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Nintendude

Smash Hero
Joined
Feb 23, 2006
Messages
5,024
Location
San Francisco
stealth rocks broke the game? lol?

All you need is a spinner or a ghost type to counter. I think stealth rocks made it more competitive if anything.
I mean I'm still a pretty casual player but I hate how it nerfed certain types and destroyed Pokemon like Articuno who have a double weakness to rock. I also don't like how the metagame seems to revolve around stealth rock, spinning, and spin-blocking. It seems to limit team creativity a bit.

Stealth rocks would be better imo if they were just a better version of spikes (not influenced by types) and had a worse distribution. The number of Pokemon that can use stealth rock is pretty absurd.
 

The Star King

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 6, 2007
Messages
9,681
You don't really need a spinner or spin-blocker to be successful. Depends on the team. Though SR itself is seen somewhere on almost every team, that is true.
 

AtotheZ

Smash Lord
Joined
May 3, 2008
Messages
1,178
Location
Woodhaven, MI
A lot of pokemon hindered by stealth rocks weren't really that good in the first place, stealth rocks just kind of set their nulled competitive usage in stone (heh)

mostly because ice types and fire types awful defensively
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
Except it also gets full power in 1 turn, is totally unavoidable by all types(rock,steel and ground types should be immune) and it's ridiculously common. Compare to spikes which is almost exactly the opposite.
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
Because flying pokemon are immune to spikes. There is nothing that can avoid the stones.
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
Actually that is a valid point. Only rock types should be immune, but at least someone. Or maybe rock types would actually gain a bit of defense when they are around. Anything to not make a goddamn game changing move all the time.
 

AtotheZ

Smash Lord
Joined
May 3, 2008
Messages
1,178
Location
Woodhaven, MI
If stealth rocks could only be learned by those who learn it through level up, I think that would be p cool

@Yobolight, genwunner=gen one(er), someone who regards the first gen of pokemon to be the greatest of all time
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
I used to be a genwunner. Now I realize what a **** I was. The Pokemon design has been relatively at the same level imo. They all have their bad and amazing ones.
 

Sedda

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 26, 2013
Messages
2,393
Location
Luigi sucks
The whole thing with stealth rocks limiting your team is the same as the high tiers in Melee. They just don't make these games to be played competitively. Nintendo gives zero ****s about balancing beyond what's on the surface, but that has spawned some really creative stuff by the Pokemon and Smash communities
 

asianaussie

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 14, 2008
Messages
9,337
Location
Sayonara Memories
pokemon is a game of prediction, forcing switches, and attrition (and your dragon attempts to sweep at some point). any disadvantage on switching (you know, THE HALF OF THE GAME THAT ISN'T ATTACKING) is incredibly powerful, and hazards are the most obvious example of this.

stealth rock is preposterously broken and anyone saying they are easy to spin away clearly has not played very much pokemon past 4th gen - their very existence makes so many pokemon just plain bad, and even if you don't know much about the pokemon metagame, the fact that it is one EVERY DAMN TEAM should say something

while it is not as broken as some things, (cough weather cough) it is clearly a tremendous asset to any type of team, so much so that certain pokemon are defined by their ability to spin or block rocks (come on, who would use xatu if it didn't have bounce? excadrill is amazing in ubers mostly because he spins for ho-oh/lugia's sake more than anything else)

also, while articuno does boast stab ice beam/hurricane, ice is such an atrocious typing that even without stealth rocks, i just dont see it doing well
 

clubbadubba

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Messages
4,086
are we saying articuno is not good at competitive pokemon? damn articuno was my man back in the day. Was it at least good in gen 1?
 

asianaussie

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 14, 2008
Messages
9,337
Location
Sayonara Memories
ice probably still sucked and alakazam/chansey/zapdos likely did a better job at being wololol high special

i can see stab blizzard being ridiculous if you can get it off
 

asianaussie

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 14, 2008
Messages
9,337
Location
Sayonara Memories
i dont play it competitively, but i used to have a fun little deck a few years ago, which i since sold (since the community was ****)

the game has the worst good-to-bad card ratio of any card game, even pokemon, which has a disgustingly high number of nigh-unplayable cards (even in sealed formats) - this makes all the good cards stupid expensive

you can probs get back in for less than $100 on a semi-competitive budget deck, then slowly build up your cardpool and extra deck (your fusions and many of your 'boss monsters' are in here) over a year or so, but idk, the yugioh community worldwide seems to consistently be the worst of any cardgame
 

AtotheZ

Smash Lord
Joined
May 3, 2008
Messages
1,178
Location
Woodhaven, MI
Articuno was OK back in the day, not a dominating force but not particularly bad, mostly because Blizzard had 90% accuracy in gen 1.

In doubles I faced an interesting team built around Articuno that worked pretty well, where he was choice scarf and boasted blizzard, ice beam, hurricane, and hidden power fire. He had Politoed and Abomasnow on the team to switch in for deadly perfect accuracy hurricanes or blizzards, while having the team function pretty well without him. In doubles you usually don't have to worry about sneaky stones either, especially if it's the VGC format where you pick 4 out of your 6 pokemon, making it pretty useless to waste a turn on.
 

KeroKeroppi

Smash Champion
Joined
Sep 1, 2011
Messages
2,060
Location
New York
Morino, if you're thinking about getting into competitive yugioh, don't let what aa said discourage you. There's a lot of falsity behind that post, no offense aa. :laugh: I played yugioh competitively until last summer and still somewhat keep up with it. A lot of my good friends still play.

It is true that the good-to-bad card ratio is absurd lol. But if you're expecting to build a deck from cards you get in packs you're out of your mind. I didn't buy my first booster pack until two years after i started playing lol.

Acquiring the cards to make a deck is extremely easy. If you walk into a decent sized local with cash you could easily have a deck by the time you leave.

Main decks are generally cheap. There aren't a lot of "stupid" expensive cards for any given deck, there might be like 1 or 2 that you need to complete your extra deck. However, Konami continues to reprint cards so you can pick up like a third of the cards in your extra deck for virtually nothing.

Yeah, a top tier main decks could cost you like 150 bucks to complete. But that's really unlikely and might only be like one deck in a format. Like i said, main decks are generally pretty cheap.

There are top tier main decks (Rabbit & Darkworld) that you could make for like 20 dollars lol.

Evilswarms just came out and the most expensive card is 16$. It's a tier one deck.

Getting in to yugioh isn't very expensive. What's expensive is keeping up with the metagame. New decks and cards are made a LOT. BUT there are decks that you could play competitively for a really long time to avoid spending a lot of money. Rabbit and Darkworld are both over a year and a half old and are still top tier decks.

The game's really fun and the community is great. If you have the time and locals to go to, i highly suggest playing.
 

SheerMadness

Smash Master
Joined
Aug 18, 2005
Messages
4,781
If you're gonna play anything play the ORIGINAL tcg Magic: The Gathering.

I played that game 24/7 back in middle school. I stopped in high school cause I was "too cool" for it. But If I had more time and money I'd start playing it again.

Nothing beats the original.
 

Tom Bombadil

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 12, 2012
Messages
305
Location
Oregon
Magic is the best game.

It's built so well that casual decks are really fun to play but complex enough that you can have a metagame and high level tournaments. Drafting is great too because then deckbuilding skill overcomes the amount of money you are willing to spend on a constructed deck. The new stuff coming out is starting to get a little ridiculous though. Doing a weekend tourny with your casual friends while everyone slowly changed their deck to counter everyone else's... Those where the days.

Then again, I've never played yugioh so I can't judge
 

SheerMadness

Smash Master
Joined
Aug 18, 2005
Messages
4,781
All other TCG's are based on MTG's success in some way. It paved the way for everything else.

Just don't tell any chicks you date that you play a TCG. At least until it gets serious. Women are immature and it can be a deal breaker.
 

Sangoku

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 25, 2010
Messages
3,931
Location
Geneva, Switzerland
Given the fact I'm playing at 8 against scrubs when there's really nobody to play, I guess anything lower could be fine...

And given the fact I've played 26 with tacos, nothing can scare me anymore.
 

asianaussie

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 14, 2008
Messages
9,337
Location
Sayonara Memories
wholeheartedly agree with sheer, if you have time to kill and only one card game's worth of money, go straight for mtg and don't look back

Yeah, a top tier main decks could cost you like 150 bucks to complete. But that's really unlikely and might only be like one deck in a format. Like i said, main decks are generally pretty cheap.
afaik fire fists and mermails cost preposterous amounts of money not long ago, bear going for like $50 a pop and abyssmegalo like $80ish? and dont even talk about spellbooks...it doesn't seem restricted to just one deck a format at all, tbh

extra decks still probably cost quite a bit as well
 

mixa

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Jun 6, 2012
Messages
2,005
Location
Isle of ゆぅ
Given the fact I'm playing at 8 against scrubs when there's really nobody to play, I guess anything lower could be fine...

And given the fact I've played 26 with tacos, nothing can scare me anymore.
I get 11 frames on Galaxy, and sometimes I can't even get in.
Though we should def P2P to see how bad it is.
 

KeroKeroppi

Smash Champion
Joined
Sep 1, 2011
Messages
2,060
Location
New York
afaik fire fists and mermails cost preposterous amounts of money not long ago, bear going for like $50 a pop and abyssmegalo like $80ish? and dont even talk about spellbooks...it doesn't seem restricted to just one deck a format at all, tbh

extra decks still probably cost quite a bit as well
Lol yeah this is very true. There will be some main deck cards that do cost a **** ton of money. But you might need like 2 or 3 expensive playsets for a deck tops. That's where the bulk of the cash you put into the deck will go though. The majority of the cards in a main deck are pretty cheap.
 

Cobrevolution

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 8, 2012
Messages
3,178
Location
nj
if anyone knows how to do music analysis with roman numerals, get at me. i got a mozart piece that's confusing the **** outta me.
 

Cobrevolution

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 8, 2012
Messages
3,178
Location
nj
mozart's eine kleine nachtmuzik. the first movement, allegro. i'm going through it and finding an absurd number of ii, vi and vii* chords and not enough I and V's. it's in G, sonata allegro form, moves into Em around measure 56 without introducing an Em chord, then moves to i believe C, then Gm, then back to G.

what i have trouble with is actually identifying what the chords are. i know if there's a g sustained through the bass then it's probably just a I chord throughout, but then there will be a bunch of other notes down there and i don't know how many chords are in the measure. my professor told us the aforementioned info about the key stuff and that in the development section there's primarily one chord per measure. my main concern would be having something like 4 chords in one measure and it turns out it's only two and i couldn't see why :/
 
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