Smash Ultimate Leak Discussion Thread

[Nekoo]

Here's a question I have about "Music Theory":
If everyone believes Ken is in the game, then how can any of those people believe in "Music Theory"? A Street Fighter song was one of the first songs added to the blog. That together with the fact that Incineroar seems so likely (no matter how much I would prefer almost any other Pokemon), I would say "Music Theory" is dead.

Echoes doesn't count and never did.
And I'm still holding back on the Music theory... I'm going to say that, it will SHAKILY stand if Incineroar is next newcomer announced.

 

[Momotsuki]

I think this music track has taken a massive blow to the Music Theory, nearly outright killing it, and as Mr. Nintendo said, a minor, but not killing blow to the box theory. I will say though, this track is remixed from RSE/ORAS rather than a Generation 7 entry. So there's that.

 

[Fenriraga]

Here's a question I have about "Music Theory":
If everyone believes Ken is in the game, then how can any of those people believe in "Music Theory"? A Street Fighter song was one of the first songs added to the blog. That together with the fact that Incineroar seems so likely (no matter how much I would prefer almost any other Pokemon), I would say "Music Theory" is dead.

The counter argument is that Echoes don't fall under the music theory, since Dark Samus and Daisy were already confirmed. Same would apply to Ken, of course.

Which isn't untrue, but I still think it's a weak point.

 

[CosmicQuark]

Everything after E3 was wrong.
People kept giving him excuses but his August Direct prediction was just wrong. And he deleted posts so they couldn't be used against him.

I agree, though technically some of it was "correct"--it's just the claims he made were vague (modes shown off), obvious (tournament mode), or dead wrong (how to unlock characters). Not defending him (in fact, I was criticized for pointing out he got things wrong), but try to give as much credit as possible even if I don't think it's completely earned. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

[T3Z3R1]

I honestly think the situation Verge is in right now, in terms of his leaking, has likely forced to him to mature a great deal when it comes to this stuff. He's being extremely careful, and for good reason; there are quite a few people hoping for him to slip up and lynch him.

Doesn't mean that he have to extra careful, he got mobs growing which is filled with hatred for his leaks even they were correct. But, about new music and music theory, which didn't make ****ing sense and I thought that it was pointless theory. At this point, some people who thought music theory being died = Verge is wrong will likely having their hope raising for wanted characters to only having it crushed again after surprise character reveal or one of characters implicated in Verge's leaks.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

Everyone's saying the Music theory is dead.

And me I'm just smh at why Isabelle's song was pushed to let Pikmin and why Simon/DK got their songs right next to each others. Or Ridley/Splatoon getting their neither E3/Right after E3.


I'm genuinely starting to think that the Music Theory was true until people datamine the Website showing the missing blog updates

Nintendo is trying to kill the leads- call me crazy but I'm willing to bet that we will get no newcomers from the already released series Exception Being Geno.

Eh I think it's just some newcomers had music posts saved for them when it was convenient/necessary and some don't, and that's all there is to it.

 

[WallyPalmer]

I think this music track has taken a massive blow to the Music Theory, nearly outright killing it, and as Mr. Nintendo said, a minor, but not killing blow to the box theory. I will say though, this track is remixed from RSE/ORAS rather than a Generation 7 entry. So there's that.

The Zelda track was from BOTW rather than a game with a Skull Kid. The Kirby track was from a game without Waddle Dee. I don't think we should resort to this logic.

 

[Exalt4747]

I can understand Verge getting mad.

GameFaqs probably already harasses him a lot based on what he's said before, and now they're harassing him over what he may see as a silly fan-theory.

Wait, did he post again?

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Also, Verg does seem to be unravelling a bit on Smashboards and is being overall very defensive.

This topic for example
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/77040303

Some are comparing it to loz, although I don't really have much opinion on the matter

Guys, Enough! Leave Verg alone
He seems very confident about Incineroar being in, and I still trust him...
We don't even know if the music theory was even legit in the first place...

 

[Momotsuki]

The Zelda track was from BOTW rather than a game with a Skull Kid. The Kirby track was from a game without Waddle Dee. I don't think we should resort to this logic.

Oh, I totally agree with you. I just thought it was worth mentioning.

 

[Luigi The President]

Echoes doesn't count and never did.
And I'm still holding back on the Music theory... I'm going to say that, it will SHAKILY stand if Incineroar is next newcomer announced.

Lol it won't stand at all if Incineroar's the next announced

 

[Polan]

Also, Verg does seem to be unravelling a bit on Smashboards and is being overall very defensive.

This topic for example
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/77040303

Some are comparing it to loz, although I don't really have much opinion on the matter

gamefaq users are absolutely insufferable, that's like the only correct response to their bull****.

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

So either Verg was wrong all along and we will look like FOOLS for trusting him, or he is still right and for believing theories over rumors we will look like FOOLS.

 

[Nekoo]

Oh yeah.

Please guys. The music theory being dead is great and all...but still, don't raise your expectations too much.

We had that discussion before- if people raise it too much because a fan theory is wrong, it will backfire badly.


Music theory, box theory or whatever. We're not getting suddenly tons of newcomers.
3 are probably a lock, 5 is I think the MAXIMUM

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Music Theory is dead, Incineroar is still possible.


...And so by extension is the box theory. Yeah, I said it, and what?

 

[Momotsuki]

If I was in Vergeben's shoes on GameFAQs right now I'd have much harsher things to say than he does, to be honest. I look at that and am impressed by how well he keeps it together, because I couldn't remain that collected.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

So either Verg was wrong all along and we will look like FOOLS for trusting him, or he is still right and for believing theories over rumors we will all look like FOOLS.

GameFAQs look like fools for attacking Verg over a dead theory.

 

[Untouch]

There's 3 outcomes here..

1. Vergeben is still right, Incineroar is released and gets another music entry.
2. Music theory is right, Incineroar isn't in the game at launch, Vergeben's sources were wrong.
3. Both are right, Incineroar is announced and never gets a music post, perhaps the main theme to the spirits mode is posted instead?

 

[Radical Bones]

People implying that the Smash team posted a Pokemon track to intentionally bust the music theory because 'they knew we were on to them' sound so ****ing crazy right now.

 

[KingofKoopas]

I don't get it, Music Theory had nothing to do with Vergeben. Why are people getting on his case?

 

[Luigi The President]

If I were in Verge's shoes then I'd just hop off of GameFAQ's and stick to r/smashbros.

 

[Chrono.]

People implying that the Smash team posted a Pokemon track to intentionally bust the music theory because 'they knew we were on to them' sound so ****ing crazy right now.

Thats just another day in the Smash bubble

 

[Jigglymaster]

People discrediting Verge entirely based on an unconfirmed fan made theory clearly don't know the textbook definition of the word "theory".

I don't really see anyone here discrediting him (at least not here on Smashboards). I've believed in him myself and I still do. While it's silly to think that he'll be wrong, since he hasn't yet, it's also silly to think he'll be correct no matter what. I don't know why its such a hard thing to understand neither the theory or vergeben have been debunked yet. This isn't enough to debunk either.

You don't just give up and turn on your belly the moment things don't go your way. That's not how this works.

 

[KingofKoopas]

GameFAQs look like fools for attacking Verg over a dead theory.

gamefaqs has always been a cesspool though so its to be expected

 

[PLATINUM7]

People implying that the Smash team posted a Pokemon track to intentionally bust the music theory because 'they knew we were on to them' sound so ****ing crazy right now.

But what if they know we know they know?

 

[Untouch]

I don't get it, Music Theory had nothing to do with Vergeben. Why are people getting on his case?

If the music theory is right it means we aren't getting a pokemon newcomer, he's been pretty adamant that Incineroar is in.
People (it's just gamefaqs here, they have a raging hateboner hardon for him and have for a while), think this debunks it even though weeks ago they were saying the music theory is false.

 

[KingofKoopas]

If I were in Verge's shoes then I'd just hop off of GameFAQ's and stick to r/smashbros.

I still cant figure out why anyone would post there to begin with.

 

[Deleted member]

...Honestly, I'd be more interested if Verge knows anything about Spirits and other modes. Characters are cool and all, but what am I gonna use them in in the game?

Has he said anything about that?

 

[Exalt4747]

So either Verg was wrong all along and we will look like FOOLS for trusting him, or he is still right and for believing theories over rumors we will look like FOOLS.

I wouldn't say we were "foolish" if he ends up wrong.

 

[Luigi The President]

I still cant figure out why anyone would post there to begin with.

Because they live to suffer, if you mean GameFAQ's.

 

[Wyoming]

So either Verg was wrong all along and we will look like FOOLS for trusting him, or he is still right and for believing theories over rumors we will look like FOOLS.

Galaxy brain: Inexplicably, despite everything going for them, they are both wrong.

 

[T3Z3R1]

Well I can honestly say is that in regard to music theory after Dark Samus:

That leaves two theories remaining: Box Theory and Blog Theory.

Box Theory needs to be killed ASAP, because I find it so stupid since it mentions that we would get final 2 newcomers.

as for Blog Theory, I have nothing to say about it.

 

[CannonStreak]

Anti-theory theory?

I like it.

Dude's frustrated with the community and I understand. He already didn't like us, but he's been the one reliable leaker of this cycle and all he gets is hate for it.

I don't think this means anything really.

I mean, GameFAQs was already toxic, but...Wow...

Also, how Vergeben using tism as in autism, as I think he is implying? That's a big low, even for him.

I mean, they are doing this over a theory which may still be true or may not be true at all. Like, come on!

 

[Shadowwolflink]

Echoes doesn't count and never did.
And I'm still holding back on the Music theory... I'm going to say that, it will SHAKILY stand if Incineroar is next newcomer announced.

Nah, that totally sounds like a bull**** "b-but I want my theory to be real!" explanation. Daisy is the only one that I could see being an argument in favor of echoes not counting. Dark Samus didn't have a corresponding song because it went a long with Ridley instead, who was the first Metroid rep announced and "Gear Up For..." was the next song added after "Bloody Tears/Monster Dance" and "Gangplank Galleon".

 

[DuckMeat]

I don't think Gematsu said Chrom was planned. They said Chrom was playable.

After the game was released, Sakurai said that Chrom was planned but a unique moveset made him feel kind of lackluster so he went back to the drawing board and chose Robin instead.


Also, I watched Alax's video on the whole blog theory, I've read the document but I'm still under the impression that blog theory rests on the assumption that characters are revealed all the way until the end (2.9 average, so 6 characters left as there are also veteran blog posts to cover still) . However, I had two people say that wasn't the case yesterday. So what's the deal-o? Does blog theory just assume they will reveal characters up until the release date or not?

G'day - spreadsheet guy here. If I understand what you're asking, you want to know if the 2.9 average characters-per-week will be assumed to keep up up to release. My answer to that is yes - sabi can go into the specifics on how the Blog's patterns have kept up consistently up until now, and I see absolutely no reason for the blog to trip up in the last weeks before release - it just doesn't seem like a marketing decision even Nintendo wouldn't reasonably make. Ultimate's main selling point is the sheer amount of content it's packing, with the Blog being one of the key communicators of that - having the whole thing go into radio silence for the last week of December would hypothetically grind that business strategy to a halt.

On the topic of broken street dates, I honestly think they won't make a dent in the Blog's schedule - like i said earlier, the Blog is an advertising campaign first and should be view as such. Why would any company in the right mind decide to halt their advertising in response to a few leakers or people getting the game early? It doesn't make sense in my eyes - broken street dates are a low level incident that haven't and won't have a butterfly effect that kills the Blog a week before release.

Finally, if there are dedicated Blog posts to the hidden mode's content (i.e. boss of the day) i wouldn't factor them in as something that would disturb the current trends. If anything, I'd put them on the same priority as items, assists, and pokéball pokémon - they fill in the gaps not filled by characters or music. Even if they did, I wouldn't be able to predict the effect they'd have at this stage - nobody knows how many bosses we'll be getting or if the new mode will even feature bosses enough to warrant separate blog posts about them. I agree that they could be the dark horse that beats blog theory into pulp, but I'm willing to double down on that for the time being.

Does that answer your questions? You can DM me @DuckMeat13 if you have more.

 

[KingofKoopas]

Because they live to suffer, if you mean GameFAQ's.

couldnt help myself

 

[Deleted member]

If music theory holds, then the only plausible newcomers left are Elma and or are from unrepped franchises.

And that seems mighty sketch, to me.

To be fair, it wouldn't be that weird if Box Theory is right and we just got the characters wrong. Elma and Medusa, maybe? Or maybe Shadow as the Echo? I don't think Sonic was on the visible side of the box render...

 

[PushDustIn]

If you opened your Smashboards account to find 20~50 private messages of people pestering you for info, alongside 100+ mentions or quotes of your post of people begging you to answer your questions?


Yeah, you'd get a bit mental too.

Yeah, I don't blame him at all. After I made some tweets about the box theory GameFaqs users made several threads about me calling me some pretty bad stuff and I snapped back at some people. He obviously gets a lot more hate than I do, so I commend him for his patience.

 

[Nekoo]

Nah, that totally sounds like a bull**** "b-but I want my theory to be real!" explanation

Not to be an ass but that's how theory work by applying scientific method y'know?
The music theory is dead, but people using this to fit their theory is what make it...a theory.

 

[Luigi The President]

couldnt help myself

You squeak feel it too?

To be fair, it wouldn't be that weird if Box Theory is right and we just got the characters wrong. Elma and Medusa, maybe? Or maybe Shadow as the Echo? I don't think Sonic was on the visible side of the box render...

I don't think you understand just how damn weird would be