[SPOILER ALERT] - The Sevens Squares. - A Square-Enix general support threads.

[TheYungLink]

Easy! Simply another Dragon Quest hero. Probably 4, 5, or 8.

E: Or Mallow I guess, but Mallow is below DQ representation period.

Do not speak ill of my cloudy son

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It's almost like Sora represents Square-Enix and Disney. It's tied to both companies.

Keep in mind leakers also can use odd ways to describe things. But really, Sora is still a Square-Enix character in some way. They created the character. It's just owned by Disney. Calling him a character from both companies is completely accurate.

 

[Idon]

I have a question for you all, if you had to pick characters to be in Smash from all of the franchises in the list, but it cant be any of the list characters themselves, who would you choose?

FFV: Bartz Klauser
DQ9: Celestrian

 

[Deleted member]

Do not speak ill of my cloudy son

Eh. Mallow had his own arc, which is pretty good, but Geno had more practicality as a party member. I literally played Super Mario RPG because of Geno so it's hard to say how much I want Mallow as a character.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I have a question for you all, if you had to pick characters to be in Smash from all of the franchises in the list, but it cant be any of the list characters themselves, who would you choose?

Sora: Aqua (she looks cool)
Erdrick: Eight
Luminary: Hero Descendant (DQ1)
Slime: Dragonlord
Crono: Magus
Sephiroth: Terra / Tifa
Geno: Mallow

 

[Deleted member]

Also I remember I had this on reserve. Here's Geno. Should get to drawing other characters I'm interested in.

 

[Blade of Evil's Bane]

I have a question for you all, if you had to pick characters to be in Smash from all of the franchises in the list, but it cant be any of the list characters themselves, who would you choose?

Without any regards to popularity and likeliness, just my crazy pipe dream picks would be:

Spoiler: SMRPG

Other than Mallow, this little guy:

Wait... you can't see him? Look closer:

Spoiler: ZOOM

That's right, the minuscule martial arts master, JINX!!

Spoiler: Final Fantasy

Buffoon, madman, master of sass and self proclaimed God of Magic, Kefka Palazzo.

Spoiler: Chrono Trigger

Lucca the genius steampunk inventor, hammer/energy pistol wielder and kickass fire mage.

I just think they could have some interesting movesets/gimmicks... I don't know enough about KH or DQ to imagine any alternate picks.

 

[Sigran101]

If SE didn't consider Sora "close to them" or an "honnorary SE rep", they wouldn't even put him in the list of leakbait name they throw around.

You're kidding right? I'm sure you know Luigi was joking about the list being from square themselves. I just have to make sure.

 

[Luigi The President]

You're kidding right? I'm sure you know Luigi was joking about the list being from square themselves. I just have to make sure.

No, actually, I wasn't.
Though I may have worded it wrong, this list is indeed a compilation of names Squenix has tossed around.

The list itself isn't what is official it's what is on it so Nekoo is right.

 

[Sigran101]

No, actually, I wasn't.
Though I may have worded it wrong, this list is indeed a compilation of names Squenix has tossed around.

The list itself isn't what is official it's what is on it so Nekoo is right.

I thought it was just list of the names Verg heard. Did I miss something about square being involved?

 

[Luigi The President]

I thought it was just list of the names Verg heard. Did I miss something about square being involved?

Well those names being what Verge has heard makes them the Squenix names, as that's what has been sent out by leakbait by extension.

 

[ZenythSmash]

Which one? That 5channel rumor with Joker's stage or Other leak that claims to have full five fighters?

both

 

[Sigran101]

Well those names being what Verge has heard makes them the Squenix names, as that's what has been sent out by leakbait by extension.

Ah, I see. I was under the impression that a lot of that could be just bad info as often happens with smash leaks.

 

[Captain Fun]

Ah, I see. I was under the impression that a lot of that could be just bad info as often happens with smash leaks.

The idea that every wrong name we've heard is deliberate misinformation from Square Enix themselves is an assumption that this thread has just run with.

 

[zabimaru1000]

I have a question for you all, if you had to pick characters to be in Smash from all of the franchises in the list, but it cant be any of the list characters themselves, who would you choose?

SMRPG: Smithy
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
DQ: Dai (technically a manga character)
Chrono Trigger: Magus
Kingdom Hearts: Aqua

 

[Nekoo]

Ah, I see. I was under the impression that a lot of that could be just bad info as often happens with smash leaks.

The idea that every wrong name we've heard is deliberate misinformation from Square Enix themselves is an assumption that this thread has just run with.

There truth and wrong.
Vergeben and Hitagi. The two main people who heard about the Square-Enix Names, did say that, there ACTUALLY was misinformation inside Square-Enix.
And people actually got caught and fired over it.

However, what names on the list are from SE, and what names are just Vergeben hearing about it is another discussion.

 

[Jboy1010]

If SE didn't consider Sora "close to them" or an "honnorary SE rep", they wouldn't even put him in the list of leakbait name they throw around.

SE considering him to be believable leakbait doesn’t change the fact that Sora is in No way a character they control or represents them in an legal/official way. They have as much control over him as any developer... which is no official control or representation. You don’t see platinum games getting credited to the same extent as SEGA for Bayonetta, Not would you see SE getting credited for the inclusion of any Persona material prior to P5 if Smash were to use it.

It's almost like Sora represents Square-Enix and Disney. It's tied to both companies.

Keep in mind leakers also can use odd ways to describe things. But really, Sora is still a Square-Enix character in some way. They created the character. It's just owned by Disney. Calling him a character from both companies is completely accurate.

Sora is still a SE character in the same way Bayonetta is platinum games and any Persona character, or enemy prior to persona 5 is a SE character. That being that they’re one’ll a character they developed... not a character they get any official representation from, that goes to the owners of the copyright. Nintendo would be in hot water if they called Sora a rep for a company that doesn’t own him.... it doesn’t really matter how he fans associated Sora to be when the Law clearly indicates otherwise

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Sora is still a SE character in the same way Bayonetta is platinum games and any Persona character, or enemy prior to persona 5 is a SE character. That being that they’re one’ll a character they developed... not a character they get any official representation from, that goes to the owners of the copyright. Nintendo would be in hot water if they called Sora a rep for a company that doesn’t own him.... it doesn’t really matter how he fans associated Sora to be when the Law clearly indicates otherwise

Law doesn't have anything to do with how representation works at all.

That's pure licensing. What actually determines representation is how he's implemented. If he's implemented with nothing but Square-Enix content, then he's only a Disney character by proxy. If he has FF references, he's Square-Enix too. He was always both because he's created by Square-Enix. He has little to do with Disney beyond copyright, and he might not even have his small references either. We might not even get the keychain. I certainly hope we do, as I think he'd be better with some of the Disney-related content. But the OC's actually more represent Square-Enix than anything else because it's content they made.

Bayonetta absolutely represents Sega and Platinum Games. She's just owned by Sega. Representation is very different from licensing/copyright/trademarks. They have two completely different reasons for existing.

 

[MissingGlitch]

I've actually really warmed up to Sora and Crono. If the SE rep isn't Geno I want it to be one of them.

 

[Jboy1010]

Law doesn't have anything to do with how representation works at all.

That's pure licensing. What actually determines representation is how he's implemented. If he's implemented with nothing but Square-Enix content, then he's only a Disney character by proxy. If he has FF references, he's Square-Enix too. He was always both because he's created by Square-Enix. He has little to do with Disney beyond copyright, and he might not even have his small references either. We might not even get the keychain. I certainly hope we do, as I think he'd be better with some of the Disney-related content. But the OC's actually more represent Square-Enix than anything else because it's content they made.

Bayonetta absolutely represents Sega and Platinum Games. She's just owned by Sega. Representation is very different from licensing/copyright/trademarks. They have two completely different reasons for existing.

Law has everything to do with representation due to it meaning the character represents their company properly and Nintendo avoiding a lawsuit for misrepresentation of a character.

Licensing means to get it from the company that owns that creative material... any company having their creative material showing in other products that aren’t their own would be represented. SE owns nothing of any KH content... so any KH Original content put into smash would be Disney content, making it to be represented by Disney. It doesn’t matter if it was created by SE because they have to give up all rights, creative control and any official representation righty’s to Disney since they own the IP of KH, this is common in any Developer-Owner agreement. Even if Sora didn’t have his keychain it wouldn’t change the fact he still represents Disney since him and his series is Disney content. Your talking from the perspective of a fan of what you associate Sora to be... not from the perspective of a Company that is legally obliged to say who Sora represents and Where exactly they would be getting the character from.

Again... the official site for Bayonetta’s smash 4 DLC page only mentioned the copyright holders and nothing else, meaning as far as representation officially it was the copyright holders that got the mention. Same will go for Sora... no matter what they would change about his design

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Law has everything to do with representation due to it meaning the character represents their company properly and Nintendo avoiding a lawsuit for misrepresentation of a character.

Licensing means to get it from the company that owns that creative material... any company having their creative material showing in other products that aren’t their own would be represented. SE owns nothing of any KH content... so any KH Original content put into smash would be Disney content, making it to be represented by Disney. It doesn’t matter if it was created by SE because they have to give up all rights, creative control and any official representation righty’s to Disney since they own the IP of KH, this is common in any Developer-Owner agreement. Even if Sora didn’t have his keychain it wouldn’t change the fact he still represents Disney since him and his series is Disney content. Your talking from the perspective of a fan of what you associate Sora to be... not from the perspective of a Company that is legally obliged to say who Sora represents and Where exactly they would be getting the character from.

Again... the official site for Bayonetta’s smash 4 DLC page only mentioned the copyright holders and nothing else, meaning as far as representation officially it was the copyright holders that got the mention. Same will go for Sora... no matter what they would change about his design

I just don't see it. Because I don't believe representation is some hard-coded definition of how it works. This only sounds like dismissing the company that actually did all the hard work for no good reason. It's pretty inaccurate and actually rather hurtful to see artists dismissed as important just because they don't own the IP.

With that said, agree to disagree. Just wanted to clear up why I don't believe any of that should affect how people view representation. Because it sets a very bad precedent for a lack of respect towards content creators.

 

[Jboy1010]

No, representation is solely how the characters are enacted. Bayonetta is absolutely a Platinum Games representative because they are the creators. They don't get mentioned at all because they don't own the IP. These are still entirely different things. You're trying to look at it at the wrong angle here.

Disney owns the IP. They didn't create it. It's still a Square-Enix representative because they created it. Without them, the game doesn't exist. Without Disney, the game doesn't exist. Reality is, they both matter and always will no matter what. Why is Sora called a Square-Enix representative? Because they created him. That's it. And they're still right by the facts. He does represent something Square-Enix legitimately created. Because that's a correct use of representation. You're literally trying to act like there's only one usage of the term, which isn't true. There's tons of ways to represent something.

And for the record, the reason why Sora is part of the SE 7 is because it was for characters created or owned by Square-Enix. Besides that, if the list was seriously released by SE(which is possible, as some could be leakbait), they damn well know that people consider Sora related to SE anyway(which is still true no matter how you stretch it).

You’re still talking from a fan perspective and what you associate which character with who they’re with. You can’t provide any tangible official material backing up your perspective because there is none. But on the smash ultimate website however they actually credit the companies these characters came from. Since they don’t get mentioned it means they aren’t being officially cited as a reprenseted party in the characters inclusion. If the leaked are coming from SE then it means SE are officially cited represented parties in all these characters, the way they get officially cited is to own some form of copyright... if you look at all the characters in the list besides sora, SE owns their copyrights. Making them SE material that represent SE in the characters/IPs they have.

When it comes to representation/character inclusion officially it’s the owners that get credited/mentioned for the inclusion. Not the creators... the most a creator/developer gets is a special thanks at the end of the credits or in Smash 4’s case, being mentioned in the credits in helping with the creative process (this is exactly the treatment platinum games got... SEGA got more credited though since it’s a character they own the IP).

But let me present to you this hypothetical situation. Let’s say Joker wasn’t chosen to be the Character to be in smash and it was instead the P4 protag... that was made under the creative material of SE until it moved to SE. Under your logic it would be SE getting officially represented and Not SEGA... that isn’t how it works at all.

Also you’re conflating the creation of a Disney product with the licensing of a Disney product. It doesn’t matter how a KH franchise itself is created between Disney and SE since it has nothing to Do with smash and how Nintendo creates the KH product that is licensed by Disney (and in fact licensed to SE by Disney when new KH material is created for the franchise. Sora is so Bly called a SE representative because that’s what the fans think of him... even if SE actually used his name as some leakbait it’s not anything official since it’s private info that doesn’t mean anything officially since no official agreement was made to recognise Sora as a SE character, because that would mean SE would be the party that’s credited for his inclusion. Being mentioned by Name in non-public form doesn’t mean he’s an official SE character. You’re pulling out different meanings for the term of representation out of thin air... even though Nintendo and co have made it very clear what it means to be a representative, which is parties that get credited with those parties owning those characters official. It’s only a matter if you’re willing to look or not and not just listen to the voices of fans that don’t handle licensing, copyright or crediting of the needed parties.

The reason why Sora got included in the SE 7 is because SE know that one of the last things a fan would do is check the copyright of the characters in smash (or the copyrights of the character in general) since fans associate them more with the people that create the characters rather than those who own the character. They knew that if the list went public the fans would easily believe that each of these to be a SE character since the fans only see it from a perspective of who created the characters rather than who owns them... you’re proving that right now. And it helps that this list wasn’t meant for the public meaning they could easily get away with it since it can’t properly be traced back to SE due to no info that’s official or public ever came out about these characters and their smash inclusion... all that’s in front of us is “he said she said”... which is in no way any official information. Again you’re right... SE Know fans consider Sora to be a SE rep, but it doesn’t mean he actually is one officially.

I just don't see it. Because I don't believe representation is some hard-coded definition of how it works. This only sounds like dismissing the company that actually did all the hard work for no good reason. It's pretty inaccurate and actually rather hurtful to see artists dismissed as important just because they don't own the IP.

With that said, agree to disagree. Just wanted to clear up why I don't believe any of that should affect how people view representation. Because it sets a very bad precedent for a lack of respect towards content creators.

I definitely see your point of view of this, but unfortunately Developer and Publisher agreements in the industry don’t give a lot of rights to the Developer... even if they deserve them. A publisher can usually do what they like with a developer/creator creative material without the consent of the creator(s). I mean Metal gear is a good example of this as it shows the hold a publisher (Konami) has on creative material that was made by someone else (Kojima).

But I do agree with you on how bad it is.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I've actually really warmed up to Sora and Crono. If the SE rep isn't Geno I want it to be one of them.

Honestly, Sora would be neat. Crono isn't too bad, but I wouldn't mind a somewhat more well known character right now. Or at least relevant currently in one part of the world.

 

[TriggerX]

The law aside, Im sure the two companies have a great working relationship. Nintendo would probably have to have a discussion with both square and disney. Regardless of who actually owns the character in smash tho the series is represented not the company.

Fans are funny because they do create their own rules. As far as Sora goes, I doubt Nintendo cares who owns the right to the character. Its business, and if Nintendo wants Sora and the price is right, they will get that character.

 

[TheCJBrine]

As far as I'm aware, Disney owns Sora himself - however, they ask Square or Nomura before they do anything with him, so idk. I don't think it matters, but I think Disney would still get credit if he's added to Smash, which would be funny/somehow cool to see.

After that happens, people will commonly ask for Mickey Mouse, Pooh, Scrooge McDuck, and whoever else, and it'll be great.

 

[shinhed-echi]

So Dai's trailer finally popped up!

I'm really excited for the character even though I'm not sure I'll be able to play the game..


https://youtu.be/rGXbz54QT08
I was half hoping to see him representing a Dragon Quest moveset (from the games) but being an anime Character, it was reasonable that they'd go for the moves from his anime.

At least he uses one of the trademark Fire spells which is cool. And I Wonder if Giga Strash is what would come to be known as Giga Slash, from the more modern games.

 

[Deleted member]

So Dai's trailer finally popped up!

I'm really excited for the character even though I'm not sure I'll be able to play the game..


https://youtu.be/rGXbz54QT08
I was half hoping to see him representing a Dragon Quest moveset (from the games) but being an anime Character, it was reasonable that they'd go for the moves from his anime.

At least he uses one of the trademark Fire spells which is cool. And I Wonder if Giga Strash is what would come to be known as Giga Slash, from the more modern games.

It seems they are using the word "strash" for a few of his attacks including Avan Strash, which I think at least could've been translated to Avan slash. It just seems a weird localization.

 

[shinhed-echi]

It seems they are using the word "strash" for a few of his attacks including Avan Strash, which I think at least could've been translated to Avan slash. It just seems a weird localization.

Hmm I wonder if that's a weird european censorship thing like ninja used to be? Because he clearly Says "Slash" in plain Engrish.

 

[Deleted member]

I have a question for you all, if you had to pick characters to be in Smash from all of the franchises in the list, but it cant be any of the list characters themselves, who would you choose?

Mallow, Boshi, Croco, Jonathan Jones, and Booster

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Square Enix related question. Why the fecking heckles has the download for Kingdom Hearts 3 not started yet? It comes out tonight in America, Square. Get on it. Get. On. It. I want to play at 12:01am on the 29th.

This is not a game.

 

[EarlTamm]

Square Enix related question. Why the fecking heckles has the download for Kingdom Hearts 3 not started yet? It comes out tonight in America, Square. Get on it. Get. On. It. I want to play at 12:01am on the 29th.

This is not a game.

But it is a game.

 

[Deleted member]

Why the fecking heckles has the download for Kingdom Hearts 3 not started yet?

THEY ARE DELAYING IT AGAIN

 

[Tree Gelbman]

But it is a game.

Take your corny ass on somewhere. This is why we're getting Erdrick. Lol.

 

[Deleted member]

Kingdom Hearts 3 will now come alongside Mother 3

 

[Nazyrus]

Square Enix related question. Why the fecking heckles has the download for Kingdom Hearts 3 not started yet? It comes out tonight in America, Square. Get on it. Get. On. It. I want to play at 12:01am on the 29th.

This is not a game.

What are you talking about? I already started the preload yesterday morning. Not gonna get it in time anyway cause my internet speed is **** but oh well…

 

[Tree Gelbman]

What are you talking about? I already started the preload yesterday morning. Not gonna get it in time anyway cause my internet speed is **** but oh well…

Wait. Wut? My Playstation legit has not started the pre-load AT all. Is there a way to force it too?

 

[Teeb147]

Hmm I wonder if that's a weird european censorship thing like ninja used to be? Because he clearly Says "Slash" in plain Engrish.

Strash? Weird. Maybe it's to avoid possible copyright issues with dragon quest material from the games. I dunno tho, just a guess. I haven't read the dragon quest manga.

 

[Nekoo]

It's called Strash because it's where he wanna send his foes obviously.

 

[Ayumi Tachibana]

“Strash” is a made up word combining “strike” and “slash”.
Gigs Slash is from Dai’s Giga Strash.

 

[Masked Marshmallow]

I think this is a fitting thread to post this. I made a few Tifa sprites.