Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Maybe their Classic Modes could be them battling characters meant to represent the player? ending with those bosses?

No, because that'd be the exact same thing for each of them. Every Classic Mode is separate and unique. Echoes nor Clones have identical Classics either. The "Avatar" route never worked because it assumes they're just the same character. They aren't simply Miis, they're 3 unique classes and treated way more separately. The announcer even calls them Mii Swordfighter, Mii Brawler, and Mii Gunner, and they have their own VS Mode Renders and roster slots. They aren't actually grouped together fully anymore, so there's no reason to give them the same thing either. It's like having Samus/ZSS as well as all 3 Links with the exact same Classic. Or any Echo sharing the exact same one. It doesn't fully work as is nor have any real theme that adheres to the fact they're separated characters now.

I kind of wish they were added to the random button at least lol

That wouldn't much work? Unless you mean how you cannot have them as an option among Random in VS/etc.(where Mii Gunner, Mii Swordfighter, and Mii Brawler are playable). I think it's because they have to also choose a lot more criteria, including which specifically saved character you made. That wasn't possible in 4 either(if I remember right), so I doubt it's simply cause Ultimate got rushed.

 

[osby]

Do I wanna know what arguments were made?

No, because that'd be the exact same thing for each of them. Every Classic Mode is separate and unique. Echoes nor Clones have identical Classics either. The "Avatar" route never worked because it assumes they're just the same character. They aren't simply Miis, they're 3 unique classes and treated way more separately. The announcer even calls them Mii Swordfighter, Mii Brawler, and Mii Gunner, and they have their own VS Mode Renders and roster slots. They aren't actually grouped together fully anymore, so there's no reason to give them the same thing either. It's like having Samus/ZSS as well as all 3 Links with the exact same Classic. Or any Echo sharing the exact same one. It doesn't fully work as is nor have any real theme that adheres to the fact they're separated characters now.

This, basically.

 

[KarneraMythos]

No, because that'd be the exact same thing for each of them. Every Classic Mode is separate and unique. Echoes nor Clones have identical Classics either. The "Avatar" route never worked because it assumes they're just the same character. They aren't simply Miis, they're 3 unique classes and treated way more separately. The announcer even calls them Mii Swordfighter, Mii Brawler, and Mii Gunner, and they have their own VS Mode Renders and roster slots. They aren't actually grouped together fully anymore, so there's no reason to give them the same thing either. It's like having Samus/ZSS as well as all 3 Links with the exact same Classic. Or any Echo sharing the exact same one. It doesn't fully work as is nor have any real theme that adheres to the fact they're separated characters now.


That wouldn't much work? Unless you mean how you cannot have them as an option among Random in VS/etc.(where Mii Gunner, Mii Swordfighter, and Mii Brawler are playable). I think it's because they have to also choose a lot more criteria, including which specifically saved character you made. That wasn't possible in 4 either(if I remember right), so I doubt it's simply cause Ultimate got rushed.

What about characters who share identical moves with the individual Mii Fighter types as opponents?

 

[Will]

I'm trying to think of how it is really different from Mii Gunner, honestly. Or some options among Mii Swordfighter. I'm sure it could be, but this is one of those you need to see the moveset to see how it stands out.

You obviously have fake moves. You can also have stat-boosting spells like (or i guess that one move geno has).

 

[Aeronite's Kiseki]

Yeah, and the Koopalings and Alph are the only ones with no unique Classic mode

 

[osby]

You obviously have fake moves. You can also have stat-boosting spells like (or i guess that one move geno has).

What about normals.

Yeah, and the Koopalings and Alph are the only ones with no unique Classic mode

Olimar's route fits Alph fine enough. Koopalings...could be better.

 

[DevaAshera]

It is for businesses. They have to pay again to license the costume. For them, it's easy money. It's pretty likely this is why too.

I won't pretend it's not annoying, but I expected it as soon as we found out all the 3rd party costumes were gone. At least they're still cheap. Also, you only pay for what's in the game. I'd be more annoyed if it was a port that tried to resell the costumes. But it's a new game. So new licenses and all. Also, how many 3rd party costumes were base roster in 4 anyway?

There weren't any 3rd Party Mii Fighter Costumes in the base game of Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS & Wii U..in fact, there weren't many 1st or 2nd Party Mii Fighter Costumes at all in the base game either, most of it was just their headgear if anything.

 

[Will]

What about normals.

bonk with staff

 

[Wademan94]

Alrighty then, how about they have Classic modes that represent each step in creating a Mii Fighter:

-One could go through the avatar characters I mentioned representing the avatar creation
-One could go through characters that represent their custom moves. Example: , & for Gunner’s Neutral Specials
-One goes through characters in their alternate costumes.

 

[osby]

bonk with staff

So, swordfighter

 

[Will]

So, swordfighter

how the **** do you do a club attack with a sword

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

bonk with staff

Well, if it lets me do a more proper Brian Mii...

 

[PLATINUM7]

how the **** do you do a club attack with a sword

Hit with the flat side of the sword?

 

[osby]

how the **** do you do a club attack with a sword

Ask her:

 

[Will]

Ask her:View attachment 184603

i dont speak to never evers

 

[DevaAshera]

Hit with the flat side of the sword?

I mean, well, duh..after all,

 

[Noipoi]

You slap em with the flat side, obviously.

 

[Deleted member]

I’d be 100% up for music DLC. If you think the soundtrack “leaves a lot to be desired” as is though, you’re on crack

Xenoblade - Amazing music as is, doesn’t really need remixes
Bayonetta - As the last new series added, she pretty much got “new” treatment already. You can count her as getting remixes
Sonic - Not sure why people thought the music selection style would suddenly change for this series after multiple games of no remixes but new ports

Oh, I know, I absolutely love Wario World, I had to refind it to buy it again a couple years ago as I'm slowly rebuilding my Gamecube collection (still need to find Star Fox Assault). At least Greenhorn Forest should really be in Smash.

I'm honestly kind of sad that Wario seems to only rep the WarioWare series in Smash..even the 1 Wario Land song they put in the game is just a remix of a song from WarioWare..making it not really a Wario Land song at all..

For that matter, I hate when the one song a particular series gets in Smash is just a remix from another game..like the previously mentioned Wario Land song and the 1 song they included from the Mega Man Zero series being Theme of Zero, itself a remix of Zero's Theme from Mega Man X (even the song name says this), Departure from Mega Man Zero 2 would have been a much better choice...for that matter, the lack of a MegaMan Battle Network song (particularly the main theme of the series) makes me sad since the other series got music in the game. I'll forgive Mega Man Legends since I've heard that game has a lot of licensing issues with its music and stuff during my days as a Capcom Moderator.

Now see, now you guys got me ready One of my biggest expectations going into Smash Ultimate was how they were gonna handle the music department, because I really feel a lot of series included could use some work in that department. My general feelings for Ultimate, going by each series...

Spoiler: BIG POST

 

[osby]

Now see, now you guys got me ready One of my biggest expectations going into Smash Ultimate was how they were gonna handle the music department, because I really feel a lot of series included could use some work in that department. My general feelings for Ultimate, going by each series...

Spoiler: BIG POST

1. You keep bringing up this game's name is "Ultimate" and it still doesn't mean anything.
2. Didn't Sakurai said he's not responsible from every single music track?

 

[Deleted member]

1. You keep bringing up this game's name is "Ultimate" and it still doesn't mean anything.
2. Didn't Sakurai said he's not responsible from every single music track?

It sorta means something when they market this game as "the biggest Smash Bros. game ever". While we sorta had the message of a Smash game always getting bigger and bigger with each game, especially Brawl's "Brawl to End them All!", I don't think it's too much to ask for the music department to go all out when they specifically made this game's motif alone as "the greatest Smash game". Hell, when even Japan calls the game "Special", I would at least hope it'd be "Special" for some franchises' music.

And look, I need someone to blame anyways. I know it's the composer department.

 

[MBRedboy31]

What about normals.

They could have a decent number of attacks that produce magical bursts at certain ranges and with dead zones in between them and the player, giving them a lot of zoning potential even just with normals but making it tricky to use as they’ll whiff entirely if the opponent is too close. Or, they could have both an up close hitbox and a distant hitbox, kind of like many of the attacks of Brawl Minus Zelda. I feel deadzones aren’t really explored enough in the current Smash movesets, but IDK, maybe it would be too annoying to use.

(On a related tangent, there isn’t a Mii class that’s a puppet fighter yet, so...)

 

[Will]

(On a related tangent, there isn’t a Mii class that’s a puppet fighter yet, so...)

the hell is a puppet fighter

 

[osby]

the hell is a puppet fighter

Rosalina (ft. Luma)

 

[Noipoi]

the hell is a puppet fighter

Characters that control other characters, like Rosalina.

 

[Gentlepanda]

Tbh, I'm still on the camp "irregular menus are a thing" but if we're going to get a surprise stage, it doesn't have to tied to a character.

What I'm getting is, we'll get a Yoshi's Crafted World stage.

Since they cut Wooly World for no clear reason, it's probably that but rethemed to Crafted World.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Oh they're there. You can call it "assuming the worst", but I call it "show's over".

I'm assuming that you're referring to these two statements in these two interviews:

As for Persona music, he says he purchases the soundtracks and always listens to them. For Persona 5’s acid jazz battle theme, Sakurai says it isn’t fitting for a battle theme, and if it were Smash Bros. it definitely wouldn’t be a battle theme, yet to have the sense to still push that is something Sakurai finds quite remarkable.

As we make the DLC fighters, the team involved will continue to shrink. Until now I’ve been overseeing hundreds of peoples’ work, so my work as a director is about to get relatively light. Of course, we have to plan the next DLC character, and the next… and so on and so forth. I planned in advance and set aside some funds, though, so we’ve got a bit of a surplus compared to earlier on.

I wouldn't read too far into the first statement. It seems like Sakurai is saying that if he were the one in charge, the acid jazz battle theme wouldn't be a thing, not that it won't be in Smash Bros. Regardless, there's a precedent for no vocals within game tracks as Bayonetta's tracks all lacked vocals.

I find the second one much more interesting, but without further information I'll remain skeptical. I wouldn't be surprised if we do only get 1 Fighters Pass though.

 

[Will]

Rosalina (ft. Luma)

Characters that control other characters, like Rosalina.

you mean puppeteer fighters?

 

[Noipoi]

you mean puppeteer fighters?

It's literally a 3 letter difference, but yeah sure let's go with that if it makes you feel better.

 

[osby]

Since they cut Wooly World for no clear reason, it's probably that but rethemed to Crafted World.

Eh, it might be just "we didn't have enough time".

And before someone says "but they brought back X", we gone through the same thing with Mewtwo in Brawl.

you mean puppeteer fighters?

Oops, our bad. Puppet fighter should be Geno.

 

[PLATINUM7]

you mean puppeteer fighters?

The fighting game community exists solely to make abbreviations.

 

[Will]

It's literally a 3 letter difference, but yeah sure let's go with that if it makes you feel better.

It's literally a 3 letter difference with the correct definition.

The fighting game community exists solely to make abbreviations.

that's not an abbreviation that's just a different word

 

[GoeGoe]

Name a character..
- Not your ultimate wish.
- Originated from a game.
- E-rated.
- Not talked about much.
- No one expects to join Smash.
- Either popular or have a history in gaming.
- Adds real significance to Smash.

 

[Will]

Name a character..
- Not your ultimate wish.
- Originated from a game.
- E-rated.
- Not talked about much.
- No one expects to join Smash.
- Either popular or have a history in gaming.
- Adds real significance to Smash.

listen you cant just put a list that specifically applies to goemon and expect a gajillion other characters to apply to the same list mike jones

 

[KingBroly]

Are the Pokemon LG P/E Support Spirits showing up for anyone on the Spirit Board? If so, do you have either LGE or LGP?

 

[osby]

Name a character..
- Not your ultimate wish.
- Originated from a game.
- E-rated.
- Not talked about much.
- No one expects to join Smash.
- Either popular or have a history in gaming.
- Adds real significance to Smash.

Define "real significance".

 

[Deleted member]

If y'all are interested to see how Japan is responding to Smash Ultimate in various areas, including DLC wants, here's a recent report that Abadango retweeted out from. Here's what I got as a quick translation.
Source: http://news.denfaminicogamer.jp/kikakuthetower/181228g

Quick Ones: The most preferred controller is the Switch Pro Controller. Online Mode has been the most played, second most played mode is Adventure Mode: World of Light. And most people who have played Ultimate have played Brawl in the past with a whopping 96.84%.

Now, onto the main stuff.

Top 5 Favorite Characters

1. Kirby - 8.67%
2. Mario - 5.55%
3. Link - 4.06%
4. Pikachu - 3.04%
5. Zelda - 2.98%

Top 5 Characters Who Think Are The Strongest

1. King K. Rool - 20.23%
2. Inkling - 11.30%
3. Pikachu - 5.22%
4. Isabelle - 4.70%
5. Bayonetta - 2.73%

Top 5 Favorite Stages

1. Final Destination - 17.87%
2. Temple - 5.56%
3. Fountain of Dreams - 5.31%
4. Battlefield - 4.73%
5. Hyrule Castle N64 - 4.40%

Top 5 Preferred Rulesets

1. 3-Stock - 47.47%
2. 2-Stock - 27.35%
3. Time - 3:00 - 7.17%
4. Time - 2:30 - 5.54%
5. 1-Stock - 2.41%

Top 10 Most Wanted DLC Characters

1. Rex (Xenoblade Chronicles 2) - 79
2. Sora (Kingdom Hearts) - 60
3. Bandana Dee (Kirby) - 43
4. Geno (Super Mario RPG) - 33
5. Banjo & Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie) - 32
6. 2B (NieR: Automata) - 30
7. Hunter (Monster Hunter) - 30
8. Dante (Devil May Cry) - 28
9. sans (Undertale) - 22
10. Pyra (Xenoblade Chronicles 2) - 20

 

[osby]

Top 5 Favorite Stages

1. Final Destination - 17.87%
2. Temple - 5.56%
3. Fountain of Dreams - 5.31%
4. Battlefield - 4.73%
5. Hyrule Castle N64 - 4.40%

Nice to see people giving Temple the respect it deserves. Also, damn, people really do want Rex.

 

[SoccerStar9001]

If y'all are interested to see how Japan is responding to Smash Ultimate in various areas, including DLC wants, here's a recent report that Abadango retweeted out from. Here's what I got as a quick translation.
Source: http://news.denfaminicogamer.jp/kikakuthetower/181228g

Quick Ones: The most preferred controller is the Switch Pro Controller. Online Mode has been the most played, second most played mode is Adventure Mode: World of Light. And most people who have played Ultimate have played Brawl in the past with a whopping 96.84%.

Now, onto the main stuff.

Top 5 Favorite Characters

1. Kirby - 8.67%
2. Mario - 5.55%
3. Link - 4.06%
4. Pikachu - 3.04%
5. Zelda - 2.98%

Top 5 Characters Who Think Are The Strongest

1. King K. Rool - 20.23%
2. Inkling - 11.30%
3. Pikachu - 5.22%
4. Isabelle - 4.70%
5. Bayonetta - 2.73%

Top 5 Favorite Stages

1. Final Destination - 17.87%
2. Temple - 5.56%
3. Fountain of Dreams - 5.31%
4. Battlefield - 4.73%
5. Hyrule Castle N64 - 4.40%

Top 5 Preferred Rulesets

1. 3-Stock - 47.47%
2. 2-Stock - 27.35%
3. Time - 3:00 - 7.17%
4. Time - 2:30 - 5.54%
5. 1-Stock - 2.41%

Top 10 Most Wanted DLC Characters

1. Rex (Xenoblade Chronicles 2) - 79
2. Sora (Kingdom Hearts) - 60
3. Bandana Dee (Kirby) - 43
4. Geno (Super Mario RPG) - 33
5. Banjo & Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie) - 32
6. 2B (NieR: Automata) - 30
7. Hunter (Monster Hunter) - 30
8. Dante (Devil May Cry) - 28
9. sans (Undertale) - 22
10. Pyra (Xenoblade Chronicles 2) - 20

Huh...? Isn't #9 in Smash already?

 

[osby]

Huh...? Isn't #9 in Smash already?

Nah, this is like saying Ganon is in Smash because we have Ganondorf.

 

[Deleted member]

Nice to see people giving Temple the respect it deserves. Also, damn, people really do want Rex.

If there's anything I've seen from Japan is that if they want a character, they will never ****ing stop pushing.

This was pretty evident with King K. Rool back during Smash For, especially with the whole Mii Costume thing. But even with K. Rool having a Mii Costume, did that stop the Japanese? Of course not. The OG Donkey Kong Country trilogy is seen by the Japanese as a "supreme master-class", especially DKC2, so I see why Japan would want K. Rool so much during these years.

Something I've noticed is that when Japan collectively pushes a character if they appear number one on so many polls, just like King K. Rool, they usually tend to get their wishes granted, more so than here in America and other countries, which makes me really sus about Rex & Pyra.

I know that some people are feeling fishy about no Porky spirit in lieu for the Absolutely Safe Capsule, but I dunno, having no Counterattack alongside XBC2 content makes me feel a bit sus, especially after the praise Sakurai gives that game and with Nintendo pushing the IP.