Radical Bones
Soul King
I've played every Kirby game bar Squeak Squad and just love Marx. Don't wanna start any argument here, but I'd much rather Marx before Bandanna Dee. He just has more personality and potential IMO.
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Official Smash Ultimate Discussion
- Thread starter IntelliHeath1
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Sure thing!Good news everyone! I GOT ROSTER MAKER ON MAC.
I'll be looking to upload a roster of my very own sooner or later. I've been obsessed with it almost all night. Still trying to work out the kinks, and actually added characters I never thought I would add.
BTWOpossum could you share some of your ideas for Celica? Last time I read your ideas for her I was interested, but I'm forgetting some of the specifics!
Moveset
Normal Attacks
Jab: Using the Beloved Zofia, Celica performs a three hit combo attack. The first strike comes downward from overhead, the second comes from the side in a sweeping motion, and the third has Celica twirling a bit, swinging the blade from behind in an upward motion. This is based on her in-dungeon combo from Shadows of Valentia. Specifically, it comes directly from her second, third, and fourth strike.
Dash Attack: The small wisp of fire following Celica creates a wall of flames in front of her as she charges forward. Unlike her other magical attacks, no recoil is done here. This is changed, however, if Celica charges her Fire special. If it is charged, this move makes Celica take minor recoil damage, but also makes the move hit much harder. This is taken directly from her dash attack in Shadows of Valentia.
Up Tilt: Celica points the Beloved Zofia skyward as the glowing flame beside her becomes three fire balls, which twirl around the tip of her sword. A multi-hit move.
Side Tilt: Celica thrusts the Beloved Zofia forward, moving slightly in the direction she's facing while doing so. This move comes from the first and fifth strike of her in-dungeon combo in Shadows of Valentia.
Down Tilt: Celica, while crouched, moves her hand outward, launching a small, thunderous spark toward the ground. Due to the stun effect, this move can combo into itself twice before knockback forces foes away.
Smash Attacks:
Up Smash: Celica, using the Beloved Zofia like a sort of baton, casts Excalibur above her, creating a slow-rising razor wind. It travels higher up and does more damage the longer it is charged. The move has a trapping effect due to it being a rapid multi-hit move.
Side Smash: Celica leaps up and smashes the Beloved Zofia downward onto opponents. This is based on her critical hit and finishing blow animation in both Gaiden and Shadows of Valentia. However, this move does far less knockback than the rest of her smash attacks, due to not being magically backed.
Down Smash: Celica performs her casting animation and casts Thunder, hitting both sides of the ground beside her with bolts of lightning.
Aerial Attacks:
Neutral Air: Celica's fire ball splits into a small stream of fire. Celica moves the Beloved Zofia in a circular motion and the stream of flames circles around her twice, clockwise.
Forward Air: Celica, using a variation of Seraphim, quickly grows angelic wings and uses them to slam foes both forward and downward. This move is based on one of Celica's attacks in Fire Emblem Warriors.
Back Air: Celica quickly makes a backhanded strike with the Beloved Zofia. Here, the tip of the blade is blessed with the Thunder spell, creating a small orb of electricity at the end. Hitting with the spark does much more damage.
Up Air: Celica uses another variant of Excalibur, sending a small gust of wind upward. Knockback-wise and potency-wise, it is somewhere between Mega Man's and Mr. Game and Watch's wind-based up airs.
Down Air: Celica points her arms downward, spreading her fireball into a stream of fire beneath her in a parabolic arc.
Grab, Pummel, and Throws:
Grab and Pummel: Celica has a fairly standard grab, and pummels by imbuing her hands with fire to burn the opponent. The pummel does not, however, cause recoil damage, despite being magic-based. This holds true for Celica's throws as well.
Forward Throw: Celica releases the foe as three columns of fire erupt in front of her, beneath the foe, carrying them away before causing severe knockback.
Back Throw: Celica tosses the foe back and releases a blast of light magic from her hands, sending them flying.
Up Throw: Celica waves her arms overhead after bringing her foe upward, shocking them with electricity before launching them.
Down Throw: Pointing her Beloved Zofia to the ground, three strikes of compressed wind energy pummel the foe before bouncing them off the ground of the stage.
Specials:
Neutral Special: Fire (Ragnarok) - Celica charges up her fire ball that shoots forward before exploding. At full charge, this becomes Ragnarok, which is incredibly powerful, doing roughly 35% damage and quite a bit of knock back, but at the expense of Celica taking hefty recoil damage. Chargeable and storable. While it is stored, however, any attack using Celica's fire ball will grow in power, but the recoil damage of the move will be more severe. This does not effect her pummel or forward throw, however.
Side Special: Seraphim - Celica clasps her hands together as she is bathed in a flash of white light. A giant ball of white light surrounds Celica when the button is released, and it slowly moves forward. If the opponent is overlapping Celica's light, they will be trapped similarly to Mewtwo's neutral air, before being carried forward with the ball of light and being erupted from it when it reaches its full distance. A "get off me" move befitting Celica's connection to Mila and having one of her weaknesses protected.
Up Special: Excalibur - Celica summons a gust of razor wind around her as she ascends. Nearby foes get cut by the wind, though Celica also takes minor damage from this move (less than five percent).
Down Special: Mila's Turnwheel - Celica clasps her hands and enters a praying stance. A counter-styled move, if Celica activates this move at the right moment of impact with the foe, the foe is pushed away, doing no damage. However, Celica is healed by ten percent, making it a very risky way of restoring health. Note, though, that the move has far stricter timing than other Counter-like moves, and excessive usage of the move will lower the amount of health it heals.
Final Smash: Ragnarok Ω - If foes are in range of the attack's start up, a cutscene plays, based on Celica's in-game cutscene when activating this move. Visually, they're essentially the same. The move then ends. Unlike in Shadows of Valentia, this move does not cause recoil damage to Celica, due to being her Final Smash.
Overview:
Celica mainly relies on her spells, with a few moves utilizing the Beloved Zofia, like her jab. The Beloved Zofia acts more like a conduit for her spells here than an actual weapon for most of her moveset, where she makes graceful guiding motions with it to focus her spells, not unlike a baton, or how Toon Link uses the Wind Waker. For the few attacks where she uses the Beloved Zofia for offense, she takes a more rapier-like style.
Like in Shadows of Valentia's dungeon segments, Celica is followed by a small wisp of fire. This is mostly cosmetic and serves as a neat way for her to animate some of her attacks, but also benefits from her neutral special, wherein she can increase its size the more she charges her Fire spell. This increases the size of some of her attacks' hit boxes at the expense of more recoil damage, and after firing off her charged Fire or Ragnarok, the wisp fizzles back to its original size.
In reference to Gaiden and Shadows of Valentia's unique magic system, Celica takes a variant of Pichu's self damage gimmick, but better executed. Celica does more self damage the more potent her spells are, but can reliably kill using them. Her issue stems from her being the epitome of a glass cannon, as she can't take hits well at all, especially when using her higher recoil spells. In addition to reflecting her game of origin's mechanics, her moveset also reflects her personality and character, with her gracefulness coming through in her use of the Beloved Zofia and her penchant for self-sacrifice coming through in her powerful spells' recoil.
Entrance Animation:
Celica slowly walks in and creates her wisp of fire from her hand, as in her dungeon entrance animation from Shadows of Valentia.
Taunts:
Up Taunt - Celica holds her right arm up as the wisp of fire wraps around it, traveling upward until it bursts into flames above her hand, all while saying "I'm not about to stop here!"
Side Taunt - Celica holds a hand over her heart and says "Guide me, Mila."
Down Taunt - Twirls and puts a hand on her hip, saying "All thanks to the Mother." This is taken directly from her Shadows of Valentia victory animation.
Victory Animations:
Victory 1: Celica exits a kneeling prayer stance, breathing a sigh of relief.
Victory 2. Celica sheathes the Beloved Zofia and says "The Mother has seen us through safely."
Victory 3: Celica gracefully launches a fireball upward, which explodes like a firework, sending down small embers.
Credits Theme (if custom Classic Mode credits return from Brawl) : With Mila's Divine Protection (Celica Map 1) or The Heritors of Arcadia
Alternate Costume: Rigain Celica, taken directly from her Overclass outfit.
Codec:
Snake: Colonel, this girl is using magic. What do you know about her?
Colonel: That's Celica, Snake, though she's also known as Princess Anthiese of Zofia.
Snake: So she's royalty, huh?
Colonel: Princess Anthiese went into hiding at a young age after an attempted coup led to the murder of her entire family. She's since stayed at a priory, and in turn became a priestess of Mila, skilled in both swordplay and magic.
Snake: I wouldn't expect a holy woman to be fighting here.
Colonel: She may be kind, but don't underestimate her, Snake. Her magic can call upon the powers of fire, thunder, wind, and holy light. You'd do well to stay away. Her magic is powerful, but it comes at the cost of her health. Use that to your advantage.
Snake: Have her whittle away at her own health, huh? Got it.
Normal Attacks
Jab: Using the Beloved Zofia, Celica performs a three hit combo attack. The first strike comes downward from overhead, the second comes from the side in a sweeping motion, and the third has Celica twirling a bit, swinging the blade from behind in an upward motion. This is based on her in-dungeon combo from Shadows of Valentia. Specifically, it comes directly from her second, third, and fourth strike.
Dash Attack: The small wisp of fire following Celica creates a wall of flames in front of her as she charges forward. Unlike her other magical attacks, no recoil is done here. This is changed, however, if Celica charges her Fire special. If it is charged, this move makes Celica take minor recoil damage, but also makes the move hit much harder. This is taken directly from her dash attack in Shadows of Valentia.
Up Tilt: Celica points the Beloved Zofia skyward as the glowing flame beside her becomes three fire balls, which twirl around the tip of her sword. A multi-hit move.
Side Tilt: Celica thrusts the Beloved Zofia forward, moving slightly in the direction she's facing while doing so. This move comes from the first and fifth strike of her in-dungeon combo in Shadows of Valentia.
Down Tilt: Celica, while crouched, moves her hand outward, launching a small, thunderous spark toward the ground. Due to the stun effect, this move can combo into itself twice before knockback forces foes away.
Smash Attacks:
Up Smash: Celica, using the Beloved Zofia like a sort of baton, casts Excalibur above her, creating a slow-rising razor wind. It travels higher up and does more damage the longer it is charged. The move has a trapping effect due to it being a rapid multi-hit move.
Side Smash: Celica leaps up and smashes the Beloved Zofia downward onto opponents. This is based on her critical hit and finishing blow animation in both Gaiden and Shadows of Valentia. However, this move does far less knockback than the rest of her smash attacks, due to not being magically backed.
Down Smash: Celica performs her casting animation and casts Thunder, hitting both sides of the ground beside her with bolts of lightning.
Aerial Attacks:
Neutral Air: Celica's fire ball splits into a small stream of fire. Celica moves the Beloved Zofia in a circular motion and the stream of flames circles around her twice, clockwise.
Forward Air: Celica, using a variation of Seraphim, quickly grows angelic wings and uses them to slam foes both forward and downward. This move is based on one of Celica's attacks in Fire Emblem Warriors.
Back Air: Celica quickly makes a backhanded strike with the Beloved Zofia. Here, the tip of the blade is blessed with the Thunder spell, creating a small orb of electricity at the end. Hitting with the spark does much more damage.
Up Air: Celica uses another variant of Excalibur, sending a small gust of wind upward. Knockback-wise and potency-wise, it is somewhere between Mega Man's and Mr. Game and Watch's wind-based up airs.
Down Air: Celica points her arms downward, spreading her fireball into a stream of fire beneath her in a parabolic arc.
Grab, Pummel, and Throws:
Grab and Pummel: Celica has a fairly standard grab, and pummels by imbuing her hands with fire to burn the opponent. The pummel does not, however, cause recoil damage, despite being magic-based. This holds true for Celica's throws as well.
Forward Throw: Celica releases the foe as three columns of fire erupt in front of her, beneath the foe, carrying them away before causing severe knockback.
Back Throw: Celica tosses the foe back and releases a blast of light magic from her hands, sending them flying.
Up Throw: Celica waves her arms overhead after bringing her foe upward, shocking them with electricity before launching them.
Down Throw: Pointing her Beloved Zofia to the ground, three strikes of compressed wind energy pummel the foe before bouncing them off the ground of the stage.
Specials:
Neutral Special: Fire (Ragnarok) - Celica charges up her fire ball that shoots forward before exploding. At full charge, this becomes Ragnarok, which is incredibly powerful, doing roughly 35% damage and quite a bit of knock back, but at the expense of Celica taking hefty recoil damage. Chargeable and storable. While it is stored, however, any attack using Celica's fire ball will grow in power, but the recoil damage of the move will be more severe. This does not effect her pummel or forward throw, however.
Side Special: Seraphim - Celica clasps her hands together as she is bathed in a flash of white light. A giant ball of white light surrounds Celica when the button is released, and it slowly moves forward. If the opponent is overlapping Celica's light, they will be trapped similarly to Mewtwo's neutral air, before being carried forward with the ball of light and being erupted from it when it reaches its full distance. A "get off me" move befitting Celica's connection to Mila and having one of her weaknesses protected.
Up Special: Excalibur - Celica summons a gust of razor wind around her as she ascends. Nearby foes get cut by the wind, though Celica also takes minor damage from this move (less than five percent).
Down Special: Mila's Turnwheel - Celica clasps her hands and enters a praying stance. A counter-styled move, if Celica activates this move at the right moment of impact with the foe, the foe is pushed away, doing no damage. However, Celica is healed by ten percent, making it a very risky way of restoring health. Note, though, that the move has far stricter timing than other Counter-like moves, and excessive usage of the move will lower the amount of health it heals.
Final Smash: Ragnarok Ω - If foes are in range of the attack's start up, a cutscene plays, based on Celica's in-game cutscene when activating this move. Visually, they're essentially the same. The move then ends. Unlike in Shadows of Valentia, this move does not cause recoil damage to Celica, due to being her Final Smash.
Overview:
Celica mainly relies on her spells, with a few moves utilizing the Beloved Zofia, like her jab. The Beloved Zofia acts more like a conduit for her spells here than an actual weapon for most of her moveset, where she makes graceful guiding motions with it to focus her spells, not unlike a baton, or how Toon Link uses the Wind Waker. For the few attacks where she uses the Beloved Zofia for offense, she takes a more rapier-like style.
Like in Shadows of Valentia's dungeon segments, Celica is followed by a small wisp of fire. This is mostly cosmetic and serves as a neat way for her to animate some of her attacks, but also benefits from her neutral special, wherein she can increase its size the more she charges her Fire spell. This increases the size of some of her attacks' hit boxes at the expense of more recoil damage, and after firing off her charged Fire or Ragnarok, the wisp fizzles back to its original size.
In reference to Gaiden and Shadows of Valentia's unique magic system, Celica takes a variant of Pichu's self damage gimmick, but better executed. Celica does more self damage the more potent her spells are, but can reliably kill using them. Her issue stems from her being the epitome of a glass cannon, as she can't take hits well at all, especially when using her higher recoil spells. In addition to reflecting her game of origin's mechanics, her moveset also reflects her personality and character, with her gracefulness coming through in her use of the Beloved Zofia and her penchant for self-sacrifice coming through in her powerful spells' recoil.
Entrance Animation:
Celica slowly walks in and creates her wisp of fire from her hand, as in her dungeon entrance animation from Shadows of Valentia.
Taunts:
Up Taunt - Celica holds her right arm up as the wisp of fire wraps around it, traveling upward until it bursts into flames above her hand, all while saying "I'm not about to stop here!"
Side Taunt - Celica holds a hand over her heart and says "Guide me, Mila."
Down Taunt - Twirls and puts a hand on her hip, saying "All thanks to the Mother." This is taken directly from her Shadows of Valentia victory animation.
Victory Animations:
Victory 1: Celica exits a kneeling prayer stance, breathing a sigh of relief.
Victory 2. Celica sheathes the Beloved Zofia and says "The Mother has seen us through safely."
Victory 3: Celica gracefully launches a fireball upward, which explodes like a firework, sending down small embers.
Credits Theme (if custom Classic Mode credits return from Brawl) : With Mila's Divine Protection (Celica Map 1) or The Heritors of Arcadia
Alternate Costume: Rigain Celica, taken directly from her Overclass outfit.
Codec:
Snake: Colonel, this girl is using magic. What do you know about her?
Colonel: That's Celica, Snake, though she's also known as Princess Anthiese of Zofia.
Snake: So she's royalty, huh?
Colonel: Princess Anthiese went into hiding at a young age after an attempted coup led to the murder of her entire family. She's since stayed at a priory, and in turn became a priestess of Mila, skilled in both swordplay and magic.
Snake: I wouldn't expect a holy woman to be fighting here.
Colonel: She may be kind, but don't underestimate her, Snake. Her magic can call upon the powers of fire, thunder, wind, and holy light. You'd do well to stay away. Her magic is powerful, but it comes at the cost of her health. Use that to your advantage.
Snake: Have her whittle away at her own health, huh? Got it.
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Yellowlord
ゆゆネーター
Why not both?
As unlikely as that is, admittedly, it would give Kirby series the last of the "RTDL 4" and the series first villain. If I had to choose between the two, I would favor Bandana Dee, but let's just wait and see.
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Chron
Smash Journeyman
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Meta Knight?
Why not both?
As unlikely as that is, admittedly, it would give Kirby series the last of the "RTDL 4" and the series first villain. If I had to choose between the two, I would favor Bandana Dee, but let's just wait and see.
Yellowlord
ゆゆネーター
I wouldn't really consider Meta Knight to be a villain; he's more of an anti-hero in the Kirby series nowadays. The only time he was truly an antagonist in any form was in the Revenge of Meta Knight sub-game in Super Star/Super Star Ultra. Otherwise, he's never been a deliberate villain and has even been a mentor to Kirby at times.
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Radical Bones
Soul King
Meta-Knight generally is working for the greater good and is considered more of a rival. He's only really a villain in Meta-Knight's Revenge and his motivation has always bugged me...
The only way I would've said "only 5 newcomers" is if it were a Deluxe port as originally rumored. And I think it's clear by this point that it's probably not.Two+ years in secret and you expect only 5 newcomers?
And I thoughtBurb was the most downplayed individual in Hype in all of Smashland.
As far as Smash 4 veterans go, I 100% agree.
I'd only put him second overall, though. I think Cloud's the most likely cut of them all.
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Ghirahilda
♥Smash Beauty♥
What the Multi-man characters will be this time? Polygons? Wire Frames? Alloys? MIIS?
Also doing every mode with ALL characters was pretty painful
Also doing every mode with ALL characters was pretty painful
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Guybrush20X6
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Here's a hypothetical: Multiple characters from a 3rd party franchise are allowed and to make things fair, every franchise has to have two characters.
Who would be the second one for existing ones and who'd accompany the main character for any additional 3rd party series?
(To make things a bit more interesting, let's say Pac-Man's verse covers all Namco arcade games, Mega Man's covers all sub-series and Final Fantasy isn't restricted to just 7)
My picks
Sonic: Tails
Pac-Man: Dig-Dug
Mega Man: Zero
Street Fighter: Chun-li
Final Fantasy: Black Mage (or if only named characters, Terra)
Bayonetta: Jaunne
Metal Gear: Venom Snake
Rayman: (Rayman &) Barbra
Shantae: (Shantae &) Risky Boots
Shovel Knight: (Shovel Knight &)... this one's a bit tricky.
Who would be the second one for existing ones and who'd accompany the main character for any additional 3rd party series?
(To make things a bit more interesting, let's say Pac-Man's verse covers all Namco arcade games, Mega Man's covers all sub-series and Final Fantasy isn't restricted to just 7)
My picks
Sonic: Tails
Pac-Man: Dig-Dug
Mega Man: Zero
Street Fighter: Chun-li
Final Fantasy: Black Mage (or if only named characters, Terra)
Bayonetta: Jaunne
Metal Gear: Venom Snake
Rayman: (Rayman &) Barbra
Shantae: (Shantae &) Risky Boots
Shovel Knight: (Shovel Knight &)... this one's a bit tricky.
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Pakky
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I would like both, both are great and unique characters
You had be a at Dig Dug.
Chun-li I would love
Jaunne I could see, in 2 she's less like Bayonetta. And she's alwyas reffered to as the swordswoman of the two so there's that .
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DJ3DS
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Not a particularly controversial roster and it looks like it scratches most people's itches. I guess my questions are as follows:
1) What differentiates Yarn Yoshi from Yoshi?
2) We've not seen any KI since last time, so why another character?
3) I'm unfamiliar with Marx, so what makes him more interesting than the more obvious Bandana Dee?
4) Isn't Balloon Fighter's gimmick already taken by Villager?
5) Why no Ice Climbers? :'(
DraginHikari
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To be fair it was only Meta Knight's 2nd appearance in the main series at the time and I don't think his motivation was real well established at the time.
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Pakky
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Last edited:
I'll give my take on this. I'm mostly coming from how realistic I think it is. If this is just what you want to see, you can pretty much ignore this
- The one thing I like is you were far more reasonable with the guest characters. Too often people will have 8-10 of them which is just silly. I think its still a bit too high (and I can go into why if anyone cares), but I'd say its fairly reasonable. Crash is a decent pick if there is just one
- Props for Isabelle. Too many people ignore this character.
- Not sure about the classic picks. They are both interesting, but historically, there has always been a hardware and a software classic character (I know people hate patterns, but this has been the case for the last three games).
- On the same note, the only new Nintendo series is Splatoon? That seems odd especially when ARMS will probably happen too.
- There are a few doopy picks here. Why would Yarn Yoshi be a separate character? Why would Mimikyu be the new Pokemon character?
- Rex/Pyra and Captain Toad are good picks. K Rool and Ridley are good but I dont think both will get in. Dixie is so-so
- The rest of the characters I think are a stretch.
Radical Bones
Soul King
Yarn Yoshi would have inspiration from his Wii U and upcoming game. Changes such as running with wheels, flutter with a propeller, eggs that tie and more.
Despite no games coming out, KI is still incredibly popular and all Viridi was one of the most important figures in the game and prominent in Smash 4.
Marx has his ball, crystal wings, splice and transformation. Dee is a good choice too.
Balloon Fighter is more than one special move. Plenty of characters share or have similar moves. I see BF always in that form rather than just an up spesh.
I literally forgot them
they were meant to be added!
Cosmic77
Smash Hero
As much as I like KI, the support for the series just isn't as strong as it used to be. Things were looking good after Uprising, but Nintendo failed to capitalize on that success, and now the fanbase has drifted away to other things.
At this point, I think the series would basically need a second revival to guarantee a new character.
RosiePeaches
Banned via Warnings
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Here is my prediction roster!
Yellow are newcomers. (Ryu is missing but assume that he is here on the roster)
I cut Dark Pit because he is extremely similar to Pit to the point of being redundant. He is bascially the Metal Mario of Smash, but without a unique voice even! As for Shulk and Cloud, I feel like they were the main reason of why the "Anime Characters with Swords" trope is prevalent. They are by far the most common type of fighter in Smash. Cloud also has rights issues to contend with. Because of 8 Player Smash, I don't see Ice Climbers coming back.
For newcomers, I put Stunt Race FX car as the surprise obscure character...literally no one thinks that this fighter is possible, and it's not even a fighting figure...it's a car!
I added Spring Man and Ribbon Girl as separate characters because they have different stats, different abilities and even different extendable arms.
I added Princess Daisy, Waluigi and Toad as the Super Mario newcomers, they are the only non enemy and non generic characters to have a Mario amiibo, but NOT be in Smash Bros! Plus, they have a lot of fans between them and I think they can cover different fighter archetypes between them.
Since the game was planned in 2016 I think Decidueye will be added to the Smash roster as an poison/grass archer type. We don't have many plant/flower fighters in Smash and I think him and Daisy can fill that niche.
Midna could come with Wolf Link and they can fight using their Twilight powers...and Midna's large hand. Also, the Midna and Wolf Link amiibo are not compatible with Smash Bros...yet.
Chibi Robo also has an amiibo and he has interesting moveset potential with his lasso plug and electricity.
Crash Bandicoot is coming to Switch and I feel like Crash would be the perfect 3rd party newcomer.
Yellow are newcomers. (Ryu is missing but assume that he is here on the roster)
I cut Dark Pit because he is extremely similar to Pit to the point of being redundant. He is bascially the Metal Mario of Smash, but without a unique voice even! As for Shulk and Cloud, I feel like they were the main reason of why the "Anime Characters with Swords" trope is prevalent. They are by far the most common type of fighter in Smash. Cloud also has rights issues to contend with. Because of 8 Player Smash, I don't see Ice Climbers coming back.
For newcomers, I put Stunt Race FX car as the surprise obscure character...literally no one thinks that this fighter is possible, and it's not even a fighting figure...it's a car!
I added Spring Man and Ribbon Girl as separate characters because they have different stats, different abilities and even different extendable arms.
I added Princess Daisy, Waluigi and Toad as the Super Mario newcomers, they are the only non enemy and non generic characters to have a Mario amiibo, but NOT be in Smash Bros! Plus, they have a lot of fans between them and I think they can cover different fighter archetypes between them.
Since the game was planned in 2016 I think Decidueye will be added to the Smash roster as an poison/grass archer type. We don't have many plant/flower fighters in Smash and I think him and Daisy can fill that niche.
Midna could come with Wolf Link and they can fight using their Twilight powers...and Midna's large hand. Also, the Midna and Wolf Link amiibo are not compatible with Smash Bros...yet.
Chibi Robo also has an amiibo and he has interesting moveset potential with his lasso plug and electricity.
Crash Bandicoot is coming to Switch and I feel like Crash would be the perfect 3rd party newcomer.
D
Deleted member
Guest
People are honestly overestimating Steve's chances. I can see why Microsoft would give Banjo away, because Banjo is not as prominent. Would Microsoft really give away their precious cash-cow to a game that they do not own? I am a little confused, so you can help me on this.
Imagine if Sakurai actually never added Banjo because he wanted to surprise everyone by adding Banjo in Smash for Switch, which would make them buy Smash for Switch.
Imagine if Sakurai actually never added Banjo because he wanted to surprise everyone by adding Banjo in Smash for Switch, which would make them buy Smash for Switch.
Sorry if my feedback is short, but I love this move-set!Sure thing!
Fully detailed moveset with a playstyle explanation, alongside some fun bonus features like entrance and victory animations, taunts, a Snake codec should he return, unique credits theme if those come back from Brawl, and an alternate costume.Moveset
Normal Attacks
Jab: Using the Beloved Zofia, Celica performs a three hit combo attack. The first strike comes downward from overhead, the second comes from the side in a sweeping motion, and the third has Celica twirling a bit, swinging the blade from behind in an upward motion. This is based on her in-dungeon combo from Shadows of Valentia. Specifically, it comes directly from her second, third, and fourth strike.
Dash Attack: The small wisp of fire following Celica creates a wall of flames in front of her as she charges forward. Unlike her other magical attacks, no recoil is done here. This is changed, however, if Celica charges her Fire special. If it is charged, this move makes Celica take minor recoil damage, but also makes the move hit much harder. This is taken directly from her dash attack in Shadows of Valentia.
Up Tilt: Celica points the Beloved Zofia skyward as the glowing flame beside her becomes three fire balls, which twirl around the tip of her sword. A multi-hit move.
Side Tilt: Celica thrusts the Beloved Zofia forward, moving slightly in the direction she's facing while doing so. This move comes from the first and fifth strike of her in-dungeon combo in Shadows of Valentia.
Down Tilt: Celica, while crouched, moves her hand outward, launching a small, thunderous spark toward the ground. Due to the stun effect, this move can combo into itself twice before knockback forces foes away.
Smash Attacks:
Up Smash: Celica, using the Beloved Zofia like a sort of baton, casts Excalibur above her, creating a slow-rising razor wind. It travels higher up and does more damage the longer it is charged. The move has a trapping effect due to it being a rapid multi-hit move.
Side Smash: Celica leaps up and smashes the Beloved Zofia downward onto opponents. This is based on her critical hit and finishing blow animation in both Gaiden and Shadows of Valentia. However, this move does far less knockback than the rest of her smash attacks, due to not being magically backed.
Down Smash: Celica performs her casting animation and casts Thunder, hitting both sides of the ground beside her with bolts of lightning.
Aerial Attacks:
Neutral Air: Celica's fire ball splits into a small stream of fire. Celica moves the Beloved Zofia in a circular motion and the stream of flames circles around her twice, clockwise.
Forward Air: Celica, using a variation of Seraphim, quickly grows angelic wings and uses them to slam foes both forward and downward. This move is based on one of Celica's attacks in Fire Emblem Warriors.
Back Air: Celica quickly makes a backhanded strike with the Beloved Zofia. Here, the tip of the blade is blessed with the Thunder spell, creating a small orb of electricity at the end. Hitting with the spark does much more damage.
Up Air: Celica uses another variant of Excalibur, sending a small gust of wind upward. Knockback-wise and potency-wise, it is somewhere between Mega Man's and Mr. Game and Watch's wind-based up airs.
Down Air: Celica points her arms downward, spreading her fireball into a stream of fire beneath her in a parabolic arc.
Grab, Pummel, and Throws:
Grab and Pummel: Celica has a fairly standard grab, and pummels by imbuing her hands with fire to burn the opponent. The pummel does not, however, cause recoil damage, despite being magic-based. This holds true for Celica's throws as well.
Forward Throw: Celica releases the foe as three columns of fire erupt in front of her, beneath the foe, carrying them away before causing severe knockback.
Back Throw: Celica tosses the foe back and releases a blast of light magic from her hands, sending them flying.
Up Throw: Celica waves her arms overhead after bringing her foe upward, shocking them with electricity before launching them.
Down Throw: Pointing her Beloved Zofia to the ground, three strikes of compressed wind energy pummel the foe before bouncing them off the ground of the stage.
Specials:
Neutral Special: Fire (Ragnarok) - Celica charges up her fire ball that shoots forward before exploding. At full charge, this becomes Ragnarok, which is incredibly powerful, doing roughly 35% damage and quite a bit of knock back, but at the expense of Celica taking hefty recoil damage. Chargeable and storable. While it is stored, however, any attack using Celica's fire ball will grow in power, but the recoil damage of the move will be more severe. This does not effect her pummel or forward throw, however.
Side Special: Seraphim - Celica clasps her hands together as she is bathed in a flash of white light. A giant ball of white light surrounds Celica when the button is released, and it slowly moves forward. If the opponent is overlapping Celica's light, they will be trapped similarly to Mewtwo's neutral air, before being carried forward with the ball of light and being erupted from it when it reaches its full distance. A "get off me" move befitting Celica's connection to Mila and having one of her weaknesses protected.
Up Special: Excalibur - Celica summons a gust of razor wind around her as she ascends. Nearby foes get cut by the wind, though Celica also takes minor damage from this move (less than five percent).
Down Special: Mila's Turnwheel - Celica clasps her hands and enters a praying stance. A counter-styled move, if Celica activates this move at the right moment of impact with the foe, the foe is pushed away, doing no damage. However, Celica is healed by ten percent, making it a very risky way of restoring health. Note, though, that the move has far stricter timing than other Counter-like moves, and excessive usage of the move will lower the amount of health it heals.
Final Smash: Ragnarok Ω - If foes are in range of the attack's start up, a cutscene plays, based on Celica's in-game cutscene when activating this move. Visually, they're essentially the same. The move then ends. Unlike in Shadows of Valentia, this move does not cause recoil damage to Celica, due to being her Final Smash.
Overview:
Celica mainly relies on her spells, with a few moves utilizing the Beloved Zofia, like her jab. The Beloved Zofia acts more like a conduit for her spells here than an actual weapon for most of her moveset, where she makes graceful guiding motions with it to focus her spells, not unlike a baton, or how Toon Link uses the Wind Waker. For the few attacks where she uses the Beloved Zofia for offense, she takes a more rapier-like style.
Like in Shadows of Valentia's dungeon segments, Celica is followed by a small wisp of fire. This is mostly cosmetic and serves as a neat way for her to animate some of her attacks, but also benefits from her neutral special, wherein she can increase its size the more she charges her Fire spell. This increases the size of some of her attacks' hit boxes at the expense of more recoil damage, and after firing off her charged Fire or Ragnarok, the wisp fizzles back to its original size.
In reference to Gaiden and Shadows of Valentia's unique magic system, Celica takes a variant of Pichu's self damage gimmick, but better executed. Celica does more self damage the more potent her spells are, but can reliably kill using them. Her issue stems from her being the epitome of a glass cannon, as she can't take hits well at all, especially when using her higher recoil spells. In addition to reflecting her game of origin's mechanics, her moveset also reflects her personality and character, with her gracefulness coming through in her use of the Beloved Zofia and her penchant for self-sacrifice coming through in her powerful spells' recoil.
Entrance Animation:
Celica slowly walks in and creates her wisp of fire from her hand, as in her dungeon entrance animation from Shadows of Valentia.
Taunts:
Up Taunt - Celica holds her right arm up as the wisp of fire wraps around it, traveling upward until it bursts into flames above her hand, all while saying "I'm not about to stop here!"
Side Taunt - Celica holds a hand over her heart and says "Guide me, Mila."
Down Taunt - Twirls and puts a hand on her hip, saying "All thanks to the Mother." This is taken directly from her Shadows of Valentia victory animation.
Victory Animations:
Victory 1: Celica exits a kneeling prayer stance, breathing a sigh of relief.
Victory 2. Celica sheathes the Beloved Zofia and says "The Mother has seen us through safely."
Victory 3: Celica gracefully launches a fireball upward, which explodes like a firework, sending down small embers.
Credits Theme (if custom Classic Mode credits return from Brawl) : With Mila's Divine Protection (Celica Map 1) or The Heritors of Arcadia
Alternate Costume: Rigain Celica, taken directly from her Overclass outfit.
Codec:
Snake: Colonel, this girl is using magic. What do you know about her?
Colonel: That's Celica, Snake, though she's also known as Princess Anthiese of Zofia.
Snake: So she's royalty, huh?
Colonel: Princess Anthiese went into hiding at a young age after an attempted coup led to the murder of her entire family. She's since stayed at a priory, and in turn became a priestess of Mila, skilled in both swordplay and magic.
Snake: I wouldn't expect a holy woman to be fighting here.
Colonel: She may be kind, but don't underestimate her, Snake. Her magic can call upon the powers of fire, thunder, wind, and holy light. You'd do well to stay away. Her magic is powerful, but it comes at the cost of her health. Use that to your advantage.
Snake: Have her whittle away at her own health, huh? Got it.
Cosmic77
Smash Hero
A good first attempt. Here's my thoughts.Here is my prediction roster!
Yellow are newcomers. (Ryu is missing but assume that he is here on the roster)
I cut Dark Pit because he is extremely similar to Pit to the point of being redundant. He is bascially the Metal Mario of Smash, but without a unique voice even! As for Shulk and Cloud, I feel like they were the main reason of why the "Anime Characters with Swords" trope is prevalent. They are by far the most common type of fighter in Smash. Cloud also has rights issues to contend with. Because of 8 Player Smash, I don't see Ice Climbers coming back.
For newcomers, I put Stunt Race FX car as the surprise obscure character...literally no one thinks that this fighter is possible, and it's not even a fighting figure...it's a car!
I added Spring Man and Ribbon Girl as separate characters because they have different stats, different abilities and even different extendable arms.
I added Princess Daisy, Waluigi and Toad as the Super Mario newcomers, they are the only non enemy and non generic characters to have a Mario amiibo, but NOT be in Smash Bros! Plus, they have a lot of fans between them and I think they can cover different fighter archetypes between them.
Since the game was planned in 2016 I think Decidueye will be added to the Smash roster as an poison/grass archer type. We don't have many plant/flower fighters in Smash and I think him and Daisy can fill that niche.
Midna could come with Wolf Link and they can fight using their Twilight powers...and Midna's large hand. Also, the Midna and Wolf Link amiibo are not compatible with Smash Bros...yet.
Chibi Robo also has an amiibo and he has interesting moveset potential with his lasso plug and electricity.
Crash Bandicoot is coming to Switch and I feel like Crash would be the perfect 3rd party newcomer.
While I understand your reasoning for cutting Dark Pit and Dr. Mario, I don't know why you applied your argument to them but not Lucina. Unless you're pulling the "she's popular" card, I don't know why she'd be any less likely to get cut than the other two. I also can't see how Shulk could get cut, especially since Xenoblade 2 was so successful. Cloud could get cut, but that would be moreso because of the difficulties in acquiring rights than it would be because he's an anime-looking character. Ice Climbers? Ehh, maybe. I don't know if 8-player Smash would pose a problem.
Stunt Race FX car? Never let Gamexplain influence your newcomer decisions.
The Mario characters you listed are all popular, but all three getting in at once just because they have an amiibo? Maybe one, but definitely not all three.
Chibi-Robo isn't doing so hot right now. Don't know about him.
I could see Crash getting added. Mainly depends on how much Sakurai has worked on getting him in Smash over other third-party characters.
Again, not a bad first attempt. Your list of newcomers was interesting, and while I don't think all of them will get in Smash, I think there's a few in there that have a good shot.
If anything, Banjo being not as prominent would HURT his chances, not help. If Steve really is the precious cash-cow that Microsoft makes him out to be, then I could understand while they would want him in Smash. Lots of people play Minecraft, so if Steve is capable of persuading those fans to pick up Smash, then both Nintendo and Microsoft would make a profit from this. Certainly more than they would with Banjo anyway.
Not saying Steve will get in Smash (and I honestly don't want him to), but I can at least see where Nintendo is going from if they add him.
Cutie Gwen
Lovely warrior
Here's the thing. Minecraft is popular, meaning it can make more people buy Minecraft as it's available everywhere. Banjo only appeals to people who were already going to get Smash Switch. Plus, royalties! Microsoft would get a huge chunk of cash allowing the character go begin withPeople are honestly overestimating Steve's chances. I can see why Microsoft would give Banjo away, because Banjo is not as prominent. Would Microsoft really give away their precious cash-cow to a game that they do not own? I am a little confused, so you can help me on this.
Imagine if Sakurai actually never added Banjo because he wanted to surprise everyone by adding Banjo in Smash for Switch, which would make them buy Smash for Switch.
Sorry if my feedback is short, but I love this move-set!
True Blue Warrior
Smash Hero
And yet you kept all of the FE characters? If anything, we are more likely to lose several of them than Shulk, who represents a new Nintendo franchise by himself.
Questionmark222
Smash Journeyman
Also, Steve's obviously a huge icon and I can't see any better character that could represent modern gaming as a whole as well as indie games.
Questionmark222
Smash Journeyman
Also, do you think Zelda should switch to her BOTW design like Link or keep her TP design to stay consistent with Sheik (whose appearance in Brawl and Sm4sh was based on a concept art for TP) ?
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Bowserlick
Smash Hero
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Steve from Minecraft hurts my eyes.
MamaLuigi123456
Smash Champion
It makes zero since to change Link and not Zelda
Ganondorf can be given the exception as he never had a proper form in The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, at least not one that is Smash-friendly.
Lyndis_
Smash Ace
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- Mar 11, 2018
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- 607
- Switch FC
- SW-6600-3090-1548
If nothing else, I'd love to see Nintendo's interpretation of remixing the C418 Minecraft OST for a song or two in Smash.
Especially if they're similar to the tone of the old Caution & Crisis remixes that Mojang still uses in a lot of promotional material.
Especially if they're similar to the tone of the old Caution & Crisis remixes that Mojang still uses in a lot of promotional material.
- Joined
- Aug 7, 2012
- Messages
- 9,582
- Location
- Buffalo, New York
- NNID
- ScoliosisxJones
- 3DS FC
- 1762-3194-1826
Alright, I'm going to post my first roster for Switch. I'll give reasoning for each addition, and considerations involved.
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I’m sure there’s more I could say, but I’m sick of typing at this point. Hope you like it! Let me know what you think.
EDIT: One criticism I will give it myself...I feel like it's too safe. However, I don't feel like the "unexpected" character is really possible to be predicted. That's my opinion on that though.
EDIT 2: A second critique...I may have added too many characters.
Both Link and Zelda, while veterans, would get somewhat of a redesign. This would take just as much work (at least close to similar amount of work) as a newcomer would take.
Considering this, I counted 16 newcomers. I feel like that may be too many. But who to cut?
EDIT 3: If I made cuts from this roster, my first choices would be Captain Toad, Celica and maybe one other? Celica would be a cool idea though, so it would pain me to do that honestly.
However, I do feel as if Fire Emblem could go with one fewer character. Still looking for feedback if you've got it for me!
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Alright, so first of all no cuts. Even if you don’t think a “No cuts” roster is going to happen, it’s what I’d like to see.
The roster totals out at 72 slots, with 74 if you consider all 3 Mii Fighters.
Below, I will list each newcomer and reasoning used. To be honest, I’m surprised at some of the choices I made as I put this together. As I list each character, I’ll mention the gameplay ideas I think of, which is mostly why I added them.
Captain Toad- I’m usually not a huge advocate of Captain Toad. It’s not like I didn’t like the game or anything, but I’ve never been entirely convinced of the moveset potential. I started thinking about it again, and there are a few ideas to put out there.
First, I think using the Light on his head as a stun move would be interesting, wielding a pickaxe (also throwing it perhaps, maybe surprisingly violent) and a minecart similar in usage similar to Bowser Jr. I see him as a character with moderate speed and either lightweight or slightly heavier than moderate because of his equipment.
Yes, he can jump.
Dixie Kong- I feel that Dixie is someone we’re more likely to see over K.Rool. DKCTF is coming out again, and Dixie and Cranky are a big part of that. Dixie would move similarly to Diddy, but would have more moves involved with her hair and bubble gum. Perhaps her grab could be with her hair? I’m not entirely sure of the archetype that she would be, but that’s up for discussion as always.
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Ice Climbers- I’m not sure that I need to say much about these two. They’ll stay much like they were in Brawl, but some of the jank involved can be removed to make them less annoying.
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BOTW Link and BOTW Zelda- If Link is getting redesigned, I have little doubt that we will see that with Zelda as well. While I believe that Link will have changes to his specials mainly, I think we may see a more athletic Zelda. No longer restricted in a dress, she may be faster, use more kicks or other movements.
Rather than using Din’s Fire, Nayru’s Love, or Farore’s Wind, Zelda could now be given the power of the Champions. Revali’s Gale (recovery/Up B), Mipha’s Grace (not sure how to make this work exactly) , Daruk’s Protection (counter?), Urbosa’s Fury (could be a combo with extra knockback like Marth?). Each ability would be on cooldown after using it, so you can’t spam. This could factor into a risk/reward type moveset.
Her Final Smash could be tied to either the Light Arrows, or it could be something like the Sealing magic she uses against Ganon. Either way, I am excited at the prospect of a reworked Zelda.
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Celica- After reading some moveset ideas and given the fact that I believe we may be too far out from the next Fire Emblem, Celica seems like an overall solid addition. I am sure this will trigger some people, mainly because I didn’t cut anyone.
Personally, I don’t care if we get one more Fire Emblem character as long as they are different. If it’s going to be a clone situation, stop adding them from Fire Emblem, plain and simple at this point. If Celica has Mila’s Turnwheel as a counter, I think that would be something that, while similar, would be different enough with the time component involved. Given that she is similar to Robin in that she uses magic and a sword, there’s a good amount of potential there.
Even if it isn’t Celica, I do believe there will be a Fire Emblem newcomer.
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Bandana Dee- This is another character I hadn’t expected myself to add. What seems like a pretty lame character actually could be pretty fun. A mainstay of co-op Kirby games, BD has some funny, stabby spear attacks that could effectively be a spacing, poking moveset. The tip of the spear would be the strongest part, but much of the moveset would likely be based on building up damage via multi-hit attacks, and then finishing with “just the tip” (lol sorry, had to).
Not a necessity for me, but I can see a fun character and that’s what matters.
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Wolf- this seems like another obvious pick. Smash veteran with enough of a difference to make him valuable to the roster once again. Not much else to say. I could see him not coming back, but I don’t know that that’s for the best.
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Decidueye- This here is one of my favorite potential newcomers. As a Ghost/Grass owl, with aspects of a “Robin Hood” appearance and moveset potential (archery), I think there’s plenty to work with. Spirit Shackle can do knockback or, with a sweet spot (or charged enough), trap the opponent for a follow up grab.
Sucker Punch could be a counter of sorts, but a wee bit different. For example, it could be an attack on its own, but if the opponent actually inflicts damage during it, the damage and knockback is intensified.
Much of the basic attacks (and Smash attacks frankly) could be slashes with wings, or vicious kicks with his talons. I really think Decidueye will be a really fun addition because of these different attacks. As far as Smash (and frankly a large portion of Pokemon) these are things that are Decidueye, through and through.
Lastly, Decidueye gets in over a Gen 8 choice because we literally haven’t seen anything on Gen 8 and Smash 6 comes out this year. If a character from Gen 8 gets in and we know nothing of the game that seems a little...weird. That might change if Gen 8 gets revealed at E3, but again this game started development in 2016. My bet is Decidueye.
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Takamaru- Again being a bit hesitant, I actually think Takamaru could be fun. As an Overwatch fan, I considered the possibility of his neutral B being a 3 Shuriken projectile attack, similar to the DPS of Genji. Another ability to include would be invisibility. While it may sound sketchy, think of it this way.
The cloaking device from Melee more or less shimmered to indicate where the player was. In Overwatch, Sombra has the ability to disappear but she cannot attack and moves faster while invisible. If we apply this to Takamaru, it may be a function to buy time, play mind games, or avoid a deadly Smash attack.
I’m not entirely sure of what else I’d like to see from Takamaru, but as a retro character/series with recent attention in games like Nintendo Land I think he’d be a good choice.
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Rex & Pyra- These two would provide a relatively interesting moveset. They wouldn’t be like the Ice Climber or Rosalina and Luma, but would play off of the Affinity system in XC2. There’s a number of different ways it could work, but here’s how I think I’d like it.
The Affinity bond is usually characterized by a faded blue line. This eventually grows into a strong, vibrant gold line as time passes. When it’s fully vibrant, every time Rex uses an Art, the gauge continues to fill, and eventually allow for higher level Art attacks. If you combine this will sort of a block/partner combo system with Pyra (who could block or continue a combo similar to MvC gameplay) I think we’d have yet another interesting newcomer. These two have something nobody else has!
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Dillon- This was a recent “a-ha” moment for me. I feel as if a lot of people sleep on Dillon as a choice, but I think he’d be really, really fun. Given the gameplay of Dillon’s Rolling Western is Tower Defense, giving Dillon an ability to build turrets and walls would be something only he could do.
This make me reference Torbjorn, another Overwatch hero. Torbjorn creates turrets that can be damaged by other heroes in-game. Torb also uses scrap to assist teammates.
In Dillon’s Rolling Western, Dillon must use materials (like scrap) to build walls and turrets (like armor in OW). This could lead Dillon to have a moveset revolving around defense and stage control. Opponents would take damage (no knockback) from the turret fire, but can destroy that which Dillon constructs. Dillon, as a “westerner” would also have a sort of revolver projectile similar to Fox, Falco, or even Bayonetta. Some sort of mix in terms of fire rate and stun/knockback.
Dillon would also have something similar to a Spin Dash obviously. Aside from the spin dash, I would say he would perhaps be a bit slower as a character. Dillon has quite a bit here that only he can do.
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Inklings- already in!
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Spring Man and Ribbon Girl- I frankly don’t see why an ARMS character wouldn’t be added. Nintendo made a big push with ARMS, and some might consider Smash to be in competition in terms of eSports crowds. Nintendo has actively pushed for more eSports with their own games, with the NintendoVersus twitter, as well as push for Splatoon and Smash at this years E3.
Smash has the power to bury ARMS, which has already seemed to dwindle in terms of interest with eSports. However, including ARMS content in Smash could help avoid that.
Spring Man is the cover character for ARMS, similar to Tracer for Overwatch, or Scorpion/Sub Zero for Mortal Kombat, or Ryu for Street Fighter, or Heihachi for Tekken.
Spring Man could time stretched punches across the stage to effectively control where the opponent could go. The grab would have significant range, making him a dangerous contender. This could also be a different mechanic...a Special could be the “ARMS” grab, while he could then have a regular “Smash” type grab. The Special would draw them in, and then forcefully throw them down, whereas the “Smash” throw would have a throw in 4 directions.
There is also potential for a Down B allowing to change ARMS. This is, again, only something somebody from ARMS could do.
Ribbon Girl, at least on this roster, is effectively a semi-clone. As a co-Cover star, Ribbon Girl IS DIFFERENT from Spring Man. She doesn’t necessarily use the same Arms and has the ability to infinitely jump back and forth. These are where the “semi-clone” differences can come in. I think this would bring two characters of equal stature in their home game come in with noticeable differences, while not entirely needing as much dev time. I can’t really say this without the disclaimer that it may take more work than I’m saying, as I’m no expert of game development.
(I’ve also seen a suggestion that Spring Man would be the default skin for all fighters, and I simply have to say it wouldn’t work. Each of the characters in ARMS is a different size, has different abilities, and simply wouldn’t work in the same way Bowser Jr. and the Koopalings do.)
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Rayman- I’m not entirely sold on getting a huge amount of 3rd parties, but I also am not entirely invested in 3rd parties this time. The characters available aren’t nearly as big as the ones we’ve already gotten, but considering the trophies that Rayman received and the support given by Ubisoft, I think we might see Rayman get added. There is demand there, and he’d have unique moves that nobody else can do.
Rayman would want to keep opponents further away, given the fact that he can use his hands for ranged punching. If an opponent can get within those punches, Rayman will have nothing to defend himself.
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Notable exclusions:
K.Rool and Ridley- I simply don’t think they’re happening. Every single time a new Smash game comes out, it’s always said they’re a lock. They’ve never been a lock, and very little has changed for either character. I also don’t believe that Sakurai would suddenly change his perspective on Ridley as he develops two Smash games back to back, and in the former he’s already a stage boss.
I think they’d both be great. I just don’t think they’re going to happen.
Crash Bandicoot- Crash would certainly strike the nostalgia of many. However, this is one of those cases where...did Sakurai know the N.Sane trilogy was coming in 2016? Is Crash worth delaying the game similar to Sonic with Brawl? I don’t know about that. I simply feel the timing wasn’t right, and that Crash is only considered a popular choice because he suddenly has a game.
Could be good, I just don’t see it happening on the base roster.
-
Isabelle- I’m seriously torn on this one. I feel like Isabelle could do quite a bit as a newcomer, and I would certainly add her in exchange for at least one character on the roster. I’m just not sure who. She easily the closest to being added to this one.
There is also the fact that I kinda feel like she’s a character that the people at Nintendo maybe...well, I don’t know, but maybe not have her get beat up badly? She just seems like the perky heartwarming assistant. Are we going to throw bombs at her? Slash her with a sword?
I mean if we are, I’m down. I think she’d be great. But I do have to wonder if that would stop anybody from committing.
The roster totals out at 72 slots, with 74 if you consider all 3 Mii Fighters.
Below, I will list each newcomer and reasoning used. To be honest, I’m surprised at some of the choices I made as I put this together. As I list each character, I’ll mention the gameplay ideas I think of, which is mostly why I added them.
Captain Toad- I’m usually not a huge advocate of Captain Toad. It’s not like I didn’t like the game or anything, but I’ve never been entirely convinced of the moveset potential. I started thinking about it again, and there are a few ideas to put out there.
First, I think using the Light on his head as a stun move would be interesting, wielding a pickaxe (also throwing it perhaps, maybe surprisingly violent) and a minecart similar in usage similar to Bowser Jr. I see him as a character with moderate speed and either lightweight or slightly heavier than moderate because of his equipment.
Yes, he can jump.
Dixie Kong- I feel that Dixie is someone we’re more likely to see over K.Rool. DKCTF is coming out again, and Dixie and Cranky are a big part of that. Dixie would move similarly to Diddy, but would have more moves involved with her hair and bubble gum. Perhaps her grab could be with her hair? I’m not entirely sure of the archetype that she would be, but that’s up for discussion as always.
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Ice Climbers- I’m not sure that I need to say much about these two. They’ll stay much like they were in Brawl, but some of the jank involved can be removed to make them less annoying.
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BOTW Link and BOTW Zelda- If Link is getting redesigned, I have little doubt that we will see that with Zelda as well. While I believe that Link will have changes to his specials mainly, I think we may see a more athletic Zelda. No longer restricted in a dress, she may be faster, use more kicks or other movements.
Rather than using Din’s Fire, Nayru’s Love, or Farore’s Wind, Zelda could now be given the power of the Champions. Revali’s Gale (recovery/Up B), Mipha’s Grace (not sure how to make this work exactly) , Daruk’s Protection (counter?), Urbosa’s Fury (could be a combo with extra knockback like Marth?). Each ability would be on cooldown after using it, so you can’t spam. This could factor into a risk/reward type moveset.
Her Final Smash could be tied to either the Light Arrows, or it could be something like the Sealing magic she uses against Ganon. Either way, I am excited at the prospect of a reworked Zelda.
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Celica- After reading some moveset ideas and given the fact that I believe we may be too far out from the next Fire Emblem, Celica seems like an overall solid addition. I am sure this will trigger some people, mainly because I didn’t cut anyone.
Personally, I don’t care if we get one more Fire Emblem character as long as they are different. If it’s going to be a clone situation, stop adding them from Fire Emblem, plain and simple at this point. If Celica has Mila’s Turnwheel as a counter, I think that would be something that, while similar, would be different enough with the time component involved. Given that she is similar to Robin in that she uses magic and a sword, there’s a good amount of potential there.
Even if it isn’t Celica, I do believe there will be a Fire Emblem newcomer.
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Bandana Dee- This is another character I hadn’t expected myself to add. What seems like a pretty lame character actually could be pretty fun. A mainstay of co-op Kirby games, BD has some funny, stabby spear attacks that could effectively be a spacing, poking moveset. The tip of the spear would be the strongest part, but much of the moveset would likely be based on building up damage via multi-hit attacks, and then finishing with “just the tip” (lol sorry, had to).
Not a necessity for me, but I can see a fun character and that’s what matters.
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Wolf- this seems like another obvious pick. Smash veteran with enough of a difference to make him valuable to the roster once again. Not much else to say. I could see him not coming back, but I don’t know that that’s for the best.
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Decidueye- This here is one of my favorite potential newcomers. As a Ghost/Grass owl, with aspects of a “Robin Hood” appearance and moveset potential (archery), I think there’s plenty to work with. Spirit Shackle can do knockback or, with a sweet spot (or charged enough), trap the opponent for a follow up grab.
Sucker Punch could be a counter of sorts, but a wee bit different. For example, it could be an attack on its own, but if the opponent actually inflicts damage during it, the damage and knockback is intensified.
Much of the basic attacks (and Smash attacks frankly) could be slashes with wings, or vicious kicks with his talons. I really think Decidueye will be a really fun addition because of these different attacks. As far as Smash (and frankly a large portion of Pokemon) these are things that are Decidueye, through and through.
Lastly, Decidueye gets in over a Gen 8 choice because we literally haven’t seen anything on Gen 8 and Smash 6 comes out this year. If a character from Gen 8 gets in and we know nothing of the game that seems a little...weird. That might change if Gen 8 gets revealed at E3, but again this game started development in 2016. My bet is Decidueye.
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Takamaru- Again being a bit hesitant, I actually think Takamaru could be fun. As an Overwatch fan, I considered the possibility of his neutral B being a 3 Shuriken projectile attack, similar to the DPS of Genji. Another ability to include would be invisibility. While it may sound sketchy, think of it this way.
The cloaking device from Melee more or less shimmered to indicate where the player was. In Overwatch, Sombra has the ability to disappear but she cannot attack and moves faster while invisible. If we apply this to Takamaru, it may be a function to buy time, play mind games, or avoid a deadly Smash attack.
I’m not entirely sure of what else I’d like to see from Takamaru, but as a retro character/series with recent attention in games like Nintendo Land I think he’d be a good choice.
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Rex & Pyra- These two would provide a relatively interesting moveset. They wouldn’t be like the Ice Climber or Rosalina and Luma, but would play off of the Affinity system in XC2. There’s a number of different ways it could work, but here’s how I think I’d like it.
The Affinity bond is usually characterized by a faded blue line. This eventually grows into a strong, vibrant gold line as time passes. When it’s fully vibrant, every time Rex uses an Art, the gauge continues to fill, and eventually allow for higher level Art attacks. If you combine this will sort of a block/partner combo system with Pyra (who could block or continue a combo similar to MvC gameplay) I think we’d have yet another interesting newcomer. These two have something nobody else has!
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Dillon- This was a recent “a-ha” moment for me. I feel as if a lot of people sleep on Dillon as a choice, but I think he’d be really, really fun. Given the gameplay of Dillon’s Rolling Western is Tower Defense, giving Dillon an ability to build turrets and walls would be something only he could do.
This make me reference Torbjorn, another Overwatch hero. Torbjorn creates turrets that can be damaged by other heroes in-game. Torb also uses scrap to assist teammates.
In Dillon’s Rolling Western, Dillon must use materials (like scrap) to build walls and turrets (like armor in OW). This could lead Dillon to have a moveset revolving around defense and stage control. Opponents would take damage (no knockback) from the turret fire, but can destroy that which Dillon constructs. Dillon, as a “westerner” would also have a sort of revolver projectile similar to Fox, Falco, or even Bayonetta. Some sort of mix in terms of fire rate and stun/knockback.
Dillon would also have something similar to a Spin Dash obviously. Aside from the spin dash, I would say he would perhaps be a bit slower as a character. Dillon has quite a bit here that only he can do.
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Inklings- already in!
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Spring Man and Ribbon Girl- I frankly don’t see why an ARMS character wouldn’t be added. Nintendo made a big push with ARMS, and some might consider Smash to be in competition in terms of eSports crowds. Nintendo has actively pushed for more eSports with their own games, with the NintendoVersus twitter, as well as push for Splatoon and Smash at this years E3.
Smash has the power to bury ARMS, which has already seemed to dwindle in terms of interest with eSports. However, including ARMS content in Smash could help avoid that.
Spring Man is the cover character for ARMS, similar to Tracer for Overwatch, or Scorpion/Sub Zero for Mortal Kombat, or Ryu for Street Fighter, or Heihachi for Tekken.
Spring Man could time stretched punches across the stage to effectively control where the opponent could go. The grab would have significant range, making him a dangerous contender. This could also be a different mechanic...a Special could be the “ARMS” grab, while he could then have a regular “Smash” type grab. The Special would draw them in, and then forcefully throw them down, whereas the “Smash” throw would have a throw in 4 directions.
There is also potential for a Down B allowing to change ARMS. This is, again, only something somebody from ARMS could do.
Ribbon Girl, at least on this roster, is effectively a semi-clone. As a co-Cover star, Ribbon Girl IS DIFFERENT from Spring Man. She doesn’t necessarily use the same Arms and has the ability to infinitely jump back and forth. These are where the “semi-clone” differences can come in. I think this would bring two characters of equal stature in their home game come in with noticeable differences, while not entirely needing as much dev time. I can’t really say this without the disclaimer that it may take more work than I’m saying, as I’m no expert of game development.
(I’ve also seen a suggestion that Spring Man would be the default skin for all fighters, and I simply have to say it wouldn’t work. Each of the characters in ARMS is a different size, has different abilities, and simply wouldn’t work in the same way Bowser Jr. and the Koopalings do.)
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Rayman- I’m not entirely sold on getting a huge amount of 3rd parties, but I also am not entirely invested in 3rd parties this time. The characters available aren’t nearly as big as the ones we’ve already gotten, but considering the trophies that Rayman received and the support given by Ubisoft, I think we might see Rayman get added. There is demand there, and he’d have unique moves that nobody else can do.
Rayman would want to keep opponents further away, given the fact that he can use his hands for ranged punching. If an opponent can get within those punches, Rayman will have nothing to defend himself.
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Notable exclusions:
K.Rool and Ridley- I simply don’t think they’re happening. Every single time a new Smash game comes out, it’s always said they’re a lock. They’ve never been a lock, and very little has changed for either character. I also don’t believe that Sakurai would suddenly change his perspective on Ridley as he develops two Smash games back to back, and in the former he’s already a stage boss.
I think they’d both be great. I just don’t think they’re going to happen.
Crash Bandicoot- Crash would certainly strike the nostalgia of many. However, this is one of those cases where...did Sakurai know the N.Sane trilogy was coming in 2016? Is Crash worth delaying the game similar to Sonic with Brawl? I don’t know about that. I simply feel the timing wasn’t right, and that Crash is only considered a popular choice because he suddenly has a game.
Could be good, I just don’t see it happening on the base roster.
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Isabelle- I’m seriously torn on this one. I feel like Isabelle could do quite a bit as a newcomer, and I would certainly add her in exchange for at least one character on the roster. I’m just not sure who. She easily the closest to being added to this one.
There is also the fact that I kinda feel like she’s a character that the people at Nintendo maybe...well, I don’t know, but maybe not have her get beat up badly? She just seems like the perky heartwarming assistant. Are we going to throw bombs at her? Slash her with a sword?
I mean if we are, I’m down. I think she’d be great. But I do have to wonder if that would stop anybody from committing.
I’m sure there’s more I could say, but I’m sick of typing at this point. Hope you like it! Let me know what you think.
EDIT: One criticism I will give it myself...I feel like it's too safe. However, I don't feel like the "unexpected" character is really possible to be predicted. That's my opinion on that though.
EDIT 2: A second critique...I may have added too many characters.
Both Link and Zelda, while veterans, would get somewhat of a redesign. This would take just as much work (at least close to similar amount of work) as a newcomer would take.
Considering this, I counted 16 newcomers. I feel like that may be too many. But who to cut?
EDIT 3: If I made cuts from this roster, my first choices would be Captain Toad, Celica and maybe one other? Celica would be a cool idea though, so it would pain me to do that honestly.
However, I do feel as if Fire Emblem could go with one fewer character. Still looking for feedback if you've got it for me!
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Curious Villager
Puzzles...
I feel like they should just change Sheik back to her original canon OoT design now that she and Zelda are separated. Though I think they will most likely redesign her again as well as Ganondorf to the BotW art style along with Link and Zelda.
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King9999
Smash Journeyman
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Who do you think they will use for the announcer? Based on history, they don't use the same announcer twice, so I'm curious as to who they might pick up. Maybe they'll even consider a female announcer to shake things up?
D
Deleted member
Guest
This is probably one of my favorite prediction rosters I have even seen. No over-the-top third parties, No Ridley ( I am sure Sakruai still thinks he is too big ), and you did not add too much characters. I love it.
I am personally hoping they use Xander Mobus again, but who knows?
>Daisy getting in over PaulineHere is my prediction roster!
Yellow are newcomers. (Ryu is missing but assume that he is here on the roster)
I cut Dark Pit because he is extremely similar to Pit to the point of being redundant. He is bascially the Metal Mario of Smash, but without a unique voice even! As for Shulk and Cloud, I feel like they were the main reason of why the "Anime Characters with Swords" trope is prevalent. They are by far the most common type of fighter in Smash. Cloud also has rights issues to contend with. Because of 8 Player Smash, I don't see Ice Climbers coming back.
For newcomers, I put Stunt Race FX car as the surprise obscure character...literally no one thinks that this fighter is possible, and it's not even a fighting figure...it's a car!
I added Spring Man and Ribbon Girl as separate characters because they have different stats, different abilities and even different extendable arms.
I added Princess Daisy, Waluigi and Toad as the Super Mario newcomers, they are the only non enemy and non generic characters to have a Mario amiibo, but NOT be in Smash Bros! Plus, they have a lot of fans between them and I think they can cover different fighter archetypes between them.
Since the game was planned in 2016 I think Decidueye will be added to the Smash roster as an poison/grass archer type. We don't have many plant/flower fighters in Smash and I think him and Daisy can fill that niche.
Midna could come with Wolf Link and they can fight using their Twilight powers...and Midna's large hand. Also, the Midna and Wolf Link amiibo are not compatible with Smash Bros...yet.
Chibi Robo also has an amiibo and he has interesting moveset potential with his lasso plug and electricity.
Crash Bandicoot is coming to Switch and I feel like Crash would be the perfect 3rd party newcomer.
>Cutting ZSS for Ridley
>Stunt FX when there's better obscure characters
>Waluigi
>Cutting Dr. Mario & DP but keeping Lucina
3/10
Kirby Dragons
Smash Hero
So I was tinkering around with character archetypes as a way to help balance characters. I feel if characters actually fit to an archetype (with fairly balanced strengths and weaknesses), it would help prevent them from being too polarizing.
Here is the Smash 4 roster (along with cut Brawl veterans). A lot of the veterans either do a lot more than their archetype or don't even perform their archetype well at all. Nonetheless, I feel these are what Sakurai wanted the characters to feel like.
Sword (fencer archtype):
Mobile Offensive (super mobile with strong combo game):
(he's complicated)
Neutral Offensive (average mobility with strong combo game):
Slow Offensive (below average mobility or range with strong combo game):
Zoner/Projectile (keeps people at a distance; dominant newcomer archetype):
Heavy (large size and range):
Featherweight (small size and range):
Duo character:
Wtf customs character:
-----------
Potential Newcomer Archetype:
Inkling: Zoner (confirmed)
Rex and Pyra: Sword
Celica: sword, maybe zoner
Midna + Wolf Link: Heavy? (maybe neutral offensive)
Rayman: Neutral Offensive
Crash: same as Rayman
Bandanna Dee: Mix of featherweight and sword
Palutena designed better: practically any archetype, maybe zoner or Mobile Offensive
Chorus Kids: Trio character???
Dixie: Neutral Offensive
King K rool: Heavy (maybe heavy zoner like dedede)
Decidueye: Zoner
Takamaru: Zoner, maybe Sword
Excite Bike: lol
Ridley: Heavy
Paper Mario: Zoner, maybe Sword (honestly I can't think of an interesting moveset for him)
Isabelle: Zoner like Villager
Ashley: Zoner like Duck Hunt
Impa: Sword or maybe Mobile Offensive
Isaac: Sword or Zoner
Spring Man: Sword (on steroids)
Let me know if you have any other newcomer ideas that fit some of these archetypes!
- Daisy: Mobile Offensive
- Waluigi: Mobile Offensive
- King K. Rool: Heavy
- Dixie Kong: Mobile Offensive
- Kamek: Zoner
- Ashley & Red: Duo
- Chibi-Robo: Featherweight
- Professor Layton: Sword
- Maxwell: Zoner
- Crash Bandicoot: Neutral Offensive
- Bandana Waddle Dee: Mobile Offensive
- Isaac: Zoner
- Isabelle: Featherweight
- Tom Nook: Featherweight
- Spring Man: Zoner
- Rayman: Slow Offensive
- Lip: Neutral Offensive
- Urban Champion: Slow Offensive
Pakky
Smash Hero
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Yellow blocks are Newcomers, Yellow Random blocks are newcomers yet to be determined or could be anyone from the series.
Explanations
Captain Syrup: Wario Land Rep that all the Wario Land stuff Wario is willing to hold himself can be piled onto her.
Ashely: Self explanatory I think
Paper Mario:
Impa over Sheik: They can be costumes of one another but I really think Impa based on her near perfect attendance as Zelda's aid makes more sense.
Ridley: Self explanatory I think
Wolf: I think he's more different than Falco personally but yeah
Bandana Dee: Just finished Star Allies so he's self-explanatory I think
Marx: He is in Star Allies and the only real villain so far I think to be in multiple games now and is a playable boss which is new.
DK guys: They're all self-explanatory
Plasma Wraith [needs a video]
Rex and Pyra: Well ya'know
FE: Okay I'm no expert but here's what I see, FE has new games and more coming possibly after smash release those two random slots are for those guys. I can't see Lucina as anything but a costume personally.
King Hippo: The most recognizable Punch Out character other than Little Mac
Deahtborn: [Have a read] Also he'll be taking Gana's old set
Porky: There's a lot you can do with him he doesn't have to be a giant spider and the other two Mother characters are amalgamates so yeah.
Pokemon: Gen 8 guy needs a slot. Lucario could come back but I don't know.
KI: Overhaul Dark Pit and everyone else is pretty self-explanatory
ARMS:
[Springman] is the main character and has an ability very similar to how Lucario works in Smash right now along with a parry-like bounce
[Ribbon Girl] Has aerial mobility and different equipment
[Dr. Coyle] Villainess (kind of ) of ARMS is the reason for like most of the cast existing and created Healock and robotic head that can possess the wearer (Except her) and give them four extra arms.
Everyone else shouldn't be too hard to understand
Now is Doomguy a real pick?
Well he's kind of a nostalgia character and the granddaddy of FPS games so I think he's important.
This is my first roster ever so yeah tell me what ya think.
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Bowserlick
Smash Hero
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- Jul 25, 2005
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- 5,136
I want Zelda, Sheik and Ganondorf to have Breath of the Wild designs.
Zelda has a design in the ne wgame. Sheik can be based on the sheikah armor Link wears.
Ganondorf can be designed based on Gerudo armor and Sheikah tech armor.
Zelda has a design in the ne wgame. Sheik can be based on the sheikah armor Link wears.
Ganondorf can be designed based on Gerudo armor and Sheikah tech armor.
Morbi
Scavenger
I am genuinely not sure what they will do about Ganondorf. The safe assumption is to just keep him Twilight because I doubt Sakurai would design his own version of Ganondorf. It would be unprecedented, to say the least. If he did not bother with a move-set, he is not going to bother with a design. I guess I would like to see it, however.
Lyndis_
Smash Ace
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I honestly just want Hyrule Warriors Ganondorf. A BotW Ganondorf would either look really good, or horrendously ugly and awful. Even the former I can't really see looking better than the HW Ganondorf.
I don't really want them to keep the TP look. It'd feel weird using that when everyone else gets updated, and I think the look is starting to seem a bit dated.
I don't really want them to keep the TP look. It'd feel weird using that when everyone else gets updated, and I think the look is starting to seem a bit dated.
MamaLuigi123456
Smash Champion
Ganonodorf reminds Sakurai of his late father, so I honestly doubt he'll be changed.
Guybrush20X6
Creator of Lego Theory
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If we're showing off rosters, here is mine at a really early stage of development.
So far I'm having trouble narrowing down my newcomers to a reasonable level
(in case there's doubt, Blue is Smash 4, Red are previous cuts, Green is confirmed and yellow is potenital newcomers.)
Any opinions?
So far I'm having trouble narrowing down my newcomers to a reasonable level
(in case there's doubt, Blue is Smash 4, Red are previous cuts, Green is confirmed and yellow is potenital newcomers.)
Any opinions?
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AwesomeAussie27
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Sorry for the delay. Some stuff happened at home. Anyways, the winner was Sothe for the last Radiant Dawn poll. Ashera and Soren were decently popular, then there's Cain who did horribly for a Laguz.
Next up without be the start of three Awakening polls, starting with Chom's main group. Your choices are Chrom, Lissa, Frederick, and Cordelia.
Begin.
Next up without be the start of three Awakening polls, starting with Chom's main group. Your choices are Chrom, Lissa, Frederick, and Cordelia.
There was a problem fetching the tweet
Begin.
- Status