Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Morbi]

Steve/Minecraft would definitely pull in a lot of this/newer generation's gamers. Every new Smash game is a first Smash game for someone, anything Minecraft would definitely attract a whole new crowd, which I think would only be a positive.

The worst part is, I prefer Steve to Shovel Knight because at least Steve has genuine numbers to back him up. If we are just going for an indie, I would rather have one that changes the landscape. Shovel Knight very nearly did that and many would argue it blatantly did, but if we are within that "tier" of indie, I much prefer Undertale.

 

[Nauzgo]

Because someone mentioned the clones: I never understood and never will understand why Sakurai chose Lucina & Dark Pit over Young Link & Pichu as clones. But maybe these two were already too diverse. Anyways, I think all of the clones have a pretty decent chance to return this time.

And for the thirds I think it's a safe bet to say that Bayonetta will stay since she's the winner of the Ballot. And since the game industry is growing and more and more people become multi consoleros, third parties will beg for their characters to stay. Snake on the other hand is the only difficult one imo.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

There seems to be some weird misconception within the Smash community that just because the roster was decided at a certain point, that they are beholden to that as though it is the ten commandments or written in stone. That is not the case, and while this is not proven, I personally believe the Gematsu leak was real (which is ironic, because I was literally one of the only people that thought it was false during the time). In that case, Chrom was planned, as in decided, but that changed and we got Robin. It happens. Maybe Crash was added to the priority list and bumped someone else who he intended to put in the game off the list. Who knows? This does not just apply to Crash either. I see a lot of people denying the HYPER obvious Spring Man or Rex as a result of this strange opinion.

I would believe that most Smashers would realize that circumstances change. It happens within our series much more than most others.

I definitely agree that the roster isn't set in stone from the start, in fact we know that hasn't been the case for pretty much every game in the series, but the fact that Crash is 3rd party complicates things a lot. We already know that Sonic being added late in Brawl's development was a nightmare and came at the cost of other content, I highly doubt they'd have gone out of their way to do if it wasn't because it was Sonic specifically. It'd also depend a lot on how cooperative Activision are, Nintendo and Sega are on very good terms and had already done a recent cross over at the time, and yet it was still so incredibly difficult to add Sonic at that point, so you'd imagine Activision would have to act quickly and make very little fuzz out of it.

It's definitely not impossible, but I do think Crash fans should manage their expectations as it'd be difficult to add him for launch.

 

[Senselessbreak]

The worst part is, I prefer Steve to Shovel Knight because at least Steve has genuine numbers to back him up. If we are just going for an indie, I would rather have one that changes the landscape. Shovel Knight very nearly did that and many would argue it blatantly did, but if we are within that "tier" of indie, I much prefer Undertale.

Honestly no Indie character is ever getting into a giant like Smash. The 3rd party choices are so heavily vetted and they just don't do it to make the cut. That said, I don't consider Steve indie as Minecraft is owned by M$ and makes more money than most AAA titles from major companies.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Because someone mentioned the clones: I never understood and never will understand why Sakurai chose Lucina & Dark Pit over Young Link & Pichu as clones. But maybe these two were already too diverse. Anyways, I think all of the clones have a pretty decent chance to return this time.

And for the thirds I think it's a safe bet to say that Bayonetta will stay since she's the winner of the Ballot. And since the game industry is growing and more and more people become multi consoleros, third parties will beg for their characters to stay. Snake on the other hand is the only difficult one imo.

Lucina and Dark Pit were already going to be alternative costumes for Marth and Pit, so they already had all the assets ready to make them into clones in a really short span of time. For Young Link and Pichu they'd have had to make entirely new models, like they did with Roy for the DLC.

 

[Graizen]

New Animation to Support Agumon for Smash!

https://vitor-aizen.deviantart.com/art/Agumon-vs-Pikachu-Smash-Bros-ANIMATED-736277504

I hope you guys like it!

 

[Senselessbreak]

And for the thirds I think it's a safe bet to say that Bayonetta will stay since she's the winner of the Ballot.

Nintendo owns 100% of the rights to Bayo 3 instead of 50% this time around so shes essentially first party now.

 

[A Distant Demon]

So...

What do you guys think of a Xenoblade 2 character getting in like Rex/Pyra but only a Xenoblade X stage being added in?

The reason why i'm saying this is because Smash Switch's development started in like mid-2016 meaning if there was room for Monlith Soft to show Sakurai what Rex/Pyra would be it would only give him a chance to work on those characters and not any stages from Xenoblade 2. With that, Sakurai would only have Xenoblade Chronicles X to work with for a stage.

I don't think it's a big deal personally. XCX had a lot of stunning visuals that would work much better as a stage.

This would be best case scenario for me.

My favorite art of XCX was Mira. My least favorite was the characters (well that and the story)

And I think an XC2 character could still be cool.


I dont think it would happen, but it's what I would want.

 

[Cosmic77]

Nintendo owns 100% of the rights to Bayo 3 instead of 50% this time around so shes essentially first party now.

Not how character rights work.

Until Nintendo buys the ENTIRE Bayonetta series rights from Sega, she's third-party.

 

[UserKev]

I definitely agree, I am buying into the Ridley hype. Even without leaks, it just makes sense. He is perhaps the only "missing" character. Sakurai cannot keep pushing it off for arbitrary reasons, and even if he does, the demand is never truly going to die and Nintendo will likely step in. It is inevitable.

So, to that end, I am not surprised in the slightest that credible leakers are talking about him.

I'm also expecting Ridley. He's realistic.

This is a great description of the matter.

 

[Ura]

This would be best case scenario for me.

My favorite art of XCX was Mira. My least favorite was the characters (well that and the story)

And I think an XC2 character could still be cool.


I dont think it would happen, but it's what I would want.

For me personally i'd like it because I liked the art style of XCX and wanted it represented in some way. A feel a stage from that game is a nice way to not have it miss it's chance completely even if there isn't a character in that game in Smash Bros.

That being said I do prefer Elma over any XC2 character even though I know the latter is (most likely) going to be added in.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

How popular is Steve among the Minecraft fanbase?

 

[CannonStreak]

Hey guys, just wondering what you guys think: In the potentially unlikely event that we get another Direct before E3, when do you guys think it may possibly happen? I'd like to know your thoughts.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Can we just get a Minecraft stage? A stage would do a great job of encapsulating what people like about Minecraft. I mean who the hell cares about Steve as a character?

 

[Senselessbreak]

Not how character rights work.

Until Nintendo buys the ENTIRE Bayonetta series rights from Sega, she's third-party.

Sega owns 100% of Bayo 1
Sega and Nintendo own Bayo 2 50/50
Nintendo owns Bayo 3 100%

So its split on control but going forward Sega has no power unless they want to invest money and make their own version of Bayo 2 and 3.

Technically Nintendo doesn't own Pokemon 100%, but its still 2nd party. So Bayo in a weird boat.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I never understood and never will understand why Sakurai chose Lucina & Dark Pit over Young Link & Pichu as clones.

You never understood?....................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

...Dude, first of all, Toon Link is already a part of the roster, second of all, Dark Pit & Lucina are from popular 3DS games from hardly years prior.

Where does this "This character got in over that character" mentality come from that so many smash fans seem to have? It's like you're proposing that Young Link & Pichu were ever on the table for Smash 4 to begin with. How can Dark Pit and Lucina be chosen over someone who was never intended to be in the game.

The reason they are separate characters is because they were originally planned to be costumes. Young Link & Pichu can't be costumes of Link or Pikachu. If they were intended to be costumes, then they would have made it into the game like Dr. Mario did when he was intended to be a costume for Smash 4.

It's not like Sakurai was sitting there like "Hmm. We need some clones. Who should I pick?" The clones were later additions that came naturally when it was decided they couldn't be costumes. But, even if he was, Lucina and Dark Pit are just logically better additions than Young Link or Pichu. Though I think Pichu should come back in the Switch game. Not sure why people would think Young Link should.

 

[SlickWylde]

2. Who panned Smash 4's marketing as childish?

Pretty much everyone. Especially that super long commercial with the guy from Stranger Things.

 

[Cosmic77]

Sega owns 100% of Bayo 1
Sega and Nintendo own Bayo 2 50/50
Nintendo owns Bayo 3 100%

So its split on control but going forward Sega has no power unless they want to invest money and make their own version of Bayo 2 and 3.

Technically Nintendo doesn't own Pokemon 100%, but its still 2nd party. So Bayo in a weird boat.

Nintendo could make a thousand Bayonetta sequels, but they aren't going to actually own the franchise until they purchase the rights from Sega.

And while Nintendo alone doesn't own Pokémon, they do own the rights to the characters and games. If Game Freak ever wanted to stop working with Nintendo and make their own Pokémon games, they'd literally have to rename the franchise and come up with their own 800+ species.

 

[DraginHikari]

This would be best case scenario for me.

My favorite art of XCX was Mira. My least favorite was the characters (well that and the story)

And I think an XC2 character could still be cool.


I dont think it would happen, but it's what I would want.

Kind of how I can rate the three Xenoblade games in general. Depend on what aspect of the game you ask about I'm likely to give slightly different answers as they are all pretty different beasts in general.

 

[LancerStaff]

Can we just get a Minecraft stage? A stage would do a great job of encapsulating what people like about Minecraft. I mean who the hell cares about Steve as a character?

Lots of people do.

Never mind that we have a ton of “non characters” already.

Also people care waaay too much about classifying characters. Nobody at Nintendo gives a **** about Bayo’s 1st/2nd/3rd party status.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

How popular is Steve among the Minecraft fanbase?

Steve is the default skin.

 

[SlickWylde]

My problem with "Steve" is that it's not a character. Literally, "Steve" is just a skin. (Unless the telltale games have Steve as a character)

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I just want to point out that one of Sakurai's rules when selecting characters is that "the character must display personality in their game".

What sort of personality does Steve show in Minecraft?

 

[SlickWylde]

So, someone came up with a silly moveset for "Laboman"... and I kinda love it. I would be so down for this to make it into the game: https://twitter.com/JavedLSterritt/status/975666584055197696

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

If we're talking indie reps, I'd rather see Shantae than anyone else. Lilac and Shovel Knight would be cool to have as well.

Also, regarding Steve, Minecraft is owned by Microsoft; it's not an indie franchise anymore.

 

[AwesomeAussie27]

The winner was none other than Lyn. Hector was almost as popular, though both Eliwood and Hawkeye did poorly.

Next up is a bit more fan favorites from the same game (Blazing Sword). Your choice are Ninian, Lucius, Nino, and Jaffar.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Begin!

 

[LancerStaff]

My problem with "Steve" is that it's not a character. Literally, "Steve" is just a skin. (Unless the telltale games have Steve as a character)

Like Villager, who is a fully customizable character.

I just want to point out that one of Sakurai's rules when selecting characters is that "the character must display personality in their game".

What sort of personality does Steve show in Minecraft?

I don’t recall such a rule.

Never mind that BotW Link is a walking piece of cardboard.

 

[Cosmic77]

I just want to point out that one of Sakurai's rules when selecting characters is that "the character must display personality in their game".

His deep character development and heartbreaking backstory has made R.O.B. one of my favorite characters of all time.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

I just want to point out that one of Sakurai's rules when selecting characters is that "the character must display personality in their game".

What sort of personality does Steve show in Minecraft?

Mr. Game & Watch would like to have a word with you.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I want Pichu back more than I even want most newcomers. I want to see him in the tournament mode of the game. I find the idea of people being able to make it to the top as Pichu to be very interesting.

 

[?????????????]

Steve is like Villager; it's an avatar that, as far as Smash Bros. is concerned, would encapsulate all of what you can do in Minecraft within his moveset.

Who would you possibly pick instead of Steve anyway? (For Minecraft specifically)

 

[TheLastJinjo]

You're all interpreting the word "personality" as literally as possible.

 

[Superyoshiom]

If Bayonetta could just be put in the middle of the roster rather than at the end, I wouldn't actually mind her inclusion, as that makes her seem more like a first party character, which she basically is at this point. Having her be a third-party rep just doesn't sit right with me for some reason, but having her act as if she was first party works fine for me.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

If Bayonetta could just be put in the middle of the roster rather than at the end, I wouldn't actually mind her inclusion, as that makes her seem more like a first party character, which she basically is at this point. Having her be a third-party rep just doesn't sit right with me for some reason, but having her act as if she was first party works fine for me.

It literally does not matter if Nintendo is 100% funding Bayonetta 3 or not, Bayonetta is still a property owned by SEGA, which still makes her third party.

Enough with this asinine meme.

 

[Ivander]

You're all interpreting the word "personality" as literally as possible.

Indeed. Even if Steve is a literal skin or Avatar, I'm sure that Steve can be given personality. I mean, if Sakurai could give frickin' Fitness Trainers personality, I'm sure Steve could be given some. Admittingly, my main concern with Steve is him fitting in with the cast design-wise.
I mean, as Playstation All-Stars showed, sticking each character to their main designs, textures and whatnot from their games really gives mixed feelings as the cast really doesn't look like they fit together at all. Smash Bros. however stays close to the main designs while making the cast look like they actually fit together, even if their main designs are drastically different from each other. If Steve gets in, I would like him to look like he could fit in with the rest of the cast.

 

[BrytonJ]

Steve is part of the one category of characters that still has no precedent in Smash: 3rd party, modern, non-nintendo exclusive. Bayonetta was 3rd party but also nintendo exclusive. Pac, Mega Man, Ryu, Cloud, and Sonic are all 3rd party and not Nintendo exclusive but are also all characters with a lot of pedigree ("retro" so to speak even if they do use their modern designs more or less.) In my opinion I don't know if they're ready to start adding characters that are 3rd party, not nintendo exclusive, and fairly new.

On the other hand... a tiny part of my heart really wants Steve in smash just as a way to intentionally anger people I know. A lot of them would get mad if I beat them in smash with Steve.

 

[Nauzgo]

Lucina and Dark Pit were already going to be alternative costumes for Marth and Pit, so they already had all the assets ready to make them into clones in a really short span of time. For Young Link and Pichu they'd have had to make entirely new models, like they did with Roy for the DLC.

Ah forgot about that before, you're right. My brain's not working that good these days

TheLastJinjo

let's not compare Tink to Young Link.

Wait, so how do you know who's been planned on and who's not? I believe it was confirmed that they usually don't intend to cut any character and if someone gets cut, it's due to technical issues or time constraints.

Forgot that Dark Pit and Lucina were considered to be costumes before, my bad. You definetely got some points there, sure.

Still, Young Link was pretty present at that time due to the remakes. And I figure that it's funny that they did the reverse thing with Alph.
Pichu would be nice as the one non-balanced character. As for Young Link, it's a personal preference. It's not that I hate Tink, but I liked Young Link more.

 

[Deleted member]

@RelaxAlax put Steve on his roster too. I think he made a very great point stating that Minecraft can represent indie gaming as a whole. Although I disagree that Minecraft represents indie gaming NOW.

I do not think Minecraft represents Indie games as a whole now, either. Minecraft used to be an Indie game, but it got a lot more corporate and could be considered "too big" for an Indie game for now. I say that other Indie games can be considered the top representing Indie game, as I think Minecraft does not count as an Indie game, even though it started as one.

If we're talking indie reps, I'd rather see Shantae than anyone else. Lilac and Shovel Knight would be cool to have as well.

Also, regarding Steve, Minecraft is owned by Microsoft; it's not an indie franchise anymore.

This is a good example on why Minecraft is not an Indie game as well. Microsoft is very corporate and has a lot of members, so I would not classify Minecraft as an Indie game.

This would be best case scenario for me.

My favorite art of XCX was Mira. My least favorite was the characters (well that and the story)

And I think an XC2 character could still be cool.


I dont think it would happen, but it's what I would want.

Well Sakurai could have kept up with the recent games during development...
Rex will be guaranteed, but I want Pyra and Mythra as well.

Why should the fanbase of the character matter at all?

Hell, if we're resorting to fanbase stereotypes, Smash fans as a whole are among the worst, in my experience.

Minecraft is not as a bad fanbase as people view it. The screaming or "cringy" children is a microscopic percentage of the enormous young fanbase. It is just that the reason why people view it as bad is because people think "Minecraft kiddie game = cringe lol", and people like to their children in cringe compilations.

The Smash community on the other hand is more like a violent warzone where you can get harassed easier. Heck, you told me once that there was a girl who was sexually harassed and stuff.

 

[MrSmashFour]

-Fake Leak Removed-

Mod Edit: Blatantly fake leaks are not allowed to be posted.

 

[Cosmic77]

SMASH DIRECT LEAKED SMASH DIRECT LEAKED

THIS IS NOT A DRILL

Clickbait. It's too late for me, but you can still save yourself.