en masse).

The zerg can definitely deal with this style of play, but I'm just saying that I don't think mech is inherently worse as you make it out to be.

These are just my observations from watching a lot of successful mech play in proleague
 
Alphicans

Alphicans

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Seriously don't do mech. You need all the stars to line up for it to work. Plague is just a kick in the nuts, and the immobility of tanks under darkswarm is disgusting. Whatever you do don't use mechs unless it's a map that has proven it works with the build.
 
Mogwai

Mogwai

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I want to expect better of you, but I know not to
the thing is that the vulture harass only works if they don't see it coming. 1 well placed sunken + your initial lings @ your ramp holds off the initial harass and then getting hydra den right after lair (rather than spire) ensures that you can have 6 hydras running around on mine patrol and keeping vultures off your expansions until you can get sunkens up. The stupid 1 base, 2 starport build drives me much more nuts than the standard mech build.
 
Winston

Winston

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Alphican said:
Seriously don't do mech. You need all the stars to line up for it to work. Plague is just a kick in the nuts, and the immobility of tanks under darkswarm is disgusting. Whatever you do don't use mechs unless it's a map that has proven it works with the build.
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Haha I dunno, the new-style mech has been proven to work on a lot of maps that were previously thought to be "un-mechable"...

It's true that medic/marine is more flexible overall but you're really selling mech short. Have you watched pro games from this latest proleague season? Lots of mech going around, not just on Destination.

Also, you're talking about Defiler tech, which brutalizes medic&marine just as much, if not more...

Mogwai said:
the thing is that the vulture harass only works if they don't see it coming. 1 well placed sunken + your initial lings @ your ramp holds off the initial harass and then getting hydra den right after lair (rather than spire) ensures that you can have 6 hydras running around on mine patrol and keeping vultures off your expansions until you can get sunkens up. The stupid 1 base, 2 starport build drives me much more nuts than the standard mech build.
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What you said does hold off vultures, but the threat of the vultures does keep you from going expo-crazy, no? The 5 speed vulture runby can still deal damage past 1 sunken unless you have a lot of zerglings. Playing a bit conservatively with upgraded hydras + overlords is a good option but it does allow the mech player to establish his own expansions and get his macro in gear. Mech shouldn't drive you nuts when you're prepared but it's still a very valid alternate game plan, which is what I'm arguing.

Haha, 2 port wraith is a much cheesier build than mech I think... but it's so good against an unprepared zerg...
 
Mogwai

Mogwai

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I want to expect better of you, but I know not to
yea, way cheesier for sure. If they catch you with your pants down though, it's really effective. Then again, if you scout it and get 1-2 spores up at each base... lol.

I find that mech terrans don't expand quickly beyond the fast expo. (Speaking of which, the build is stupid weak vs. 9 pool on a lot of maps due to cutting Marines after like 1 or 2.) You can just spread them too thin with mutalisks for them to get expos up in timely manner. Like, I usually get 6 mutas somewhere around the time I get my 2nd expansion and I just sorta keep moving them around making sure that they can't keep up at all with me on expos.

I know what you mean at the pro level, but at the D/D+ level that I play mech terrans turtle too much to fight a macro-intensive zerg. The loss of mobility is so brutal on terrans too. I frequently drop mech terrans back to the stone age once I see them trying to move out.

EDIT: OSL Spoiler
SUCK IT BISU!!!!
 
Alphicans

Alphicans

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unknownPresence said:
think u could take her alpha?
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That's not the point. Like in smash if someone is better than you, you can't just say "they suck" but in SC you can because they are in such a different league you can't compare yourself to them. No I could not beat tossgirl but she still sucks.
 
P

Plairnkk

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i would **** tossgirl senseless. i refuse to believe a female will beat me at anything videogame related.

though in all seriousness she probably would **** me, i hold that my male ego would pull out miraculous victories as to not spite my name.
 
TheBuzzSaw

TheBuzzSaw

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Send me Starcraft replay of Plairnkk losing his manhood, pl0x...
 
P

Plairnkk

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ewww she plays terran? how gay is that :D

im confident in pvp at any level, and confident in pvz up to a pretty high level.

unfortunately even mediocre T's **** my balls off =(

LOL poor manhood T_T
 
P

Plairnkk

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yeah lol, im usually on iccup in my spare time...ive been in jail in the weekends tho so i havent been playing all too much. do u have time now for a quick game?
 
P

Plairnkk

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see, you never have time to play. thats why we havent played!

and yeah...screw jail ^_^

but i'm out now
 
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