Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[SuperSceptile15]

Just a few factors for both Incineroar and Pokemon, but I have a jab against Fire Emblem as well so that's not off the hook entirely.
For Incineroar, it's that he's another fully-evolved Fire Starter when we already have one, on top of the fact that it's another safe and basic choice for a Pokemon fighter. Alola gave us Ultra-Beasts and other interesting non-starter Pokemon, what gives? This franchise has a "Tutorial Level" mindset when it comes to reps post Gen 1. All of that being said, Incineroar is a lot of fun to watch, so he's got that going for him.

For Gen 8, we don't know what's in it beyond Meltan. Meltan is adorable, but selling us on the guy just won't do it. Where are the rest? We should acquaint ourselves with the Pokemon first before they're put on a paywall. Fire Emblem Three Houses is guilty of this possibility too. We don't know the characters! We should learn about them and learn to like the characters on our own, and that's another positive Incineroar has on his list. Sure, he's controversial, but at least we got to know him.

All in all, it's Game Freak's behavior with the franchise. They go about it in such an uninspired and boring way that a lot of what they've done lately feels like they're regressing and missing out on a lot of opportunities. Instead, we continuously get Gen 1 after Gen 1 shilling non-stop, and they go about the franchise in such a corporate fashion that the decisions end up being boring and predictable to a fault. They're the anti-Sakurai in more ways than one. That's just my 2 cents though. If we get a Gen 8 'Mon, I just hope it's cool.

The thing with Incineroar's inclusion is that Sakurai doesn't care about type representation. He looks at what the Pokemon itself can offer, and Incineroar is both a dedicated wrestler and feline character which Smash has never had before. I do agree with your opinion on GameFreak though. I am sick to death of the constant Gen 1 pandering, and they are just plain incompetent and lazy as developers. Sadly, Pokemon games will always sell well, so there is no incentive for lots of effort to be put into the series anymore.

 

[CallMeKnux]

Tbh I'm still really thinking the Minecraft representation that keeps getting hyped up is just a few measly spirits.

 

[Deleted member]

They only content announced in the first that they didn't show off in the direct and didn't post on the site is Boss Rush, which was only shown in Sakurai's demonstration, though that suggests that it is finished...
It could be referring to that, it can't really be anything else if it's announced on the site.

What you smoking we didn't see any Boss Rush

 

[Deleted member]

RIP Steve
View attachment 178988

steve from minecraft ****ing dies (2018) (colorized)

I was always suspicious of Hitagi when verge didn't back any of ehr claims, and just said that he kinda sorta trusted her

tbh I'm sick and tired of fake leaks just either rip the band-aid off and actually leak all the characters ESRB-style or let me enjoy the hype cycle dammit

 

[Untouch]

**** wait Boss Rush is confirmed?

Wait, I'm wrong. Sorry, I thought the World of Light button was actually a Boss Rush.

 

[Zeox]

Here's a Fortnite Sans to celebrate the "no Steve".
Unless you wanted Steve, then here's a Fortnite Sans to cry for Steve.

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

If someone says this again I swear

View attachment 178993

Actually that's a robloxian you're quoting.


Hey, is that Digimon guy still here? I feel really bad for him atm

 

[Idon]

God, all the Square talk has gotten me back into Dissidia and holy **** is that one hell of a fanservice game.

The character designers really did some cool **** especially for the older characterd that were just 16×16 sprites on a CRT.

That said, Bartz Klauser or Terra Branford for Smash.

 

[Foulds]

Here's a Fortnite Sans to celebrate the "no Steve".
Unless you wanted Steve, then here's a Fortnite Sans to cry for Steve.

and now I have a vision impairment

 

[MainJPW]

No it's also Steve. Went over this while you were gone. Both have this quote.

It’s also Mario.

 

[LetterO]

For the record, I don't dislike Incineroar, but you're overtly defensive over a criticism I have toward a character (which is mostly on Game Freak's part more than anything).

Sakurai chose Incineroar, Gamefreak wasn’t mentioned at all. Sakurai left open a Pokemon slot and waited after USUM and chose Incineroar. He didn’t mention Gamefreak giving a list like they did Greninja.

 

[kirbsmash]

I don't even care about Steve, y'all can have him! I got my favorites.

 

[Deleted member]

I find it funny we're complaining about starters when back before Greninja was a thing we thought it wasn't ever gonna happen because it was all of them or bust. I'm glad Sakurai is going in this direction, but I wish he could have started it with Feraligatr.

 

[Zeox]

and now I have a vision impairment

Then my job is done here.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

Steve: "Mr. Sakurai, I don't feel so good..."

Let's not get ahead of ourselves now. Steve still has a good chance of getting in due to Sakurai liking Minecraft and it being the second best-selling game of all time. Regardless, I'm happy with what happened. DLC speculation will be a lot more fun since we don't know what to expect.

 

[Grunky Peep]

So now that Hitagi.exe has stopped working, all we know is that there is an unknown Square Enix character.

 

[Foulds]

I find it funny we're complaining about starters when back before Greninja was a thing we thought it wasn't ever gonna happen because it was all of them or bust. I'm glad Sakurai is going in this direction, but I wish he could have started it with Feraligatr.

there are a lot of interesting and cool pokemon tbh, so I hope he doesn't restrict his choices to just starters in future.

honestly I've been hoping for a ghost pokemon to get in at some point, I feel like moveset potential would be interesting and it's the sort of character we don't already have in smash atm.

 

[Deleted member]

@JDCabrera

Sounds like Madden Player got some competition, eh?

I would prefer an EA Sports rep over an Activision rep from Atari getting over Crash, tbh.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

TPC I love ya but are you telling me you think Erdrick and Nintendo Promotional Rep are more exciting and hypeworthy than Geno, or Bandana Dee, or even Banjo to an extent

I can understand /why/-because they're unexpected or at least were-but like...K. Rool is regarded as one of this games more hypeworthy moments, and a lot of us expected he was coming.

The picks listed up there would definitely hype the core fanbase this game is aimed for I think.

>Geno, a niche character who appeared in one game 20 years ago
>Erdrick, the Marth of one of, if not the most popular video game series in Japan and overall one of the largest video game series not represented in Smash

People at least know Dragon Quest in passing; Geno is a literal who outside of the Smash fanbase. It comes down to the core vs. the wider fanbase, and I can't imagine Nintendo catering exclusively or majorly to the core fanbase. This is proven by the inclusion of Isabelle, Incineroar, and Piranha Plant, none of which cater to the core fanbase; this game appeals to a wider fanbase. The Nintendo Promotional Rep was a bone thrown to Nintendo because its realistic.

K. Rool is an exception because EVERYONE wanted him. America, Japan, Europe, the core fanbase (who brigaded the Ballot), old time fans of Donkey Kong Country, etc. If you participated in any sort of Smash Bros. speculation you would know who K. Rool is, or if you watched any Top 10 lists K. Rool was 10/10 times going to be on that list. Only casual fans didn't know about him, but there was a very large majority to justify his inclusion.

The major Smash poll on Reddit proves that most of Geno's fanbase comes from America, and therefore he has less popularity in other countries. I'll concede that he is popular, but he is certainly no King K. Rool.

 

[FreeFox]

Just a few factors for both Incineroar and Pokemon, but I have a jab against Fire Emblem as well so that's not off the hook entirely.
For Incineroar, it's that he's another fully-evolved Fire Starter when we already have one, on top of the fact that it's another safe and basic choice for a Pokemon fighter. Alola gave us Ultra-Beasts and other interesting non-starter Pokemon, what gives? This franchise has a "Tutorial Level" mindset when it comes to reps post Gen 1. All of that being said, Incineroar is a lot of fun to watch, so he's got that going for him.

For Gen 8, we don't know what's in it beyond Meltan. Meltan is adorable, but selling us on the guy just won't do it. Where are the rest? We should acquaint ourselves with the Pokemon first before they're put on a paywall. Fire Emblem Three Houses is guilty of this possibility too. We don't know the characters! We should learn about them and learn to like the characters on our own, and that's another positive Incineroar has on his list. Sure, he's controversial, but at least we got to know him.

All in all, it's Game Freak's behavior with the franchise. They go about it in such an uninspired and boring way that a lot of what they've done lately feels like they're regressing and missing out on a lot of opportunities. Instead, we continuously get Gen 1 after Gen 1 shilling non-stop, and they go about the franchise in such a corporate fashion that the decisions end up being boring and predictable to a fault. They're the anti-Sakurai in more ways than one. That's just my 2 cents though. If we get a Gen 8 'Mon, I just hope it's cool.

Can we stop the two fire starters argument?

They dont have a similar body type, they dont have the same type of movement, they share no moves at all, they dont seem like they have a similar playstyle at all. Despite, being a fire starter, he doesnt even have a single fire type move. The comparison is absolutely superficial. It is like saying that Ivysaur and duck Hunt play the same because they are quadruped. Or that Rosalina and Peach are the same because of the crowns and the dresses.

 

[kirbsmash]

hey guys, question, what are your ideas on why Dr.Mario isn't an echo?

 

[Iridium]

Best reveal trailer of this game was Everyone is Here because my boi was revealed that way

The entire introduction did it for me too. See Link's face before he blows up the Remote Bomb? That's going to be me every match I play.

 

[Deleted member]

there are a lot of interesting and cool pokemon tbh, so I hope he doesn't restrict his choices to just starters in future.

honestly I've been hoping for a ghost pokemon to get in at some point, I feel like moveset potential would be interesting and it's the sort of character we don't already have in smash atm.

Starter Pokemon are always sure to be some of the most popular and they now always have cool gimmicks to them. For now, it's good, all it need is a grass starter because of my OCD and then he can move onto other types.

 

[RandomAce]

>tephony

It's tehponycorn you guys. Not the, not te, TEH.

I've had this username for years (since I was like, 12) and I've been here for years. Come on guys. /s

Youre first mistake, assume I was a weeb since 2013.

I have only been a weeb for a year.

Since SE char came from Vergeben and has been part of his line up for a while and Hitagi was the one who said Steve, I would guess that SE char is the one I would still call to be safe,

The SE character is the only character I would bet all my money to be in the game.

 

[Deleted member]

hey guys, question, what are your ideas on why Dr.Mario isn't an echo?

I think it's partially seniority, but he also seems to have gotten a lot of things to distinguish himself from Mario this time around so maybe it's that.

 

[Idon]

Starter Pokemon are always sure to be some of the most popular and they now always have cool gimmicks to them. For now, it's good, all it need is a grass starter because of my OCD and then he can move onto other types.

I'm banking on Sceptile because he has the SICK ASS IZUNA DROP.

LEAF STORM HAS NEVER LOOKED SO SICK

 

[Deleted member]

I remember my dissapointment when Other M Samus appeared on the “Everyone is Here Trailer!” without the Samus Returns Varia Suit as a skin, my anger after seeing it and how Ridley made me hyped at last.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

I went to go check if the demo for Smash was out, cuz a Best Buy employee I was talking to earlier said it woupdate be out by yesterday. He was full of lies.

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

So since Hitagi is now oof...what about verge? Remember, he said he trusted her

 

[Luigi The President]

>Geno, a niche character who appeared in one game 20 years ago
>Erdrick, the Marth of one of, if not the most popular video game series in Japan and overall one of the largest video game series not represented in Smash

People at least know Dragon Quest in passing; Geno is a literal who outside of the Smash fanbase. It comes down to the core vs. the wider fanbase, and I can't imagine Nintendo catering exclusively or majorly to the core fanbase, as proven Isabelle, Incineroar, and Piranha Plant, none of which cater to the core fanbase. The Nintendo Promotional Rep was a bone thrown to Nintendo because its realistic.

K. Rool is an exception because EVERYONE wanted him. America, Japan, Europe, the core fanbase (who brigaded the Ballot), old time fans of Donkey Kong Country, etc. If you participated in any sort of Smash Bros. speculation you would know who K. Rool is, or if you watched any Top 10 lists K. Rool was 10/10 times going to be on that list.

The major Smash poll on Reddit proves that most of Geno's fanbase comes from America, and therefore he has less popularity in other countries. I'll concede that he is popular, but he is certainly no King K. Rool.

"Japan" is the key word here. Erdrick's popularity is almost solely Japan so it feels unfair to include him but bin Geno because he has less popularity in other places.

I just wanted to raise those pointers though. The rest of your list like Sora and Doomguy will be indisputable hype machines, but I just had some qualms with the Nintendo Promo Rep (I understand why they're in now) and Erdrick.

Thanks for the response my guy. Though I feel it's unfair to say "if you participated in any Smash speculation you'd know K. Rool" when the same absolutely applies to Geno.

But, you know me well, I'm a rabid Geno fan-don't trust my views too much! Just wanted to voice my points.

Thanks again chief.

 

[doomedtacox]

So now that Hitagi.exe has stopped working, all we know is that there is an unknown Square Enix character.

And minecraft content.

 

[KarneraMythos]

The thing with Incineroar's inclusion is that Sakurai doesn't care about type representation. He looks at what the Pokemon itself can offer, and Incineroar is both a dedicated wrestler and feline character which Smash has never had before. I do agree with your opinion on GameFreak though. I am sick to death of the constant Gen 1 pandering, and they are just plain incompetent and lazy as developers. Sadly, Pokemon games will always sell well, so there is no incentive for lots of effort to be put into the series anymore.

Again, let me reiterate: Incineroar is a fun character. I just think that he's proof of how Game Freak largely influences Sakurai's decisions with Pokemon reps, to a point where every rep we could possibly get from this point on is going to be a Starter of some kind (or something else from Gen 1). Ehh, on second thought, it's hard to imagine Smash going anywhere beyond Ultimate.

Actually that's a robloxian you're quoting.


Hey, is that Digimon guy still here? I feel really bad for him atm

It's still possible that we'll get a rep from Bamco. Hitagi's comment comes off as, "Never mind. Nothing big has been discussed yet, so no one knows who the characters are." We might get a Bamco rep; we might not get a Bamco rep. The difference between then and now (in speculation terms) is that we don't know "who" and "if".

Can we stop the two fire starters argument?

They dont have a similar body type, they dont have the same type of movement, they share no moves at all, they dont seem like they have a similar playstyle at all. Despite, being a fire starter, he doesnt even have a single fire type move. The comparison is absolutely superficial. It is like saying that Ivysaur and duck Hunt play the same because they are quadruped. Or that Rosalina and Peach are the same because of the crowns and the dresses.

Can you stop nitpicking? His fire-typing isn't the centerpiece of my criticism. It's toward Game Freak and how they go about advertising things that makes them really unexciting in Smash. Fire Emblem is in the same boat for me, and this is coming from someone who's fine with 4's line-up. I dislike the idea of getting 3 Houses rep and a Gen 8 rep before knowing who the hell we're dealing with. It's advertisement done in the worst way possible.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Even if stealth is being BS here. Cloud being the last vet isn't .

He still only has 2 songs, no other SE Spirits other than a Fighter Spirit of Cloud, and him being the only 3rd party character not in the WoL trailer. Heck it'll probably be proven right if he's one of the very last characters recruited in WoL.

As for the effect of the DLC SE rep. If the SE rep is actually fake then I believe the 1st DLC character revealed if it's around the VGAs could be Lloyd based on the Tales anniversary being in December and the broadcast being 2 days after VGAs and one day after Ultimate's release rather than around the 15th.

 

[MainJPW]

hey guys, question, what are your ideas on why Dr.Mario isn't an echo?

Dr. Mario lacks FLUDD, has a different Dair, and different stats.

 

[Luigi The President]

Even if stealth is being BS here. Cloud being the last vet isn't .

He still only has 2 songs, no other SE Spirits other than a Fighter Spirit of Cloud, and him being the only 3rd party character not in the WoL trailer. Heck it'll probably be proven right if he's one of the very last characters recruited in WoL.

As for the effect of the DLC SE rep. If the SE rep is actually fake then I believe the 1st DLC character revealed if it's around the VGAs could be Lloyd based on the Tales anniversary being in December and the broadcast being 2 days after VGAs and one day after Ultimate's release rather than around the 15th.

Don't see how any of this is relevant if the plan of "EVERYONE IS HERE" was finalized in 2015.
They've had literally 3 years to throw in some SE Spirits, it clearly isn't the time he was added stopping them.

I don't think even Cloud being one of the last recruited proves anything right because he was one of Smash 4's final characters.

 

[staindgrey]

I'm thinking of going all in for my Jill Valentine for DLC support. But I'm still pretty attached to my Midna-in-a-hoodie icon.

What to do, what to dooooo.

 

[Pyra]

Hitagi is now oof

ohhh mannnn how could this have haaaaappened

/s

 

[praline]

I'm thinking of going all in for my Jill Valentine for DLC support. But I'm still pretty attached to my Midna-in-a-hoodie icon.

What to do, what to dooooo.

Jill would be a hype dlc character.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

"Japan" is the key word here. Erdrick's popularity is almost solely Japan so it feels unfair to include him but bin Geno because he has less popularity in other places.

I just wanted to raise those pointers though. The rest of your list like Sora and Doomguy will be indisputable hype machines, but I just had some qualms with the Nintendo Promo Rep (I understand why they're in now) and Erdrick.

Thanks for the response my guy. Though I feel it's unfair to say "if you participated in any Smash speculation you'd know K. Rool" when the same absolutely applies to Geno.

But, you know me well, I'm a rabid Geno fan-don't trust my views too much! Just wanted to voice my points.

Thanks again chief.

No, your points are totally fair. I personally underestimate Geno most times, but he is/was a part of the Holy Trinity of Smash speculation characters.

I feel like Dragon Quest gets a buy here because Square Enix is making a hard effort to break into the Western market. Calane probably knows more about it given he's the resident Dragon Quest guy, but now more than ever they're trying to make Dragon Quest a global series. Dragon Quest XIS is coming to Switch soon, and the promotional opportunity seems too good to pass up.

It's unfortunate for both you and I, but we're likely getting a DQ character.

 

[Idon]

I'm thinking of going all in for my Jill Valentine for DLC support. But I'm still pretty attached to my Midna-in-a-hoodie icon.

What to do, what to dooooo.

Midna cosplaying as Jill.
Jill cosplaying as Midna.