Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[osby]

inb4 Smash Bros becomes a dating sim because Sakurai changed his mind.

At least, you'll know what you Smash in that game.

Mr. Game & Watch, like any sane, 3D person would.

 

[Sage of Ice]

inb4 Smash Bros becomes a dating sim because Sakurai changed his mind.

At least, you'll know what you Smash in that game.

*doubles down on krystal and linkle support*

 

[Deleted member]

Tree Gelbman how come you have doubts about Decidueye?
Decidueye is the most popular Gen 7 fully evolved starter and it is in Pokken. I think it is likely. Probably not a shoo-in, but very likely.

The first point is debatable considering we have at least one polling that shows Primarina is the most popular of the three.
It is also an irrelevant point since that's never factored into a Newcomer choice thus far. Greninja gained the popularity it did long after it was already included in Smash.

The second point is also irrelevant. Smash and Pokken are two different beasts entirely and don't affect each other's rosters.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

FE is considered a flagship franchise by Nintendo and has been having massive success recently compared to the expectations of it.

The only way Fire Emblem can truly be a flagship franchise is if they add Lyn/Celica/Anna as playable characters in some shape or form in Smash 5...it would make sense to add one of the most popular FE characters, a most recent fresh take on an older character who seems be be getting a minor push up the ranks, and someone who’s the unofficial face of the series.

 

[SlickWylde]

I worry that some people might be expecting a little too much of e3. I think there will be anywhere from 3-5 characters. But expecting X Veterans with reworks, X new characters and X 3rd Party new characters is setting ourselves up for disappointment.

 

[Roberk]

The only way Fire Emblem can truly be a flagship franchise is if they add Lyn/Celica/Anna as playable characters in some shape or form in Smash 5...it would make sense to add one of the most popular FE characters, a most recent fresh take on an older character who seems be be getting a minor push up the ranks, and someone who’s the unofficial face of the series.

I was referencing the context of Nintendo as a company, but Lyn really does deserve to be in. I can justify Celica for being relevant. Anna's a different case though, it seems like Intelligent Systems themselves is phasing her out. While she has gotten more important she still feels like a Nurse Joy, i’d much rather have an Easter egg of her run an in game shop if there is one in this Smash.

 

[IsmaR]

I'll actually die if for whatever reason pokemon doesn't get a newcomer at all. How many pages would have beem wasted?

You're doing speculation wrong if you think any of the ideas posted here will be even close to right.

Speculation as a whole is a thing to pass time, share ideas to get a general idea of what the consensus would like to see, and basically see how close to "right" we can get without having any actual say in the matter. Those who make it more than that are doing so at their own expense (sometimes quite literally).

Historically, even when people were right, people were still usually in the wrong. A vast majority predicted Little Mac in Smash 4, for example, but a lot of us thought he would have the Star Punch incorporated differently than how the K.O. Punch wound up being in game. I have no doubts the same will happen this time around for Inklings (who almost everyone saw coming), and possibly even some veterans like BotW Link (community seems split on making him "Smash Link" or changing him completely to match BotW).

As someone said above, none of the time we "wasted" means anything in the long run. Being wrong isn't a bad thing, nor does being right give you any reason to brag or shove it down other people's throats. Regardless of how serious you're taking it, whether you're analyzing Sakurai's mind or just throwing random ideas on the dartboard just to see if anything sticks, speculah in a nutshell will continue to repeat the same patterns as previous times ("Oh this is happening for sure, everyone else thinks so" and "This would never happen" being phrases and posts I see every single time that wind up being both right and wrong) and ultimately, will amount to nothing, as it has (and will continue to in the future) time and time again.

 

[SuperSmashStephen]

And if the Leak isn't real, what other characters you think would be on E3?

If the leak isn’t true, I could see Rex & Pyra, Lycanroc/Decidueye, Rhythm Girl, and Sora.

Edit: If any of these need explanation, I’m happy to give my reasons why.

 

[Xpinkbean]

Steve from minecraft steals the show at e3, my prediction is 100% absolute

 

[Murlough]

Alright, my point was that, this team, instead of 3 characters for the same franchise, they could repart them to other more classic franchises that has been there since smash 64 but never got too many reps, like F-zero, Mother, Metroid or even Star fox, franchises that never got more than 3 characters.

In theory, Sakurai could have put "Gen 7 Pokemon" in his binder of Smash characters to be made in order to see which ones were popular before deciding. That way he could get one many people wanted for no loss. He just works on the new mon at the back end of the character making process.

I doubt they make all the characters at the same time so it isn't impossible or improbable.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

I feel like I've made this point several times but I'll mention it again because it's relevant. The Pokemon Company knows what they are doing. They already know which Pokemon will become the popular picks before they release them (besides surprises). Rowlett, Lycanroc, Mimikyu and to an extent Littens whole line were made to be popular, hence their huge promotion and role in the Anime. The Anime needs to be written and storyboarded in advance, it's not like they wait until the games are released to decide which Pokemon Ash will catch. It's all planned. This is marketing.

I'm kinda ticked about it too because I saw a video last night that said Mimikyu wouldn't be picked because popularity has never been the reason a Pokemon was picked for Smash. Mimikyu aside, are you kidding me? Melee - Mewtwo. Brawl - Lucario. Smash 4 - Greninja. Are you trying to tell me none of these Pokemon were the popular pics of those generations?

Just saying, just because the roster may have been decided before Sun and Moons release (not that that matters because they could have definitely seen which Pokemon were stirring the most hype for release) does not mean popularity will not play a role.

 

[Nekoo]

Smash 4 - Greninja. Are you trying to tell me none of these Pokemon were the popular pics of those generations?

Unironically luck. He was picked before even being revealed to the world. No way to know his popularity

 

[osby]

Unironically luck. He was picked before even being revealed to the world. No way to know his popularity

You forgot Sakurai can predict the future with 33.333% accuracy.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Unironically luck. He was picked before even being revealed to the world. No way to know his popularity

Im actually looking for a source that says whether or not Sakurai picked Greninja or if the Pokemon Company sent choices.

Because if the Pokemon Company sent choices that's my whole point. It's not luck, it's buisness and marketing.

 

[SchAlternate]

I feel like I've made this point several times but I'll mention it again because it's relevant. The Pokemon Company knows what they are doing. They already know which Pokemon will become the popular picks before they release them (besides surprises). Rowlett, Lycanroc, Mimikyu and to an extent Littens whole line were made to be popular, hence their huge promotion and role in the Anime. The Anime needs to be written and storyboarded in advance, it's not like they wait until the games are released to decide which Pokemon Ash will catch. It's all planned. This is marketing.

I'm kinda ticked about it too because I saw a video last night that said Mimikyu wouldn't be picked because popularity has never been the reason a Pokemon was picked for Smash. Mimikyu aside, are you kidding me? Melee - Mewtwo. Brawl - Lucario. Smash 4 - Greninja. Are you trying to tell me none of these Pokemon were the popular pics of those generations?

Just saying, just because the roster may have been decided before Sun and Moons release (not that that matters because they could have definitely seen which Pokemon were stirring the most hype for release) does not mean popularity will not play a role.

Mewtwo, and arguably Charizard in Smash 4, are about the only Pokemon characters to get in for being popular on their own right. Pikachu is the face of the series, Jigglypuff* and Pichu were easy to implement, Pokemon Trainer was an experiment at best, with Ivysaur and Squirtle being complementary, and Lucario and Greninja were literally added in before they became popular because they were the new kids on the block.

*Was mildly popular due to the anime at the time, which had her as a recurring side character.

 

[MBRedboy31]

Unironically luck. He was picked before even being revealed to the world. No way to know his popularity

Possibly part of it is Sakurai could also put a reasonable bet on the assumption that, if Greninja doesn’t end up popular in Pokémon, it’ll end up popular via Smash itself.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Im actually looking for a source that says whether or not Sakurai picked Greninja or if the Pokemon Company sent choices.

Because if the Pokemon Company sent choices that's my whole point. It's not luck, it's buisness and marketing.

Sakurai was given illustrations of Greninja to work with.

*Was mildly popular due to the anime at the time, which had her as a recurring side character.

Not just "mildly".

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

So I feel as if no one read my post...or rather they aren't commenting on the main point. Lucario/Greninja were chosen before they were revealed but that doesn't mean the Pokemon Company did not choose them to be the stars of those gens already.

https://sourcegaming.info/2017/05/31/character-selection-smash-for/

Hoping down to the section about Greninja it seems the Pokemon Company sent Sakurai options, and thus they likely sent the Pokemon they'd market the most (Greninja, Sylveon , Hawlucha, possibly the other starters). Sakurai may have made that choice without knowing Greninja would be so popular but the Pokemon Company sent those to him knowing they would. I'd imagine they'd do the same with Sun and Moon this time.

 

[Lukingordex]

So what do you guys think about that Ridley, Simon Belmont and Ics rumor?

I didn't really look into it much but as far as i can tell most people seem to be believing it and it appears to come from a reliable source.

Does anyone here have any relevant info on it?

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I was referencing the context of Nintendo as a company, but Lyn really does deserve to be in. I can justify Celica for being relevant. Anna's a different case though, it seems like Intelligent Systems themselves is phasing her out. While she has gotten more important she still feels like a Nurse Joy, i’d much rather have an Easter egg of her run an in game shop if there is one in this Smash.

I know what you were referencing, but it felt like a good transition to Lyn deserving a Smash Bros spot. Celica I’m just hoping is a Robin alt while Anna...she better not be phased away

 

[Nekoo]

*Imagine Lyn being added to Smash Switch after the Fire Emblem Warriors little weird reception where she got in BEFORE Ike(ESPECIALLY IKE)/Roy/Eliwood/Hector and the literal fiasco and riot of her getting Five Alt and a Legendary in Fire Emblem Heroes before Marth get literally Two*

I really want to see the reaction from the hardcore Fire Emblem community if it does happens. I can't wait for the Firework.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

*Imagine Lyn being added to Smash Switch after the Fire Emblem Warriors little weird reception where she got in BEFORE Ike(ESPECIALLY IKE)/Roy/Eliwood/Hector and the literal fiasco and riot of her getting Five Alt and a Legendary in Fire Emblem Heroes before Marth get literally Two*

I really want to see the reaction from the hardcore Fire Emblem community if it does happens. I can't wait for the Firework.

Speaking of fireworks, have you guys seen Delzethin's wild roster video?

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Speaking of fireworks, have you guys seen Delzethin's wild roster video?

That may or may not have been the video that ticked me off...lol

 

[osby]

Speaking of fireworks, have you guys seen Delzethin's wild roster video?

Yep, it was really well explained but... was a strangely diappointing idea. Like, it was just some shocking-but-everyone's-first-pick ideas with some relatively unpopular picks. With just a small part of veterans.

I hope new game's roster will be more boring than that.

 

[Arcanir]

*Imagine Lyn being added to Smash Switch after the Fire Emblem Warriors little weird reception where she got in BEFORE Ike(ESPECIALLY IKE)/Roy/Eliwood/Hector and the literal fiasco and riot of her getting Five Alt and a Legendary in Fire Emblem Heroes before Marth get literally Two*

I really want to see the reaction from the hardcore Fire Emblem community if it does happens. I can't wait for the Firework.

I'd be more scared of the Smash fanbase in that case, at least Lyn has FE fans that would be happy with her, with Smash fans they would put her head on a pike for being yet another FE character.

 

[Deleted member]

So what do you guys think about that Ridley, Simon Belmont and Ics rumor?

I didn't really look into it much but as far as i can tell most people seem to be believing it and it appears to come from a reliable source.

Does anyone here have any relevant info on it?

I honestly think it's fake. I personally never believe text leaks unless there's some really hard evidence to back it up, and from what I've read from others about the leaker, he seems pretty unreliable. From what I've read, most of the things he's credited for leaking are things he wasn't even the first person to report on, and I guess people say he's known to edit his posts a bunch after things are revealed, so who knows. Plus, to my knowledge, I don't think anything he's ever leaked about Nintendo has been right. I think the only thing he got spot on was the TMNT DLC in Injustice 2.

The only leak floating around right now that's probably legit is the Pokemon stuff, but that's mainly because the domain names for the leaked games have been registered by a legit company and match up with what was stated.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

*Imagine Lyn being added to Smash Switch after the Fire Emblem Warriors little weird reception where she got in BEFORE Ike(ESPECIALLY IKE)/Roy/Eliwood/Hector and the literal fiasco and riot of her getting Five Alt and a Legendary in Fire Emblem Heroes before Marth get literally Two*

I really want to see the reaction from the hardcore Fire Emblem community if it does happens. I can't wait for the Firework.

As someone who loves Lyn but is sincerely tired of all the alts she's getting, receiving her in Smash wouldn't cause outrage among the Fire Emblem fans who are tired of her alts I think. Getting her in a different game is completely different than another forced alt of her in a game she's already in. We all voted for her to be popular in Fire Emblem Heroes, we just didn't know the ridiculous effect it would have on new characters in the Heroes going forward... She was voted #1 most popular for a reason.

EDIT: reworded bc I realized I misread the original post

 

[Roberk]

*Imagine Lyn being added to Smash Switch after the Fire Emblem Warriors little weird reception where she got in BEFORE Ike(ESPECIALLY IKE)/Roy/Eliwood/Hector and the literal fiasco and riot of her getting Five Alt and a Legendary in Fire Emblem Heroes before Marth get literally Two*

I really want to see the reaction from the hardcore Fire Emblem community if it does happens. I can't wait for the Firework.

The thing with Warriors is that Lyn was praised for being a unique character that wasn’t FatesAwakening. Plus, the developers said that they were saving Ike and Roy for a sequel. I’d think they’d generally be happy with Lyn in Smash tbh.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

*Imagine Lyn being added to Smash Switch after the Fire Emblem Warriors little weird reception where she got in BEFORE Ike(ESPECIALLY IKE)/Roy/Eliwood/Hector and the literal fiasco and riot of her getting Five Alt and a Legendary in Fire Emblem Heroes before Marth get literally Two*

I really want to see the reaction from the hardcore Fire Emblem community if it does happens. I can't wait for the Firework.

And then Lyn in Smash uses everything she’s ever learned from her own game and Heroes (meaning the horse and love would be included)

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Mark my words, Gen 7 is Mimikyu or Rowlet.

People are gonna get their upset with Decidueye this time.

He's the Chrom this time.

 

[SuperSmashStephen]

Mark my words, Gen 7 is Mimikyu or Rowlet.

People are gonna get their upset with Decidueye this time.

He's the Chrom this time.

God, if Mimikyu gets revealed I’ll squeal like a schoolgirl.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Mark my words, Gen 7 is Mimikyu or Rowlet.

People are gonna get their upset with Decidueye this time.

He's the Chrom this time.

What if we get Lycanroc?

 

[Tree Gelbman]

What if we get Lycanroc?

I think he's a real dark horse. He has to beat mass popularity in the cute borb who is also a grass starter.

Or someone who is a play on the series mascot.

 

[Smartz]

How would Mimikyu actually be able to put up a fight with someone like Donkey Kong or hell even someone like Kirby. He’s 0.02m tall. Is there some sort of like form where he grows legs or something? I really do think someone will be added from pokemon just not mimikyu or Lycanroc. Lycanroc might actually work because they got a dog and duck into a game with an actual move set.

 

[Munomario777]

Mimikyu's shape is pretty workable, I reckon. Headbutt attacks, swipes with his little tail stick thing, and especially those dark tentacles / arms he has in some of his artwork. I also think it'd be pretty neat if he could "mimic" other characters somehow, like a counter that lets him copy whatever move he got hit with or something.

The main one that puzzles me is Rowlet... his body shape doesn't lend itself awfully well to making attack animations.

 

[Sage of Ice]

How would Mimikyu actually be able to put up a fight with someone like Donkey Kong or hell even someone like Kirby. He’s 0.02m tall. Is there some sort of like form where he grows legs or something? I really do think someone will be added from pokemon just not mimikyu or Lycanroc. Lycanroc might actually work because they got a dog and duck into a game with an actual move set.

the actual ROB they sold in stores was around that size, but in smash he's taller than some of the human characters. making mimikyu drawn-on eye level with pikachu wouldn't be too unbelievable.

lycanroc and decidueye are still my favorites but i'd be alright with mimikyu! would it be too much of a stretch to hope for some of its "palette swaps" to instead be costumes of different pokemon? they make merch to that effect, so it has precedent.

 

[Smartz]

the actual ROB they sold in stores was around that size, but in smash he's taller than some of the human characters. making mimikyu drawn-on eye level with pikachu wouldn't be too unbelievable.

lycanroc and decidueye are still my favorites but i'd be alright with mimikyu! would it be too much of a stretch to hope for some of its "palette swaps" to instead be costumes of different pokemon? they make merch to that effect, so it has precedent.

ROB?

And bulbepedia said he was 0.02m tall. and in like perspective ZSS is 6ft tall. And shortest human (I think don’t quote me on this) is Little Mac at 5’3.

 

[MBRedboy31]

The main one that puzzles me is Rowlet... his body shape doesn't lend itself awfully well to making attack animations.

Rowlet is kind of approximately a sphere with tiny limbs, which already works with Kirby, Jigglypuff, and Meta Knight, so it shouldn’t be too much of a stretch.

 

[Munomario777]

In canon, Olimar is the size of a quarter, and Kirby is like eight inches tall. They'll size Mimikyu up lmao.

 

[Opossum]

My issue with Lyn getting in is just that I don't think it's likely. Popularity is pretty much all she has going for her...mainly because Intelligent Systems seemed genuinely shocked at her placement in the first Choose Your Legends poll, basically admitting they underestimated her popularity to some degree.

That poll came around in late January of 2017, presumably long after the roster was decided. I honestly think she has a far better shot at DLC than a main-game newcomer.