SSB4 Rumours and Leaks

[Spazzy_D]

Ever see Harry Potter? Those folks had magic powers. I believe this person in question has those same sort of powers.

.... It all makes sense now. Muggles....Moogles....

Cloud confirmed for Smash!

 

[MasterofMonster]

Thank you Three who answered. ^^

I can't say I'm looking forward to a Chorus Kid/Marshal, though. :/ But tell me. Were it said that all those characters were gonna be playable? If not, can't there have been Assists with them?

 

[TeenGirlSquad]

I wonder what sort of source would have detailed Mario Kart AND Smash information. Smash isn't even being developed in house. Anyone have any ideas on this?

Marketing?

 

[Chimera]

We've had a previous image where there was no Mii in the cage however. You can say that's because at the time they released the image they hadn't programmed it yet. But you also have the fact we haven't exactly seen Miis in the background for the Pilotwings Stage that goes around Wuhu Island either. Plus, there's the Tomodachi Life stage. Which speaking of which, Miis have a chance at being revealed around the Month of E3 due to that game's Western release in June.

Also for every King Mii in Streetpass Quest/Find Mii. There were Miis you can gather that is trying to save the King (Which was usually your own Mii). And that may include having them being able to fight the Dark Emperor. Playing as your Mii might end up having the Mii in the cage be a Mii representing one of your family members for example. Mii's chances were really not that well affected by the Streetpass Quest/Find Mii cameo. Even if it's lower, it's only slightly lower. Not a significant change.

That's fair enough. I guess we'll just have to see.

I've always talked about the collective fanbase, which yes, doesn't refer to every single last member of the fanbase, but rather a large portion of it.

It's not a large portion. It's a small portion, with an inflated sense of importance.

Keep strawmanning it up by claiming I have dismissed the entire roster as a 'fail.'

You've called the RUMORED roster disappointing several times now.

Whining that people like @soviet prince are daring to not be satisfied with the final roster is what's childish here.

To be clear, I don't particularly care that he isn't satisfied, just that he, and you, feel the constant need to tell everyone how disappointed you are, and then go on an on about Sakurai is ignoring the fanbase, hurting the fanbase, sucks at marketing, fails at fanservice, etc. That behavior is what I called childish. Even going so far as to mock the man's hard work is pretty childish. The guy moved close to the studio so that he could work more, is dealing with an injury that has now spread to both of his arms, and takes the time to give us Smash info EVERY DAY. I realize you don't know him personally, and neither do I, but you could probably try to at least show a LITTLE respect for the guy. He obviously cares very deeply about his, and Nintendo's fans or he wouldn't go through so much trouble just to give a bunch of impatient nerds a new Smash game to play. That's my rant. I don't want to argue about this anymore, I know it's derailing the topic. Sorry for the distraction.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Marketing?

Yeah, I was thinking it would have to be marketing or administrative (or someone higher up on the food chain), but if that was the case I'm not sure if they would have concrete details about things like a roster count. I don't know, maybe somebody with experience in the industry might now more.

 

[BKupa666]

That's fair enough. I guess we'll just have to see.
It's not a large portion. It's a small portion, with an inflated sense of importance. You've called the RUMORED roster disappointing several times now. To be clear, I don't particularly care that he isn't satisfied, just that he, and you, feel the constant need to tell everyone how disappointed you are, and then go on an on about Sakurai is ignoring the fanbase, hurting the fanbase, sucks at marketing, fails at fanservice, etc. That behavior is what I called childish. Even going so far as to mock the man's hard work is pretty childish. The guy moved close to the studio so that he could work more, is dealing with an injury that has now spread to both of his arms, and takes the time to give us Smash info EVERY DAY. I realize you don't know him personally, and neither do I, but you could probably try to at least show a LITTLE respect for the guy. He obviously cares very deeply about his, and Nintendo's fans or he wouldn't go through so much trouble just to give a bunch of impatient nerds a new Smash game to play. That's my rant. I don't want to argue about this anymore, I know it's derailing the topic. Sorry for the distraction.

By that logic, no one should ever express disappointment about any aspect of a Smash game ever. All hail tripping! All hail 60% of development time going to the SSE! So much work/effort/injury/potato went into all of them!

In a roundabout way, praising what we like and expressing disappointment about what we don't like is the ideal way to serve as fans. We want the best game possible, and thus offer comments based on what decisions we believe could lead to the creation of such a game. We're not mindless yes-men, nor are we indiscriminately ******** about everything.

 

[Spazzy_D]

You can express your dissatisfaction with the game without belittling other peoples opinions or coming off as petulant.

 

[ZombieBran]

You can express your dissatisfaction with the game without belittling other peoples opinions or coming off at petulant.

I'd have hoped a mod would know this, too.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Guys, stop arguing over whatever whoever said and get back on topic. Just stop.

I know there aren't any leaks to discuss right now besides Palutena and the Sal leak, but for the sake of this thread, keep it on topic. There's been an incredible amount of off-topic discussion in here. It's understandable, but try to avoid it.

 

[Fatmanonice]

and it's only your opinion that the roster is good, see what I did there it goes both ways. why is it ok for you to claim nothing is wrong but I can't express my distaste for this roster? I am sorry if this hurts your fellings but I think sakurai choices of characters are a disservice to the fanbase.

See, that's the thing. We don't know the full roster yet and we probably won't for another four months. It's way too early for you to be bent out of shape about the supposed final roster when we don't even have a final product yet.

 

[Muster]

You can express your dissatisfaction with the game without belittling other peoples opinions or coming off at petulant.

The problem is that you get hate either way. People have already politely discussed their dissatisfaction with the roster, only to accused of needless ******** by others. There's really no winning here on smashboards.

See, that's the thing. We don't know the full roster yet and we probably won't for another four months. It's way too early for you to be bent out of shape about the supposed final roster when we don't even have a final product yet.

He's probably not going to like the final roster either, assuming it's different from the one we have, but still missing key characters.
(probably going to be the one we have, though.)

 

[leprechaunlink727]

In general, I'm ambivalent. My most wanted newcomers were Little Mac, Ridley, Tingle, Waluigi, and Takamaru. I also really want Snake to return. Little Mac is in, Waluigi is an Assist, and the other four characters I want are looking unlikely. I also have no particular attachment whatsoever to most of these newcomers, confirmed and rumored. Despite my personal feelings on the Sal Ramano roster, I could see it going either way still. I also think that in spite of his accuracy so far, there are a lot of reasons to be skeptical of the Sal Ramano leak. We've yet to have a Smash roster with newcomers that are all so obscure or recent.

Villager, Mega Man, Mii, and Pac-Man are obviously all big faces throughout the world, and Little Mac is an icon to (American) Nintendo fans, but Wii Fit Trainer is a well discussed left field choice, Rosalina is a second string Mario character who has only recently come to prominence, Palutena is an older character who has only become relevant again due to Sakurai, Greninja and Chrom are from games that released in the last year and a half, and Shulk and Marshall are both from games that sold okay (well... Rhythm Heaven sold well in Japan) but have remained fairly obscure to people who aren't die-hard Nintendo fans. To somebody whose main Nintendo love stems from the Gamecube era or earlier, most of these characters are completely alienating, as though this particular Smash Bros is not meant for them. I'm only 20, and that's kind of the way I'm feeling.

One of Sakurai's rules for including a character is "they have to make people want to buy the game", and given that this game has to "save" the Wii U, it doesn't make sense that Sakurai would skip out on so many obvious fan desired additions for all of these lesser known characters. It makes sense that he has revealed mostly left-field surprises so far to keep us on our toes, saving the big crowd pleasing reveals for the two E3's when they'll get the most exposure, but it would not make sense if nearly all of the newcomers defied expectations and desires in this way.

No retro characters despite Sakurai saying he wanted to add more this time around, no new DK, Zelda, or Metroid rep (Nintendo's big three long-lasting series after Mario, Pokemon, and Kirby), 8 of 12 newcomers being from previously unrepresented series... these things may very well be the case, but they don't line up with the previous patterns Sakurai has established. I know people are insisting these won't be all of the newcomers, but come on, there's 12, how much more are you really expecting? It just doesn't add up, and not in the same way as Brawl including R.O.B., Wolf, and Toon Link, because Brawl also included Wario, Meta Knight, Diddy Kong, King Dedede, Olimar, Sonic, Pit, Pokemon Trainer, etc... Characters who were desired, predictable, and could all be considered Nintendo "All Stars", even the first three I mentioned to varying degrees. Hell, Wolf, R.O.B. and Toon Link are all about as left field as Yoshi compared to Marshall...

On the flip side, it could all be true. Sakurai could have chosen all of these characters based on their promotional value for games he feels are deserving of more attention. Generally, when Sakurai wants to call attention to underrated games, he reaches back much farther into Nintendo's history, but it's possible that he decided to mix it up this time given the faltering nature of Nintendo's console games sales. If this is the case, then Sakurai's definition of what Smash Bros is has changed. With this fourth entry, he does not see it as a celebration of Nintendo's history and iconic characters, but primarily as a promotional vehicle. It could be that he believes all of Nintendo's biggest icons are already included, and it's time to bring in the new blood. It would not be that unusual or unprecedented for a crossover game. Lord knows Playstation All-stars was basically just a big advertisement. Disney has a similar thing going with Disney Infinity, in which lots of classic characters have been looked over in favor of the stars of Disney's most recent hits. Moreover, Sal Ramano is indeed 5 for 5 out of 6 announced newcomers, and the remaining 6 characters he's guessed are all still totally possible, with at least 3 of them (Palutena, Chrom, Pac-Man) looking more or less definite.

I'm not really interested in continuing the argument that has already been going on for like 7 billion pages, but I think that both sides have reasons for believing what they do, just like I think both sides of the "Ridley's shadow" debate have a case. I also just don't think it adds up, so I lean more towards the skeptical side, but I'm open to this roster and will probably buy the game regardless because I know that Sakurai will make these characters fun to play as, even if I don't find all of them particularly worthy of inclusion.

 

[Fatmanonice]

One thing I'm curious about is how the "Chorus Men" would work. There's technically four of them, (the conductor and three singers) right? Even if it was just the singers, that sounds pretty complicated. We already had transformations cut because the 3DS apparently can't handle them without lagging and we already know Olimar and Dedede had changes made to them to have less items on the screen (less Pikmin for Olimar and wandering Waddle Dees/Doos getting cut) for probably the same reason so how on earth would at least three of the exact same character on screen work? Sakurai specifically mentioned complications with the Ice Climbers way back in August too and they're just a pair so how would a trio work?

 

[Dairz]

I just have a hard time believing Sakurai would choose the Chorus Men from Rythm Heaven. They're obscure, but unlike G&W or ROB they're not important to Nintendo's history...like, at all. Its a complete WTF choice, and we already got one of those with the Wii Fit Trainers. Something about this just feels off...

 

[BluePikmin11]

One thing I'm curious about is how the "Chorus Men" would work. There's technically four of them, (the conductor and three singers) right? Even if it was just the singers, that sounds pretty complicated. We already had transformations cut because the 3DS apparently can't handle them without lagging and we already know Olimar and Dedede had changes made to them to have less items on the screen (less Pikmin for Olimar and wandering Waddle Dees/Doos getting cut) for probably the same reason so how on earth would at least three of the exact same character on screen work? Sakurai specifically mentioned complications with the Ice Climbers way back in August too and they're just a pair so how would a trio work?

Most likely based on rhythm, where every attack involves rhythm in different ways, executing correctly will reward the player with a strong attack. That's how I see it.

I just have a hard time believing Sakurai would choose the Chorus Men from Rythm Heaven. They're obscure, but unlike G&W or ROB they're not important to Nintendo's history...like, at all. Its a complete WTF choice, and we already got one of those with the Wii Fit Trainers. Something about this just feels off...

It's not obscure at all, just look at the Rhythm Wrestler becoming an internet phenomenon now.

 

[Homelessvagrant]

See, that's the thing. We don't know the full roster yet and we probably won't for another four months. It's way too early for you to be bent out of shape about the supposed final roster when we don't even have a final product yet.

That is unless he's expecting a completely ridiculous character, in which case it's better to get it out of the system now. Still I'd imagine ranting on smashboards would be the worse way for stress relief. When Sakurai murdered Pokemon Trainer, I found that taking a few hours of vitamin E helped sooth the system.

 

[Lolo Lolo]

Do you remember that rumor about taboo being playable ?
Can someone re-post it please ?
it said that Charizard was alone without the Pkm Trainer

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I think it's entirely possible that "Chorus Men" is actually just Marshall.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I think it's entirely possible that "Chorus Men" is actually just Marshall.

Chorus Men.
That involves more than one.

 

[R0Y]

About Snake, it's nice to want things.

 

[Spazzy_D]

I wonder what the support for a Rhythm Heaven rep was like on Japanese Smash boards. Obviously not as high as some of the other heavy hitters, but I wonder if it was a somewhat common request or at least talking point. If it was brought up at least as much as say, Bandanna Dee is here, it would help with the validity of the leak I think.

 

[chronomantic]

I just have a hard time believing Sakurai would choose the Chorus Men from Rythm Heaven. They're obscure, but unlike G&W or ROB they're not important to Nintendo's history...like, at all. Its a complete WTF choice, and we already got one of those with the Wii Fit Trainers. Something about this just feels off...

His (possible) inclusion would help increase the sales of Rhythm Heaven. Not important? well it's a relatively new series but it's been successful so that's enough to be considered.

 

[IsmaR]

I still like the theory that they actually meant the Elite Beat Agents or a rep from Ouendan/Rhythm games in general rather than any specific character.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Chorus Men.
That involves more than one.

Fair point. I just have a hard time seeing them happen if transformation characters are gone. Not that they would necessarily transform, but that raises a question about what the Chorus Men would do if they were one character.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Chorus Men as a trio, they aren't really transformation characters, and they would most likely have the same attacks for each choir boy.

 

[Dairz]

His (possible) inclusion would help increase the sales of Rhythm Heaven. Not important? well it's a relatively new series but it's been successful so that's enough to be considered.

I don't mean sales, I mean importance. ROB played a big part in helping Nintendo around the time of the video game crash. Game and Watch made handhelds become popular, and I think it was Nintendo's first big success. I like Rhythm Heaven, but it would be crazy to suggest its anywhere near as important as those two.

 

[chronomantic]

I still like the theory that they actually meant the Elite Beat Agents or a rep from Ouendan/Rhythm games in general rather than any specific character.

Maybe you're right. After all this is the same guy who vaguely said 'Pokemon X/Y' and it turned out to be Greninja.

 

[stan423321]

Fair point. I just have a hard time seeing them happen if transformation characters are gone. Not that they would necessarily transform, but that raises a question about what the Chorus Men would do if they were one character.

The basic idea that I had when I heard of Chorus Men the first time, just based on the name and not too much on the franchise, was something crossing the lines between Ice Climbers and Double Cherry, moving in unison to your input. Not sure how 3DS would handle that, but hey, here's an idea.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I still like the theory that they actually meant the Elite Beat Agents or a rep from Ouendan/Rhythm games in general rather than any specific character.

It still kills me that they didn't even get an assist trophy in Brawl. I will say though that a 3DS stage based on EBA or Ouendan would kick an indescribable amount of ass.

 

[leprechaunlink727]

I still like the theory that they actually meant the Elite Beat Agents or a rep from Ouendan/Rhythm games in general rather than any specific character.

This would make slightly more sense but still not that much sense.

 

[Zhadgon]

I just have a hard time believing Sakurai would choose the Chorus Men from Rythm Heaven. They're obscure, but unlike G&W or ROB they're not important to Nintendo's history...like, at all. Its a complete WTF choice, and we already got one of those with the Wii Fit Trainers. Something about this just feels off...

Well it has more than 3 or 4 million on sales, with only three games in home consoles and handhelds, in Japan is not small at all. You can argue Xenoblade is smaller.

.n_n.

 

[IsmaR]

To be fair, Roy didn't make much sense during the Melee leak era. People mistook him for Roy Koopa of the Koopalings, similarly to how people during the Brawl-leaks thought R.O.B. was actually ROB64 from StarFox, since R.O.B. was "disconfirmed" as a generic enemy.

All I'm saying is maybe something was lost in translation.

 

[Riotpomp]

Chorusmen doesn't need to imply that you play as more than one.

For example: Wii Fit Trainers

 

[Staarih]

Even if the Chorus Men aren't transformation characters, wouldn't a trio of them still be difficult to work on on the 3DS, if even the Ice Climbers have been problematic?

 

[BluePikmin11]

Even if the Chorus Men aren't transformation characters, wouldn't a trio of them still be difficult to work on on the 3DS if even the Ice Climbers have been problematic?

I'm surprised no one brought that up when it came to trios.
Inb4 programming hell argument pops up.

 

[Dairz]

Of course, if the Chorus Men were actually confirmed I would be happy, and I would probably enjoy playing as them. It just doesn't seem like a choice Sakurai would make to me. :/

 

[True Blue Warrior]

To be fair, Roy didn't make much sense during the Melee leak era. People mistook him for Roy Koopa of the Koopalings, similarly to how people during the Brawl-leaks thought R.O.B. was actually ROB64 from StarFox, since R.O.B. was "disconfirmed" as a generic enemy.

All I'm saying is maybe something was lost in translation.

Interesting. This leak mystifies me, too.

 

[Wolfie557]

oh no what if each man from chorus men had a few attacks..........some would do that some the other and never full moveset for each.

 

[stan423321]

Even if the Chorus Men aren't transformation characters, wouldn't a trio of them still be difficult to work on on the 3DS, if even the Ice Climbers have been problematic?

Heavily depends on both trio implementation, and problematic points of ICs and Pikmin. It could have been polycount, it could have been AI, it could have been physics. I don't really know. It most probably would be possible if you hired some hackers working specifically on that after everything else is finished.

 

[The Light Music Club]

I still surprised by lack of Retro in the leak. I mean personally when I think about it more and more, Duck Hunt Dog makes a ton of sense. He's from the game that uses the Zapper which is an icon item from the NES. Plus he fits in more than Takumaru I think, as he's known world wide.


Off topic: Why hasn't there been a new Duck Hunt yet?