Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[drag0nscythe]

Obviously Incineroar is gonna suffer the most. His faithful supporters were speculating that he'd get in Smash long before Verge, but once that comment was made, Incineroar's thread raked in a ton of new supporters within the following days.

If people believe this leak is real, then all of those so-called "fans" are gonna distance themselves from Incineroar as much as possible, leaving the real supporters looking like bandwagoners too.

I still support him. I am surprised there is no new pokemon rep. I was against him at first, but bad guy fire cat has grown on me.

It is just a game people. Grow up.

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

People defended the leak because of those Grinch renders, they said that those render were unavaliable to public and that they were too hard to "fake".
It turned out that the renders were avaliable to public.

Let's completely ignore the other reasons why people believe it, why don't we?

 

[Chrono.]

I labelled all the CK for people who can't see. I think this gives the leak more credence because a fake leaker probably would've just gone with the 3 of them.
View attachment 171724

Also does anyone know what psynergy move Isaac is using?
View attachment 171725

He's using Growth.

 

[Luigi The President]

How is it valid evidence?? Or are you joking??

Because it's still a large part of the leak?

 

[Paperchampion23]

I labelled all the CK for people who can't see. I think this gives the leak more credence because a fake leaker probably would've just gone with the 3 of them.
View attachment 171724

Also does anyone know what psynergy move Isaac is using?
View attachment 171725

Likely this

Edit: It was wild growth, the image isn't loading...

I can see how "Earth" and Earthquakes may be offensive on promotional art.

Some people only looked at the op and missed these:

Spoiler: Grinch

I'm more and more convinced about my theory that the leak is 100% fake

I REALLY don't get your argument. So what if the renders are available to the public. The fact is, its there of all things, and is being used for media cutouts like Smash is, at a company that has ties to both things.

 

[P1ZZ4CHU]

Some people only looked at the op and missed these:

Spoiler: Grinch

I'm more and more convinced about my theory that the leak is 100% fake

You're missing the point there.

Yeah, the source exists. But your average leaker does not make concept prints in specialized paper using industry standard test formats. That's a cutout as evidenced by the white fold lines. Likely for a movie theatre display. Again, you don't just _make those._ This person is either legit, or went way out of their goddamn way to sell us the whole promotional printer gig.

Again, if this is a conspiracy, this is one of the most thorough jobs I HAVE EVER SEEN.

 

[Deleted member]

Ah ****, I forgot that the official launch trailer of the biggest selling Smash game has a section dedicated to Wario farting in it for like 30 seconds.

ooooh Japan...

I never forgot that. Like, I was so excited for Wario... and Sakurai decided "Surly treasure hunter, nah! Now... a farting guy... YEAH!"

 

[「 Derk 」]

Still hoping for a demo. Even if it's only a week before the game launches. Don't make me play Let's Go Pikachu for a full month please! I literally only bought it for a filler to hold me until smash comes out lol.

 

[Iko MattOrr]

You keep saying that it's completely, absolutely, 110% fake, but what happens if this is confirmed?

Nothing. Though I'm super convinced that it's fake. I have no interest in it being real or fake, I just hate liars.

 

[CallMeKnux]

Just a thought, with the talk of Brawl's first trailer. What if, instead of a trailer persay, they do something like Street Fighter V Arcade Edition did, where they just show the game's intro, and reveal the final characters through it? And then, after it runs, they run through each character individually?

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

I think it's stupid for people (yes including me) to use grinch to both defend and rebut against the leak when it has other things going for it. Focus on the actual main part of the leak instead of trying to cram the grinch in there.

 

[Luigi The President]

I think it's stupid for people (yes including me) to use grinch to both defend and rebut against the leak when it has other things going for it. Focus on the actual main part of the leak instead of trying to cram the grinch in there.

It's not "cramming" if it's in the leak
Even the smallest things can break a leak
Ask Sassy Geno

 

[Just a random scrub]

If real what order do you guys think the last of the newcomers will be. Geno I think will be 73 and obviously Shadow and Ken are 38e and 60e.

Considering the design of the box (having a clear spot for Ken but not Shadow), Ken is probably gonna be one of the next characters revealed.

If this is real, then mark my words, this is the chill before the storm. Sakurai WILL go in, guns blazing. November will be an absolute doozy.

My predictions:

-Ken reveal in the first week (since he's accounted for in the placeholder boxart, I think he's right around the corner)
-Mach Rider and Chorus Kids as part of a general direct
-Everyone else in a final Ultimate Smash direct
.....Except for maybe Banjo, who will probably be the final suprise, revealed in the week of release. Then again, I don't think Nintendo would want to pass up showing the Complete Roster at the end of the direct and having Xander yell out one last "EVERYONE IS HERE" or "GAME!" or something to that effect.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I think it's stupid for people (yes including me) to use grinch to both defend and rebut against the leak when it has other things going for it. Focus on the actual main part of the leak instead of trying to cram the grinch in there.

The Grinch is supposed to be a funny meme, not the main issue

 

[KMDP]

your average leaker

...Because, P1ZZ4CHU, you're not dealing with the average Smash Leaker anymore...

 

[Ignoritus]

50 fact extravaganza and every 10th fact is a newcomer

 

[FalconFire93]

Still hoping for a demo. Even if it's only a week before the game launches. Don't make me play Let's Go Pikachu for a full month please! I literally only bought it for a filler to hold me until smash comes out lol.

Same, but I’ll just go through that game catching some of my favorites until Smash’s eventual release.

 

[xpnc]

Some people only looked at the op and missed these:

Spoiler: Grinch

I'm more and more convinced about my theory that the leak is 100% fake

Yeah it's the craziest person in the world going out of their way to make incredibly boring cardboard cut-out models using promotional material from the upcoming Grinch movie because he's thinking 47 steps ahead and knows that both Bandai-Namco and Universal studios contract the same obscure French marketing company. To this end, he then got himself an office, printed out the name of an employee of said company, and haphazardly half blurred out the name because, once again, he's some kind of super genius beyond the mental capacities of mortal man and he knew that the internet's crack team of cybersleuths would find his red-herring name in seconds.

This absolute Einstein of social engineering also happens to moonlight as an expert artist and after presumably spending hours carefully cutting and pasting characters from the Smash poster, he then went out of his way to produce 7 more drawings of his own with obscure elements like vines for Isaac that hardly anyone would be able to make out, and then, for the fun of it, he saw to making a completely unique drawing of the blank version of Battlefield just because he could. He made sure that this fake roster of his perfectly mirrored one posted on 4chan last month by someone whose first language clearly isn't English because he knew that people would immediately make the connection to the French marketing company that he is pretending produced this image. The fact that 5 new characters lines up with the 5 missing stages from Corocoro was all part of his master plan. He also made sure this coincided with Nintendo renewing relevant trademarks.

The lengths you have to go to believe that this is all an incredibly elaborate leak would make this man one of the most intelligent people to ever walk the Earth. Apparently he knew where people would look at every turn, making him at the minimum more competent than the entire government of Saudi Arabia when it comes to fakery.

I suggest you think about which outcome is the most likely here

 

[CallMeKnux]

I think it's stupid for people (yes including me) to use grinch to both defend and rebut against the leak when it has other things going for it. Focus on the actual main part of the leak instead of trying to cram the grinch in there.

I dunno, Grinch's unused renders were a pretty big point in it's favor. Not that it being used already debunks the leak, assets are re-used for marketing all the time, but it's still worth bringing up.

 

[Cosmic77]

How is it valid evidence?? Or are you joking??

I mean, it's called "The Grinch Leak" for a reason.

We originally thought the Grinch cutouts were new, but that's not the case. The fact that they were available beforehand doesn't necessarily hurt the leak, but that's something that really would've helped this be more believable.

 

[Deleted member]

You're missing the point there.

Yeah, the source exists. But your average leaker does not make concept prints in specialized paper using industry standard test formats. That's a cutout as evidenced by the white fold lines. Likely for a movie theatre display. Again, you don't just _make those._ This person is either legit, or went way out of their goddamn way to sell us the whole promotional printer gig.

Again, if this is a conspiracy, this is one of the most thorough jobs I HAVE EVER SEEN.

There is also the outcome in which he is vehement against this leak because of personal reasons, so he's trying to find any reason to discredit this.

I'm not arguing it's legitimate or that a spade is a spade, but in the 5+ years I've been on SmashBoards, and the 15 or so years I've been following Smash Bros. with baited breath, imagining new games and potential rosters, and yearning for new fighters, most of these "leaks" tend to die a quick and painful death for various reasons, such as the artist coming forth and admitting they just goofed around, or a photo being examined for Photoshop elements where subtle details were neglected, or even someone trying to pass off Smash mods as true.

The fact we haven't even gotten to that point, as well as the fact that so many parts of this have a credible tracing do help the case, and while I do appreciate skepticism (I'm not trying to be an antagonist), if you're constantly arguing that something MUST be fake by grasping at straws and not even humoring the idea shows me one of two things; you're embittered about the final roster, or that you may just be trying to stir up trouble.

 

[larlargaming]

in the midst of all this, nintendo uploaded this smash ad https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkTzHcHTcME

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

in the midst of all this, nintendo uploaded this smash ad https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkTzHcHTcME

You think they know?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

69: Mach Rider
70: Chorus Kids
71: Isaac
72: Banjo-Kazooie
73: Geno
38e: Shadow
60e: Ken

How I see it personally.

 

[vaanrose]

I think it's stupid for people (yes including me) to use grinch to both defend and rebut against the leak when it has other things going for it. Focus on the actual main part of the leak instead of trying to cram the grinch in there.

The Grinch is the key to all of this.

 

[Samcrumpit]

Yeah it's the craziest person in the world going out of their way to make incredibly boring cardboard cut-out models using promotional material from the upcoming Grinch movie because he's thinking 47 steps ahead and knows that both Bandai-Namco and Universal studios contract the same obscure French marketing company. To this end, he then got himself an office, printed out the name of an employee of said company, and haphazardly half blurred out the name because, once again, he's some kind of super genius beyond the mental capacities of mortal man and he knew that the internet's crack team of cybersleuths would find his red-herring name in seconds.

This absolute Einstein of social engineering also happens moonlight as an expert artist and after presumably spending hours carefully cutting and pasting characters from the Smash poster, he then went out of his way to produce 7 more drawings of his own with obscure elements like vines for Isaac that hardly anyone would be able to make out, and then, for the fun of it, he saw to making a completely unique drawing of the blank version of Battlefield just because he could. He made sure that this fake roster of his perfectly mirrored one posted on 4chan last month by someone whose first language clearly isn't English because he knew that people would immediately make the connection to the French marketing company that he is pretending produced this image. The fact that 5 new characters lines up with the 5 missing stages from Corocoro was all part of his master plan. He also made sure this coincided with Nintendo renewing relevant trademarks.

The lengths you have to go to believe that this is all an incredibly elaborate leak would make this man one of the most intelligent people to ever walk the Earth. Apparently he knew where people would look at every turn, making him at the minimum more competent than the entire government of Saudi Arabia when it comes to fakery.

I suggest you think about which outcome is the most likely here

I mean, it's elaborate but you dont have to be a super genius to think of this.

 

[Wambo]

Yeah it's the craziest person in the world going out of their way to make incredibly boring cardboard cut-out models using promotional material from the upcoming Grinch movie because he's thinking 47 steps ahead and knows that both Bandai-Namco and Universal studios contract the same obscure French marketing company. To this end, he then got himself an office, printed out the name of an employee of said company, and haphazardly half blurred out the name because, once again, he's some kind of super genius beyond the mental capacities of mortal man and he knew that the internet's crack team of cybersleuths would find his red-herring name in seconds.

This absolute Einstein of social engineering also happens moonlight as an expert artist and after presumably spending hours carefully cutting and pasting characters from the Smash poster, he then went out of his way to produce 7 more drawings of his own with obscure elements like vines for Isaac that hardly anyone would be able to make out, and then, for the fun of it, he saw to making a completely unique drawing of the blank version of Battlefield just because he could. He made sure that this fake roster of his perfectly mirrored one posted on 4chan last month by someone whose first language clearly isn't English because he knew that people would immediately make the connection to the French marketing company that he is pretending produced this image. The fact that 5 new characters lines up with the 5 missing stages from Corocoro was all part of his master plan. He also made sure this coincided with Nintendo renewing relevant trademarks.

The lengths you have to go to believe that this is all an incredibly elaborate leak would make this man one of the most intelligent people to ever walk the Earth. Apparently he knew where people would look at every turn, making him at the minimum more competent than the entire government of Saudi Arabia when it comes to fakery.

I suggest you think about which outcome is the most likely here

It's when you guys put it like this that restores my faith in the leak.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Someone posted this claiming it as proof it's fake

 

[larlargaming]

You think they know?

yes definitely

 

[TheBazry64]

So i now uploaded my Snapchat chat (warning German) on Imgur, the guy i spoke with is my friend from France, he is not into gaming but definitly saw the story after i asked him. (Sorry he asked me too censor his name for obvious reasons)
https://imgur.com/y2ZcyTk

 

[Roo525]

Yeah it's the craziest person in the world going out of their way to make incredibly boring cardboard cut-out models using promotional material from the upcoming Grinch movie because he's thinking 47 steps ahead and knows that both Bandai-Namco and Universal studios contract the same obscure French marketing company. To this end, he then got himself an office, printed out the name of an employee of said company, and haphazardly half blurred out the name because, once again, he's some kind of super genius beyond the mental capacities of mortal man and he knew that the internet's crack team of cybersleuths would find his red-herring name in seconds.

This absolute Einstein of social engineering also happens to moonlight as an expert artist and after presumably spending hours carefully cutting and pasting characters from the Smash poster, he then went out of his way to produce 7 more drawings of his own with obscure elements like vines for Isaac that hardly anyone would be able to make out, and then, for the fun of it, he saw to making a completely unique drawing of the blank version of Battlefield just because he could. He made sure that this fake roster of his perfectly mirrored one posted on 4chan last month by someone whose first language clearly isn't English because he knew that people would immediately make the connection to the French marketing company that he is pretending produced this image. The fact that 5 new characters lines up with the 5 missing stages from Corocoro was all part of his master plan. He also made sure this coincided with Nintendo renewing relevant trademarks.

The lengths you have to go to believe that this is all an incredibly elaborate leak would make this man one of the most intelligent people to ever walk the Earth. Apparently he knew where people would look at every turn, making him at the minimum more competent than the entire government of Saudi Arabia when it comes to fakery.

I suggest you think about which outcome is the most likely here

I logged in for the first time in years just to like your comment. Beautifully stated.

 

[monadoboy]

You think they know?

They absolutely do, but I doubt they would alter their plans because of it.

 

[SigmaMewtwo]

Trying to keep up with this thread today has been a nightmare lol

Assuming this "Grinch Leak" is real (which it does seem very likely), I feel so sorry for Sakurai for having these characters blown out like this. What a shame to not be able to surprise us with 7 newcomers, which most of us weren't expecting after taking Sakurai's words of "don't expect too many newcomers" to heart, and I personally would liked to have been surprised by the man himself than through a leaker.

However, this is honestly a very solid set of newcomers that would please pretty much everyone, especially those of us who have been involved in speculation for a long time, and I myself would be very happy if these were our remaining newcomers. Geno, Banjo-Kazooie, Chorus Kids, Isaac, Mach Rider, Shadow and Ken essentially round out the roster of dreams, and all are choices I could see Sakurai choosing for Ultimate.

On a personal scale, Geno, Isaac and Banjo appeal to me the most, while the other four are also solid choices. Super Mario RPG is one of my favorite SNES games, and Geno does evoke the sense of nostalgia I had when playing the game for the first time. Golden Sun + The Lost Age is one of my favorite series on the GBA, and I'd love to see Isaac's abilities represented in Ultimate. Banjo-Kazooie is a game I love dearly from the N64 era (which perfected the collectathon in my opinion), so their inclusion would be wild for me, as I never thought that they would truly see the light of day in Smash.

Mach Rider is the Retro pick that I would totally see Sakurai choosing, and was considered for Melee from what I recall, so seeing the character make it in now would be wonderful. Chorus Kids would be the final Smash 4 scrapped character to make it in, and bring new franchise representation as well, which I appreciate. Shadow has been a long-time request even back in the Brawl days ever since Sonic made it into the roster, and I'd be very happy for his fans to see him make it in. And Ken makes perfect sense to join Ryu as the OG Echo Fighter, but I would also hope that he has at least a couple unique differences with his moveset as well.

I'm not going all in on this leak, as there is the possibility that it could be fake, but it certainly seems more likely to be real than fake from what I've seen throughout the day. What I really hope for is that the next Smash Direct will confirm or deny these newcomers, so that we can move forward with discussing Ultimate itself and the possibility of DLC candidates. If November 8th turns out to be true for our next direct date, it's going to be a wild two weeks until then, you can bet on that. Until then, I'm going to keep my expectations tempered, but will remain hopeful that our characters will make it in. I will be very interested in seeing what happens when we reach the end of this crazy hype train we're on now.

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

View attachment 171732


Someone posted this claiming it as proof it's fake

This is, out of everything today, the most pathetic way to call something fake I seen

 

[RyuhoFox]

This can't be stated enough.


If this roster is what we're getting, this is a time to be celebrating, not fling **** at others.



The Incineroar fanbase is going to have it the worst, due to them more or less going to be labeled as "Bandwagoners" and that's just petty.

Honestly they already have it pretty bad and get labeled as that right now. :/ It's going to get worse

 

[UberMadman]

Serious question: what do you guys think of this?

 

[The Animator]

Saw the leak on my lunch break today, it does seem to good to be true. After they revealed Ridley and K Rool, I thought the only way they could match those in hype would be either be Banjo/Kazooie or a cluster of characters. To get both seems like a lot, but on the other had its still within reason since Sakurai said there will be less newcomers then last time. Sma4h had 17 newcomers in the base roster. These leaked characters would bump the roster up to 16 new characters. so its still less then last time even with echo fighters. But with only some blurry photo to go on I will remain skeptical. Still...

 

[Luigi The President]

View attachment 171732


Someone posted this claiming it as proof it's fake

Could one not just...blur the characters out???

 

[Zinith]

Did something happen in the last 30 minutes to have everyone's opinions of the leak flip?

 

[Dcas]

Yeah it's the craziest person in the world going out of their way to make incredibly boring cardboard cut-out models using promotional material from the upcoming Grinch movie because he's thinking 47 steps ahead and knows that both Bandai-Namco and Universal studios contract the same obscure French marketing company. To this end, he then got himself an office, printed out the name of an employee of said company, and haphazardly half blurred out the name because, once again, he's some kind of super genius beyond the mental capacities of mortal man and he knew that the internet's crack team of cybersleuths would find his red-herring name in seconds.

This absolute Einstein of social engineering also happens to moonlight as an expert artist and after presumably spending hours carefully cutting and pasting characters from the Smash poster, he then went out of his way to produce 7 more drawings of his own with obscure elements like vines for Isaac that hardly anyone would be able to make out, and then, for the fun of it, he saw to making a completely unique drawing of the blank version of Battlefield just because he could. He made sure that this fake roster of his perfectly mirrored one posted on 4chan last month by someone whose first language clearly isn't English because he knew that people would immediately make the connection to the French marketing company that he is pretending produced this image. The fact that 5 new characters lines up with the 5 missing stages from Corocoro was all part of his master plan. He also made sure this coincided with Nintendo renewing relevant trademarks.

The lengths you have to go to believe that this is all an incredibly elaborate leak would make this man one of the most intelligent people to ever walk the Earth. Apparently he knew where people would look at every turn, making him at the minimum more competent than the entire government of Saudi Arabia when it comes to fakery.

I suggest you think about which outcome is the most likely here

This is true but seriously you just cant overestimate people with skill and free time, i know its mental gimnastics to think the way you said but still.