Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[LetterO]

I feel like geno is very unlikey at this point look at how stingy THEY are with Cloud and final fantasy 7. Do you really think squares cares about Geno to put him Smash over Another Final fanasty rep Sora or A Dragon quest Rep.

Isn't the reason that FF7 has limited music and no Spirits due to copyright issues?

 

[WaxPython]

I feel like geno is very unlikey at this point look at how stingy THEY are with Cloud and final fantasy 7. Do you really think squares cares about Geno to put him Smash over Another Final fanasty rep Sora or A Dragon quest Rep.

Yeah good point tbh. I have no idea why Square just doesn't sell the rights of Geno to Nintendo, it's not like they're doing anything with him.

 

[KMDP]

As far as I know, most if not all fighting games don't use dedicated servers. It's not efficient in 1v1 scenarios because both parties would have to communicate through the server rather than send packets to each other directly.

If I had to hazard a guess, online connections are bad because everyone is playing through a wireless connection because Nintendo just really loves the idea of you having to buy an adapter.

It would've been really nice if there was at least an Ethernet Port in the Switch dock, but alas, Nintendo aren't that forward thinking.
---
Also, it kinda bugs me that, in the Japanese version of the Game, all the actors (except the characters like Donkey Kong) are credited in the Voice section of the Sound Test, but the English version doesn't do that.

This is a thing even though the Super Smash Bros. Install/Game Card contains all versions of the game.

By the way, I recommend people give Charizard Voice 6 a listen, it's a pretty funny voice clip.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

When it comes to the topic of Geno I'm more interested in the question if Nintendo is even aware of his popularity.

As we know Nintendo were the ones who decided the five DLC characters. And while I'm sure Sakurai is well aware of characters like Geno who have been requested since forever, I'm unsure if obscure characters like Geno are even in Nintendo's radar. I wonder if they look at the ballot or if they simply choose what they believe to be hugely popular.

 

[Idon]

Isn't the reason that FF7 has limited music and no Spirits due to copyright issues?

That'll explain the songs, but not the total lack of spirits of him or spirits possessing him.

 

[perfectchaos83]

DQ rep: I still think the complete lack of worldwide recognition makes them very much less likely. Sure it's historic but Joker shows me they want a worldwide pick-Erdrick and Luminary just don't fit that. Slime just barely makes KINDA sense for that but I don't feel he's necessarily likely either. However, it's still pretty damn likely despite all this-more likely than the other Squenix reps, but still has a lot against it-I still think the licensing is a pretty valid point when one factors in how Squenix is reportedly being quite uncooperative. However your analysis makes a ton of sense to me-it's hugeness in Japan is a very big factor.

I do think DQ's apparent lack of popularity worldwide is over exaggerated. The series does well enough in the west to still sell (almost) a million units for some titles. It's by no means a gangbuster like final fantasy, but it can hold it's own in the market.

 

[Shroob]

When it comes to the topic of Geno I'm more interested in the question if Nintendo is even aware of his popularity.

As we know Nintendo were the ones who decided the five DLC characters. And while I'm sure Sakurai is well aware of characters like Geno who have been requested since forever, I'm unsure if obscure characters like Geno are even in Nintendo's radar. I wonder if they look at the ballot or if they simply choose what they believe to be hugely popular.

If Bkupa's source is to be believed about K.Rool, until the ballot, Nintendo didn't even know K.Rool still had a fanbase.

 

[Deleted member]

Shulk is actually good now.

They changed the properties of the Monado Arts though, which is a blessing and a curse. They feel stronger, but forms like Shield, Speed, and Jump last shorter which is unfortunate.

Chrom is also a sleeper good character. He'll be mid-high tier, mark my words.

Seems like they gave Shulk the Monado III too so he's definitely top tier

So i found this huge glitch with shulk, i think it happened when my smash art ran out during fox's final smash, it like increased EVERY STAT
Landing lag, damage, hitstun, jump height, etc.
ITS SUPER CRAZY LIKE WHAT#SuperSmashBrothersUltimate pic.twitter.com/5HrKmQG8Fd

— PeteLavaDigger! (@PeteLavaDigger) December 8, 2018

 

[PlasmaDam]

Square Enix doesn't care about Geno he is like their ******* child that they abandonded he has no official merch it would be a miracle if he got in over Sora or another ff rep or a Dragon quest rep unless Nintendo pays them

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

If Bkupa's source is to be believed about K.Rool, until the ballot, Nintendo didn't even know K.Rool still had a fanbase.

See thing is that would explain Joker.

That is a WILD pick and not one I expected at all. But a character like Joker is absolutely on Nintendo's radar. Bandanna Waddledee? Geno? Not so much

 

[Flyboy]

So, how many people are actually playing, as opposed to just talking about what characters might come next? I noticed a weird pattern that I also get into: We get hyped for a new game. Characters are announced and we're so excited. But as soon as the game is released, we basically forget about how awesome their inclusion is, and start longing for new ones. I wonder why we do that.

So, favorite characters so far? Also, who do you think the most improved character from SM4SH to Ultimate is?

I'm absolutely loving Incineroar and Inkling, and I'm loving the Belmont boys' mixups. I finally unlocked my boy ROB and he just plays like he did in Smash 4 except smoother and that's all I wanted.

Little Mac is fun too. Everyone just feels good in this game.

 

[WaxPython]

It would've been really nice if there was at least an Ethernet Port in the Switch dock, but alas, Nintendo aren't that forward thinking.

I'm sure they at least thought about it but they decided in most games it's a luxury so they made it into an accessory for some $$$.

Unfortunately in a fighting game where even the slightest amount of input lag is dreadful consequently putting the majority of players on a wireless connection is simply awful. Especially for gamers in islands or low pop regions who need to connect with people over a larger distance.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

When it comes to the topic of Geno I'm more interested in the question if Nintendo is even aware of his popularity.

As we know Nintendo were the ones who decided the five DLC characters. And while I'm sure Sakurai is well aware of characters like Geno who have been requested since forever, I'm unsure if obscure characters like Geno are even in Nintendo's radar. I wonder if they look at the ballot or if they simply choose what they believe to be hugely popular.

Nintendo did post this earlier, so I'm sure they're aware of the demand for Geno:
https://mobile.twitter.com/NintendoAmerica/status/995680065206784000
However, they probably don't care enough about him to buy his rights from Square Enix or get their permission to include him as a playable fighter. The demand for Sora right now is at an all-time high, though. If any Square Enix character is getting in, it's either him or Slime. Although, he is my number one most-wanted newcomer now, so maybe I'm just being biased.

 

[Deleted member]

If Bkupa's source is to be believed about K.Rool, until the ballot, Nintendo didn't even know K.Rool still had a fanbase.

We don't need his sources when Sakurai stated that himself.

 

[Shroob]

We don't need his sources when Sakurai stated that himself.

I'm moreso talking how Nintendo themselves flat out forbid Retro from using him for three games since they thought he wasn't iconic/relevant.

 

[WaxPython]

I'm moreso talking how Nintendo themselves flat out forbid Retro from using him for three games since they thought he wasn't iconic/relevant.

Did Nintendo really do that? I do not understand their logic sometimes.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm moreso talking how Nintendo themselves flat out forbid Retro from using him for three games since they thought he wasn't iconic/relevant.

I mean, the DK series did just fine with him so I say good riddance to Rare's terrible 90s designs.

 

[Noipoi]

So, favorite characters so far?

INCINEROAR

Also Inkling K Rool Ridley and Isabelle.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I used to think that HRC would come back.

But vaanrose said it best when it's probably just leftover data from Smash 4, though I'd love to be wrong.

Ah, didn't see him write that. There's a ton of pages each day, and I have a long workshift, so I skim sometimes. Fair point.

...I hope it comes back though. I feel it's a necessity these days. Challenges aren't much fun if you have few modes to give them to. Simple things like "defeat it with 10, 20, 30 characters" are artificial, sure, but it also gives you something extra to do for completion. Without just RNG grinding alone.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

I mean, the DK series did just fine with him so I say good riddance to Rare's terrible 90s designs.

I will admit K. Rool's design is a bit goofy and unappealing for some people, but I think that's one of the things which makes him a unique villain. And you can't deny he's far more popular and memorable of an antagonist than a plank of wood and a walrus with his same exact personality (now I know why some people wanted him as a K. Rool echo fighter...).

 

[Shroob]

I mean, the DK series did just fine with him so I say good riddance to Rare's terrible 90s designs.

I mean, did it really though?

K.Rool still had a rabid fanbase 10 years after his absence, to the point that it got him in Smash, ESPECIALLY in Japan, you could not believe how many Japanese reaction videos I watched that screamed at the top of their lungs "KING KURURU!"


Likewise.........anyone really remember Tiki Tong or Lord Frederick?

 

[Noipoi]

I mean, the DK series did just fine with him so I say good riddance to Rare's terrible 90s designs.

K Rool is a good boy hush your mouth

 

[Luigi The President]

I do think DQ's apparent lack of popularity worldwide is over exaggerated. The series does well enough in the west to still sell (almost) a million units for some titles. It's by no means a gangbuster like final fantasy, but it can hold it's own in the market.

TBH no I disagree.
No matter how you put it, DQ still sells 80% in Japan from what I understand.

20% being other places just isn't enough to justify a Smash rep.

(I know I said I was gone but I can't help debating)

 

[zyaire33]

New Boss Battles/Extra Content DLC Predictions?

Hades and or Medusa would be goat.
Sephiroth would also be great, however likely.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

I like how Possesed red eyed Villager is now a canon thing

 

[LetterO]

At this point I really feel Porky is coming. His strange absense in everything, Reggie's comment about unexpectedness, the possibility of a Mother 3 Port, and Mother's 30th anniversary being next year really makes me think he'll be a playable character. I doubt he'd be a boss because it still wouldn't make sense on why he wasn't at least an online icon or a Spirit base game.

 

[KMDP]

I'm sure they at least thought about it but they decided in most games it's a luxury so they made it into an accessory for some $$$.

Unfortunately in a fighting game where even the slightest amount of input lag is dreadful consequently putting the majority of players on a wireless connection is simply awful. Especially for gamers in islands or low pop regions who need to connect with people over a larger distance.

What are you talking about?

Smash Bros. is a Party Game!
(I live on an island, btw)

I mean, the DK series did just fine without him so I say good riddance to Rare's terrible 90s designs.

There's a video I'd like to post in response to this, unfortunately one does not exist.

So take a gif instead.

You'd think someone would think to isolate this and post it to Youtube, but no.
---
I just had a funny experience listening to Palutena's Guidances,

I was trying to listen to Mewtwo's, having trouble triggering the Smash Taunt, I finally got it, while the Lv. 1 CPU Mewtwo wandered around nearby.

Almost immediately after the Guidance ended, Mewtwo teleported off the bottom of the stage and SD'd (though since I was "fighting" him, the game didn't count it as a Self Destruct).

 

[Will]

I don't know what it is but I fell in love with Ridley. You can side b an opponent into the air and slam underneath the stage for the best GIMP. His N-Air is super solid, and he basically has a reverse Fox U-Smash.

he can't beat mac but man i underestimated how much i'd like him

 

[theyellowgreninja]

Any extra content aside from new classic campaigns would most likely be those little

Spoiler: Minor-ish Adventure mode spoilers

areas where you can find characters and fight bosses, like the castle or temple of light

In which case I'd be down to clown with the extra content.
The only other extra content I can think of would be Smash Run/Smash Tour (please not smash tour), but that's iffy. Granted, I haven't explored Games and More much yet, but Target Smash, if it doesn't exist, should.

 

[Idon]

New Boss Battles/Extra Content DLC Predictions?

Hades and or Medusa would be goat.
Sephiroth would also be great, however likely.

I'll predict we'll get nothing and that the focus will be on the new DLC characters, music, and stages.

 

[perfectchaos83]

TBH no I disagree.
No matter how you put it, DQ still sells 80% in Japan from what I understand.

20% being other places just isn't enough to justify a Smash rep.

(I know I said I was gone but I can't help debating)

It's still a series that has better selling titles than even characters currently in Smash, even if you only take the west alone into consideration. Bayonetta being the Prime example.

 

[Deleted member]

I will admit K. Rool's design is a bit goofy and unappealing for some people, but I think that's one of the things which makes him a unique villain. And you can't deny he's far more popular and memorable of an antagonist than a plank of wood and a walrus with his same exact personality (now I know why some people wanted him as a K. Rool echo fighter...).

I mean, did it really though?

K.Rool still had a rabid fanbase 10 years after his absence, to the point that it got him in Smash, ESPECIALLY in Japan, you could not believe how many Japanese reaction videos I watched that screamed at the top of their lungs "KING KURURU!"


Likewise.........anyone really remember Tiki Tong or Lord Frederick?

I'm not saying about his popularity or anything I just think his design ****ing sucks like everything else Rare regurgitated

K Rool is a good boy hush your mouth

I will not

TBH no I disagree.
No matter how you put it, DQ still sells 80% in Japan from what I understand.

20% being other places just isn't enough to justify a Smash rep.

(I know I said I was gone but I can't help debating)

I mean, is that a bad thing when said 80% is really ****ing big?
I love ya buddy but the argument against DQ saying "no western popularity" is pretty weak.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Square Enix doesn't care about Geno he is like their ******* child that they abandonded he has no official merch it would be a miracle if he got in over Sora or another ff rep or a Dragon quest rep unless Nintendo pays them

I want to ask a question. One question.

Why do people leave out Lara Croft during Square discussions? I personally think she's probably the most likely of them all. If it weren't for Geno being as crazy popular as he is inside the Smash Community I wouldn't even call it much of a comparison. Lara is an icon of gaming and if there's going to be another Square rep for real then I think it'll be Lara. If not, then Geno. I don't see any other character being chosen. If Square even has another Rep coming...

 

[Idon]

TBH no I disagree.
No matter how you put it, DQ still sells 80% in Japan from what I understand.

20% being other places just isn't enough to justify a Smash rep.

(I know I said I was gone but I can't help debating)

If you're able to go toe to toe with Spiderman PS4 on launch month, then I'd say that's more than enough for a lot pf people to recognize it. It's not like a "what the hell is that" franchise like SMT.

Plus, like if that supposed 20% is still a million or more copies than that's still pretty damn big.

Why do people leave out Lara Croft during Square discussions? I personally think she's probably the most likely of them all. If it weren't for Geno being as crazy popular as he is inside the Smash Community I wouldn't even call it much of a comparison. Lara is an icon of gaming and if there's going to be another Square rep for real then I think it'll be Lara. If not, then Geno. I don't see any other character being chosen. If Square even has another Rep coming...

One, because people don't play her games here.
Two, because she wasn't on "the list" of potential characters.

 

[Deleted member]

I want to ask a question. One question.

Why do people leave out Lara Croft during Square discussions? I personally think she's probably the most likely of them all. If it weren't for Geno being as crazy popular as he is inside the Smash Community I wouldn't even call it much of a comparison. Lara is an icon of gaming and if there's going to be another Square rep for real then I think it'll be Lara. If not, then Geno. I don't see any other character being chosen. If Square even has another Rep coming...

Because she's not on the list. Only the Seven Squares are being really discussed right now, otherwise I'd love to argue for Neku, Agnes and an Octopath character but I'm too busy trying to convince myself Crono isn't in.

 

[Will]

I want to ask a question. One question.

Why do people leave out Lara Croft during Square discussions?

Why do people leave out COOKING MAMA during Square decisions?

I swear, y'all are lacking.

 

[Deleted member]

I mean, the DK series did just fine with him so I say good riddance to Rare's terrible 90s designs.

I see someone has no taste in husbandos.

Ah well, not everyone can appreciate the finer things in life...

Plus, it's a Shishoe post. No guarantee it isn't some sneaky, bamboozle bait.

 

[Deleted member]

All these are problems with the community in and of itself though. There's not much that can be done about the no new faces thing, at most I imagine some Melee players may give Ultimate a shot. Other than that all that could happen is that new people get good at the game and climb to the top. We're two days into release though, so it's impossible to tell starting now how likely that is. Ultimate is a phenomenon right now though, and competitive Smash is bigger now than ever, so I don't see the possibility of new blood as a low one.

The other two problems are things that can only be fixed in tangent with the competitive community's maturity, which is very lacking right now. Getting rid of the mindset/biases they had been holding onto with 4 is going to take a minute.

The game lends itself to competitive play though, far more so than Sm4sh and Brawl at the very least.

At the end of the day what will determine the competitive scene's health is support. If Nintendo REGULARLY releases balance patches and additional support then Smash Ultimate has a decent chance of having a prosperous competitive life.

I highly doubt much of any Melee players actually sticking with the game after a month. If your name isn't HungryBox, I don't see really any top players in Melee be in favor for Ultimate, and I'm honestly not surprised. I've watch Melee and see people like Mang0 and HBox win. I watched Smash For and seen people like ZeRo and Nairo win. I however, don't want a repeat and keep seeing those same faces from For and let the new blood take over this gen of Smash. I'm not saying I don't like these players, far from it, but it would get very stale, very fast if all we see are repeats from Smash for.

I'll give Nintendo this at the least, they update Mario Tennis Aces and Splatoon 2 pretty frequently, so I don't see Smash Ultimate not being the case. But just like Smash For, it's how the community reacts and tries to Direct Nintendo and Sakurai into what really needs to be fixed. If the competitive community wants to stop being a meme made fun of, then they need to make direct, concise and clear responses to them. If they can make a stink about Online Mode, they can sure aa **** do it with the game as a whole.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Y’know, I kind of said it as a half-joke earlier, but Joker’s really got me considering the idea that the guys at Nintendo who are calling the shots for DLC might just be fanboys about it.

Like, a lot of the high-ranking people at Nintendo are pretty big gamers themselves, having basically said the older businessmen who ran the company are starting to be replaced with people like Koizumi, who very clearly have had a lifelong passion for games. And every gamer has someone they‘d love to see in Smash, right?

Even if this is the case I’m sure there’ll be some balance. There’s going to be at least some level of professionalism and picking characters who will sell well.

But I can’t get rid of the mental image of a bunch of higher-ups trying to hide their excitement while proposing the prospect of Joker or even Sephiroth to Sakurai.

We’ve had the theory of ”we’re getting promo characters,” but might I suggest the “we’re getting near-pipedream fan-favorites among Japanese” theory? Joker fits into that pretty well.

 

[Luigi The President]

It's still a series that has better selling titles than even characters currently in Smash, even if you only take the west alone into consideration. Bayonetta being the Prime example.

I'm not saying about his popularity or anything I just think his design ****ing sucks like everything else Rare regurgitated

I will not

I mean, is that a bad thing when said 80% is really ****ing big?
I love ya buddy but the argument against DQ saying "no western popularity" is pretty weak.

If you're able to go toe to toe with Spiderman PS4 on launch month, then I'd say that's more than enough for a lot pf people to recognize it. It's not like a "what the hell is that" franchise like SMT.

Plus, like if that supposed 20% is still a million or more copies than that's still pretty damn big.


One, because people don't play her games here.
Two, because she wasn't on "the list" of potential characters.

All valid points-wasn't aware just how much DQ sold over here. with its latest entry.

Can I ask if DQ sold well in the West before the latest entry?