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Starcraft 2 (Info on first post!)

Zankoku

Never Knows Best
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No, I don't play WoW, nor have I ever, lol.

Ankoku is a rather common name to see in online games and anime communities given that it's the Japanese word for "darkness." It's like those people named "kage" (shadow) or "kuro" (black) or "mugen" (infinite) or "naniganandakawakarani" (I don't know what the hell I'm talking about).
 

Zankoku

Never Knows Best
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Tournament starts now. No set schedule, but please play your matches as soon as you are able to. I'll keep brackets updated as regularly as I can, but it should be easy to tell who you play against next.


3 Terran 2 Protoss 5 Zerg 2 Random

  1. rhan // rhan.667
  2. S.O.L.I.D. // Solid.414
  3. vrud // AllYourBase.445
  4. Nashun // GRITnashun.348
  5. Werekill // Werekill.779
  6. ArcNatural // ArcNatural.328
  7. AltF4 // Alt.358
  8. Roman. // fycROMAN.268
  9. Sveet // CrumbsMcgee.182
  10. TheYoster // YellowYoster.807
  11. Cynan Machae // Cynan.623
  12. Nasty_Nate // NastyNate.922

Rules:
  • Best of 3
  • Finals are best of 5
  • Single elimination
  • First game will be played on the specified map for the round
  • Loser of previous game selects map for next game
  • You may not select a map you have already won on in a given set
  • Players must stay their designated race

Map Pool:
  • Shakuras Plateau
  • Tal'Darim Altar
  • Xel'Naga Caverns
  • Metalopolis
  • Terminus RE
 

Fortress | Sveet

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Joined
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no worries man. I actually have work in 7 hours but im choosing to watch the GSL instead of getting adequate amounts of sleep. I'll probably be on sc tomorrow night

Also, looking forward to playing nashun in the semifinals. Whoever wins between us will win the tournament :troll:
 

rhan

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 16, 2007
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SoVA 757
That bracket image looks so prettyyyyy!

I can play anytime Starting Sunday.

Post here saying you'll play or send me a PM (Probably more effective that way). I would like to keep the time frame somewhere between 3pm - 11pm EST.
 

AltF4

BRoomer
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I'll be available essentially anytime this weekend, Rhan. Does anyone want to obs the game? That would be fun. I haven't done a game with an observer before. (Actually, I haven't done an SC2 tourney before. XD)
 

vrud

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
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163
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Arc ill be able to play all day tomorrow and very late today (as in early tomorrow lol) so pm me or reply the time u would like
 

Nashun

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 11, 2006
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637
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Riverside, CA
What are the guidelines for how long we have to play our matches? Last tournament was ******** because of all of the flakes that thought they wanted to play and all of the people who are only available for like 3 hours a week.

You can contact me any time for matches, here's my contact info.
AIM:NashunPrez
B.net:Nashunprez@gmail.com, GRITnashun.348
 

Zankoku

Never Knows Best
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Play matches immediately, or as soon as possible. I'm hoping we finish in two weeks or less, so... every three days, if a match marked as "In Progress" is not either played or scheduled (within a reasonable time frame), a player is forfeited.
 

Nasty_Nate

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 22, 2006
Messages
1,164
Those were really good byes btw (havent seen yoster play yet tho)

And werekill i hate your posts because they are painfully nooby, and not in the sense that your new to the game and wanna learn. Stop talking about how much you suck or what your doing to get outta bronze league. Play more and get better and everything will take care of itself

example:
Hahaha, oh man, I need to try that, but since I'm near the top of bronze now, it probably wouldn't work. :(
Suggesting being at the top of bronze will affect your strategy compared to any other bronze placement is extremely facepalm-worthy. Im fairly certain I could get out of bronze if I played with closed fists

Also note im saying this with much less hostility than the internet might make it appear
 

Lore

Infinite Gravity
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And werekill i hate your posts because they are painfully nooby, and not in the sense that your new to the game and wanna learn. Stop talking about how much you suck or what your doing to get outta bronze league. Play more and get better and everything will take care of itself

example:

Suggesting being at the top of bronze will affect your strategy compared to any other bronze placement is extremely facepalm-worthy. Im fairly certain I could get out of bronze if I played with closed fists

Also note im saying this with much less hostility than the internet might make it appear
Ah, I see. Well, sorry, I just have major self confidence/anxiety issues. I'll try to stop talking about how much I suck if it's bothering you that much, ok?

And lol, I meant that there are actually quite a few decent people at the top of bronze who wouldn't fall for a mass-drone strat. A lot of them seem to be people who've played a TON of team matches, if their avatars were actually legitly earned.

But thanks, actually. I needed someone to be that honest with me. ^_^
 

Fortress | Sveet

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Werekill i am on AIM or skype. I will be ready to play in 30 minutes.


edit- sent contact request on skype
 

Lore

Infinite Gravity
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Formerly 'Werekill' and 'NeoTermina'
Werekill i am on AIM or skype. I will be ready to play in 30 minutes.


edit- sent contact request on skype
K, I'm gonna play one more practice round, and then I'll be ready.

Edit: Didn't you say that you were on skype? Lol.

Edit: I'm on SC2 now. Just message me in the swf channel
when you're ready.
 

victra♥

crystal skies
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Jan 20, 2007
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Slippi.gg
victra#0
hi guys

so im a sc2 noob and i started playing zerg and I keep losing to the same thing over and over again. I really want to quit because this is something I am literally losing to every time I play and it's starting to get really discouraging.

how do you handle protoss mass void ray/carriers? I just can't do anything to stop this. I'm not ranked yet (haven't played placement) but I can beat silver/gold players but if protoss goes mass air I lose every time.

I've heard people say "lol hydras" but i'd have 20~ish in my base and even when i try focus firing i'd still lose, even with random spore crawlers all around. 15~ void rays seems literally impossible especially after fully charged and carriers is just ugh.

and of course I'd scout and i'd see an early assim/stargate and i'd quickly go hydra but it doesn't seem like i can get enough in time cause all the damn buildings take 2 hours to build.

man im so salty right now and i could really use some advice. =(
 

rhan

Smash Hero
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SoVA 757
You don't let the game get that far. Zerg has so many ways to harass the min line and do massive damage.

Queens are great base defense. Mutas are great mobile defense. spore crawlers scare away voids.

Corruptors beat Carriers. You just have to focus fire the Carrier ship.
 

victra♥

crystal skies
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Slippi.gg
victra#0
i try to harass the main line early with roach/speedlings but my toss opponents always opt for early air so once 1 or 2 voids come out i'm done.

so what happens when the game does go that far? zerg automatically loses?

edit: isn't zerg supposed to reactionary play? shouldn't they be able to cope with mass void/carrier when its scouted?
 

Nashun

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You have to overproduce corrupters. With heavy air play, the protoss ground army is not cost effective against roaches or hydralisks. You can afford to have a less expensive ground army because your ground army beats his. With the extra money, you can make Corrupters. They beat every Protoss air unit for cost except for Void Rays, but you should win the fight anyways since you'll have more stuff.

Also note that there may be many underlying problems with your play other than unit composition. Zerg is a VERY complicated race because of the way their larva works. It is very possible that your opponents are just mining more than you because you made too few drones. Check out the army and resource collection graphs at the end of each of your games.

If you have a bigger army but still lost, it was probably your micro or unit composition. If you have a smaller army and a smaller resource collection rate, you simply did not build enough drones. If you have a larger resource collection rate and a smaller army, it means that you created too many drones and not enough fighting units in order to hold off the attack.
 

Nasty_Nate

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 22, 2006
Messages
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If air is beating you it sounds like your getting caught of guard (bad scouting) or macroing horribly

SCOUTING: You should scout as often as possible (sending a drone to mine minerals in opponents base will give you sufficient scouting for a while). Make sure ovie is nearby (or going to be nearby) his base. Use drone to check for double gas or more gates. If you see double gas it be wary of something techy. If you see early gates be wary of pressure/expanding. If your drone cant scout anymore due to death from stalker, and you dont have a good idea what hes doing, send that ovie in. Keep scouting the front with a zling.

This should give you enough information so you dont get caught off by multiple voidrays/pheonixes. As soon as you scout air, depending on how far along the tech is you want to get...
1. Fast tech to hydras if you have enough time (Make sure that at any time you have/can make enough units to stop the ground army if it attacks!)
2. Make more queens if you need them, or are unsure of air numbers
3. Make spores if you REALLY need them (this is only if your very scared, desperate, or they are getting increasing pheonix numbers)

Remember he shouldnt have enough money to get fast void rays and a large army/expansion. Its usually gonna be void ray push with medium ground army, or a quick tech switch to expansion (from very good players)


MACRO: Most important part of zerg is droning up. Think of it as a long term investment that easily pays for itself if it survives long enough. When you clean up your builds and learn to only make units when you need them (and drones when you dont) then youll macro up in such a way that he should never be able to get far enough ahead for void rays AND carriers (in fact he should almost never be able to get carriers) As long as you stop pushes by scouting correctly and stay ahead on bases, your extra drones will give you so much cash that youll be able to take a third and produce as many units as you need to beat toss. Can't do this without good scouting though, cause if you make an extra set of drones right when he pushes you can get run over. Or you can get beaten by a quick tech.
 

Overswarm

is laughing at you
Joined
May 4, 2005
Messages
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Protoss armies are stronger than yours. They always will be. If they aren't, they're doing it wrong.

Protoss hard counters do better than yours. If they get 4 or 5 collosi, they can one shot your hydras with focus fire. You have to overproduce collosi to such an amount that their stalker ball will beat your hydra/roach and you have to replenish.

Zerg, unlike protoss and terran, don't have the ability to tech up, get a strong economy, and get a good army all at the same time. We can get a good economy, a good army, or tech quicky. We only get one, they get all three. Past early game when you get towards the mid game though, you're suddenly able to do any of those three (still one at a time, pretty much) much better than your opponent. You can fully saturate an expansion almost instantly, you can build one building and suddenly be able to produce twelve of that unit rather than having to build multiple buildings to produce it, and you can create dozens of units at the same time.

So scout your opponent. See what he's doing. React accordingly by picking either eco, army, or tech. Try not to do more than one in a phase. Make a few lings for defense or some spines, sure. Get your lair if you can, sure. Make a few extra drones when low on gas instead of roaches, sure. But really, pick one that is best for you and use that.

Then, once you get a good handle on that, react accordingly. Strong tech should give you some sort of control, whether it be map control (muta) or confrontation control (casters or units that hard counter T1 like hydras vs. stalkers in low numbers), strong econ should give you more options down the line, and strong army should give you the ability to go on the aggression.
 

Zankoku

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I've heard people say "lol hydras" but i'd have 20~ish in my base and even when i try focus firing i'd still lose, even with random spore crawlers all around. 15~ void rays seems literally impossible especially after fully charged and carriers is just ugh.
20 Hydras is 2000 minerals/1000 gas/40 supply
15 Void Rays is 3750 minerals/2250 gas/45 supply

I know that Hydras are supposed to counter Void Rays, but come on, he's spent twice as much money as you have on an army of a unit that gets pretty devastating in critical mass.
 

Roman.

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lol i don't even want to read all of your posts but zerg beats that toss comp with fungal and hydras - fungal should keep them from all attacking you at once and then they melt to 20+ upgraded hydras

also if you scout it early, just build a couple extra queens and maybe 1 spore in each base for your queens to retreat to if they have to and drone as hard as possible... this is where you need to get a huge macro lead just like when dealing with early banshees and phoenixs
 

victra♥

crystal skies
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Slippi.gg
victra#0
thank you so much you guys! You guys have been so helpful. haha

If you're letting someone mass carriers and void rays you're not applying enough early pressure of harassing enough.
how do i harass when in the earlier game, all i have is roach/lings where as my opponent has a few fast air in their base? hydra's are so slow off creep and it takes forever for a spire to build
 

rhan

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I don't play Zerg at all but I think Hydras are pretty useless compared to other units like Mutas. You have to get a Lair to get Hydras.. Meanwhile you can just produce an extra queen to hold off any kind of early Void Ray harass and the Queen transfusion can be used on anything. So if they're focus firing a Queen just transfuse it then focus fire down one Void at a time. Mutas are also good for harassing a min line or taking out pylons.

Speedlings can rush a mineral line pretty well also.

Expanding your creep constantly is definitely required for any Zerg. The more creep you have on the map the faster ALL your ground units are.
 

¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯

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oh solid, i might not be able to do it tonight (depending on how late you're on til) but i'll definitely be available all day tomorrow
I've got school tomorrow but I should be able to play in the evening.

how do i harass when in the earlier game, all i have is roach/lings where as my opponent has a few fast air in their base? hydra's are so slow off creep and it takes forever for a spire to build
If you only have lings and banelings and your opponent has air units up, that's a problem. Make mutas, use them for harass. Lings can be good if you can get a run by. Think about it: carriers and void rays are slow. If someone is massing them, they aren't going to be very mobile. The way you engage an immobile army is not straight up, you go around them however you can and damage their economy, production, etc. They cannot be everywhere at once with an immobile army, but you can.
 

Fortress | Sveet

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If you're letting someone mass carriers and void rays you're not applying enough early pressure of harassing enough.
Im a defensive player by nature. I read this: They aren't applying enough early pressure ;)

My favorite games are ones where i can build 80 drones without any other unit. How can any race stop that other than making you make units by attacking?
 

¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯

Smash Legend
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But the same can go for other races if you let them. That's my point. Zerg can't afford to let Protoss macro up a huge late game army because no Zerg composition can beat out a Protoss late game composition in a straight up battle, which is why pressure and harass are super important for Zerg.
 

Zankoku

Never Knows Best
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Well, no, it doesn't quite apply to the other races, because only Zerg can dedicate all their production solely to one unit without being inefficient about it. Yes, Terran and Protoss can produce everything at once, but they also can't decide to produce more of one thing in exchange for another. If Zerg feels like being greedy and risky and Terran/Protoss don't do anything to stop it, Zerg will be hitting a fully replenishable 200/200 army probably a good 5 minutes before the other two races manage to.
 

TheYoster

Smash Journeyman
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Silver Spring, Md
Im a defensive player by nature. I read this: They aren't applying enough early pressure ;)

My favorite games are ones where i can build 80 drones without any other unit. How can any race stop that other than making you make units by attacking?
Have you played your match yet?
 
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