Solar Powered: Ivysaur Q&A/General Discussion Thread

[-Fatality-]

I'm also going to Tipped Off 9, and will be playing a lot of Ivysaur for you guys. Also, welcome back to the PM scene, Reflex, hopefully I'll get to play you in bracket

 

[Meme]

Well finally got to play vs someone with Ivy, against a friend's yoshi and felt that Ivy isn't as bad Ias I thought it would be the aerial mobility is there as well the new lenght of her wavedash is noticeable, would've tried wavedash-back, jump, bair a la Ice climbers but well Yoshi's armored jump... still B-air can stop Yoshi's 2nd jump at a decent percentage.

 

[Pluplue]

I feel like Ivysaur underwent perfect and necessary changes. I think the reason people are upset with the nerfs are because he can't be played the same way as 2.6. Try to mix up your play styles as opposed mindlessly spamming forward b, back air, and forward air.

also c u guise at tipped off. its gon be phun

 

[KariteSama]

I actually really like the changes to Bair. I think it makes her off the ledge game so much better. The same goes for the aerial mobility. I feel like she has been turned into one of the best ledge-guarding characters in the game.

 

[-Fatality-]

Yet ANOTHER ivysaur will be at TO9, interesting, maybe we should all convene and have a pep rally, lol.
Lets show these southern bums who's the master race.

 

[Swann]

Had some trouble handing falcon, but I think it was mostly due to personal fatigue (tired johns) and me just generally having a huge block vs falcon in general. I really hate that he has guaranteed kill setups off of throws, while mostly being able to get out of Ivy's juggles despite being a quasi-fastfaller. His pressure strings are also very obnoxious.

I mean, my melee main is falco so it's not a huge deal, but I'd really like to figure out that character once and for all and not have to switch to what I consider a "cop-out" solution.

 

[Dng3]

Had some trouble handing falcon, but I think it was mostly due to personal fatigue (tired johns) and me just generally having a huge block vs falcon in general. I really hate that he has guaranteed kill setups off of throws, while mostly being able to get out of Ivy's juggles despite being a quasi-fastfaller. His pressure strings are also very obnoxious.
I mean, my melee main is falco so it's not a huge deal, but I'd really like to figure out that character once and for all and not have to switch to what I consider a "cop-out" solution.

Yea this is pretty much my main concern, how to deal with the pressure when an character gets in. Ivy gets comboed super easy, and without the speed of 3.0 Ivy I want to see how he's going to get around this since it's always been his huge weakness and now it feels more so.

 

[TreK]

Just completed my first P:M 3.0 smashfest, there's another one coming up on friday.

Remember when I said "the main factor is going to be am I having fun playing Ivysaur" ? The new Ivy didn't result in me losing more matches, but it did result in me getting bored. The 8 years of startup and cooldown on everything forces me to press a lot less buttons. And I like pressing buttons.
I'll just 2nd him until he's fun again I guess. Roy will take my main spot, for obvious fiery and buttonny reasons.

 

[Ogopogo]

Ivy seems way more sluggish all around. A little less fun.

Still a very capable contender, but less fun overall.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Fewer available/useful options tend to make for a less fun character for those used to them, but I'd say that's she obviously requires much more thought to succeed with, which is very important to us, as it's ideal for a competitive game.

 

[KariteSama]

I am personally a fan of the new Ivy. She combos so well now and she is incredible in the air. I am going to to continue to main her.

 

[-Fatality-]

I really like the new Ivysaur as well, the cool things about her general design are still there, and she's notably more well-rounded now. It's nice that Fair approaches no longer gets so easily CC'd anymore, and Razor Leaf is still pretty good. Two thumbs up!

 

[Chesstiger2612]

From what I have seen, the new Ivysaur is fine. The only things I would demand are:
-give Razor Leaf some use again (seems overnerfed)
-give neutral B some optical effect if the windbox hits when I saw that tutorial I didn't even recognise what happened

 

[QraQ]

Ivy is good, not great. I don't see her beating top tier with her new kit.

 

[Alteffor]

Alright, my initial post-patch frustrations are gone. I feel somewhat good about the new Ivy now, I think shes got some pretty strong moves but is largely lacking in term of CQC, which i think is what they were shooting for. Nair is really all I can do to an opponent wrecking my day and it's not exactly the safest attack. Bair seems very good now, Uair kills fairly early, even with the new ceilings.

I'm still trying to make use of that windbox but I just can't seem to get consistent results with it at all. Sometimes it does a lot, other times is seems like it does absolutely nothing. I want to work it into my repertoire but I have a hard time justifying it if I can't actually get it to be consistent

Another thing I'm having issues with: is slow seed bomb useful at all? It doesn't really cover your landing, it doesn't go high enough to follow anything up (that wouldn't be followed up another way better). The move seems like it takes sniper precision to land a hit and it doesn't do that much when you do. It used to be decent for finishing off an opponents on the top, you to cover your fall when your falling down, but I just can't find a use for new seed bomb.

Anyone been using these things to great effect and have some tips?

 

[Yeerk]

Alright, my initial post-patch frustrations are gone. I feel somewhat good about the new Ivy now, I think shes got some pretty strong moves but is largely lacking in term of CQC, which i think is what they were shooting for. Nair is really all I can do to an opponent wrecking my day and it's not exactly the safest attack. Bair seems very good now, Uair kills fairly early, even with the new ceilings.

I'm still trying to make use of that windbox but I just can't seem to get consistent results with it at all. Sometimes it does a lot, other times is seems like it does absolutely nothing. I want to work it into my repertoire but I have a hard time justifying it if I can't actually get it to be consistent

I feel like I could have written all of this. Tonight I'm planning to redownload 2.5 and compare the "then and now" Ivysaurs. I loved Ivysaur from the beginning in 2.5, but at the start here, like so many others, I was skeptical. My guess (it's not much of a guess) is that 2.6a+b spoiled the shizz out of me. But I've been hearing a lot of "this move was reverted back to it's 2.5 version", or something along those lines, so I'm going to give it a shot. I've been forsaking my precious dino-plant.

As for seed bomb, I feel like it may even cover descent better this time around, with it not going so high and falling closer to Ivy's fall speed than previously. I like et.

 

[Deleted member]

I know I may have jumped the gun earlier and made it seem like I despised the new Ivysaur, but that isn't the case. I just wanted to clarify this for anybody who thought otherwise. I actually think that, apart from the over-nerfing of Razor Leaf (sorry, but I still strongly believe this to be the case), she was very well-done in 3.0, so props to the PMBR. Just fix Razor Leaf next version and you'll receive my highly sought after golden seal of approval

 

[KariteSama]

Another thing I'm having issues with: is slow seed bomb useful at all? It doesn't really cover your landing, it doesn't go high enough to follow anything up (that wouldn't be followed up another way better). The move seems like it takes sniper precision to land a hit and it doesn't do that much when you do. It used to be decent for finishing off an opponents on the top, you to cover your fall when your falling down, but I just can't find a use for new seed bomb.

Anyone been using these things to great effect and have some tips?

I like using it for ledge-guarding. When they try to recover you can wall with seed bomb and when they get popped up hit them with an attack.

 

[Swann]

New fair and nair being positive advantage on block is godlike.

Reflex, where're you in bracket? Kevin said he's in WF having beaten pikachad and plup but he didn't give any more details... Looking for that Ivy, but PB&J's stream leaves a bit to be desired. Hope your matches are recorded.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

F-Air and N-Air don't have positive advantage on block. Perfect timing + L-Cancel is -2, I believe, which allows us to Jab to avoid Grab and is very good when compared with the rest of the game as a whole, but not outright positive.

As for my tournament stuff, I'm in Winners Finals, ready to get bopped by Kevin tomorrow. I beat Hungrybox in Winners Semis, but otherwise has an easy bracket, it seems. 41 people, lots of good players. 100% Ivysaur as it is.

 

[Ogopogo]

Any matches of you uploaded, Reflex?

 

[Swann]

Get 'im, Reflex!

 

[Dng3]

I cant wait to see your matches =). Also, its very true what you guys said before, it is definitely more rewarding performing well with the new Ivy.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I have a couple matches of myself recorded. I was gonna put everything I had up last night, but I forgot my computer charger at the venue, so I couldn't really do that yesterday (though the internet at the area I stayed at last night was -way- better than what I have at home). I'll try to get stuff up soon, though.

 

[SheldonH44]

Solid work reflex. 3.0 Ivy is obviously still viable

 

[Yeerk]

I really expected Reflex to get a windbox kill for that 4-stock. It was set up so perfectly game 3.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I was nervous. Nervous, nervous, nervous.

Fun stuff.

 

[Ogopogo]

Kind of a dumb question... but to insta-snap to ledge and insta-jump after vine whipping, do you just mash up?

 

[Swann]

Wolf is buuuuuuull**** bull**** bull****... **** that character's easymode autocombo setups, free as **** followups, and unpunishable shield shenanigans.

At least Ivy has bair for when he's offstage, geezus

Johns all day I hate that character

 

[Alteffor]

Reflex, that was awesome man. I must admit, you put my doubts about new Ivy in their place. I'm definitely gonna keep rocking some Ivysaur (though yoshi is too fun to not second at least).

Also, I've been working on a custom ivy texture since just before 3.0 dropped, I sorta lost motivation to finish it once 3.0 came out, but I ended up finishing it after watching Ivy own today. If anyone wants to check it out here it is:
[collapse=Dark Green Ivy]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4m9yvpc5cq6lvrb/DarkGreenIvy.zip
[/collapse]

Its the first texture I've made I feel comfortable enough with to actually let other people use so I hope you like it. I also welcome constructive criticism.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Kind of a dumb question... but to insta-snap to ledge and insta-jump after vine whipping, do you just mash up?

You snap to the ledge by pressing A. You're forced to ledge jump if another character is already on the ledge when you snap to the ledge.

Also, I'm glad the stuff at TO9 went over well. I should have matches from the event up in the next couple days.

 

[Alteffor]

Possible new tech? Full hop > Razor Leaf at jump apex > Fast fall immediately

The new startup on the side-b makes it not come out until around the short hop height. I found it really useful playing the Samus matchup to avoid charged shot and quickly go in for pressure afterwards. Probably useful against any big move you want to dodge and punish, and works from a pretty good distance.

 

[Meme]

Anyone having trouble sometimes with distinguishing when Solar Beam is fully charged?

Because even with the flare/light on the bulb there's times when I think I still have 1% charge left to shoot Solar Beam but it's already charged and viceversa.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Not since 2.5. *shrugs*

 

[Serris]

I hate fighting Mewtwo. That is all.

 

[ss118]

Ivy wrecks mewtwo what lol

Mewtwo in general is pretty average and fails against hitboxes

 

[Swann]

I've also had basically no trouble with M2

 

[Ogopogo]

Is letting go of the b-button and then re-pressing it every 2% still a viable tactic?

(maybe I'm not explaining this very well, but if you've done it you know what I mean)

 

[TheReflexWonder]

The difference has been made smaller in 3.0 (not for balance purposes; it was unintentionally changed as a result of changing the other properties of Neutral-B).

I feel like the difference between doing it and not doing it is now so small that I don't even bother with it, but it's still technically an improvement over just holding the button, however slight.

 

[JOE!]

Just saying, but I think that a slower seed bomb is actually a *buff*.

The actual fire animation wasn't slowed, so you can actually have more bombs on-screen at a time. Food for thought.