Spacing with neutral air

[Enzo]

Discuss

 

[V]

I love it because its multi hits. I prefer it for anti air over fair, especially vs charcters with good aerial mobility. I always try to refresh it tho since its a great kill move

 

[Nike.]

Earth to Shaya

 

[Orion*]

its a lot easier to punish than fair but the move is amazing when it hits

speaking of

whats the frame advantage on hit when you ff properly at low %s

 

[Mr-R]

mk's up-b ***** it

 

[clowsui]

i find that ppl forget about using float nair as a mixup

extremely effective as it catches people when they change their jump patterns around their nair

 

[Lord Chair]

its a lot easier to punish than fair but the move is amazing when it hits

speaking of

whats the frame advantage on hit when you ff properly at low %s

Enough to do everything worthwhile, except for charging a downsmash.

But when were charged dsmashes are lower percentages worthwhile anyway.

 

[LooftWaffles]

Nair is what makes me hate short characters.

It only connects against them on the way down.


Rising fhnair is TOO GOOD

 

[Player-3]

nair is only good for everything but spacing

its good at zoning tall characters, and punishing things, ledge hopped, and catching airdodges/landings lol

 

[Shaya]

@Earth to Shaya:
Neutral air is good at everything.
And Neutral Air is the best move in the game, so a topic about it must be OPEN.

I've been meaning to release some top secret information relating to it, but I was a bit lazy.

Either way, I played in a tournament yesterday where I'm pretty sure the only aerial I used was nair, and won.

Maybe I used uair if they were above me, or bair because it kills people.

But like, nothing else.
all nair.

Also nair has the same frame advantage on shield as fair.
Very well spaced nair outspaces MK's shuttle loop.

 

[Lord Chair]

I'll be that guy and say Shaya's modding skills are mediocre, leaving a thread like this open on basis of such arbitrary reasons.

 

[Shaya]

I'll be that guy and say Shaya's modding skills are mediocre, leaving a thread like this open on basis of such arbitrary reasons.

Thank you Lord Chair. However, we needed a place to discuss neutral air. And the first post of the topic does happen to have an appropriate picture.

However if it goes silly, of course I'm prone to lock it like the fist of the north star.

 

[Lord Chair]

Nair
Hit: 6, 15, 17 (behind), 19
End: 48
First Hit Shield Stun: 6
~Shield Hit Lag: 3
ADVANTAGE (SHFF): -4
First Hit Tipper Shield Stun: 9
~Shield Hit Lag: 8
ADVANTAGE: (SHFF): -6
First Hit Regular Stun: 25
~Hit Lag: 4
ADVANTAGE (SHFF): +14
First Hit Regular Tipper Stun: 34
~Hit Lag: 8
ADVANTAGE (SHFF): +19
Strong Hit Shield Stun: 10
~Shield Hit Lag: 4
ADVANTAGE: -27
ADVANTAGE (SHFF): -4
Strong Hit Tipper Shield Stun: 12
~Shield Hit Lag: 12
ADVANTAGE: -33
ADVANTAGE (SHFF): -8
SHFF Nair Lag: 8
First hit nair lag: 8
SH Nair Fast Falled Lag: 3

The latter frames of the nair hitbox have more knock back than the first. Nair is Marth's strongest killing move. Nair canceling gives absurd advantage and allows for grabbing, fsmashing (tipper depending on % and DI), dtilting, usmashing and utilting (sexier yet, at higher %, nair cancel > nair).

The move, when properly spaced (which is a fairly easy thing to do) is not shieldgrababble, even when it's a non-tipper, and is therefore absolutely splendid for baiting shieldgrabs.

The move is sex and should be spammed.

Better platform pressure than other aerials, because you can hit the first hit while rising, and quickly fastfall after the second hit hits.

Damage per hit, non-tipper and tipper respectively: 3/9, and 6/12.

No, hitting both hits still only counts as 1 refresh. Hitting one hit is (surprise) also 1 refresh.

A well-timed FF nair on shield has the same gimmick FF fair has: if you upB, your opponent cannot grab it even if spaced terribly. It's easier to do than with fair though, because you cover a larger amount of timespan (and you can choose whether to do it with the first or the second hit).

Tipper nair beats nado, but that's far from practical spam it.

With regards to Shaya's doctrine and months of brainwashing (and because I wanted a break from studying constitutional law).

 

[Shaya]

I must admit, tipper nair is not that practical against mk's tornado.

 

[Enzo]

It beats glide attack :DD

 

[Haze~]

imo usually the shorthpped NONfastfalled tipper nair is less predictable than the fastfalled, i guess delaying it like that makes it better cause its a very akward move to block so we will probably have the oponent trying to grab us (lol) and we get frameadvantage(loads of it) but ofc the fastfalled is just as good, just saying the nonfastfalled has been working better for me in most situations.

When you sh and after half a second NAIR is very unpredictable and pretty safe if the opponent is shielding, it also gives you better accuracy for that matter, naturally a fastfalled nair is harder to space most of the time cause the process is faster, but ofc both are used under mindgames in different situations

 

[Lord Chair]

It beats glide attack :DD

Nothing beats glide attack.

 

[VietGeek]

it does however clash

that's nice

i guess

oh hey guys is my roy any good this is his stats at 20/04



oh wait he sucks anyway doesn't he

oh well

obv

 

[C.J.]

It beats it the same way Falco's nair beats it. First hit clashes, 2nd hit hits MK.

 

[PEACE7]

Wow Nair is even more sexy than I thought.

 

[_Kadaj_]

Frame Adv on a Slow falling Tippered or un Tippered Nair would be very appreciated

 

[Sephy95]

Nair is one of my favored moves. Think I use it too much.....